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  • Locked thread
Gally
May 31, 2001

Come on!

Macaluso posted:

Did Jake kill that bird and use it in his sandwich? :psyduck:

I have some harsh truths to tell you about where meat comes from...

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MojoKingBee
Sep 4, 2011

Everybody, there's a new king in town.

Get ready.

Gally posted:

I have some harsh truths to tell you about where meat comes from...

What do you mean? It all comes from Meat Man... right?

MojoKingBee fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Sep 4, 2013

Mage Ham
Apr 28, 2010

MojoKingBee posted:

God I love Magic Man. He's a villain, but he's not really evil. He's just a huge rear end in a top hat.

This is, to me, what makes him that much more terrifying; he's a representation of banal evil.

Magic Man seems to be amoral, and not only exclusively works towards his own desires, he doesn't even percieve other people as having wants or desires; they're just objects for him to work his magic on.
This makes him a huge rear end in a top hat in the show, but if he were more of a 'big picture' thinker, he could easily be a genocidal madman or dictator. Magic Man is the banal, human evil that results from dehumanization.

The Lich, meanwhile, isn't all that scary (aside from Ron Perlman's silky tones) because he represents a completely understandable internal force, the drive toward death instead of life. He's something that we'd like to deny, but he's in all of us, we know him- and in most cases, it's easy to deny him, to not destroy yourself. The impulse toward life wins out.

The Magic Man, on the other hand, is also a tendency we all possess (self-absorption), but he's one that we don't have a strong motive to deny and may not even notice as it slowly drives us to greater and greater transgressions.
Scary.

Froodulous
Feb 29, 2008

Hey, head pigeon, is this a bad post?

Mage Ham posted:

This is, to me, what makes him that much more terrifying; he's a representation of banal evil.

Magic Man seems to be amoral, and not only exclusively works towards his own desires, he doesn't even percieve other people as having wants or desires; they're just objects for him to work his magic on.
This makes him a huge rear end in a top hat in the show, but if he were more of a 'big picture' thinker, he could easily be a genocidal madman or dictator. Magic Man is the banal, human evil that results from dehumanization.

The Lich, meanwhile, isn't all that scary (aside from Ron Perlman's silky tones) because he represents a completely understandable internal force, the drive toward death instead of life. He's something that we'd like to deny, but he's in all of us, we know him- and in most cases, it's easy to deny him, to not destroy yourself. The impulse toward life wins out.

The Magic Man, on the other hand, is also a tendency we all possess (self-absorption), but he's one that we don't have a strong motive to deny and may not even notice as it slowly drives us to greater and greater transgressions.
Scary.

MindTheGap
Jul 24, 2007

Shwoo posted:

Because they put out fire, probably.
I think it's representative of FP coming back down to earth, and subsequently, Finn having to "turn back" into a "water elemental" (read: giant crybaby) once he realizes he's been dumped for good.

Gnarly Bae Jepsen
Jul 12, 2007

Manic Pixie Dick Girl

I love Magic Man and glad we are seeing more of him, but I hope he never gets a backstory. I think any explanation other than "he's just a really big rear end in a top hat" would ruin his character. Also I love how unassuming his name is vs. how chaotic he is.

MacheteZombie
Feb 4, 2007

Militree posted:

I love Magic Man and glad we are seeing more of him, but I hope he never gets a backstory. I think any explanation other than "he's just a really big rear end in a top hat" would ruin his character. Also I love how unassuming his name is vs. how chaotic he is.

Did you miss the episode, Son of Mars? We know his backstory is something tragic.

some kinda jackal
Feb 25, 2003

 
 

Say Nothing posted:

Same annoying voice over guy.

No man, please. I freakin' hate that guy :ohdear:

Calico Heart
Mar 22, 2012

"wich the worst part was what troll face did to sonic's corpse after words wich was rape it. at that point i looked away"




God Magic Man is my favourite character.

MacheteZombie posted:

Did you miss the episode, Son of Mars? We know his backstory is something tragic.

Barely, is the thing. He had a sweetheart who maybe died? The thing is, he only seemed to care at the end, but then suddenly didn't anymore. And even then, don't think it's enough to explain the shift to psychopathic murdering clown man.

Honestly, I don't think we should hear about Magic Man's past at all... but the thing is, I don't like how vague it was in "Sons of Mars", so maybe it wouldn't be awful. Personally I think the "just because" explanation for his personality is what makes him brilliant.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost
I didn't like Sons of Mars and don't think about it much.

I hope Earth & Water means less CB screentime, I find him boring. I like this show so much that even minor boredom is jarring.

Owlofcreamcheese
May 22, 2005
Probation
Can't post for 9 years!
Buglord

MacheteZombie posted:

Did you miss the episode, Son of Mars? We know his backstory is something tragic.

Son of mars always feels like a weird episode that drifted in over from some other series. None of it really makes sense. Looking it up it's written by a writer that wrote just that episode then left the show. It feels like someone that threw in a ton of big concepts without really backing it up.

axelblaze
Oct 18, 2006

Congratulations The One Concern!!!

You're addicted to Ivory!!

and...oh my...could you please...
oh my...

Grimey Drawer
Sons of Mars rules :colbert:


Steve Yun
Aug 7, 2003
I'm a parasitic landlord that needs to get a job instead of stealing worker's money. Make sure to remind me when I post.
Soiled Meat
Sons of Mars was awesome.

I mean, the fact that Magic Man was given this machine that would transport him back to Mars if he ever thought good thoughts about someone else, and he thought it was broken because it never worked for him once in two hundred years had to be one of the funniest things in this entire series.

PowerBeard
Sep 4, 2011

Calico Heart posted:

Man, you would really think PB would stop trusting Cinnamon Bun with things by now. Why would she not get Peppermint Butler or someone else to help out? Hell, even Starchy. CB is just a citizen as far as I know anyway.

Would you trust Peppermint Butler if you saw what he's up to, he would use Flame Princess as a sacrifice in seconds. Also Starchy is too busy standing in graveyards with his back turned, completely defenceless to help out.

Gnarly Bae Jepsen
Jul 12, 2007

Manic Pixie Dick Girl

Steve Yun posted:

Sons of Mars was awesome.

I mean, the fact that Magic Man was given this machine that would transport him back to Mars if he ever thought good thoughts about someone else, and he thought it was broken because it never worked for him once in two hundred years had to be one of the funniest things in this entire series.

Not to mention nearly every line from the episode is amazing.

"Uhhh...Are you guys talking to me?"

"Everyone is welcome to share this magic kingdom. Squirrels, black mold, worms, poison ivy, tiny manticore!"

"He said his new prison is shame."

etc.

weirdojace
Sep 4, 2007

Shwoo posted:

Because they put out fire, probably.

Before the episode aired, it was also pointed out that Earth & Water is a pretty good description of the state of the Ice Kingdom by the end of the fight.

Flippinlikebirds
Feb 2, 2007
I'm an ideas man Michael. I think I proved that with Fuck Mountain.
Son of Mars is the best episode.

Steve Yun
Aug 7, 2003
I'm a parasitic landlord that needs to get a job instead of stealing worker's money. Make sure to remind me when I post.
Soiled Meat
"Earth and Water" suggests that the episode is about aftermaths and repercussions. Literally speaking, earth and water is what was left after the battle of FP and IK, and thematically the episode deals with the aftermath of Finn's screwup with FP.

Someone pointed out earlier that Finn turns back into the "water elemental" like FP called him in a previous episode, but I'm not sure if there's a similar visual pun about earth

Delaio
Jul 14, 2012

SpacePig posted:

I couldn't find anything in the last thread, so I'll ask here:
Does anyone have a gif from Too Old of Big Lemongrab bowing, and the strain of the bow contorting his face? Or perhaps of the Big and White Lemongrabs in their acceptable/unacceptable screaming match?

Because I like your avatar so much, here you go:



I'll take requests from anybody, I've been having a lot of fun since I discovered gifcam. Just don't ask for anything fancy, like avatar sized stuff. You'll need someone with actual .gif talent for that.

SpacePig
Apr 4, 2007

I'M FEELING JIMMY

Say Nothing posted:

Here's one.


Um, Is this the other one?


Thank you! This is perfect.

Delaio posted:

Because I like your avatar so much, here you go:



Thank you, too! This also is perfect! I hope you don't like my avatar too much, because I'm hoping to turn one of these two into a new one!

Logan 5
Jan 29, 2007

Bash -> To the Cop



I need to learn how to draw lemongrab's face on everything vaguely lemon related

Say Nothing
Mar 5, 2013

by FactsAreUseless
Here's some better shots of FP's Azula outfit.

What the hell is FP's real name, anyway?


Shut up, dad!


"Wow! She's even cooler than ever!"


And Cartoon Network needs to stop putting annoying promos all over the screen.

Vorgen
Mar 5, 2006

Party Membership is a Democracy, The Weave is Not.

A fledgling vampire? How about a dragon, or some half-kobold druids? Perhaps a spontaneous sex change? Anything that can happen, will happen the results will be beyond entertaining.

Jenx posted:

And yet, funnily enough, it's a post-World War III nation. This was discussed a few pages back, but the thing with Princess Bubblegum is that while she's probably good, what she isn't is nice.

This is making me imagine a 3D alignment cube with a third axis of Nice Guy - rear end in a top hat. So you can be a Lawful Good rear end in a top hat or a Neutral Evil Nice Guy, someone who could truly follow in Churchill's footsteps by following his quote, "But after all when you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
So I wonder why FP's eyes are evil now.

MojoKingBee
Sep 4, 2011

Everybody, there's a new king in town.

Get ready.

Tollymain posted:

So I wonder why FP's eyes are evil now.

Probably so she can look more intimidating. The flame people seem to respect power more than anything else. She went back to normal eyes when she was talking to Finn, so I don't think it's really significant.

Bongo Bill
Jan 17, 2012

Of course it's significant. What, do you think this show was made by accident? The "windows to the soul" close off, and she sometimes has the eyes of a tyrant.

Say Nothing
Mar 5, 2013

by FactsAreUseless

Tollymain posted:

So I wonder why FP's eyes are evil now.
Blame her father.

"Evil evil evil evil"...

(Well, that's a conveniently placed promo).

"Evil evil ev... oh, I'm sorry I thought my daughter was alone."

Steve Yun
Aug 7, 2003
I'm a parasitic landlord that needs to get a job instead of stealing worker's money. Make sure to remind me when I post.
Soiled Meat
I dunno if "evil" is the right word. She's not evil, but... I dunno, maybe she's lost part of her humanity?

Steve Yun fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Sep 5, 2013

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
For that matter, I don't know if "humanity" is the right word :v:

MariusLecter
Sep 5, 2009

NI MUERTE NI MIEDO

Steve Yun posted:

I dunno if "evil" is the right word. She's not evil, but... I dunno, maybe she's lost part of her humanity?

She's more flame than "human" now. Corrupt and EVIL.

Steve Yun
Aug 7, 2003
I'm a parasitic landlord that needs to get a job instead of stealing worker's money. Make sure to remind me when I post.
Soiled Meat


I wouldn't want to call her evil because she thinks she's doing the right thing

Steve Yun fucked around with this message at 07:55 on Sep 5, 2013

Mage Ham
Apr 28, 2010

Steve Yun posted:

I dunno if "evil" is the right word. She's not evil, but... I dunno, maybe she's lost part of her humanity?

She seems to be taking an indirect route towards 'evil' in that she's taking a nominally positive trait, honesty, to an extreme that isn't sustainable.
It's a fundamentally inhuman approach, which makes it dangerous and may also make it the only thing that will work for her.

PB has done this several times lately, with clarity and rationality in Wizards Only and with the protection of the kingdom in Earth and Water. In the end, decisions like dealing with FP only as a threat, and not a child, have consequences.

Flame Princess starts out as a kind of fiery tabula rasa, and it's neat to see her moving toward an independent moral compass rather than indulging Finn's relatively simplistic, and increasingly compromised, adventure-ethics.

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

by Nyc_Tattoo

Mage Ham posted:

She seems to be taking an indirect route towards 'evil' in that she's taking a nominally positive trait, honesty, to an extreme that isn't sustainable.
It's a fundamentally inhuman approach, which makes it dangerous and may also make it the only thing that will work for her.

Ignoring the rest of your stuff, "inhuman" equaling "dangerous" is ridiculous because, besides not applying to anyone besides Finn in this show, a lot of the nastiest things people do are done because they're human. Take, for example, why Finn did that stuff to FP and the Ice King; that was a pretty human thing to do, and look where that led.

Besides that, FP's doing this for a very "human" reason: She was hurt, repeatedly, by dishonest people. She's trying to avoid that, and she's doing so by making everyone always tell the truth. That's not inhuman, it's immature and naive. Which aren't particularly great either, really, but it's different from what you're trying to say.

I agree that it's neat that FP's been developing, though, beyond "unstable girlfriend". I liked her from the start, but she's got a lot more character to her now.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer

Flippinlikebirds posted:

Son of Mars is the best episode.

I'm a little behind now but seconded to HELL. I can't imagine the kind of monster that dislikes that episode.

Dolash
Oct 23, 2008

aNYWAY,
tHAT'S REALLY ALL THERE IS,
tO REPORT ON THE SUBJECT,
oF ME GETTING HURT,


Steve Yun posted:

I wouldn't want to call her evil because she thinks she's doing the right thing

While I'd agree that evil's not the right term here, plenty of clearly evil people think they're doing the right thing. For all we know if you asked the Lich he'd say he's just trying to put the world to rest.

thelaughingman
Mar 14, 2005
oooh I like madness!

Owlofcreamcheese posted:

Son of mars always feels like a weird episode that drifted in over from some other series. None of it really makes sense. Looking it up it's written by a writer that wrote just that episode then left the show. It feels like someone that threw in a ton of big concepts without really backing it up.

Doug TenNaple helped out a little on the story.

Edit: I miss the "king of mars".

thelaughingman fucked around with this message at 17:04 on Sep 5, 2013

sticklefifer
Nov 11, 2003

by VideoGames

Vorgen posted:

This is making me imagine a 3D alignment cube with a third axis of Nice Guy - rear end in a top hat. So you can be a Lawful Good rear end in a top hat or a Neutral Evil Nice Guy, someone who could truly follow in Churchill's footsteps by following his quote, "But after all when you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."

Steve Yun posted:

I wouldn't want to call her evil because she thinks she's doing the right thing

I propose a hypercube with a 4th axis of Ignorance - Self-Awareness.

Mage Ham
Apr 28, 2010

Roland Jones posted:

Ignoring the rest of your stuff, "inhuman" equaling "dangerous" is ridiculous because, besides not applying to anyone besides Finn in this show, a lot of the nastiest things people do are done because they're human. Take, for example, why Finn did that stuff to FP and the Ice King; that was a pretty human thing to do, and look where that led.

Besides that, FP's doing this for a very "human" reason: She was hurt, repeatedly, by dishonest people. She's trying to avoid that, and she's doing so by making everyone always tell the truth. That's not inhuman, it's immature and naive. Which aren't particularly great either, really, but it's different from what you're trying to say.

I agree that it's neat that FP's been developing, though, beyond "unstable girlfriend". I liked her from the start, but she's got a lot more character to her now.
Yeah, that's pretty sloppy terminology for this kind of discussion; point taken and chagrin felt.

I guess what I'm trying to get at is that it's a piecemeal sort of approach.
A human/bananaman/candy person/fox/etc. matures within a culture, and absorbs standards of acceptable behavior holistically by observation and imitation; they get it all together.

Since FP didn't have the benefit of anything like that, even as far as having contact with flame kingdom culture (she grew up in a literal bubble), she's experimenting, approximating what's good and acceptable one piece at a time.

That's the way I picture something like a machine or AI trying to do that, which is why I say 'inhuman'. Of course, something like a machine or AI is usually characterized as childlike, so immature and/or naive works about as well.

Steve Yun
Aug 7, 2003
I'm a parasitic landlord that needs to get a job instead of stealing worker's money. Make sure to remind me when I post.
Soiled Meat
It's hard to pin down what her eyes mean other than "probably not in a healthy place"

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MindTheGap
Jul 24, 2007
Interesting, then, that they only revert to their regular state during her interactions with Finn. Maybe the suggestion is being made that, regardless of how painful, it's healthy to confront the things that cause you distress. Or maybe they just thought she'd look too intimidating talking to Finn with evil eyes the whole time. Either way: fun.

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