|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:A hopeless combination of envy from badgame-likers
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 08:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 07:20 |
|
|
The "best" part about the Skullgirls Saga is how after everything finally seemed over, Konami just had to give one last gently caress You and get the game de-listed. A game that was free money to them as long as it went on existing. Why?
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 09:04
|
|
|
If you hated SG on launch for its boring-rear end combos but own a copy of it you should definitely download the new version when it's out for your platform of choice. I can't guarantee it'll get you to like the game but it's way better than it used to be.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 13:47
|
|
|
I don't really understand the dick-riding about ST earlier in the thread, along with the poo poo-talking on IV. While ST does have a good focus on fundamentals and footsies, it has some of the dumbest gimmicks I've seen in fighting games. Claw wall-dive 50/50's after a hard knockdown, O.Sagat has tiger shots with negative recovery with insane damage on normals / specials, T.Hawk "HMM HMM HMM" loops, Deejay ambiguous cross-ups into touch-of-death, dictator touch-of-death setups, Ken knee-throw loop, O. Ryu 50/50 unblockable forward tatsu on first frame, etc... Skullgirls used to be bad because it was 2-minute long combos. Now it's 25/25/25/25 resets after the first hit when you're playing anyone competent. Then again, I'm just a lovely '09-er, so what do I know...
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 16:32
|
|
|
HoboWithAShotgun posted:Then again, I'm just a lovely '09-er, so what do I know... Then please be quite and let the grown-rear end men talk. Unless you know the Batman match-up, in which case, as you were.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 16:59
|
|
|
Skullgirls stll has psuedo-creepy character designs but the gameplay is pretty OK now. I mean, compared to the snorefest it was at launch, it's 10000x better, but it's still just OK. It's like, ten times better than most of the other stuff out as of the moment, gameplay wise. People should try it again, at the very least. It's by no means Guilty Gear, but it has tons of really fun, broken things in it to play around with.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 18:10
|
|
|
Gutcruncher posted:Yeah it (and MK9) are essentially 3D fighters in 2D, as opposed to something like SF4 where its 2D in everything but graphics. I always assumed the sluggishness from 3D games came from their long animations and slow movement speed and not the kind of hitboxes they use. And in Injustice's case I think NRS is just not good at making games. I'm curious how 2D hitboxes would make a difference.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 18:25
|
|
|
Doggboat posted:This is from a few pages back, but what difference does it make to have 2D hitboxes instead of 3D hitboxes? most 3d games have moves that startup at around 8 frames at minimum because of the animations and stuff (and have been tuned around this). Most 2d fighting games have moves that startup in the realm of 3-5 frames. It's less hitboxes and more animation. 2D games, on average, have faster activating and recovering moves.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 18:32
|
|
|
HoboWithAShotgun posted:I don't really understand the dick-riding about ST earlier in the thread, along with the poo poo-talking on IV. While ST does have a good focus on fundamentals and footsies [snip] This is pretty much what I was talking about before where players who get into the genre in the post-sf4 climate place a lower importance on fundamentals and footsies. You clearly have a view of fgs that places a lower importance on things that I see as essential and important. About the gimmicky poo poo in ST... generally most of it requires a bit of spacing to do. Ken has to land his knee bash to start his throw loop, t. hawk has to actually get in, deejay has to land a close knockdown, etc. Since moves in general do more damage in ST than in newer games, and because footsies actually work, you can beat another player while they try to set up their gimmick. That's what makes these things gimmicks. The key to winning in ST is not mastering a loop or a combo or a one-dimensional strategy, its more of actually playing the spacing game and having good fundamentals. Just like in other games, one-dimensional strategies can carry you through a lot of wins against bad players, but tourney champs aren't winning events with only the ken throw loop, or only the t.hawk throw loop, etc. Some of the poo poo IS really, really dumb (CLAW) but you still see most of the cast in ST tournaments and the characters are able to compete because the game is more than just the gimmicks that are in it. Zand fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Feb 8, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 18:38
|
|
|
HoboWithAShotgun posted:While ST does have a good focus on fundamentals and footsies, it has some of the dumbest gimmicks I've seen in fighting games. These things aren't "gimmicks" and they're things for the most part that only really matter at the highest level of play, where you have to be really amazing at the neutral game in the first place to get any of it going. Claw is the biggest offender because he just has really stupid tools at neutral to get his walldives going, and most everyone will agree that he's bullshit. Compare this to SF4 where there are several characters that can bypass the comparatively anemic neutral game altogether (Viper, Cammy, Adon, Fuerte, Seth and Sakura to a lesser extent) and have ridiculously strong mixups that lead into themselves, literal unblockables that lead into 50% combos, and so on. Not to mention characters like Akuma who completely dominates neutral against most characters and one knockdown puts you in a situation arguably worse than ST Claw.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 18:39
|
|
|
bebaloorpabopalo posted:These things aren't "gimmicks" and they're things for the most part that only really matter at the highest level of play, where you have to be really amazing at the neutral game in the first place to get any of it going. Claw is the biggest offender because he just has really stupid tools at neutral to get his walldives going, and most everyone will agree that he's bullshit. Compare this to SF4 where there are several characters that can bypass the comparatively anemic neutral game altogether (Viper, Cammy, Adon, Fuerte, Seth and Sakura to a lesser extent) and have ridiculously strong mixups that lead into themselves, literal unblockables that lead into 50% combos, and so on. Not to mention characters like Akuma who completely dominates neutral against most characters and one knockdown puts you in a situation arguably worse than ST Claw. O.Sagat is horseshit no matter what level of play you are.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 19:46
|
|
|
HoboWithAShotgun posted:I don't really understand the dick-riding about ST earlier in the thread, along with the poo poo-talking on IV. While ST does have a good focus on fundamentals and footsies, it has some of the dumbest gimmicks I've seen in fighting games. Claw wall-dive 50/50's after a hard knockdown, O.Sagat has tiger shots with negative recovery with insane damage on normals / specials, T.Hawk "HMM HMM HMM" loops, Deejay ambiguous cross-ups into touch-of-death, dictator touch-of-death setups, Ken knee-throw loop, O. Ryu 50/50 unblockable forward tatsu on first frame, etc... The thing about the things you listed is that it's not uncommon in ST to just kill someone off a jump-in combo anyway. Having different ways to kill someone once you get them knocked down or cornered is not worth as much as having a reliable way to knock them down or corner them in the first place. There are many ways to alter your movement in games like SF4, with all the focus attacks divekicks and aerial projectiles and such. But unlike a real 'airdasher', the defensive options aren't really built to handle that kind of movement. In ST dragon punch + sweep make for pretty much infallible anti-airs, so there's much less scope for 'cheating' your way in. If T. Hawk had a dive kick he'd be broken as poo poo, but as he is he has to rely on slow pokes and a really slow Condor Dive to get in. In the same vein Ken's throw isn't anything really special (Boxer/Dhalsim/Blanka/Fei et al. can do the same thing), and trying to do O. Ryu's unblockable mostly just gets you DP'd since the landing recovery makes it impossible to safejump. The one character whose gimmick actually overrides fundamentals and footsies and makes the midscreen game simple is Claw, and that's why a lot of people hate Claw. O. Sagat isn't even a gimmick, he's just a classic case of a dude whose numbers are too good. He's kind of like Honda in that either your character can deal with his bullshit or can't. Other than those two (and maybe Honda) I think all the matchups are sound; not in the sense of being perfectly balanced, but in being interesting to play. Redmark fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Feb 8, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 20:30
|
|
|
MrJacobs posted:O.Sagat is horseshit no matter what level of play you are. A lovely O.Sagat will get jumped in on and outfootsied at close range all day. He's a ridiculous character but it's only at the highest level he really "breaks" things, and is mostly soft banned in Japan just because he makes things boring more than the fact he's broken.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 20:34
|
|
|
It's all about O.Hawk, O.Hawk wrecks fools something fierce.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 20:57
|
|
|
El Estrago Bonito posted:It's all about O.Hawk, O.Hawk wrecks fools something fierce. When somebody mentions Hawk in an ST context you can just assume they mean O. Hawk.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 21:37
|
|
|
getitoffgetitoff posted:When somebody mentions Hawk in an ST context you can just assume they mean O. Hawk. Oooh, Hawk.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 21:40
|
|
|
getitoffgetitoff posted:When somebody mentions Hawk in an ST context you can just assume they mean O. Hawk. Not really, I'd say they're about evenly popular.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 22:01
|
|
|
Redmark posted:Not really, I'd say they're about evenly popular. Other than he's cooler (his super owns) does ST T.Hawk have any major advantages over O.Hawk outside of a rarely landed super. I remember there being some slight differences in normals, but I don't really mess with the O. character all that much.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 23:40
|
|
|
MrJacobs posted:Other than he's cooler (his super owns) does ST T.Hawk have any major advantages over O.Hawk outside of a rarely landed super. I remember there being some slight differences in normals, but I don't really mess with the O. character all that much. Are you a legit casual ST player in 2014? Like, you play the game, you play Hawk, but you aren't like super into it where you memorize all these crazy frame data and poo poo? That's... beautiful. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 23:48
|
|
|
MrJacobs posted:Other than he's cooler (his super owns) does ST T.Hawk have any major advantages over O.Hawk outside of a rarely landed super. I remember there being some slight differences in normals, but I don't really mess with the O. character all that much. No. O.hawk has a few normals that are slightly better, enough to make up for not having a super. N.hawk can option select into the super though, so there is that. Thats the main differences, without going into frame data about it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 23:53
|
|
|
MrJacobs posted:Other than he's cooler (his super owns) does ST T.Hawk have any major advantages over O.Hawk outside of a rarely landed super. I remember there being some slight differences in normals, but I don't really mess with the O. character all that much. My memory is rusty, but one of them had more range on the RH (I believe that's O.Hawk) and St. Hawk could tech (soften) throws and had the super. Not sure of what else beyond that off the top of my head.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2014 23:57
|
|
|
40 OZ posted:Are you a legit casual ST player in 2014? I don't know about casual, since I've been playing it off and on since whatever PSX collection had it, but I never got into high level play, mostly mid-level stuff with my friends who were into it. It's my favorite FG after CvS2.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 00:01
|
|
|
It's pretty marginal. You're going to have exactly the same game plan either way, so you're choosing between failing to do sick walkup 720s and failing to out-poke the opponent a little less. I don't play grapplers so there might be a bit more to it (since mashing jab is important to beat some things in ST having a better hitbox on it helps, and some of O. Hawks moves will hit low enough to reach certain hitboxes N. Hawk doesn't) but it does't transform any matchups as far as I know. edit: O. Hawk might be a good bit better against Blanka now that I think about it, since it's easier to jab out random balls and s.HK hits crouching Blanka hitbox. You don't really see that matchup though so 
Redmark fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Feb 9, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 00:26
|
|
|
MrJacobs posted:Other than he's cooler (his super owns) does ST T.Hawk have any major advantages over O.Hawk outside of a rarely landed super. I remember there being some slight differences in normals, but I don't really mess with the O. character all that much. Not being super into the game myself but from all the time I've spent randomly playing, N.Hawk seems to be a slightly worse O Hawk sans throw loop shenanigans. 40 OZ posted:Are you a legit casual ST player in 2014? More of us than you might think. I go to an arcade where there are still plenty of people who don't participate in the tournaments and just play the game for the hell of it along with more people still who just started playing. Hell, I only found I really enjoyed ST a couple of months ago. ST is plenty enjoyable to those who aren't super serious about it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 00:28
|
|
|
HoboWithAShotgun posted:I don't really understand the dick-riding about ST earlier in the thread, along with the poo poo-talking on IV.  (Yes I know that the anniversary edition where you can choose any version of any character is the official tournament version)
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:05
|
|
|
My impression was that not many people liked HSF2, because it was so overrun with CE characters.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:07
|
|
|
Hyper Fighting and Hyper SF2 are two different games.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:09
|
|
|
Yeah, HSF2 is a cute gimmick but it's largely unplayable due to poo poo like CE Dictator and a huge glut of "why would you pick them?" choices like nearly the entire WW cast.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:09
|
|
|
I wish they would revisit Hyper Street Fighter Alpha and un-gently caress the -ism selection. They went and added in new -isms just cuz, but then like a bunch of dummies they hid them and you can only select them if you know what youre looking for. Also give it an Arcade mode.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:10
|
|
|
Waterbed posted:Hyper Fighting and Hyper SF2 are two different games. Right, I was addressing the Anniversary Edition comment, because AFAIK, HSF2 = SF2AE Broken Loose posted:Yeah, HSF2 is a cute gimmick but it's largely unplayable due to poo poo like CE Dictator and a huge glut of "why would you pick them?" choices like nearly the entire WW cast. Doesn't WW Guile still beat the tar out of most of the cast?
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:14
|
|
|
inthesto posted:Doesn't WW Guile still beat the tar out of most of the cast? That's why I said nearly. The polar opposite of mega-damage counter-hit Ryu and Blanka, WW Guile is a merciless killing machine whose existence justifies the inclusion of WW characters in the first place.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:17
|
|
|
WW Guile rules https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mP3VcQ6uJI Also the version of Boxer that can combo 2 uppercuts. HF I think? getitoffgetitoff fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Feb 9, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 06:36
|
|
|
How do I stop getting scrubbed out by Zangief in Super Turbo, aside from picking O. Sagat? I mainly play deejay, and you just die so quick so fast.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 21:18
|
|
|
Elephunk posted:How do I stop getting scrubbed out by Zangief in Super Turbo, aside from picking O. Sagat? Don't let him close to you. Not really sure what else to say, Dee Jay can keep him out really really well, so just throw a ton of slashes and be on point with your AAs. If he's close to sweep range don't even try to outfootsie him, just run away.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 21:27
|
|
|
Jmcrofts posted:Don't let him close to you. Not really sure what else to say, Dee Jay can keep him out really really well, so just throw a ton of slashes and be on point with your AAs. If he's close to sweep range don't even try to outfootsie him, just run away. Deejay's antiair is cr. FP , yeah?
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 22:00
|
|
|
Standing strong, standing roundhouse, low fierce, and low roundhouse all work depending on the angle. I would say something about upkicks, but I think Gief has a pretty easy time beating those.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 22:15
|
|
|
Elephunk posted:Deejay's antiair is cr. FP , yeah? I think the best aa's in that matchup are upkicks if he's close, slide if he's a little further.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 22:47
|
|
|
There seems to be a big push to get more Arc System Works games on Steam, now that GG Isuka was just listed on there. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7llTGq7ctU
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 23:10
|
|
|
If you have charge then upkicks timed as late as possible (preferably strong/fierce version for the juggle) beat pretty much any aerial. Deejay can poke/footsies really well with his crouching normals and move forward with slide, so the only reason to not have charge is if Gief predicts a Max Out. He has to be pretty close, though, since you can slide under jumps from mid-range. If he does predict a fireball standing strong is pretty good as a panic button. Standing fierce is decent for the range where neither upkicks nor slide will work, but it has a bit of startup. Zangief can't lariat in as close as he can against Ryu, for example, because of DJ's slide range, so it's really all about not making any mistakes.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 23:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 07:20 |
|
|
This video has convinced me to stop playing Super Turbo for a bit and check out Hyper Fighting because god that's awesome.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2014 23:27
|
|