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Levitate posted:[INSERT NAME OF ROGUELIKE HERE] sure punishes the gently caress out of you for being impatient
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Jan 11, 2014 08:05
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No, in Sil opening anything is a perception check. You require SOME points in them to open a chest even after 1000 turns. I just think that after you open it you roll again against the trap, and if you've been spamming for a few hundred turns since your perception sucks you'll likely fail that one too and take damage. High perception is honestly really really useful, I'd rather risk low will on a lot of chars. It's spelt out in the Manual iirc but I don't have it on this comp
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Jan 11, 2014 09:33
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andrew smash posted:a crit out of nowhere from an orc champion, cut me from like 25 hp to dead. I'm not very good at Sil, but it really doesn't seem like a good idea to be in melee range of an orc champion on 25 hp - it's not exactly out of nowhere, those guys hit like trucks 
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Jan 11, 2014 09:35
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Unormal posted:
This sounds really good. I imagine you wouldn't want to recreate the original game, so I thought it might be interesting to make this one more freeform, cutting down on the linear setpieces and progression. Basically, give us a simple goal like most roguelikes do and let the player do his/her thing.
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Jan 11, 2014 12:13
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about CoQ spinoff
Unormal when are we going to be able to buy Sproggiwood? I want to give you my  already!
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Jan 11, 2014 12:28
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I had a good player going in Sil and then turned around a blind corner right into a special orc that I didn't want to go face to face with so I tried to back off into a hallway I already cleared and then an orc thief appeared at the other end and I was done hosed. That's the frustrating part about rougelikes, I"m not really sure I could have done something different...maybe, but sometimes bad poo poo just happens
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Jan 11, 2014 15:11
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_jink posted:ya there are lots of interesting challenges involved Actually, this. This is more what I expected ADOM tiles to be like, granted with a few more colors and maybe a little more detail, but this was the general look and aesthetic I always imagined. Those look really nice, by the way. I love the minimalism and the sepia tones.
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Jan 11, 2014 15:53
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andrew smash posted:Is it possible to force chests open in sil or are you poo poo out of luck if you haven't been pumping perception? You can use a staff of freedom or song of freedom.
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Jan 11, 2014 15:55
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Ignatius M. Meen posted:Unormal when are we going to be able to buy Sproggiwood? I want to give you my As soon as we're done with all the cut-scenes, dungeon balance, and UI Polish.  Probably Aprilish, but we're going to start inducting real Beta players this month. Lordfrikk posted:This sounds really good. I imagine you wouldn't want to recreate the original game, so I thought it might be interesting to make this one more freeform, cutting down on the linear setpieces and progression. Basically, give us a simple goal like most roguelikes do and let the player do his/her thing. Yeah, our current thinking is to give it in a much more restrained, focused scope; essentially the dungeon-diving of a single buried arcology, with a lot of detail, vs a sprawling, and somewhat unfocused, open world game. Unormal fucked around with this message at 23:30 on Jan 11, 2014 |
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Jan 11, 2014 17:00
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Levitate posted:That's the frustrating part about rougelikes, I"m not really sure I could have done something different...maybe, but sometimes bad poo poo just happens I go back and forth with them. They're easily one of my favorite genres of games, and I almost always enjoy games with rogueish elements. But at the same time they can be loving infuriating. I find Brogue almost intolerable (despite considering it to be really well designed), I quit playing FTL (same), and I really don't like Crawl's early game. Generally I take multi-month breaks, and I have an annual tradition of delving heavily around christmas (got my first 15 rune crawl win this year  ).It's very difficult to make a game hard enough to be genuinely challenging while not also including the possibility of bullshit killing you in a manner that feels unfair. People do have very high win % on very difficult roguelikes though, sometimes even chaining back to back wins, so its definitely possible to minimize the impact of the rng with good play - but reaching that point takes a lot of time. After my first ascension in Nethack, I won multiple classes in very short order - I had 'cracked' the game, and it was obvious how to proceed. But those skills definitely dull over time, I can barely remember item interactions now  Honestly I think I enjoy the wussier roguelikes more as I get older. Stuff like One Way Heroics might not be as satisfying as my first Nethack, ADOM, or Crawl victory, but its also way more approachable, fun, and I'm far quicker to recommend a game like OWH to friends or new players. I'm still waiting for a kickass gauntlet roguelike and a kickass fps roguelike. Both could be amazing.
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Jan 11, 2014 17:33
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It depends on the game. From what I understand Nethack is very nearly deterministic in the hands of a really good player, but I would never say that about Crawl, for instance.
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Jan 11, 2014 22:49
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I've been playing TowerClimb recently and just finished Chapter 1 of the beta (and there's still the bonus 100-floor mode left). It gives me exactly the same feeling of needing to focus completely on the game and manage resources properly to win as a good roguelike, but it also has nice (albeit low-res) graphics, great music and satisfying platforming. On the downside, the controls could be improved some, as it's a bit annoying having to hold down the run button to keep hold of things. You should buy this game if you like platformers even a little bit, especially since it's only $5.
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Jan 11, 2014 22:58
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Has anyone tried the "roguelike-like" piracy simulator Pixel Piracy (http://www.piracysim.com)? You control a pirate captain and his crew and do pirate-y things like plundering and ship capturing. The videos I have seen on youtube seem fairly interesting.
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Jan 12, 2014 02:22
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Unormal posted:As soon as we're done with all the cut-scenes, dungeon balance, and UI Polish. CoQ is probably my favorite newer roguelike, so I will give you my money as soon as you're willing to take it. Not just because I really love CoQ (and that 2.5 color tileset), but because the commercial roguelike space has been... not great. At least not great where non-hybrid roguelikes are concerned. Dungeons of Dredmor is pretty and has personality, but the tactical game isn't all that interesting. Then there's that Kerberos game the Pit, which is tactically more interesting, but doesn't look or sound as good and just feels like a poor clone of DoomRL. I know you guys know how to make a game fun and challenging, which is something that commercial roguelikes generally don't do very well, and you know how to make a game that just oozes atmosphere, which is something that most traditional free roguelikes don't do. I'm not saying that to suck up for a beta invite or anything since I'm going to be starting on a CS degree this spring in addition to my full-time job as a professional accountant/fraud investigator, so I probably wouldn't have time to be a very good tester, but I know a lot of people feel the same way about your company as I do, and I genuinely think you guys are working on something special.
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Jan 12, 2014 03:06
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MacGyvers_Mullet posted:CoQ is probably my favorite newer roguelike, so I will give you my money as soon as you're willing to take it. Not just because I really love CoQ (and that 2.5 color tileset), but because the commercial roguelike space has been... not great. At least not great where non-hybrid roguelikes are concerned. Dungeons of Dredmor is pretty and has personality, but the tactical game isn't all that interesting. Then there's that Kerberos game the Pit, which is tactically more interesting, but doesn't look or sound as good and just feels like a poor clone of DoomRL. Thanks for the kind words. We over-reached a bit in Sproggiwood's initial scope, and had to scale back the town portion to serve the adventure mode, which worked out to a much better result, but I'd have loved to do more with the town portion. It's a pretty different game than CoQ, being a really streamlined mobile game meant for short-duration play sessions. So, I hope we don't put off too many CoQ fans with such a dramatic shift in gameplay, but we're really trying to reach for broader accessibility and a really "pocket" play-style. I really dig Sproggiwood's plot and setting, so even with its very different play-style, I think people who appreciate CoQ's tone and setting will enjoy Sproggiwood's storyline. We're slowly getting better at scoping the games before we make them. In about 50 or 60 more games we'll have it all figured out, I'm sure. 
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Jan 12, 2014 03:13
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Unormal posted:We're slowly getting better at scoping the games before we make them. In about 50 or 60 more games we'll have it all figured out, I'm sure. Hah, here's to that.
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Jan 12, 2014 03:15
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Glad you like Qud. Even though Sproggiwood is a much simpler game, like Unormal said, we're working to make sure it's tactically challenging and fun. In scaling the town back we know that the game is going to rest on its tactical chops. We've also grown quite attached to Sproggi.
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Jan 12, 2014 03:18
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It depends on the game. From what I understand Nethack is very nearly deterministic in the hands of a really good player, but I would never say that about Crawl, for instance. you say that, but there's been multiple players able to win 20+ games in a row with different species/classes every game.
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Jan 12, 2014 04:02
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German Joey posted:you say that, but there's been multiple players able to win 20+ games in a row with different species/classes every game. Well we should make the point that they are far far more cautious than most players when they are on a streak.
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Jan 12, 2014 04:12
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Most players can't recognize when they should be cautious.
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Jan 12, 2014 05:19
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TOOT BOOT posted:Sample Screenshot of the new Unreal World tiles Reminds me of Dink Smallwood. In a way that is not bad. 
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Jan 12, 2014 06:20
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idiotmeat posted:Has anyone tried the "roguelike-like" piracy simulator Pixel Piracy (http://www.piracysim.com)? You control a pirate captain and his crew and do pirate-y things like plundering and ship capturing. The videos I have seen on youtube seem fairly interesting. I'm grabbing it now. Videos look good and the Steam forums aren't a steaming pile of "wah, this early access game is bullshit" complaints - which is highly unusual.
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Jan 12, 2014 07:05
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Jordan7hm posted:Most players can't recognize when they should be cautious. I find playing at that level of alertness constantly kind of draining honestly. Although playing roguelikes to relax is probably slightly silly as well
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Jan 12, 2014 08:54
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It's kinda weird how little community there is for roguelikes considering how many people play them. There's here and Bay12 and that's about it for finding other people who play.
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Jan 12, 2014 10:06
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TOOT BOOT posted:It's kinda weird how little community there is for roguelikes considering how many people play them. There's here and Bay12 and that's about it for finding other people who play. r/roguelikes is a pretty popular subreddit as far as they go.
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Jan 12, 2014 10:10
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Beamed posted:r/roguelikes is a pretty popular subreddit as far as they go. You must subscribe to some very small subreddits if you think that's a big or active one.
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Jan 12, 2014 10:55
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Sil is pretty much the ideal roguelike for me in terms of gameplay, difficulty, and lore (being a LotR nerd), but I can only play for a little bit before the ASCII really starts to grind on me. Saw earlier in the thread that there's a tiles version upcoming in a new version? Any date set on that? Seriously if Sil even had something like Crawl's tiles, I'm not sure I'd even install other games on my laptop.
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Jan 12, 2014 11:30
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TOOT BOOT posted:Sample Screenshot of the new Unreal World tiles These are not good tiles. I hope there's a grid overlay, because I have no idea what squares are being occupied by what in this screenshot.
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Jan 12, 2014 12:43
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oiseaux morts 1994 posted:These are not good tiles. I hope there's a grid overlay, because I have no idea what squares are being occupied by what in this screenshot. You know something you'd want to know EXACTLY how far away from you are.
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Jan 12, 2014 13:25
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God Mode posted:Sil is pretty much the ideal roguelike for me in terms of gameplay, difficulty, and lore (being a LotR nerd), but I can only play for a little bit before the ASCII really starts to grind on me. Theres been about one major update a year, and we just had one. Tiles is pretty big though, I don't know if I'd expect it that soon.
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Jan 12, 2014 18:57
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TOOT BOOT posted:You must subscribe to some very small subreddits if you think that's a big or active one. I only have it and AskHistorians. It frightens me to consider delving deeper. 
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Jan 12, 2014 19:11
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TOOT BOOT posted:It's kinda weird how little community there is for roguelikes considering how many people play them. There's here and Bay12 and that's about it for finding other people who play. there's the angband forums too.
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Jan 12, 2014 19:25
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andrew smash posted:there's the angband forums too. And then Temple of the Roguelike Anyone have some basic quick tips for Sil? I've been steadily getting a bit further each run but it's starting to cap out, enemies are just too hard to kill and too many of them. Apparently ALL THE ARMOR is kind of a bad thing.
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Jan 12, 2014 19:39
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There are big RL communities, but they're specific to the games. There aren't many general ones.
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Jan 12, 2014 20:25
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Pladdicus posted:And then Temple of the Roguelike I think debo made a good guide to getting to 400' consistently, but I'm not on that comp so you'll have to scroll back a dozen pages to find my c/p of it. Nutshell: 2/4/4/4 is flexible/good Pump melee/evasion and keep pumping No seriously, shopping for perks will kill you He described a light smithing build that's optimized to get past early game, that involves getting armoursmith + artistry then building a series of small objects with two improvements on their stats, ie a (+1)[1-5] Leather. Use longswords and medium armour, buy blocking if archers are roflstomping you, and don't be afraid to dive/reroll, since enemies give less and less xp the more you see them. But seriously, keep pumping melee/evasion and don't get surrounded, that's most of what it's about. Once you get to 400' you have to start dying a whole lot as the enemy set gets a lot cooler
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Jan 12, 2014 20:47
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Any suggestions for roguelikes that have a lot of 'discovery' and interaction? I've been playing a lot of TOME lately, which is fantastic, but I miss a lot of the item fun from Stone Soup (rare equipment, potions, scrolls, etc). I haven't played Nethack and that seems like one of the likely choices since apparently there's a ton of crazy stuff you can do. Is it something I could dive in and mess around with easily without much of a worry for actually winning?
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Jan 12, 2014 21:10
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The insane levels of item interaction and what you can do is arguably the core feature of Nethack. You have a level of freedom which I don't think any other roguelike quite reaches. This is both a good thing and a bad thing. You may want to look at one of the more recent forks of the game though (unnethack, nethack4, dynahack are the ones I can think of off the top of my head), which have a lot of quality-of-life improvements. Nethack4 is the most conservative in terms of what it changes (seems to focus more on usability than gameplay). ADOM owes a lot to nethack so it also has a number of weird tricks, but it doesn't quite reach the same level. There are a surprising number of obscure strategies in nethack, and I've been told new ones are still discovered occasionally. That is remarkable for a game that hasn't seen any major design changes since the late 90's.
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Jan 12, 2014 21:15
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I think it's kind of sad that Nethack was kind of abandoned, but to some extent, it had to happen - a lot of what makes Nethack Nethack is based on 20-30 year old dnd tropes and references that just aren't as meaningful today. But at the same time, no one has stepped up to produce a Nethack successor, at least, not what I would consider one. To some extent, I think the level of item interaction we see in Nethack is something that can be done far more easily in a text or even tile based game than any sort of 'modern' 3d environment. Games like Minecraft, oddly enough, are probably closer to the spirit of world interaction than many other rpgs (even something like the elder scrolls, lauded for being 'freeform' and open world). Nethack is definitely worth playing though, there is a lot of stuff that will make you smile or even laugh when you run into it. The absurdity of some of your deaths are pretty amazing.
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Jan 12, 2014 21:21
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Sil just got a quick bug fix releasequote:- monster songs
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Jan 13, 2014 00:49
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Tome 235, I always have weird display errors where it won't update where my character is properly. I read a fix somewhere a bit ago but can't find it. Anyone know how to fix?
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Jan 13, 2014 11:10
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