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Lawlicaust posted:Just finished it and all I can say is: drat. I thought the avalanche was over then I read the last Adolin and the Szeth and the Wit chapter. Double, Triple, Quadruple drat. Holy crap this book.
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Mar 5, 2014 08:19
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Jesus christ, chapter 80 is heart wrenching. I feel so bad for Elhohar 
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Mar 5, 2014 08:25
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Near end of book: Ok so if Radiant shardblades are bonded spren, where do Radiant shardplates come from? I've only seen them in Dalinar's visions from the first book, perhaps they have to progress further along as a Radiant?
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Mar 5, 2014 08:49
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The Gardenator posted:Near end of book: End of book spoiler At a guess, the bondsmith order creates spren-man bonds.
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Mar 5, 2014 08:57
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Jesus, that was one hell of an ending. So when does the next book come out? Edit: I wonder what Elhokar's truth will be to become a light weaver The Glumslinger fucked around with this message at 10:14 on Mar 5, 2014 |
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Mar 5, 2014 10:07
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Kaladin you goddamned idiot! Who the hell made him judge jury and executioner? Even with the personification of honor on his shoulder telling him it's a bad idea he wants to kill the king. He really pisses me off, worst kind of bigot
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Mar 5, 2014 12:56
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Ahhhhh, you guys read too fast.
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Mar 5, 2014 14:01
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Was that Nightblood there at the end? How the hell?
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Mar 5, 2014 14:50
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The Glumslinger posted:Jesus, that was one hell of an ending. It would certainly explain his Shardplate
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Mar 5, 2014 15:44
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L-O-N posted:Was that Nightblood there at the end? How the hell? At a guess, which could be completely wrong, Hoid. He gets around. Apparently also has one of (Mistborn trilogy spoiler aheadbits of metal that turn you into a mistborn, too. Mind you, he doesn't have a monopoly on inter-world travel.
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Mar 5, 2014 19:44
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I know some people have been doing this, but could people put up what chapter their spoiler is in, like specifically? Chapter 7 I kept thinking dead Jasnah had to be some sort of trick or something and then got sad when I read the intro part of the next chatper. Sanderson loving Martin'd me.
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Mar 5, 2014 19:48
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The Glumslinger posted:Jesus, that was one hell of an ending. worldbuilding, end of book I figure chapter 80 might count.
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Mar 5, 2014 20:01
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api call girl posted:worldbuilding, end of book I figure chapter 80 might count. I doubt it, because he probably hasn't said the first words. Though he did mention to Kaladin that the symbolheads did go away after Kaladin appeared, so maybe. Also, what are the first words, because I've been up until 2AM reading two nights in a row and now I can't think for poo poo
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Mar 5, 2014 20:12
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Lobsterpillar posted:At a guess, which could be completely wrong, Hoid. He gets around. Apparently also has one of (Mistborn trilogy spoiler aheadbits of metal that turn you into a mistborn, too. Mind you, he doesn't have a monopoly on inter-world travel. Cosmere spoilers the ardent who teaches about shard blades is from another book. It's Vasher. All the color metaphors. Etc.
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Mar 5, 2014 21:37
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Just finished it. Goddrat. I still think The Emperor's Soul is Sanderson's single best work, but practically everything past the halfway point was making a good try. Hype as hell for the next book. It's supposed to be about Szeth, I think, and the tentative title is Stones Unhallowed, a term which was used in description of Urithiru. I expect it'll be relatively laid back, with at least one plotline dedicated to exploring the city. Besides, this book's climax had Kaladin becoming An Anime. The pace has to back down a little... right?
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Mar 5, 2014 22:06
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In the last chapter, did I miss something or did Dalinar make up that bit about sucking in stormlight before he knew about Shallan and Kaladin? He says he's done it before, but I don't remember seeing any hints about it. e: Also, from the chapter 87, I guess Moash is the new Szeth or Shen. Narmi fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Mar 5, 2014 |
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Mar 5, 2014 23:18
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Narmi posted:In the last chapter, did I miss something or did Dalinar make up that bit about sucking in stormlight before he knew about Shallan and Kaladin? He says he's done it before, but I don't remember seeing any hints about it. I'm guessing it happened during or after his final fight with Szeth. He was carrying an Honorblade, after all, so he had the ability.
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Mar 5, 2014 23:33
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Mygna posted:I'm guessing it happened during or after his final fight with Szeth. He was carrying an Honorblade, after all, so he had the ability. That wasn't an Honorblade, though. It was just a regular dead spren Shardblade. The question now becomes why did Taln have a Shardblade and where is his Honorblade?
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Mar 5, 2014 23:52
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I'm done. It was good, although I did burn through it pretty damned quickly. I really like Shallan as a character, and while I enjoyed Kaladin in TWoK, I found him a bit too same-y in this one. I do like Syl though. I feel like Sanderson was a bit more open with the cosmere stuff this time, which I kind of regret - I always like to see on a re-read some hint about the overarching universe, and knowing (serious cosmere spoilers!) that Wit was a worldwalker and constant cosmere character made it much easier to zoom in on his actions and words to get greater insights on first-pass. The nightblood cameo was out of nowhere, though, and I'm not really sure what I think about it. It did make obvious the identity of another character in retrospect. I do need to re-read the letter from this book though, I generally skimmed the chapter headers at best. Other spoilerish thouhts: There are a ton of different groups working at cross purposes. Ghostbloods, the Sons of Honor, that Herald killing radiants, Taft's family, the Seventeenth Shard folks, Wit/Hoid. It kind of boggles the mind. It's particularly weird since I never really got a sense from my readings of the true scope of the threat of Odium or the Voidbringers, much less what would motivate so many disparate secret societies to choose different ends-justify-the-means routes to prevent them from coming back. Sure, the visions were dark, but even if the Voidbringers are returning, the impression we're left with after WoR is that even 'ordinary' shardbearers can fight them on a scope of hundreds to one, and the Radiants are coming back. The Everstorm in particular didn't seem all that scary as written. I guess we'll have to see the scope of the desolation more explicitly in the next book, in a couple years.
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Mar 5, 2014 23:59
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Fezz posted:That wasn't an Honorblade, though. It was just a regular dead spren Shardblade. The question now becomes why did Taln have a Shardblade and where is his Honorblade? Ending spoilers: Sanderson makes a point of describing the blade Dalinar uses at the end, saying it looks like a cleaver. It's obviously not the same weapon Taln has. Additional more spoilerish spoilers: Hoid probably stole the honorblade. He's hanging out when Taln shows up, and he runs off for a while after hanging out with Shallan's caravan. He replaced it with a normal shardblade.
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Mar 6, 2014 00:01
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Generic spoilersEven if a normal shard bearer is good against the Voidbringers in the rest of the world there aren't actually that many. And the Parshmen seem to be deeply ingrained in the Rosharian society. So much that they seem to be an ever present background detail. All of then turning into StormForm would probably be very devestating. Also they haven't started bringing Thinderclasts yet. I don't imagine giant rock men would go down easy for normal people either
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Mar 6, 2014 00:17
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Worldbuilding, end of book I think the Everstorm actually unleashes all the Odium-spren. Venli had to get those stormform spren from somewhere special--if those spren were already out and about some listeners would have already turned to stormform/etc. before now.
VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 00:46
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Ending spoiler Really the Everstorm is serious bad news just because it's coming from the opposite direction from normal highstorms. We've seen how pretty much every thing living on that planet has adapted to highstorms, and they've even shaped the landscape. And now there's one coming from the wrong direction for those adaptations and fortifications to work. Parshmen turning into Stormform, Thunderclasts, Odium's fragments pulling some new bullshit - all of that is just (potential) side effects of a highstorm hitting cities as well-prepared for it as a real Earth town would be.
Fetucine fucked around with this message at 01:17 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 01:07
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End of book spoilers: I got the distinct impression that Pattern was purposefully not calling the parshendi in stormform "Voidbringers". When asked about the parshendi Voidbringers, it responded by saying things like "bonded ones?". It did say that the stormspren were a type of voidspren. I just thought it stuck out how Pattern was speaking about it. The characters don't have any real idea of what Voidbringers are from the histories, other than the vague reports: glowing red eyes, have long spindly arms, and some other descriptions that led the characters to question if the chasm fiends were Voidbringers. My guess is that we still haven't see the true Voidbringers yet, I would expect a voidbringer to be roughly the equivalent to a radiant. The parshendi as Voidbringers just weren't a big enough threat compared to their reputation -- thunderclasts looked worse. 17,000 parshendi all in stormform + 1 shardbearer got annihilated by what, 30-40 K Alethi soldiers and like 3 active sharebearers? Give Szeth a suit of shardplate, a bunch of stormlight, and he would have killed the entire parshendi army if given enough time.
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Mar 6, 2014 01:53
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Ending spoilers I definitely think the Everstorm is bringing in more types of voidspren "themissingpiecePushfortheAlethitodestroythemoutrightbeforethisoneobtainstheirpowerItwillformabridge", but even with just Stormform parshmen to begin it's pretty drat bad. The Parshendi army is minuscule compared to all the Parshmen in Roshar. And all those Parshmen are in farms, towns, and cities among civilians; away from armies. We could well see the infrastructure and population of the world demolished after the first pass. It definitely seems so far that voidspren are the voidbringers, and parshmen are just favored hosts. Some spren can bond to rocks and become thunderclasts. Who wants to see what happens when one bonds with a chasmfiend? Oh, and don't forget the west half of the continent. They've never even *seen* a highstorm before. Their livestock don't have shells, their crops can't hide, and their buildings aren't buried or reinforced.
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Mar 6, 2014 02:10
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Don't read this post till you've finished the bookVelius posted:Other spoilerish thouhts: Yeah, I have the same feeling to some extent. Throughout the entire first book, the Everstorm and the Voidbringers seemed like these monstrous threats, where one or two of them could wipe out a squad of soldiers. I know in the epilogue Hoid said that things were different this time, so maybe their individual fierceness isn't the same. Overall, despite how much I really liked the book and most of the character progression, I can't help but feel like we got too many answers and now we don't have the same kind of obvious questions that we did after the first book. IDK, maybe I've just read too much Wheel of Time. api call girl posted:Worldbuilding, end of book I think the Everstorm actually unleashes all the Odium-spren. Venli had to get those stormform spren from somewhere special--if those spren were already out and about some listeners would have already turned to stormform/etc. before now. This wouldn't surprise me at all. I mean while the stormform parshendi are obviously dangerous, they don't really seem like the type of threat that could literally destroy the world. Even with them being scattered so much through the world as slaves, I still can't help but feel like there are more dangerous forms left. Plus we had that vision of dalinar's with that giant stone monster, and we aint seen anything on that scale yet. The Glumslinger fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 03:09
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Finished the book. I really enjoyed it. A few things though. Did it ever mention where the Parshendi who didn't become stormform went to? I hope some of them escape the Everstorm and show up again. I really enjoyed the few chapters that were from their point of view. Lopen at the end of the book was pretty heart warming with him being so sure that he could take in stormlight even since he say Kaladin do it. Does anybody else think that all the other spren we meet in the book are way better then Syl? They all seemed to have more personality than she did. I guess part of it has do to with her constantly having to tell Kaladin that what he is doing is stupid. Though when the Stormfather mentions when talking to Dalinar the first time that his daughter is disobeying him I got pretty pumped.
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Mar 6, 2014 03:14
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WoR ending spoilers etc why even read this thread what are you doing hereMcGrady posted:My guess is that we still haven't see the true Voidbringers yet, I would expect a voidbringer to be roughly the equivalent to a radiant. The parshendi as Voidbringers just weren't a big enough threat compared to their reputation -- thunderclasts looked worse. 17,000 parshendi all in stormform + 1 shardbearer got annihilated by what, 30-40 K Alethi soldiers and like 3 active sharebearers? Give Szeth a suit of shardplate, a bunch of stormlight, and he would have killed the entire parshendi army if given enough time. The parshendi were brand new to the form and they were self-directed. They were unable to control their red lightning power thing - they couldn't even hit the targets they wanted to hit. Half of their forces were away from battle the whole time, too, busy summoning Odium's spren/the Everstorm. The parshmen + full access to all forms + under full control by their gods are the voidbringers, or at least a significant component of them. Narmi posted:In the last chapter, did I miss something or did Dalinar make up that bit about sucking in stormlight before he knew about Shallan and Kaladin? He says he's done it before, but I don't remember seeing any hints about it. I'm guessing it might have something to do with when he goes to the surgeon for a wound in his shoulder during the Big drat Final Battle and the surgeon says "you have so much scar tissue here how many times have you wounded your shoulder in your life" and he's like "i don't remember" and the surgeon says that he shouldn't even be able to move his arm
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Mar 6, 2014 04:04
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The Glumslinger posted:Jesus, that was one hell of an ending. That he's a bad king IMO. Or he's failed his fathers legacy or something like that. spootime fucked around with this message at 04:40 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 04:29
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spootime posted:That he's a bad king IMO. Or he's failed his fathers legacy or something like that. Do we have any indication that he is even aware of what he is? He clearly had no clue by the end of book 1, and from part of his discussion with Kaladin, it doesn't seem like he knows by the end of WoR. Even if he speaks A Truth, does it count if he hasn't said the first oath or isn't actively embracing his nature as a radient? Also, I'm going to a Sanderson book signing thing, so if anyone has some questions, I'll try to ask them EDIT: Also, just realized that no one has mentioned Sadeas yet. While on one hand, I am glad to see him finally get killed, on the other hand, I really feel like he never lived up to expectations this book. We see three major plans from him this book: Trying to stop people from dueling Adolin, trying to assassinate Dalinar, and releasing the dream papers. While these are all pretty underhanded and dirty plots, I never got the sense that he might actually win the struggle with Dalinar. There was never really a sense that any of foreboding about these plots and I was never really waiting to see what he would try like I did in the first book. I just feel like he should have been a far bigger threat than he was, and now that he is dead I don't see anyone else in Alethi camp who can be the same kind of problem The Glumslinger fucked around with this message at 05:05 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 04:42
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The Glumslinger posted:Do we have any indication that he is even aware of what he is? He clearly had no clue by the end of book 1, and from part of his discussion with Kaladin, it doesn't seem like he knows by the end of WoR. Even if he speaks A Truth, does it count if he hasn't said the first oath or isn't actively embracing his nature as a radient? His widow. Well, that and Mraille and the other Ghostbloods/misc factions. Speaking of factions, I can't help but think there are WAY TOO MANY of them now. Diagram, Ghostbloods, Skybreakers(?), the dude Szeth picks up at the end, whoever Amaram is working with, the Seventeenth Shard, Hoid, etc. Too much happening under the surface, and more than half of them seem to be doing the same things for different reasons but are still working "against" each other. It even seems like more than a few of those factions shouldn't even exist by now since the Final Devastation/Everstorm has actually arrived, yet there they are. VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 05:26 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 05:22
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api call girl posted:His widow. Well, that and Mraille and the other Ghostbloods/misc factions. I agree, way too many secret factions and clubs. I'm already losing track of what secret sect certain people belong to and I imagine it will only get more convoluted as the story goes on. With the whole vasher and nightblood thing its becoming apparent that previous sanderson reading is going to be pretty much required for this book series. I'm not sure how I feel about that.
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Mar 6, 2014 05:36
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The Glumslinger posted:Do we have any indication that he is even aware of what he is? He clearly had no clue by the end of book 1, and from part of his discussion with Kaladin, it doesn't seem like he knows by the end of WoR. Even if he speaks A Truth, does it count if he hasn't said the first oath or isn't actively embracing his nature as a radient? after dalinar et al got radiant powers, with the voidbringers coming back, it's just not credible that the alethi wouldn't unite behind him, even though the radiants have a bad reputation. sadeas playing some sneaky game would mean nothing in the face of all that. narratively, he had to go. the tension from alodin possibly getting found out for murdering a lighteyes has bigger drama potential than any kind of machinations sadeas could have pulled. shallan getting put between the alethi and the ghostbloods, as well as the diagram and whatever szeth is mixed up in could fill the role of causing internal tension as well
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Mar 6, 2014 05:39
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Law Cheetah posted:after dalinar et al got radiant powers, with the voidbringers coming back, it's just not credible that the alethi wouldn't unite behind him, even though the radiants have a bad reputation. sadeas playing some sneaky game would mean nothing in the face of all that. narratively, he had to go. the tension from alodin possibly getting found out for murdering a lighteyes has bigger drama potential than any kind of machinations sadeas could have pulled. shallan getting put between the alethi and the ghostbloods, as well as the diagram and whatever szeth is mixed up in could fill the role of causing internal tension as well End of Book Spoilers Yeah, the big issue is that Sadeas didn't have any cards to play. His arguments after they get to the city are pretty weak, it's hard to go "yeah, this dude was lying about teleporting us to an ancient city". Killing him off gives Adolin something to be dark about an provides tension with his truthseeker brother, his honor-dude buddy, his fellow murderer betrothed and the rest of the lighteyes. I'd expect it to be a major point in the next book, potentially dealing with the justice stuff from the assassin.
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Mar 6, 2014 05:51
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spootime posted:I agree, way too many secret factions and clubs. I'm already losing track of what secret sect certain people belong to and I imagine it will only get more convoluted as the story goes on. I'm sure Sanderson will explain the things like nightblood when they actually start to be featured more. Right now it and recognizing that character from his other books are showing up are just cool easter eggs for fans. Kind of along with this does anybody think the setting for the series will shift to another world? It seems like Odium's plan would kind of lead to him traveling elsewhere at some point. Though being called The Stormlight Archives kind of makes the current world the most important one.
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Mar 6, 2014 06:00
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Going by the epigraphs Odium has now attached himself to Roshar somehow and might not be able to escape. Going by his previous modus operandi, he would visit a world and kill its Shard then move on. The only reason he's been able to kill Honor on Roshar apparently has been because he split himself to match it, Odium-spren vs Honor-spren.
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Mar 6, 2014 06:05
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api call girl posted:Speaking of factions, I can't help but think there are WAY TOO MANY of them now. Diagram, Ghostbloods, Skybreakers(?), the dude Szeth picks up at the end, whoever Amaram is working with, the Seventeenth Shard, Hoid, etc. Too much happening under the surface, and more than half of them seem to be doing the same things for different reasons but are still working "against" each other. It even seems like more than a few of those factions shouldn't even exist by now since the Final Devastation/Everstorm has actually arrived, yet there they are. You're probably going to have to add the ardents to that now too after what happened to Pai/Kholinar (unless Pai was somehow manipulated by Taravangian to destabilize the Alethi capitol so he could come in as its savior . It didn't really feel like that though). Narmi fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 07:26
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Narmi posted:You're probably going to have to add the ardents to that now too after what happened to Pai/Kholinar (unless Pai was somehow manipulated by Taravangian to destabilize the Alethi capitol so he could come in as its savior . It didn't really feel like that though). I think that's really more in the category of a general "welp, the home country's hosed, can't rely on them for help, we're on our own" kind of thing rather than the ardents in this selection being yet another secret faction.
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Mar 6, 2014 07:34
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worldbuilding/end of book My guess on the shardplate is that every Radiant has 2 Surges, one primary and one secondary. The dpminant spren becomes the blade, then they bond with the subordinate for the armor. The Stormfather spren seems to have a lot to do with assigning spren, so now Dalinar having bonded Stormfather as Bondsmith may be able to assign/craft new fully powered plate.
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Mar 6, 2014 07:52
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api call girl posted:I think that's really more in the category of a general "welp, the home country's hosed, can't rely on them for help, we're on our own" kind of thing rather than the ardents in this selection being yet another secret faction. I meant it more like the church is another group that have to be contended with/appeased now thanks to the queen's behaviour and the corruption of the ardents around her. They're not a secret organization like the others, it's more that there seems to be a few ardents who are dedicated enough to their religion to put their lives on the line for their beliefs even if that means going against the established order, as well as ardents who want to accumulate power to live a life of luxury. It'll lead to rebellion in which they become the moral compass, and that leads to them being in a position of authority/power, which they're not allowed to have since they lost some war awhile back. Add the voidbringers coming back to the corruption/oppression of the lighteyes, and I can see people looking to religion for answers, then raising them up to power at the expense of the established order. Narmi fucked around with this message at 09:34 on Mar 6, 2014 |
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Mar 6, 2014 09:30
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