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Rollersnake posted:Hey, uh, I made fanart, of sorts. This is awesome, you're awesome.
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Feb 21, 2014 05:40
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Rollersnake posted:Hey, uh, I made fanart, of sorts. I can honestly say when I woke up this morning, when I clicked on a new post from the TO:LUCT LP I had no idea it would involve Canopus being cheered on by rednecks, 11 year olds, and people who watch two ripped dudes in a soap opera.
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Feb 21, 2014 18:49
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waah posted:I can honestly say when I woke up this morning, when I clicked on a new post from the TO:LUCT LP I had no idea it would involve Canopus being cheered on by rednecks, 11 year olds, and people who watch two ripped dudes in a soap opera. It's perfectly apt, isn't it? 
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Feb 22, 2014 05:26
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Neurion posted:It's perfectly apt, isn't it? While I'm amazed that you can put wings on created characters in that game, what really sold it for me is the Rock's expression. If I didn't know better, I'd say that Canopus is about to hit him with a Stunner, which is apt if you think about it.
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Feb 22, 2014 18:54
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I am goddamn dumbfounded. We refused to kill people, it actually seems like it's working out for us in the long run, and Vyse is some cringing Saturday-morning cartoon henchman.
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Feb 24, 2014 04:54
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Helmet 10 Warehouse, as part of this being an RPG, I have become a horrible master of it. Besides the madness it also means I could make effortposts on classes using fell knowledge not meant for mortal man, if you like. I'll not spoil any special classes until we get them, like White Knight. And I can easily avoid story spoilers. I'll have to mention elemental weapons and augment element equipment nigh constantly, though.
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Feb 24, 2014 05:42
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:Helmet 10 Warehouse, as part of this being an RPG, I have become a horrible master of it. Besides the madness it also means I could make effortposts on classes using fell knowledge not meant for mortal man, if you like. Yeah, as I get more towards the end game it's pretty ridiculous how much stronger elemental augments make your late game weapons. I mean just wow.
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Feb 24, 2014 15:38
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I've been sick the past couple of days, so I haven't had it in me to work on the next update yet. However, I did do a lot of grinding. Also I changed Denam's class because having two Swordmasters was kind of silly.Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:Helmet 10 Warehouse, as part of this being an RPG, I have become a horrible master of it. Besides the madness it also means I could make effortposts on classes using fell knowledge not meant for mortal man, if you like. Sounds great, effort post your heart out.
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Feb 25, 2014 15:26
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Yes OFS, please post. I have been "finishing" the POTD for 2 years now. Anything to make this less of a pain as I finish out my laSt few roster spots would be just great.
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Feb 25, 2014 16:19
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Let's start with some technical disclaimers. Every nonmonster class can use (though not always learn) every recruitment skill, ~ology, elemental augment and attenuate, status resistance and proof, Tactician I and II, Swiftfoot, Jump, and Wade I, Trajectory, and all 4 ranks of Field Alchemy. These will be omitted due to their sheer redundancy. Every class also has the first two ranks of Fortify, Resistance, and Spell Ward, and the first three of Truestrike, Trueflight, Dodge, Sidestep, and Constitution. I'll note the highest ranks of these skills the class gets, since it kind of matters. If a skill is entirely absent that means the class doesn't get it at all, like Expand Mind for classes with no MP. Monsters do not get weapon skills, recruitment skills, Swiftfoot, Jump, or Field Alchemy. They're kind of odd. Warrior  Races: Human, Winged, Lizardman, Lamia, Orc, Skeleton RT: 32 Move: 4 Jump: 2/3 Weapons: Fists, Daggers, 1H Swords, 2H Swords, Axes, Hammers, Cudgels, Whips, Bows [1H], Crossbows [1H], Thrown Armor: Heavy Support: Rampart Aura II1, Counterattack IV, Knockback IV, Strengthen IV, Fortify III, Resistance II, Truestrike IV, Trueflight III, Dodge IV, Sidestep IV, Spell Ward II, Constitution IV Other: Parry, Deflect, Overpower, Wade II, Siege Action: Mighty Impact, Double Impact Special: N/A 1: They can use the skill, but not learn it. It must be learned in a different class. Soldier's the run-of-the-mill frontliner. They get a lot of weapon types, though the value of weapon ranks means switching a lot isn't really advised. Mighty Impact's 100% hit and auto-crit are handy, and Double Impact is a big boost to damage output. Access to Rampart Aura helps them control the flow of enemies while also ensuring dudes stay near them to get impacted in one way or the other. Warriors are technically competent, to be sure, but their biggest problem is they have a lot of competition with no real reason to be picked. Ninjas and several special jobs get Double Attack to do the whole "hits twice" thing without having to spend 50 TP in the first place. Several other generic classes are competent frontliners but can do other things, like Knights with Heal and Instill Light for example. You've got classes that hit harder, take hits better, and have other tricks like magic or special moves. Why bother with Warrior when you've got so many better options? The early early game they're fine, as you don't have that many classes. Late-story those other classes are all running about and the warrior struggles to even matter until you hit early-postgame, when they finally get Double Impact and elemental weapons to... almost keep up with other classes, but not quite. Unless you've got a very specific obsession, namely hitting twice with a 2H weapon or with a shield equipped, they don't have anything to make them stand out. It's a hard life for the Warrior, ain't it? Orange Fluffy Sheep fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Feb 27, 2014 |
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Feb 26, 2014 23:55
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I find Warrior generally more useful than Berzerker, but the most use I ever got out of the class was from my lizardman until Juggernaut became available. Even so Warrior might be your best option for a lizardman on the frontlines—it's a matter of sheer power vs maneuverability.
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Feb 27, 2014 00:49
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Yeeeeeeeessssssssss, MSPaint classes
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Feb 27, 2014 01:10
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I enjoy my winged warriors. Not the most effective for sure, but for heavy weapons and holding down the line while flying I don't think I can think of anything better.
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Feb 27, 2014 01:44
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In my last playthrough I used two winged warriors (+ Canopus as a Vartan) for chapter 1/part of chapter 2 and they rocked rear end. Winged mobility brings so much to the table that it more than makes up for downsides to the class. Unfortunately I recruited them with extremely low loyalty, and it got to be a pain in the rear end to try to manage it. Oh well. They gave room for Sara and Arycelle.  Unrelated, but I played with a Juggernaught lizard for a while too, and she was a pain train. Demihumans are kinda fun when they have good classes available.
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Feb 27, 2014 06:11
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Yeah I usually make my lizard dudes Warriors until Juggernaut and Hoplite become available. They kick rear end in chapter 1, Mighty Impact is awesome while accuracy is still an issue and enemy frontliners don't have Steadfast yet. Later on (after I get Folcurt) I usually make Voltare a Warrior and use it sparingly. Love the art, OFS!
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Feb 27, 2014 11:52
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:In my last playthrough I used two winged warriors (+ Canopus as a Vartan) for chapter 1/part of chapter 2 and they rocked rear end. Winged mobility brings so much to the table that it more than makes up for downsides to the class. As you said, the birdpeople just own in general. That mobility 
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Feb 27, 2014 13:07
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:Unfortunately I recruited them with extremely low loyalty, and it got to be a pain in the rear end to try to manage it. Oh well. They gave room for Sara and Arycelle. I had a similar issue until I realized how loyalty works. Especially with warriors you just need to get ranked skills leveled up. So while it may not be optimal maybe equip say fists and 1h swords and hammers. Everytime you gain a level in any ranked skill you get +10 loyalty. So why would you equip multiple skills on a low loyalty warrior? Everytime you get hit with a weapon your weapon rank goes up a little too. So you can game the system just a little to help make less time to gain ranks in those other skills. This also works for mages and elemental augments. Once you get weapons that have elemental effects just go to town raising loyalty through augment/weapon skill ranks. It helps to not wait until the screen is red though. If you have to manage a unit with loyalty that low, it's better not to deploy them and read gamefaqs or other Internet site for decisions that will raise loyalty through story decisions.
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Feb 27, 2014 18:35
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I got a Lich earlier today! Now to wrap up the PoTD as quick as possible, level her up, and kidnap an orc just to see what classes it has! Or I could beg someone in here to post an orc's list for me. I'm pretty sure gremlins have familiar/rogue just like faeries do, though. To celebrate getting a class this late in the loving game, it's the class that made it all possible! Archer  I imagine he's trying to determine if that vague shape of a dude in the distance is the enemy commander, or Donnalto. Races: Human, Winged, Skeleton, Lizardman, Lamia, Skeleton, Orc RT: 26 Move: 3 Jump: 2/3 Weapons: Daggers*, Bows, Crossbows, Thrown Armor: Medium Support: Counterattack III, Knockback II, Strengthen IV, Fortify IV, Resistance II, Truestrike III, Trueflight IV, Dodge III, Sidestep IV, Spell Ward II, Constitution IV Other: Parry, Deflect, Overpower Action: Eagle Eye, Double Shot, Tremendous Shot Special: N/A *Sticker, Baldur, and Damasc daggers only. The archer is the ranged equivalent of the warrior. As you might imagine, being able to attack more than one panel away is a huge bonus. You might also think the archer is balanced by some weakness. It's really not. The only generic class to get 2h bows, the archer is in a unique position of being able to hit, like, seven to a dozen panels away without having to bother to move. This allows archers to focus every fiber of their being on making arrows hit harder, and boy do they get to hit hard. A good archer can one-shot enemy mages without any sort of boost and one-shot nearly everything with tremendous shot. Seriously, golems are like the only exception because they take minimal damage from piercing. An amazing number of battles end up being your frontline letting the archers get shots in on the boss, and this plan works because archers get drat brutal. Their shots beat the warrior's impact in practicality due to this range and sheer oomph. If they do have weaknesses, it's the obvious inability to do much in melee. Their daggers are basically token inclusions and having a dagger means having a 1h bow. Sometimes, the 2h bows get insane ranges like 6-9 that make shots awkward because you have to be so far away. Denam also has a bad habit of running up to fortified positions head-on and yelling at them, leaving your archers terrain that can hinder shots, like large height differences and obstacles. Still, those are minor compared to what the archer brings. It's easily the best class in the game, in terms of how much value it generates throughout the game. The rear end-beginning of the game, when all you have is shortbows, is the only point they don't dominate. Bows never leave them wanting past that, and sometimes you get crazy things like Seige Bows +1 having on-hit Bound, or the elemental bows allowing the archer to cast instill element spells on themselves or friends. They're always ready to pick off mages, soften up knights, or sometimes just pick off everything that even looks at you funny as they chain tremendous shots. While they can use crossbows proficiently, there's other classes that get 2h crossbows, but only archers get the 2h bows that let them rain arcing terror on enemies. Trajectory is also a great use of a skill slot because it lets you know which shots are possible or not, saving a lot of time and grief figuring out arrows's physics and flight paths, and sometimes it can shock you with how crazy of a shot is possible. Have I gushed about archers enough I can do it all day. It and a unique spellcaster class are the only classes of which I run multiples.
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Mar 1, 2014 21:53
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:It and a unique spellcaster class are the only classes of which I run multiples.
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Mar 1, 2014 22:13
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PFlats posted:You can run multiples of a unique class? That seems... wrong. It's unique in that only unique characters get it. White Knight is one, for example. I suppose "special class" is a better name.
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Mar 1, 2014 22:21
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It's really only my commitment to variety that has me running just two archers (Canopus + a hawkman generic). You could dominate with a party consisting of only archers. They're amazing.
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Mar 2, 2014 05:22
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:Or I could beg someone in here to post an orc's list for me. I'm pretty sure gremlins have familiar/rogue just like faeries do, though. I've never used Orcs, as by the time you can recruit them you've already invested so much effort into other characters that it seems pointless -- however thanks to a little bit of hacking, I can tell you that Orcs can take the classes of Warrior, Archer, Wizard, Rune Fencer, Terror Knight, Berserker, Hoplite, Juggernaut, and Patriarch. Also, even though it's not exactly a class-specific thing, I'm surprised you didn't mention how awesome the Bow finishers are. Dark Weight does not require any sort of line of sight, and can strike targets that a regular arrow could not (i.e. behind a wall.) It deals Piercing damage, has increased accuracy the more TP you use, and has a chance to Leaden what it hits, which can be a very useful debuff on maps with great changes in elevation. Slumber Shot, like the remaining two skills, does require line-of-sight and uses the crossbow bolt collision detection rather than the arcing arrow's. It deals Crushing damage, also has increased accuracy with higher TP, and has a chance to put the victim to Sleep (provided they survive the finisher, that is.) Flaming Blast deals Crushing damage, again has increased accuracy with higher TP, gains the Fire elemental affinity (so Augment skills can be put to use for increased damage), and has a chance to Charm the victim. Empyreal Shot deals Crushing damage, has increased damage with higher TP, has the Lightning elemental affinity, and has a chance to Shackle the victim. So again, Archers are absolute beasts, and with these finishers they become even more overpowered.
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Mar 2, 2014 05:56
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Neurion posted:Flaming Blast deals Crushing damage, again has increased accuracy with higher TP, gains the Fire elemental affinity (so Augment skills can be put to use for increased damage), and has a chance to Charm the victim. They clearly didn't think this move through, if I use a finish on someone I plan for them to die, no point in charming them.
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Mar 2, 2014 06:04
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Leal posted:They clearly didn't think this move through, if I use a finish on someone I plan for them to die, no point in charming them. Sure they did. Love hurts.
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Mar 2, 2014 06:26
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Orcs can be: Warriors, archers, wizards, rune fencers, terror knights, berserkers, hoplites, juggernauts, and patriarchs. Edit: Neuron already said something about this. Reading comprehension fail. I do however really like the Orc sprite. If you rush recruit a Lich from the last floor of the pirate graveyard in chapter four, you can get orcs in time to make one or two worth while. waah fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Mar 2, 2014 |
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Mar 2, 2014 20:41
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Oh boy, OFS is doing class write-ups. Guess my write-ups are no longer needed. Looking forward to your insights, OFS!
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Mar 2, 2014 20:57
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There's an achievement/title for beating the game without having any of your units get so much as incapacitated. The only time I got it without save-scumming on a new game was with an army made of archers.
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Mar 2, 2014 21:42
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Ogre Battle never really did it for me, but god drat I love this game.
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Mar 3, 2014 02:10
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I only run one archer, where I am in the postgame. Archers are super-great but somewhere between "normal game" where archers are arrow-raining death turrets and "late game" a bizarre thing happened and my mages are all my turbo'd up killing machines now. I have some melee and stuff too. They mostly stand in the way of things.
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Mar 3, 2014 14:45
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Around the time you get level 3 missile spells and Spellcraft II, magic users really take off with damage and close the gap between them and archers. (Now I hope this isn't the moment where someone tells me Spellcraft is useless just like Strengthen/Fortify  )
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Mar 3, 2014 17:23
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:While they can use crossbows proficiently, there's other classes that get 2h crossbows, but only archers get the 2h bows that let them rain arcing terror on enemies. 
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Mar 3, 2014 17:24
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Bregor posted:Around the time you get level 3 missile spells and Spellcraft II, magic users really take off with damage and close the gap between them and archers. No, spellcraft is glorious. As are augment [element]. If you are having trouble with your mages leveling their augment skills, weapons with elemental affinities rank up just as fast if not faster. Get a ninja with two elemental katanas and watch how fast you hit augment [elemement] 8. Then change back to a Mage and be utterly amazed at how powerful your spells are. Add chokers for even more fun.
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Mar 3, 2014 17:30
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waah posted:No, spellcraft is glorious. As are augment [element]. If you are having trouble with your mages leveling their augment skills, weapons with elemental affinities rank up just as fast if not faster. Get a ninja with two elemental katanas and watch how fast you hit augment [elemement] 8. Then change back to a Mage and be utterly amazed at how powerful your spells are. Add chokers for even more fun. Boy I feel stupid for never using Ninjas now. Not that my mages weren't powerful enough aready, but this would have been nice to know.
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Mar 3, 2014 17:33
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theshim posted:I usually stuck a 2H crossbow on Canopus and let him go to town. He gets kind of insane with one (insofar as he is not already, because Canopus) and it lets him stay in his default class for some variety. I did this too. I'd go so far as to say the flight plus top-tier 2h crossbow use makes the noble vartan the superior crossbow abuser. Especially since the crossbow finishers are so, so much gooder than the bow finishers.
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Mar 3, 2014 17:45
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Ninjas just speed it along. I got plenty of mages that spent time as front line fighters to help their augment skill up. Catiua as her hybrid special class with a holy comet whip wnded up being a stroke of genius for me. For example, whips kinda suck, but holy comet is light element. Constant training of augment light is a great way to make a powerful light magic user. In addition, remember that if you put a front line fighter in the line of melee danger, even if he isn't a ninja he might get 2 or 3 hits with his weapon and counterattack per round which is just as good as ninja double attack. Rogues work too with daggers and spamming the crap out of speedstar. Edit: added spoilers, been through so many times I forget what is spoilers and what isn't. I am sorry if I ruined it for anyone. waah fucked around with this message at 01:12 on Mar 4, 2014 |
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Mar 3, 2014 17:46
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doomfunk posted:I did this too. I'd go so far as to say the flight plus top-tier 2h crossbow use makes the noble vartan the superior crossbow abuser. My very first playthrough I never used crossbows because they're typically weak in most RPGs and Arycelle/Canopus were doing fine with bows. Then I was messing around in Phorampa and someone used Brimstone Hail on me  Now I abuse the poo poo out of them. Crossbow Dragoon absolutely wrecks beasts and dragons 
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Mar 3, 2014 17:52
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I can't remember if one of the obscure Neutral route party members was a Knight trained in crossbow, or if I just got the idea to make him that, but it almost made me not regret using a Knight in the first place. Yeah, I used Tamuz for a while, because who the gently caress is Tamuz?
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Mar 3, 2014 18:05
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Bregor posted:My very first playthrough I never used crossbows because they're typically weak in most RPGs and Arycelle/Canopus were doing fine with bows. Then I was messing around in Phorampa and someone used Brimstone Hail on me Chaining Beast/Dragonslayer has never been more fun 
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Mar 3, 2014 20:38
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waah posted:Ninjas just speed it along. I got plenty of mages that spent time as front line fighters to help their augment skill up. SPOILERS
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Mar 3, 2014 23:58
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Bregor posted:(Now I hope this isn't the moment where someone tells me Spellcraft is useless just like Strengthen/Fortify 40 points of magic are all that separate two of my light magic casters and one can barely crack >1 numbers and the other regularly shaves a third to half of a thing's HP with Judgment II. Then there's mages with 40 more than that and they can't not one-shot things with summons. Since you've got me talking about spellcasters, let's talk about the basic one! A note, some classes have different names depending on the user's gender. This has no practical difference. Wizard/Enchantress  "Don't tell anyone, but the beard's a fake. I can't grow a whisker, but how could anyone respect a smooth-faced magus?" Races: Human, Winged, Lamia, Orc, Skeleton, Ghost RT: 25 Move: 3 Jump: 1/2 Weapons: Daggers*, Hammers**, Cudgels, Armor: Light Magic: Air, Earth, Lightning, Water, Fire, Ice, Dark Missile, Indirect, Status, Drain Support: Fortify II, Spellcraft IV, Resistance IV, Truestrike III, Trueflight III, Spellstrike IV, Dodge III, Sidestep III, Spell Ward IV, Constitution III, Insight IV, Expand Mind IV, Channeling IV Other: Reflect Damage II, Absorb MP II Action: Meditate, Conserve RT, Engulf Special: N/A *Sticker, Baldur, and Damasc only **Caldia only The Wizard/Enchantress is your first dedicated elemental spellcaster, and for most of the game the only one whose classmarks you can obtain without wanting to die. The damage spells are not really exceptional until later, when you get higher ranks of Spellcraft and access to elemental augmenting stuff. Thankfully, until that happens wizards can fling statuses on allies and enemies. As the enemy regularly disregards Spell Ward, you can often get 100% hit rates, and swing the flow of battle in your favor pretty easily. A well placed Balmy Breeze or Petrifog can take out 3 enemies at once, and a good Stormspark or Petriburst can make that dragon at which you are chipping away not use Toxic Breath. When the damage starts to pick up, well... The Wizard is outclassed by several other classes. And I don't mean the way the Warrior is, where other classes fill the niche. I mean, these classes literally do everything the Wizard does and more. Witches have the same spells the Wizard do, but they get spellbooks, Light's missile and indirect spells, and Draconic magic. Necromancers have even less RT than the Wizard, and have Necromancy (obviously). Liches may have slightly more RT, but have hella INT and even more elemental magic. And spellbooks. And Necromancy and some Draconic. That's just generic classes. Warren's Astromancer, for one, makes Wizards look like goddamn punks.  : Lanselot, hey, Lanselot. : What's up, War-man?: Look at that punk. He thinks he's a mage, but he can't even cast Abyss.: Did the jester pillage a wardrobe for fun or do you seriously think you're a mage? : My mom thinks I'm cool.  Conserve RT sounds neat... until you notice it costs 16 RT itself. Engulf makes status spells hit farther, but those both take 1) a lot of RT the Wizard doesn't accumulate too quick 2) RT and Actions better spent on Meditate. At rank 1, Meditate enables casting a I missile or a 20 MP status spell every turn. At higher ranks, you're dropping summons and II and III indirects and coming out ahead. Sounds like that'd be an edge but... pretty much every other dedicated elemental spellcaster gets Meditate. Witches, Necromancers, Liches, Warren's Astromancer, all get Meditate as well. They really don't get anything to themselves. I mean, Wizard's worth it in the early game, before the other spellcasters have availability, but if a Magus Mark drops then whoooops Wizard's completely worthless now. It's only good for getting other guys Meditate at that point. Quite a shame, really.
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Mar 4, 2014 01:30
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