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Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
What can you do with shopping carts? I know you're supposed to be able to push them around, but I'm not sure how. Do you have to install controls on them?

Also, is there a button that allows you to grab an object from another square, or can you just not do that anymore? A zombie dog died on a shotgun trap without triggering it somehow, and I'd like to grab his corpse to butcher it, but with my low trapping skills I'm likely to set off the trap if I try to deactivate it.

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OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Inadequately posted:

What can you do with shopping carts? I know you're supposed to be able to push them around, but I'm not sure how. Do you have to install controls on them?

Also, is there a button that allows you to grab an object from another square, or can you just not do that anymore? A zombie dog died on a shotgun trap without triggering it somehow, and I'd like to grab his corpse to butcher it, but with my low trapping skills I'm likely to set off the trap if I try to deactivate it.

Shift+G and move towards the cart, or any vehicle, actually, you can push them around.

Also e + direction is grab/activate from adjacent square.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

OwlFancier posted:

Huh, didn't know that, but then I've never been able or inclined to make chems, never really seen the point.
It's fairly useful. You can make your own mutagen and purifier, so it's a lot easier to scum for useful mutations. You can also make painkiller and sleeping pills and a few general performance enhancing drugs. Since you usually end up with a lot of cooking skill anyway it's not much of an investment either.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

Inadequately posted:

What can you do with shopping carts? I know you're supposed to be able to push them around, but I'm not sure how. Do you have to install controls on them?

Also, is there a button that allows you to grab an object from another square, or can you just not do that anymore? A zombie dog died on a shotgun trap without triggering it somehow, and I'd like to grab his corpse to butcher it, but with my low trapping skills I'm likely to set off the trap if I try to deactivate it.
Either use e+direction or learn to use / , because the advanced inventory management is the best way to move tons of stuff around you and the fastest way to manage a cart inventory or your stockpiles.

Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
Oh, right. Somehow I forgot about the advanced inventory management. I do wish there was a way to sort every item-based menu along the lines of the advanced category system.

Is there actually a way to get the vehicles out of the basement of an office building? I'm guessing there's some sort of ramp behind the metal doors, but I'm not sure if it's fully implemented yet. Regardless, the consoles are broken and the doors won't open anyway so I'm breaking them down for parts and mechanics skill grinding.

PiCroft
Jun 11, 2010

I'm sorry, did I break all your shit? I didn't know it was yours

Tyskil posted:

You can use them with ammonia to make your own batteries! They are super useful in that regard so I will usually pick a house to be the "can house" where I throw all my loose cans and then never come back for them because I die before I learn the recipe.

ah thanks.I've never needed to make new batteries, I'm usually leaving piles of them behind I have so many.

Has anyone tried using the farming system yet? What can you do with it at the moment?

Tyskil
Jan 28, 2009

PiCroft posted:

ah thanks.I've never needed to make new batteries, I'm usually leaving piles of them behind I have so many.

Has anyone tried using the farming system yet? What can you do with it at the moment?

Batteries get more useful if your character is big on electronics and you are carrying around homemade laser rifles and such.

Farming is really barebones right now so basically all you can do is 'a'pply a hoe to some dirt to make a dirt mound, then 'a'pply a seed to it and wait for it to grow into a plant. I think you can also fertilize it but I've never actually needed to farm yet so I have no idea how long things take to grow.

Ignatius M. Meen
May 26, 2011

Hello yes I heard there was a lovely trainwreck here and...

Jonny Retro posted:

Having even a single broken limb in the game is a huge handicap and basically a death sentence if your not a bad enough dude to fight your way through a hospital.

Not quite! A Big Book of First Aid, enough resources to let you read up however much you need to for level 2, and sleep while wearing your newly made splint is all you need now. Also a level in survival but that's not too hard to do if you're able to score the book.

Turtlicious
Sep 17, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
I'm making the place where I started as my base, is there a way to expand the lower area?

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Turtlicious posted:

I'm making the place where I started as my base, is there a way to expand the lower area?
Get yourself a jackhammer, it allows you to tunnel through rock. Best chance to find one is probably a farm.

Corsec
Apr 17, 2007
You can grind survival up to 3 on the first day by checking light green hashmarked forest tiles for wild veggies. It's the easiest way to get your butcher skills high enough to avoid clumsily destroying the meat of your kills. This will save you even more grinding later when you start hunting wildlife for food. It'll also give you enough food to last the first couple of days.

Anyone else like prisons for a homebase? It's got water, furniture for 2x4s, total safety indoors, convenient floor plan, storage facilities and when you clear it out it has large stockpiles of food and clothes. It's almost always near forest for hunting and treecutting and usually is a safe distance from undead spawns. It can even accommodate multiple vehicles behind the wire fence.

How to make it your own; a decent mechanic skill, crowbar and improvised lockpicks are required to gain entrance. The entrance wire gate must be lockpicked or you can smash through the wire fence. The crowbar will open everything else. Bring some armour penetration ability to bring down the 2 secubots inside. Most of the zombies inside are behind bars so are little threat, but there's huge mob in the cafeteria on the middle tile below ground. Don't walk in there unless you want to be swarmed, you can kill them with ranged weapons from behind bars. The rest of the zombies will jump you at the 3 stairwells. The already-encountered zombies will disappear from the prison map if you switch z-levels.

I got really lucky (abusing mapgen reloads and map reveal) and got a prison nearby an anti hill and triffid grove. With multiple labs/bunkers nearby and 2 towns within walking distance. So sick of finding prisons spoiled by crappy locations, this is great.

Tiler Kiwi
Feb 26, 2011
The only true home for Jesus "Scorching Face" Hernandez, ratbug hobo samurai is the open road, with the only peace to be found in the death of your many enemies.

But seriously this dude is going to be badly addicted to painkillers in short time. Him and his dumb deformed face. Its not really getting in the way of the mass murder spree (I wiped out a hospital with two broken legs - melee combat might be a tad overpowered) but its hitting me right in my sense of niggling perfectionism.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

Corsec posted:

Anyone else like prisons for a homebase? It's got water, furniture for 2x4s, total safety indoors, convenient floor plan, storage facilities and when you clear it out it has large stockpiles of food and clothes. It's almost always near forest for hunting and treecutting and usually is a safe distance from undead spawns. It can even accommodate multiple vehicles behind the wire fence.
Some mansions are awesome base too with the endless water from the pool, the king-sized bedrooms and more room then you will ever need. Sometime they even have a greenhouse. As long as you aren't playing dynamic spawning mode.

Belasarius
Feb 27, 2002
They really need to code in better interface like "smash until broken" or shift+move to move the viewport 10 squares

Dotcom656
Apr 7, 2007
I WILL TAKE BETTER PICTURES OF MY DRAWINGS BEFORE POSTING THEM
I have possibly just had the greatest moment in this game that I will ever have.

After slaughtering most of a school full of child zombies I ran through the halls and out of he back door with a large mass following behind me. I find my way across a field into a row of houses and storefronts finding some dead former military on the ground. I stop momentarily to loot their bodies and find a packed M72 LAW on one of the bodies.

After attracting the attention of a boomer and a few normal zombies I run into the front of a hardware store, run to the back and unpack the LAW. As the boomer and a couple of other zombies are banging on the doors I closed behind me. I shoot the LAW into the wall, destroying it and alerting every goddamn thing in the loving city.

I make a mad dash using my parkour skills to get past the rubble as another mass of zombies swarms out down the street after me. Heading due south I manage to smash through the window of a liquor store and raid a shelf for a bottle of vodka and a bottle of gin. I ran out of the front door and down the street. emptying the gin on the ground I smash through the back window of a house, cutting up the curtain and making a molotov cocktail from the alcohol.

I enter the next room in the hall hoping for a way out when I realize the room is full of smoke, I have barely any health left and I cant see. Zombies are closing in and this might be it.

I light the makeshift bomb on fire as zombies are streaming in the only door way. As one gets a hit at my head I hurl the firebomb at the wall, exploding and creating enough chaos I manage to slip out the doorway and out the front door of the house. Slivers of health left, and bleeding from multiple bite wounds as the house I escaped from goes up in a blaze. The fire spreads to the adjacent houses as I outrun the last few stragglers. circling back around to watch the homes burn to the ground.

This is why I really love this game.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Toplowtech posted:

Some mansions are awesome base too with the endless water from the pool, the king-sized bedrooms and more room then you will ever need. Sometime they even have a greenhouse. As long as you aren't playing dynamic spawning mode.

I live in a mansion currently and it's not quite my favorite base in the world. They're horribly insecure, even walling off a section isn't helping because I keep getting the odd wandering zombie bashing down half the walls before I find out.

You really should be able to build a wall that a zombie can't punch down.

Also they have no exterior sheltered areas or large gates, so they're hard to use as a garage.

My favorite base so far is probably a public works, just because it has so much useful stuff in it. Though I haven't tried a prison. I'm also very curious about the new hazardous waste sarcophagus which looks badass from the outside, haven't been inside yet but I'm sure it'd be radioactive.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
They're radioactive as bollocks. I explored one in 0.6, it was horrible. I couldn't figure out how to leave, the radiation sickness kept getting worse, my pain level was like 300 at one point and finally I ate so many painkillers that my heart stopped.

Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
I like setting up in a garage, there's lots of space to organize your stuff and you can drive vehicles in and work on them. The main flaw is the lack of a good water source, though. In most of my games I just end up reinforcing the first house I come across and never moving from there because I'm lazy.

Also, it turns out I set my spawn rates to low and my city size to minimum. I thought this game seemed surprisingly peaceful. I should try another game with max city size and max spawn rate, just to see how bad an idea that is.

E: You get a single gigantic map-spanning city, with maybe a couple of rivers running through it. Apparently no shelters spawn so you always spawn at the top-left corner of the map. I didn't get to see very much of it though, because I spawned in the middle of a colossal crowd of zombies who tore me to bits in seconds.

Inadequately fucked around with this message at 21:47 on Sep 26, 2013

TheKnife
Jan 24, 2009

Toplowtech posted:

Some mansions are awesome base too with the endless water from the pool, the king-sized bedrooms and more room then you will ever need. Sometime they even have a greenhouse. As long as you aren't playing dynamic spawning mode.

Except when a lightning storm happens and your mansion bursts into flames, potentially crashing the game even if you make it out alive

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

TheKnife posted:

Except when a lightning storm happens and your mansion bursts into flames, potentially crashing the game even if you make it out alive
They removed lightnings because of that, until they can fix it. Not lightning storms are just normal thunderstorms.

Strudel Man
May 19, 2003
ROME DID NOT HAVE ROBOTS, FUCKWIT
Well, I put a lot of effort into making myself a cheeseburger. Hard as hell to get your hands on edible ketchup a week or so after the apocalypse; you have to find an unspoiled tomato at a farm to do it. But homemade ketchup, some cheese spread, homemade bread, pickles found in a refrigerator and some rabbit meat, I finally had a cheeseburger.

I couldn't finish it, and it only gave me 30 morale. :(

PiCroft
Jun 11, 2010

I'm sorry, did I break all your shit? I didn't know it was yours

The more advanced food seems to be not worth the trouble to make. For the relative nutrition and enjoyment you get, you'd be asl well just eating cooked meat that hot and fresh.

Although I do quite like making kompot with the fruit I pickup during the first few days.

a podcast for cats
Jun 22, 2005

Dogs reading from an artifact buried in the ruins of our civilization, "We were assholes- " and writing solemnly, "They were assholes."
Soiled Meat
Simulating scurvy caused by months of cooked meat diet would probably cross the realism/fun threshold.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

Tonton Macoute posted:

Simulating scurvy caused by months of cooked meat diet would probably cross the realism/fun threshold.
You should get protein poisoning if you only eat lean meat (rabbit).

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

PiCroft posted:

The more advanced food seems to be not worth the trouble to make. For the relative nutrition and enjoyment you get, you'd be asl well just eating cooked meat that hot and fresh.
Jerky is really good because it's weightless and lasts forever, but yeah, otherwise the foods seem to be really worthless.

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

Considering that after a week or two of butchering everything in sight, you should be able to find half a dozen wild veggies by rooting around in the bushes in the nearest forest, scurvy wouldn't really be a problem.

Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
I am fine with anything that turns the game into a post-apocalyptic Unreal World.

Honestly I hardly ever bother with the advanced foods outside of jerky and maybe sealing some away in jars, and maybe dog food once in a while. The main draw of cooking is making mutagen, for me. It'd be nice if there was a way to seal food back up in tin cans, though. Anything that gives you more options for long term food storage would be pretty useful.

PiCroft
Jun 11, 2010

I'm sorry, did I break all your shit? I didn't know it was yours

I remember trying to fix up an electricity system which would be able to power refrigerators to preserve food, making it possible to keep fruit and veg (and meat and anything else really) for longer but the electric system was nightmarish and I think its now almost certainly hilariously out-of-date.

emanresu tnuocca
Sep 2, 2011

by Athanatos
I assume that eventually the game will move out of the 'add new features' phase and the creators will start focusing on balance and difficulty, hunting large game shouldn't be so easy and the availability of fresh meat trivializes searching for food and restocking your supplies.

Smarmy Coworker
May 10, 2008

by XyloJW
Anyone have pictures of the tilesets from last week's release? I have not been keeping up with this (thread AND game) at all since, like, page 10.

Nevets
Sep 11, 2002

Be they sad or be they well,
I'll make their lives a hell

emanresu tnuocca posted:

I assume that eventually the game will move out of the 'add new features' phase and the creators will start focusing on balance and difficulty, hunting large game shouldn't be so easy and the availability of fresh meat trivializes searching for food and restocking your supplies.

I doubt it, I expect it's going to go the Dwarf Fortress route of continual development.

Strudel Man
May 19, 2003
ROME DID NOT HAVE ROBOTS, FUCKWIT

Cardiovorax posted:

Jerky is really good because it's weightless and lasts forever, but yeah, otherwise the foods seem to be really worthless.
Not anymore, sadly. (Well, it was never weightless, but it used to be only 1 volume per hundred jerky when debagged or made fresh.) Now it's one volume per three jerky, making it pretty bad in terms of nutrition/volume.

I was halfway thinking they could track some 'acclimation' stat for the quality of food you're used to eating. Like, when you're freshly into the apocalypse, it's not that big a deal to find and eat a burger that hasn't spoiled yet, since that's the kind of thing you're used to eating. But if you've been subsisting on nothing but squirrel meat roasted on a spit for two weeks, suddenly a proper, complex, seasoned meal would be like manna from heaven. You could have a wider gulf between food enjoyabilities (with the high values given to complex, pre-cataclysm style foods), and then adjust the morale effects based on some kind of averaging of what you've eaten over the past week, loaded up at the start as though you've been, you know, living in normal society. So you're not going to like that seared wolfmeat until you've had nothing else to eat for a while, but once you've settled down into the apocalypse lifestyle, making yourself an occasional treat of spaghetti bolognese would give you a better morale boost than cocaine.

Of course, that leaves pre-cataclysm foods that don't spoil, like cookies and chips and jerky, in a weird area, where it's not clear whether they should be given high enjoyability or low.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

Strudel Man posted:

So you're not going to like that seared wolfmeat until you've had nothing else to eat for a while, but once you've settled down into the apocalypse lifestyle, making yourself an occasional treat of spaghetti bolognese would give you a better morale boost than cocaine.

Of course, that leaves pre-cataclysm foods that don't spoil, like cookies and chips and jerky, in a weird area, where it's not clear whether they should be given high enjoyability or low.
Why not introduce "food cravings", if you spend too much time eating the same things, you get a "you suddenly feel the need for (random different food)" message and get a morale boost when you finally eat some. You can make some negative traits were you lose more morale if you don't fullfill your need for specific food. Basically a minor food addiction.

Strudel Man
May 19, 2003
ROME DID NOT HAVE ROBOTS, FUCKWIT
Eh. That feels a little too specific and directed for my tastes.

Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
I don't know, that seems a bit much. I guess a good trade-off might be to implement it as an NPC quest. It doesn't punish the player if he just wants to live in the woods and survive on squirrels for ever, but maybe better food has better NPC trade value and NPCs occasionally demand it in a quest.

Really, a lot of minor issues would be fixed with better NPC implementation so I hope they get around to that soon.


E: Plus, there's already mutations that turn you specifically carnivorous/vegetarian. That seems like it'd be a problem.

Inadequately fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Sep 27, 2013

Strudel Man
May 19, 2003
ROME DID NOT HAVE ROBOTS, FUCKWIT
An NPC quest for sophisticated food still leaves the foods themselves largely pointless, little more than a McGuffin.

The system I proposed wouldn't actually penalize the player for living in the woods forever - the idea was that once the system settled down, you would get the morale effects you currently do for eating a given food if that's all you eat. It's only if you vary up your diet that things get more interesting.

Inadequately posted:

E: Plus, there's already mutations that turn you specifically carnivorous/vegetarian. That seems like it'd be a problem.
That wouldn't really be a problem for toplowtech's idea. It'd be pretty simple to check if you can eat the food item before you get a craving for it.

Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011

I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.
Honestly, I think that sounds pointlessly complicated and like a bitch to implement. It'd be more sensible to invest that kind of effort into something more immediately important, like finally making NPCs do something.

Inadequately
Oct 9, 2012
Oh, I was mostly replying to TopLowTech's proposal. The acclimation idea sounds feasible at least, but it'd be a difficult trade-off for morale balancing. Early in the game, the player isn't going to have the skill or resources for cooking anything fancier that meat/veggies, so if you start off acclimated to fancy foods, a long-lasting depressed morale effect is only going to make it harder to get off the ground. Late-game, when you can make fancier food, nobody would make it if they knew it would raise their acclimation and make things harder for themselves in the long run.

Slaapaav
Mar 3, 2006

by Azathoth
Hunting needs to be made more realistic. Make animals much harder to spot and more likely run away before you can even get close enough to see them. Throwing rocks at squirrels feels way too cheap.

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Bar Crow
Oct 10, 2012
Something I've always thought survival type games should do is just let you combined different types of food items together instead of having specific recipes. The result is a generic meal item with a food value greater than the sum of its parts. It encourages variety without being tedious. Also it's funny to imagine the bizarre dishes you could create with whatever you have on hand.

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