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SickZip posted:Vicky is already far superior to CK2/EUIV Spirits of Liberty 
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Jan 5, 2014 03:04
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:Spirits of Liberty Orphan Sweatshops Simulator.
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Jan 5, 2014 03:06
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:Spirits of Liberty March of Freedom and plaster it with American Flags and Eagles It will add some nice irony when 80% of players go maximum Hitler and turn fascist SickZip fucked around with this message at 03:10 on Jan 5, 2014 |
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Jan 5, 2014 03:08
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I always thought the loading screen for EU3 that was a low-angle shot of Washington surrounded by his soldiers was pretty bad-rear end, like, "Yes, this is what Washington in a video game looks like." Then you had deformed Napoleon on his gigantic pony.
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Jan 5, 2014 03:12
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It doesn't help that the first game had an explanatory subtitle that V2 dropped (V1 shipped as Victoria: An Empire Under the Sun).
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Jan 5, 2014 03:13
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SickZip posted:Vicky is already far superior to CK2/EUIV I actually think that this is legitimately a good idea but it would have to be pretty railroaded near the start re: France in order to even vaguely resemble RL history. 1789 might be a better start but then you lose the whole angle.
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Jan 5, 2014 03:14
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SickZip posted:Vicky is already far superior to CK2/EUIV Factroy Universalis  SickZip posted:March of Freedom and plaster it with American Flags and Eagles It doesn't help that fascism is legit the best form of government in the game; you can pass any reforms you want, you get max military spending, you get all the benefits of a planned economy while still letting your capitalists do some of the work, and your flag tends to be the coolest one for your nation. Only downside is residency means assimilation will be harder, but if you already have a high population fascism is the best government. In addition to global manpower pools and streamlining some things so the game isn't such a CPU hog, I hope V3 adds more benefits for not being fascist  .E: Also, RE: Earlier start date, I think that would be really cool to play as France and spread the revolution. Like, screw Napoleon, keep the Jacobins and conquer Europe  .
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Jan 5, 2014 03:52
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:Spirits of Liberty  Would not be any less confusing than Mega-Legged-Napoleon headlining a game that starts centuries earlier.
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Jan 5, 2014 03:54
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Farecoal posted:Vicky 2 is Clauswitz Clausewitz 2.5 rolled out with Sengoku so yeah, V2 is still on a fairly older version of the engine. HoI3 as well.
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Jan 5, 2014 04:52
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I looked into the number of provinces held by each game as a point of comparison: EU4 provinces: 2 002 Hearts of Iron 2: 2 607 Darkest Hour: 2 760 Victoria 2: 2 702 Hearts of Iron 3: 14 168 Even accounting for EU4 having a bunch of Terra Incognita, it's pretty obvious that HOI3 has WAY too many provinces, and I think a new version would have to bring that back down to keep it manageable. I also never felt like the generic research system and the Brigade-assembly system was particularly compelling, although the Practical/Theoretical system was a big improvement. Besides going back to a prettier and smaller map, I feel like HOI4 should just return to its division-scale and direct-tech-tree-with-research-team roots.
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Jan 5, 2014 05:41
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gently caress HoI4, just keep polishing Darkest Hour further and further. e; Also yeah I've felt for awhile that Vicky should maybe cover about 150 years from 1776/1789 to about 1930, which is the year HoI should then start in. But then I enjoy the process of building up countries and forces in DH more than almost anyone else and I never, ever feel like I have long enough.
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Jan 5, 2014 05:47
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gradenko_2000 posted:I looked into the number of provinces held by each game as a point of comparison: East vs West has more provinces than HoI3.
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Jan 5, 2014 05:48
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Mister Adequate posted:gently caress HoI4, just keep polishing Darkest Hour further and further. I agree that Victoria III should have a Long 19th Century if only to make investing in a pre-steam navy or clipper ship factories more than a stupid gimmick. Plus, the game's flow would go from bookends of a Liberal revolution that leads to a continental conflict (replace Anarcho-Liberals with Jacobins!) to a massive wave of communist and fascist revolutions at the end. Hell, if you start in 1754 then you can get an effectively randomized North America, but that may be pushing it. But more than those things, I want a politicians/factions system that scales in number based on country power, and an espionage system and ways to gently caress with other people economically through blockades or closed markets.
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Jan 5, 2014 06:22
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I would love a Vicky 3, and I hope that's what is being announced soon. If not, I guess I'll have to figure out how to mod V2.
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Jan 5, 2014 07:31
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DrProsek posted:Factroy Universalis Vicky is a game you play against your conscious, not against other countries. Playing it "best" is often the worst way to play it. (Take that however you want.)
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Jan 5, 2014 07:49
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uPen posted:East vs West has more provinces than HoI3. haha that game is gonna be a train wreck.
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Jan 5, 2014 07:58
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How is it even possible to cram more provinces in there  ?
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Jan 5, 2014 08:02
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To me the problem with extending V2's timeline that far back for V3 is that you'd end up with an effectively alien world almost every game. Even extending the timeline back to 1821 would lead to the problem of having much of Latin America likely remaining Spanish most games. You could have Mexico and Colombia as independent states at war with Spain in the beginning, but even then there's a decent chance that Bolivia/Peru and Argentina/Chile would stick with Spain most of the time. Not to mention having to make sure that the Ottoman starting war with Greece is a likely failure to avoid super-Ottomans showing up every game.
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Jan 5, 2014 08:03
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Raskolnikov38 posted:How is it even possible to cram more provinces in there Was it East vs West or some HoI mod that added an absurd amount of provinces everywhere, and especially in Africa.
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Jan 5, 2014 08:18
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Patter Song posted:To me the problem with extending V2's timeline that far back for V3 is that you'd end up with an effectively alien world almost every game. Even extending the timeline back to 1821 would lead to the problem of having much of Latin America likely remaining Spanish most games. You could have Mexico and Colombia as independent states at war with Spain in the beginning, but even then there's a decent chance that Bolivia/Peru and Argentina/Chile would stick with Spain most of the time. Not to mention having to make sure that the Ottoman starting war with Greece is a likely failure to avoid super-Ottomans showing up every game. I understand all of this but I still really want a game where I can start off as the 13 colonies and go all the way up to post WWI. Though if Steppe Wolf is released for EU4 I will be satisfied.
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Jan 5, 2014 08:36
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Was it East vs West or some HoI mod that added an absurd amount of provinces everywhere, and especially in Africa. That was Iron Cross:     In contrast, one of the Darkest Hour dev diaries specifically stated that they didn't want to exceed 3 000 provinces to maintain playability. Patter Song posted:To me the problem with extending V2's timeline that far back for V3 is that you'd end up with an effectively alien world almost every game. Even extending the timeline back to 1821 would lead to the problem of having much of Latin America likely remaining Spanish most games. You could have Mexico and Colombia as independent states at war with Spain in the beginning, but even then there's a decent chance that Bolivia/Peru and Argentina/Chile would stick with Spain most of the time. Not to mention having to make sure that the Ottoman starting war with Greece is a likely failure to avoid super-Ottomans showing up every game. That's what bookmarks are for, though? I know most people play from the earliest possible bookmark because "longer campaign = better than", but I've played a couple of WWI starts myself on the original Ricky just to see how it'd play out in the last 2 decades with a set of nations markedly different from 1836.
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Jan 5, 2014 08:56
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That America would be fantastic for the Fallout mod.
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Jan 5, 2014 09:09
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gradenko_2000 posted:Besides going back to a prettier and smaller map, I feel like HOI4 should just return to its division-scale and direct-tech-tree-with-research-team roots. The HoI roots are actually research by spending IC. Frankly I've always felt that the tech team system was overly generous to small nations. A nation with 40 IC has three tech teams, a nation with 400 has five. This is awesome if you want to play world conquest as Luxembourg, but it is a bit silly if late war America has to decide whether they want a new carrier model or nuclear bombs.
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Jan 5, 2014 10:38
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ArchangeI posted:The HoI roots are actually research by spending IC. Frankly I've always felt that the tech team system was overly generous to small nations. A nation with 40 IC has three tech teams, a nation with 400 has five. This is awesome if you want to play world conquest as Luxembourg, but it is a bit silly if late war America has to decide whether they want a new carrier model or nuclear bombs. Given that there is no model in the game for the spread of tech besides blueprints to allies, being generous to small nations is kind of necessary unless you want all non Great Powers to still be using WW1 gear in 1945.
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Jan 5, 2014 10:40
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The biggest problem with pushing the start date for Victoria 3 much earlier than it currently is is that, if Vic3 models military stuff the same way as Vic 2 does, it will be utterly incapable of modeling the Napoleonic Wars.
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Jan 5, 2014 12:39
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ArchangeI posted:The HoI roots are actually research by spending IC. Frankly I've always felt that the tech team system was overly generous to small nations. A nation with 40 IC has three tech teams, a nation with 400 has five. This is awesome if you want to play world conquest as Luxembourg, but it is a bit silly if late war America has to decide whether they want a new carrier model or nuclear bombs. The difference being that Luxembourg has like 3 IC and 1 tech team, whereas nations that have 40 IC are supposed to be "regional" or medium-sized powers. I've played Canada/Australia games in HoI2/DH enough to know that 40 IC is definitely not too low to make a good contribution to the war effort, but you're definitely not going to go on a world conquest with it. I mean Italy is a major world player and it only starts with like 80 IC. But by all means, if you want the US to be even more overpowered, give it like thirty tech teams to reflect its economy massively outstripping the rest of the world's (for the record I think the newest version of DH ups the maximum number of active tech teams to like 6 or 7 for nations like US/UK/France/Germany/USSR.)
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Jan 5, 2014 12:41
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ArchangeI posted:The HoI roots are actually research by spending IC. Frankly I've always felt that the tech team system was overly generous to small nations. A nation with 40 IC has three tech teams, a nation with 400 has five. This is awesome if you want to play world conquest as Luxembourg, but it is a bit silly if late war America has to decide whether they want a new carrier model or nuclear bombs. You have to factor in that Luxembourg has so little base IC that it (and most nations all the way up to Italy) are never going to be able to pull off a world conquest regardless (unless playing with Full IC/Research Team takeover), and that America's other advantage is her excellent tech teams. I've never really felt that the limit of 5 kept any of the major powers from research everything that they needed - manpower and IC tended to be bigger hurdles to that.
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Jan 5, 2014 13:56
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Drone posted:I mean Italy is a major world player Hahaha you're hilarious.
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Jan 5, 2014 14:28
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uPen posted:East vs West has more provinces than HoI3. Oh man, I gotta see where they say this. Shimrra Jamaane posted:Was it East vs West or some HoI mod that added an absurd amount of provinces everywhere, and especially in Africa. There's also The Map of Abominations, which I was convinced was designed by someone related to Iron Cross until I asked him. There's an upcoming 1980's Cold War mod that plans to use it that I'm actually kind of looking forward to- the Gulf War and the Yugoslav Wars could actually benefit from it.
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Jan 5, 2014 14:36
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Friend Commuter posted:Hahaha you're hilarious. The second largest nation in the Axis for most of the game isn't a major power?
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Jan 5, 2014 14:38
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Drone posted:The second largest nation in the Axis for most of the game isn't a major power? No it isn't. Italy isn't a fully industrialised country at the start of the war and does not have a modern equipped army and never managed to form one. Italy's main contribution to the war is to be a massive liability for Germany.
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Jan 5, 2014 14:44
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Kavak posted:Oh man, I gotta see where they say this. I was kinda "alright, sure, whatever" until I saw Africa, Saudi Arabia, the US and India in the map
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Jan 5, 2014 15:00
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Alchenar posted:No it isn't. Italy isn't a fully industrialised country at the start of the war and does not have a modern equipped army and never managed to form one. Italy's main contribution to the war is to be a massive liability for Germany. Having played an Italy game of DH Full ('36 scenario) where I turned the Med into an Axis lake and restored pretty much all of Justinian's borders, I think it's fair to say Italy isn't some backwater who's forced to play Santa's Little Helper to Germany. Doesn't mean it's not hard as gently caress to do, but Italy isn't exactly Luxembourg.
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Jan 5, 2014 15:08
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Drone posted:Having played an Italy game of DH Full ('36 scenario) where I turned the Med into an Axis lake and restored pretty much all of Justinian's borders, I think it's fair to say Italy isn't some backwater who's forced to play Santa's Little Helper to Germany. I've always wanted to try out Italy but they are just so weak and it's hard to really do anything with them. Although if you start early enough you've got time to take a bunch of African nations before the big war kicks off.
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Jan 5, 2014 15:30
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Demiurge4 posted:I've always wanted to try out Italy but they are just so weak and it's hard to really do anything with them. Although if you start early enough you've got time to take a bunch of African nations before the big war kicks off. That's the result of Italy modernising it's military way too early historically. Sorry! Is the 1933 DH scenario still hosed? Used to be that the early start makes the Soviets basically unassailable because of sheer economic power.
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Jan 5, 2014 15:38
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Riso posted:That's the result of Italy modernising it's military way too early historically. Sorry! I never use the '33 scenario because everyone's economic power just gets blown out of proportion. Supposedly the World in Flames II mod makes the '33 scenario a lot better, but I'm a little afraid to try it out because I imagine it's just some Paradox Forums Sperg's idea of a fun game (making Germany even more overpowered for dumb reasons).
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Jan 5, 2014 16:29
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Re: crazy numbers of provinces, I think a solution that could make both camps happy (the "We need more provinces for interesting troop movements" and "Holy poo poo, we need a manageable number of provinces" sides) would actually be pretty straightforward, and not even unprecedented for a Paradox game: decouple the number of places troops can be placed from the number of provinces. The most simple way to implement this would be to do what V2 does with having provinces lumped into states. So you can have the USA divided up into counties for the purposes of troop maneuvering, but all the infrastructure exists at a state level.
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Jan 5, 2014 16:52
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Doesn't HOI3 already do that? Can't remember since it's been so long since I've played.
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Jan 5, 2014 17:31
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Megadyptes posted:Doesn't HOI3 already do that? Can't remember since it's been so long since I've played. I actually don't know, but if it does, then I don't see why huge numbers of provinces are a problem. 
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Jan 5, 2014 17:45
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What I don't get about this maps with a billion provinces is why the provinces aren't very uniformly sized. Like you're increasing the number of provinces so that troop movement and warfare is better but then leaving it so that troops would move erratically and you won't be able to easily see who is moving where and to what. Move a troop from one side of the country to the other and they'll move in a weird zig-zag instead of a straight line.
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Jan 5, 2014 17:53
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