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Suprfli6 posted:DMeta / Hanzo / RSonia / Lilith / Lilith / DMeta is what I've seen posted, that assumes you have at least one max skill Lilith though. I think Echidna+Lilith can work too. I'm such a dope: That's the team I've been using, except I started using it before RSonia and was using Byakko instead. With Hanzo maxed, the only dangers were either getting boned by cascades on F1 before you're ready (which can still happen of course), or Byakko making too much blue on F4. I've been slowly dumping exp into a Zeus team just to try it differently and eliminate what risk the DMeta team presents, but once past F1 with RSonia, I can't imagine problems on the lits. e: I don't like the idea of having to skill RSonia up though to match Byakko's timer though. Ellaybee fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Feb 21, 2014 |
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Feb 21, 2014 21:07
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Cryohazard posted:Satan team talk! Vampire is made for him because gently caress hearts. Do you have a Gryps by chance? CDK is not a devil, he's balanced/dragon.
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Feb 21, 2014 21:08
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Tsurupettan posted:Vampire is made for him because gently caress hearts. Do you have a Gryps by chance? CDK is not a devil, he's balanced/dragon. Gryps -> DJ -> Vamp for massive burst. e: Or Persephone in place of those last two. ReidRansom fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Feb 21, 2014 |
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Feb 21, 2014 21:17
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ugh I cannot stall enough to get Bubblie ready for the stupid pirate dragon. pro tips? PS I NEED VAMP FRIENDS http://www.padherder.com/user/arachno/teams/#15367 because I want 9x dark 
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Feb 21, 2014 21:19
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ReidRansom posted:Gryps -> DJ -> Vamp for massive burst. DJ> Vamp does exactly the same thing, as does Persephone.
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Feb 21, 2014 21:22
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e: ^^^ derp. you're right  Smarmy Coworker posted:ugh I cannot stall enough to get Bubblie ready for the stupid pirate dragon. Skill up? They're not exactly difficult to farm, though you'd go through a lot of Sapphire Kings to get to max skill. But that and the two skill awakenings you'd get would probably do the trick. This is probably not possible before the dungeon goes away, however.
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Feb 21, 2014 21:25
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Here's my box again. Given that my current priorities are a) keep wrecking poo poo with Horus, b) get a preliminary Red Sonia team going, c) get an absurd Red Sonia team going, where should my XP be going for each color? I know Awoken Hera-Ur is very good for Sonia, but I need so much red XP for the rest of the team that I'm disinclined to give her any, and I don't know how much I should be focusing on Vamp or the Baddies since they won't be part of the absurd team. Also, do I need more Satans tomorrow, and what do I do with him?
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Feb 21, 2014 21:30
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Gryps is a good Satan sub but Grape is much better if you have one. Grape+Vamp does the same thing as Gryps+Vamp but you get absurdly imbalanced awakenings instead of just really good awakenings. Grape/Vamp/Bad Luci/Loki is really hard to beat.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:01
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tzirean posted:Here's my box again. Given that my current priorities are a) keep wrecking poo poo with Horus, b) get a preliminary Red Sonia team going, c) get an absurd Red Sonia team going, where should my XP be going for each color? I know Awoken Hera-Ur is very good for Sonia, but I need so much red XP for the rest of the team that I'm disinclined to give her any, and I don't know how much I should be focusing on Vamp or the Baddies since they won't be part of the absurd team. Since your Sonia requires a crapload of xp, I'd strongly consider feeding off-color to get some of them evolved and leveled; however if you see a specific need for your Horus team, obviously level said monster. You should also consider making a Shiva team where the Sonias can also act as subs for that team. You should get 3 more Satans to fully awaken yours.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:02
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Did some stoning on super metals last night and today and got my Dmeta team up to pretty decent levels. I'm finding Dmeta a lot of fun, stuff just blows up. I do need more dmeta friends though, 319 177 238.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:17
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two_step posted:Did some stoning on super metals last night and today and got my Dmeta team up to pretty decent levels. I'm finding Dmeta a lot of fun, stuff just blows up. I do need more dmeta friends though, 319 177 238. Use the friend finder on padherder, it's pretty useful and reaches people not just in the thread.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:20
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Furious Lobster posted:
Wasn't there talk about how it's better to just farm tamadras from metal dragons instead of evolving Satans for awakenings because of the work involved?
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Feb 21, 2014 22:35
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Furious Lobster posted:Use the friend finder on padherder, it's pretty useful and reaches people not just in the thread. I like people in this thread better though 
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Feb 21, 2014 22:35
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Shark Tower posted:Wasn't there talk about how it's better to just farm tamadras from metal dragons instead of evolving Satans for awakenings because of the work involved? If you can do Twinlits it's no contest, Tamadras all the way. If you can't just farming metal dragons is pretty close to even plus you get all the Highs and Kings as a bonus. Of course if you're swimming in Mystic Masks, Dub-mythlits and Keepers of Dark that changes things.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:38
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Shark Tower posted:Wasn't there talk about how it's better to just farm tamadras from metal dragons instead of evolving Satans for awakenings because of the work involved? Besides Heartbreakers, I really find it less time consuming to farm multiples and saving the tamas for REM stuff. BGrifter posted:If you can do Twinlits it's no contest, Tamadras all the way. If you can't just farming metal dragons is pretty close to even plus you get all the Highs and Kings as a bonus. Even though I farm Twinlits easily and quickly, I still have way too many REM monsters that need awakenings; and in the context of the poster who asked the question, he has multiple Sonias and other monsters that would require the tamas v. the Satan.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:44
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I too am looking for an ultimate Satan team, especially one ideal for Trifruit. Things I have to go with him: Loki Finn King Baddie Shirtless Vamp Awoken Hera Beelzebub Drawn Joker (not busty) Ronia (unevolved) Persephone (unevolved, not busty) I imagine I'll have time to evolve/busty whatever I need to before Trifurit comes around again, but I'd like to be ready. Most of these things are also missing Awakenings, but I have 9 Tamadra, so I can put 3 on Satan, 1 on Gryps, 3 on Loki, and 2 on Ronia to get all potential row awakenings, if that makes for the best Trifruit team.
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Feb 21, 2014 22:56
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Goddamn, how does this game somehow always knows exactly what you don't want? To the goon earlier who's got too many highlanders, I'll trade you one of my many many berserks. And while we're on the subject of ideal Satan teams, Satan/ Satan/ Satan/ Vamp/ Vamp/ Satan friend  (and like 240 cost I think :notsmug:)
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Feb 21, 2014 23:00
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Furious Lobster posted:Since your Sonia requires a crapload of xp, I'd strongly consider feeding off-color to get some of them evolved and leveled; however if you see a specific need for your Horus team, obviously level said monster. You should also consider making a Shiva team where the Sonias can also act as subs for that team. Shiva is just behind the first Sonia in priority, for use both as a team leader and as a Sonia sub. Furious Lobster posted:You should get 3 more Satans to fully awaken yours. Roger.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:00
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Shark Tower posted:Satan/ Satan/ Satan/ Vamp/ Vamp/ Satan friend While I doubt I'd be ready for the next Trifruit, I am currently at 236 Team Cost. Given enough Super Metals (and a return of Twinlits for awakenings) this is completely doable in my not-so-distant future.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:04
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SaucyLoggins posted:Can a fellow Bastet user help me come up with an all-around team so I can focus my exp in my box. http://www.padherder.com/user/SaucyLoggins/ King Shynee helps for boss spikes, but you need a heartbreaker (valk) to push the spike.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:04
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Furious Lobster posted:Even though I farm Twinlits easily and quickly, I still have way too many REM monsters that need awakenings; and in the context of the poster who asked the question, he has multiple Sonias and other monsters that would require the tamas v. the Satan. Not really sure how that changes anything? It's still an enormous stamina investment in materials and evolution mats. Using duplicate Satans means diverting stamina that could be used to farm the Tamadras needed into farming evolution mats. Even without taking into account nice event bonuses like 2x Tamadra rate or Tamadras in Pengdra Village it's still a better deal to just keep farming jewel dragons unless you're drowning in evolution materials with nothing to use them on.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:12
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Furious Lobster posted:I still have way too many REM monsters that need awakenings; I'm sure you do.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:14
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Shark Tower posted:Wasn't there talk about how it's better to just farm tamadras from metal dragons instead of evolving Satans for awakenings because of the work involved? Yes but people tend to not understand how to correctly factor statistical variance and opportunity cost into the conversation (hint even with Satan it's probably better to farm multiples and awaken that way but it's still heavily contextual).
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Feb 21, 2014 23:17
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Shark Tower posted:Goddamn, how does this game somehow always knows exactly what you don't want? To the goon earlier who's got too many highlanders, I'll trade you one of my many many berserks. NewcastleBrown posted:While I doubt I'd be ready for the next Trifruit, I am currently at 236 Team Cost. Given enough Super Metals (and a return of Twinlits for awakenings) this is completely doable in my not-so-distant future. This isn't ideal at all, though. You get the same number of row awakenings as Grape/Vamp/Bad Luci/Loki but with no enhance, no 50% damage boost, no movement extend, and 5 fewer skill charge awakenings.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:19
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BGrifter posted:Not really sure how that changes anything? It's still an enormous stamina investment in materials and evolution mats. Your argument presumes that the stamina required for farming tamas from jewel dungeons is less than that of farming evolution and experience materials, which from my own anecdotal evidence and others' is not the case. Furthermore, the farming tamas in jewel dungeons is also an enormous and often a foolhardy endeavor compared to farming materials, which can be guaranteeed. Also, the rate never increases to 2x and at best it was a 1.5x increase, which to some people really helped and to others it didn't make one whit of a difference. Lastly farming pengdra village for tamas is a fool's errand at best. Also, since you fail to address the question in terms of the poster's intentions, the Satan is a nice monster to have but since he has so many other monsters with a higher priority in receiving tamas for awakenings that farming evo materials for those monsters as well will incidentally benefit the materials needed to get the Satan multiples evolved. Putting it another way; he's going to need a lot of evo mats anyways so the necessary investment will also indirectly benefit gathering materials for Satans as well.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:21
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Yes! Beat my first Descended (that being Hero Descended of course)! And 0-stoned it to boot!  I know it's probably the easiest one, but hey, I have to start somewhere.It was with a mono-Dark team with evolved D/D Batman, evolved Pandora, Lv. 5 Drawn Joker (so not quite max, but close enough), Lv. Max Duke Vampire Lord, and Underlord Arch Hades, with an evolved AA Lucifer as a friend. So it took a while, but I wanted to play it safe. The game was surprisingly kind too, with me getting enough dark orbs when needed and none of the monsters ever syncing completely. Got a Berserk out of it. I'm fine with either one considering I don't have one or the other. Not really in a rush to go through it again right now, though.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:22
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I'm of the view that at my current state it is 100% worthwhile to throw Tamadra at Tamadra farming teams. No other teams need them now, as I can clear most decendeds with one team or another just the way they are. Getting my Tamadra farming teams up and blasting means more Tamadra to feed to those other teams that don't really need them right now.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:22
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BGrifter posted:Not really sure how that changes anything? It's still an enormous stamina investment in materials and evolution mats. Hey speaking of pengdra village, will tamadras have a chance to appear in it tomorrow since there's an event running? Or will we not know until the daily news tomorrow?
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Feb 21, 2014 23:22
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God I fucking love Diablo 3 gold, it even paid for this shitty title
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BGrifter posted:Not really sure how that changes anything? It's still an enormous stamina investment in materials and evolution mats. Let me help you. Evo mats and monster exp are both relatively low variance stam investments Farming tamadra (even in twinlits) is a relatively high variance stam investment You can also factor things like rank exp and +egg drops into this conversation if you want to, but I digress.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:25
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DaveWoo posted:According to the PAD Forum, yes, the update contained info for the 3 Indian god ultimate evos, along with Dragon Zombie and ultimate Ifrit/Divinegon/Tiamat. Welp guess I know what I'm doing tomorrow so that I can maybe get a team for RO Ace setup.  Alternately, if GC collab comes back, a UFO team might work since the boss cuts off 99% of your HP, ensuring you're in the boost zone no matter what.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:34
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mphill posted:Gryps is a good Satan sub but Grape is much better if you have one. Grape+Vamp does the same thing as Gryps+Vamp but you get absurdly imbalanced awakenings instead of just really good awakenings. Making me really hate that I got shafted on the last Godfest and got no Loki.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:35
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rivals posted:Yes but people tend to not understand how to correctly factor statistical variance and opportunity cost into the conversation (hint even with Satan it's probably better to farm multiples and awaken that way but it's still heavily contextual). I'm loosely familiar with the statistical methods that (I think) would be used, but am utterly incapable of actually doing them... It'd be based on average stamina per awakening taking into account the evo materials needed (and maybe xp needed, using super metals?) and then coming up with a range for some given likelihood of getting the drops in that range (making up numbers, say 120-180 stamina to have a greater-than 80% chance of an awakening with each method) to account for drop rate variance? I mean, technically, averaging the expected stamina based on drop chance already accounts for this, but I could see that with Tamadra being pretty rare, a risk adverse person might want the relative "certainty" of spending (again, making up numbers) 250 stamina to get the awakening by evolving a Satan (given the drop chances for the xp and his mats are much higher, and there are multiple steps, making it extraordinarily unlikely you would spend, say, double the "average" stamina) versus there still being a (say) 20% chance of spending double the average stamina to get a tamadra. Any chance you've got the statistics background (and time) to actually calculate the average stamina per tamadra based on PADForum drop rates and the average stamina per evolving a Satan (assuming super metals at average xp per stamina from PADForum data and the drop rates of the mats where available? Then do an expected stamina for 80%+ chance?
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Feb 21, 2014 23:35
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The biggest argument against using tamas to awaken Satan is the upcoming nerf to Twinlits. If the current version continued to make an appearance every event ad infinitum, I would awaken everything ever with them, because I'm lazy. We don't really know what the true stamina cost of farming a tamadra will be, though. So I'm going to focus on REM monsters until we do know.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:38
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Zierham posted:I'm loosely familiar with the statistical methods that (I think) would be used, but am utterly incapable of actually doing them... It'd be based on average stamina per awakening taking into account the evo materials needed (and maybe xp needed, using super metals?) and then coming up with a range for some given likelihood of getting the drops in that range (making up numbers, say 120-180 stamina to have a greater-than 80% chance of an awakening with each method) to account for drop rate variance? I mean, technically, averaging the expected stamina based on drop chance already accounts for this, but I could see that with Tamadra being pretty rare, a risk adverse person might want the relative "certainty" of spending (again, making up numbers) 250 stamina to get the awakening by evolving a Satan (given the drop chances for the xp and his mats are much higher, and there are multiple steps, making it extraordinarily unlikely you would spend, say, double the "average" stamina) versus there still being a (say) 20% chance of spending double the average stamina to get a tamadra. I could but  Like I said though, it's still contextual based on other monsters in your box too. Those variables include main teams, REM monsters with useful awakenings, how useful those are comparatively, and how often those teams are used. There's also the human aspect that factors into it. I have almost no patience for high-variance farming so that makes my view on it biased. I'd much rather farm up 3 Satans at 0 stones each and experience and mats at a roughly known rate than drop 400 stam into metal dragons and get unlucky and have gently caress-all to show for it. I mean, I ended the last event with 12 tamadra and they've all found great homes on non-farmable mons so even at that point if I had the choice to go back and not awaken my satan manuall I wouldn't do it. There's also the tamadra nerf where tamadra in twinlits and (I think) trifruits are going to be babby tamadra so it further constrains the resource. efb on that last point.
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Feb 21, 2014 23:42
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rivals posted:Let me help you. Tamadra from Twinlits: 180/80% success rate = 225 stamina Evolve Satan: 50 (get him) + 30 (RK) + 15 (Dark Keeper; 50% chance you get one from RK, otherwise run again) + 93.75 (mask) + 93.75 (dubmyth) + 170 (900k dark xp from super metals at 3 high, 1.1 king, .9 supers per run) = 452.5 I'm not going to do stat to come up with confidence intervals for these, but I have a pretty strong suspicion that the tamadra method comes up significantly ahead the vast majority of the time. e: though I do agree with you that it's circumstantial, at least to an extent. I also agree that the (potential!) Twinlit nerf would affect it, though if we have officially started getting event tamadra, that affects it too. mphill fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Feb 21, 2014 |
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Feb 21, 2014 23:52
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mphill posted:Tamadra from Twinlits: 180/80% success rate = 225 stamina
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Feb 21, 2014 23:59
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On the whole "how to awaken Satan" question, my advice would be to just run Metal Dragons regardless. If you're lucky and get some Tamadras, great; if not, well, you'll still end up with a whole bunch of King Metals to feed to your spare Satans. That's what I did, and it worked out just fine for me.
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Feb 22, 2014 00:12
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Haha, with all of this Satan talk, I decided to run a couple of metal dragons to start leveling up the 3 extras I have for awakenings. First run got me a Tamadra.
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Feb 22, 2014 00:45
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Got missed on the last page apparently, I'm looking for some advice for putting together a good team to take on Satan tomorrow for the least amount of stones. Help!? http://www.padherder.com/user/robodrew/monsters/
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Feb 22, 2014 00:53
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berserker posted:Got missed on the last page apparently, I'm looking for some advice for putting together a good team to take on Satan tomorrow for the least amount of stones. Help!? You could try: Bastet/Echinda/Verche/Zeus/Angelion/Bastet It would be hard to stall for skills and that 35% nuke would really help on Satan, but 16x every turn is a tough order. Kuros fucked around with this message at 01:06 on Feb 22, 2014 |
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Feb 22, 2014 01:04
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