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Pycckuu posted:So why aren't you in engineering then? Be the change you want to see in the world and all that. Because I'm male and I went to pharmacy school instead where the ratio was roughly 60:40 women to men. E: which doesn't even count as an egregious imbalance Eej fucked around with this message at 02:25 on Apr 7, 2014 |
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Apr 7, 2014 02:22
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Wait, so you are a guy who a) never studied engineering and b) believes that women should be raised differently so that more of them will "want" to become engineers? I don't necessarily disagree with you, but how did you arrive to hold point of view? Also, did you know that fields like chemical, biomedical, textile and material science engineering have quite a lot of women in them? As far as I know, the only really male dominated fields are electrical engineering, computer science, and mechanical/aerospace engineering. Hell, even nuclear engineering is full of girls.
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Apr 7, 2014 02:42
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Pycckuu posted:Wait, so you are a guy who a) never studied engineering and b) believes that women should be raised differently so that more of them will "want" to become engineers? I don't necessarily disagree with you, but how did you arrive to hold point of view? My theory is that the 18 year old boys in any of those fields are such twerps that any scientifically inclined woman will choose another field of science.
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Apr 7, 2014 02:55
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For those interested in more SJW stories this is a pretty good compilation of the worst of the worst http://wtfsocialjustice.tumblr.com/
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Apr 7, 2014 03:26
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Suben posted:Mehreen got on Riley's bad side because she made a post talking about how people on Tumblr talk a lot but never actually do anything. They don't protest or demonstrate or anything like that and that if they want to change things they need to do that. She's Pakistani-American but her family is from Pakistan and she's been living there for a long time and is working as a teacher there. Anyway that post pissed off someone (sotrieu I think) who's part of Riley's little Tumblr circle who immediately started crying about how she's ableist because some times people aren't able to protest and how she's also racist becaue if you're black you don't want to go to jail. Who the gently caress are these people? Are they internet celebrities, or are these just members of a SJW tumbler community you guys read on the reg? Is this a well known internet drama?
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Apr 7, 2014 03:56
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Last Buffalo posted:Who the gently caress are these people? Are they internet celebrities, or are these just members of a SJW tumbler community you guys read on the reg? Is this a well known internet drama? It's both. They're (fairly) well known personalities within the tumblr social justice sphere. Yes, they spend most of their time backstabbing and denouncing each other as ideologically impure. This is the phenomenon people are referring to when we talk about tumblr SJWs. As for how big tumblr activism actually is in reality it's hard to say, but at least among my friends IRL many of them are big into tumblr, though not necessarily social justice tumblrs. It's definitely A Thing, though exactly how big is up for debate. I can say for sure it's exploded in the last few years. Some light googling reveals this Mehreen person has been involved in other high profile slapfights before http://www.dailydot.com/society/tumblr-social-justice-laci-green/ icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Apr 7, 2014 |
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Apr 7, 2014 04:04
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Dusseldorf posted:My theory is that the 18 year old boys in any of those fields are such twerps that any scientifically inclined woman will choose another field of science. As an engineering student who transferred out of a discipline that was 90% men in my college (my current major is 60-40 men which as mentioned isn't too bad) I can confirm this.
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Apr 7, 2014 04:58
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Did you transfer out because the curriculum was not your thing, or because the dudes weren't hot enough? This is important to me as an up and coming engineer.
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Apr 7, 2014 05:12
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Pycckuu posted:Did you transfer out because the curriculum was not your thing, or because the dudes weren't hot enough? This is important to me as an up and coming engineer. I don't think he's gay / a girl. The way I read it he transferred out because being around MRA autists 24/7 is unappealing.
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Apr 7, 2014 05:25
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I was out with my arab friend one day and this really hyper looking white girl came up to him and started apologizing for the racism he must experience and how it's unfair how Muslims are treated in America and blah blah blah. We just wanted to grab a few drinks and shoot the poo poo, not hear about cruel injustices in a loving bar of all places. The motherfucker is Christian and doesn't take poo poo from anyone, so it was just awkward all around. I always equate a social justice warrior with this experience.
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Apr 7, 2014 05:32
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Pycckuu posted:Wait, so you are a guy who a) never studied engineering and b) believes that women should be raised differently so that more of them will "want" to become engineers? I don't necessarily disagree with you, but how did you arrive to hold point of view? Short answer: I wandered out of my upper middle class bubble. Longer answer: "Increasing female enrollment in engineering" is not the end goal that I am concerned about. It's only relevant to the discussion because it can be used as a measure of gender disparity. If somehow enrollment at all post secondary programs becomes roughly balanced between males and females it's not like you unfurl a banner saying "SEXISM IS OVER". There are so many little things expected of men and women in society that it's hard to pick apart exactly what actually leads to certain behavioural changes. It can be big things like how you perceive a given profession (and whether you express interest in it) like how men aren't secretaries or nurses or really tiny things that still affect how you behave like "men don't like girly drinks". I mean of course the answer should be "Well who the gently caress cares about how you drink your alcohol" but society teaches us to value our masculinity/femininity and failing to live up to that is seen as a negative thing. I mean, when I was a kid I was part of the problem too. I made fun of guys for being metro and girls for being butch and it was all hilarious because "wow what a fag lol". Looking back at it now I'm ashamed at my behaviour because I was part of the all encompassing societal pressure that people experience when they do something of their own accord that goes against Established Norms For Your Gender. I know a few women who have "guy-ish" hobbies like video games or cars and being told by various people that they should have girlier interests. I know a woman who does pretty well for herself but gets poo poo all the time for being unmarried even though a guy in her same situation would probably not get pressured as much if at all. I know women who were in engineering and had the constant feeling of being hyper aware that yes, they are a Woman in Engineering (if that makes sense to you). Of course there are plenty of male experiences in this regard as well but my point is that they're all bullshit and don't really serve any purpose aside from making people feel bad that they don't conform to what society deems to be appropriate behaviour, the appropriateness of which has no physiological basis on what sex you're born as but just "the way things always have been". Of course, the plural of anecdote is not data etc.
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Apr 7, 2014 09:33
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Pycckuu posted:Did you transfer out because the curriculum was not your thing, or because the dudes weren't hot enough? This is important to me as an up and coming engineer. Little of column A, little of column B.  (seriously though if you want hot male engineers go for Petroleum)
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Apr 7, 2014 12:09
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computer parts posted:Little of column A, little of column B. Chauvinist pig.
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Apr 7, 2014 16:39
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computer parts posted:As an engineering student who transferred out of a discipline that was 90% men in my college (my current major is 60-40 men which as mentioned isn't too bad) I can confirm this. Basically, it's what Dusseldorf said; that women can tell that a subject is going to be overrun by awful people, so they stay away. Except I would expand it to people in general, which just reinforces it further. E: Which I guess kinda goes for all kinds of things, tumblr included. A Buttery Pastry fucked around with this message at 19:19 on Apr 7, 2014 |
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Apr 7, 2014 18:57
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e: actually, I'm pretty sure I know what answer this is gonna get. 
Impatient Skype JO fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Apr 7, 2014 |
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Apr 7, 2014 20:14
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Dusseldorf posted:My theory is that the 18 year old boys in any of those fields are such twerps that any scientifically inclined woman will choose another field of science. As someone with an electrical engineering degree, I can't recall any time I noticed a dude from my classes being weird towards the few women in our classes. I really think this kind of thing is exaggerated by people who weren't in the major, or maybe had bad experiences in freshman classes and transferred/dropped out, because it definitely didn't seem prevalent at the higher level classes. Also, in graduate school, the number of women were roughly equal to men in my Electrical Engineering program.
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Apr 8, 2014 00:23
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Angstrom posted:As someone with an electrical engineering degree, I can't recall any time I noticed a dude from my classes being weird towards the few women in our classes. I really think this kind of thing is exaggerated by people who weren't in the major, or maybe had bad experiences in freshman classes and transferred/dropped out, because it definitely didn't seem prevalent at the higher level classes. Also, in graduate school, the number of women were roughly equal to men in my Electrical Engineering program. They may not have been weird to the women per say but they definitely said a lot of poo poo in private which would make them highly undesirable as coworkers, plus the usual goony/bathing is optional stuff. (And yes, it was Electrical Engineering I transferred out of)
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Apr 8, 2014 02:30
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From my experience that doesn't really happen. People who didn't want to be around engineering dudes all the time just took humanities courses on the side. Granted, I studied aerospace so our sperg coefficient may have been lower, but we had 2 girls out of a class of 60 pretty much from day 1 through graduation. Nobody ever treated them even remotely close to what people itt describe. Besides, it's not like you have to make friends with every student in your class and if you care about computer science and have a vagina, most of your class mates are terrified to talk to you anyway. I think the presence of MRAs might be a tad exaggerated by people who never studied or wanted to study engineering, but nevertheless find the lack of women in some of those disciplines problematic. I can't think of a single person in any of my classes who would say "this poo poo would be better if we had less girls in our major!"
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Apr 8, 2014 02:41
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computer parts posted:They may not have been weird to the women per say but they definitely said a lot of poo poo in private which would make them highly undesirable as coworkers, plus the usual goony/bathing is optional stuff. Sorry, but you don't know the people I went to class with, and no I do not think they said "a lot of poo poo in private that makes them highly undesirable as coworkers". Also, most of them have good engineering jobs for fortune 500 companies, myself included. Have you considered that maybe you were the weird one in your program? Pycckuu posted:From my experience that doesn't really happen. People who didn't want to be around engineering dudes all the time just took humanities courses on the side. Granted, I studied aerospace so our sperg coefficient may have been lower, but we had 2 girls out of a class of 60 pretty much from day 1 through graduation. Nobody ever treated them even remotely close to what people itt describe. Besides, it's not like you have to make friends with every student in your class and if you care about computer science and have a vagina, most of your class mates are terrified to talk to you anyway. Another actual engineering major with pretty much the exact same experience as me, weird!
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Apr 8, 2014 02:50
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Angstrom posted:Sorry, but you don't know the people I went to class with, and no I do not think they said "a lot of poo poo in private that makes them highly undesirable as coworkers". Also, most of them have good engineering jobs for fortune 500 companies, myself included. Have you considered that maybe you were the weird one in your program? I wasn't the one saying the rape jokes.
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Apr 8, 2014 02:51
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computer parts posted:I wasn't the one saying the rape jokes. Yes, some people in the classes you dropped out of said rape jokes, therefore every engineer makes rape jokes.
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Apr 8, 2014 02:53
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Angstrom posted:Yes, some people in the classes you dropped out of said rape jokes, therefore every engineer makes rape jokes. Just enough of them do.
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Apr 8, 2014 02:56
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Dusseldorf posted:Just enough of them do. You've convinced me... the engineers have been a secret cabal of rape jokers all along and the only way to fix myself is by enrolling in a gender studies degree.
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Apr 8, 2014 03:05
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So your hypothesis is that women don't want to study engineering because nerds in class make rape jokes behind their back. Is this based on anything substantial, or are you just repeating stuff you've read somewhere else? The reason I ask is because my personal experience and experiences of my engineering friends don't really match up to your narrative. I have a feeling that these stories are told by people who get triggered by calculus homework.
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Apr 8, 2014 03:09
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Pycckuu posted:So your hypothesis is that women don't want to study engineering because nerds in class make rape jokes behind their back. Is this based on anything substantial, or are you just repeating stuff you've read somewhere else? The reason I ask is because my personal experience and experiences of my engineering friends don't really match up to your narrative. My own personal experiences having been an engineer? I mean poo poo I'm not a liberal arts major, I'm still in engineering. Just a more sane version. quote:I have a feeling that these stories are told by people who get triggered by calculus homework. Like women, amiright?
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Apr 8, 2014 03:14
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computer parts posted:My own personal experiences having been an engineer? Well, first off, it isn't really your experience being an engineer: it's your experience being an electrical engineering undergraduate for an unknown length of time, prior to switching majors. For all we know you may have been a first semester freshman and some fellow 18 year old in your class of hundreds made a rape joke, triggering you to switch majors. As for other engineering disciplines, I'm not sure what makes something like chemical engineering or whatever "more sane" than electrical engineering? computer parts posted:Like women, amiright? Interesting comment considering he didn't mention gender at all in that sentence. A good example of SJW activism. edit: Show me where the Fourier transform touched you
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Apr 8, 2014 03:22
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It's sort of jarring to me because I've never seen or heard actual women in engineering complain about sexism or rape jokes that they encounter. Like, at my university that was just not something that took place, to the best of my knowledge. There was a university-wide program to get more girls to matriculate, but it all revolved around raising awareness and generating interest in the field. Can you tell me some of these rape jokes? Was it like, when she left the room, all the dudes would go "haha i'd totally tie her up with my ethernet cable run a train on that slut"? I just want to know what I'm working with here. computer parts posted:Like women, amiright? Nice. Are you sure you weren't the guy making all the rape jokes, and when your class mates laughed uncomfortably you took it as a sign of them encouraging the rape culture in engineering?
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Apr 8, 2014 03:22
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Angstrom posted:As for other engineering disciplines, I'm not sure what makes something like chemical engineering or whatever "more sane" than electrical engineering? More women, less of a goony feeling. Pycckuu posted:It's sort of jarring to me because I've never seen or heard actual women in engineering complain about sexism or rape jokes that they encounter. Like, at my university that was just not something that took place, to the best of my knowledge. quote:Nice. Are you sure you weren't the guy making all the rape jokes, and when your class mates laughed uncomfortably you took it as a sign of them encouraging the rape culture in engineering? Sounds like I hit a nerve.
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Apr 8, 2014 03:25
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SJWs sound like the people I'd like to drink excess alcohol with at the strip club.
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Apr 8, 2014 03:33
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computer parts posted:How many women did you personally know in engineering, and what proportion did they make of the engineers you did know? In my opinion, if sexism in engineering exists, it did not exist in the form you describe at the university where I studied. quote:Sounds like I hit a nerve. Now, how about you retell me some of those vile rape jokes that made you quit engineering?
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Apr 8, 2014 03:45
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Pycckuu posted:I was friends with 6 girls and maybe 10 guys who studied engineering. I've met most of my friends outside of engineering classes. None of the girls I knew ever complained about sexism, but they did complain about having to do tons of homework and boring professors. Also, both my undergraduate and graduate advisers were women. Academic advisors are frequently not of the same major they advise. And great, maybe it didn't happen where you went. That doesn't mean it isn't a pervasive problem. Where do you think MRAs come from? I'll give you a hint, it's not from environments with equal amounts of women. quote:Come on man, I'm trying to have a legitimate discussion with you. You really can't read, can you?
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Apr 8, 2014 03:52
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computer parts posted:Academic advisors are frequently not of the same major they advise. /edit: Now that I think about it, I've never heard of an academic adviser who was advising in the field he/she is not teaching or studying. Do you have any examples of this? quote:And great, maybe it didn't happen where you went. That doesn't mean it isn't a pervasive problem. Where do you think MRAs come from? I'll give you a hint, it's not from environments with equal amounts of women. I'm glad you brought this up. First of all, by MRA I assume you mean the internet definition: a dorky dweeb who is supposed to say stuff like "sup slut, that's an ugly dress and you should gently caress me," and he is also a sexist and doesn't respect women. To tell you the truth, I've never ever seen any human being act that way in real life. The only people who regularly cite problematic MRA behavior are SJWs on the internet. It's very convenient because if somebody disagrees with your point of view, you can just prescribe them the MRA status and completely disregard what they have to say. Now I might be completely off base here, but I would love to hear your experiences with MRAs in engineering. Also can you please tell me those rape jokes? /edit computer parts posted:You really can't read, can you? Please tell me the rape jokes. Pycckuu fucked around with this message at 04:25 on Apr 8, 2014 |
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Apr 8, 2014 04:09
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I'm currently in a load of electrical engineering/computer sciences courses at a prominent state university and I can quite authoritatively say that literally none of my classmates give a poo poo about what gender you are, just whether or not you can help them understand this homework or this lab. My professors make a specific point of encouraging women to join the Women in Engineering campus groups at the start of every semester. The gender split is roughly 60M/40F, skewed more male in the EE courses.
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Apr 8, 2014 04:36
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Pycckuu posted:First of all, by MRA I assume you mean the internet definition: a dorky dweeb who is supposed to say stuff like "sup slut, that's an ugly dress and you should gently caress me," and he is also a sexist and doesn't respect women. To tell you the truth, I've never ever seen any human being act that way in real life. You just gave an egregiously bad definition of MRA that you yourself characterized as being silly -- "internet definition." How, then, is it surprising that you've never seen a person who fits such a description? Also, why are you feeling so jarred about a person whose personal experience contradicts your personal experience? Like...what's the problem? It's not at all surprising that people will have different personal experiences with gender in engineering and it's weird that you're trying to shout down one data point with your one data point.
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Apr 8, 2014 05:47
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Missouri Fever posted:You just gave an egregiously bad definition of MRA that you yourself characterized as being silly -- "internet definition." How, then, is it surprising that you've never seen a person who fits such a description? quote:Also, why are you feeling so jarred about a person whose personal experience contradicts your personal experience? Like...what's the problem? It's not at all surprising that people will have different personal experiences with gender in engineering and it's weird that you're trying to shout down one data point with your one data point. I'm not trying to shout anyone down, honest. It's just that the issues some posters are describing here and the way in which they are describing do not happen where I went to school. Apparently, there are two other posters who studied engineering, and they also never encountered any of this stuff. I'm just trying to ask for specific examples to better understand the problem, because from my perspective this is a problem that doesn't exist. On top of that, if the poster in question decided to quit because of MRAs during his freshman year, he wouldn't even be taking any engineering classes yet, it would just be physics and calculus, and maybe an intro to engineering class. If that's the case, then the poster shouldn't even be using engineering and MRAs in the same sentence, since he took what amounts to general ed courses with a bunch of random kids, a lot of whom, like him, would quit before they even got into the meat of things. I don't want to make any accusations or jump to any conclusions and I'm trying to figure out the details and circumstances of these events, but I'm having a really hard time getting any answers. So far, I've been the one defending myself from questions like "well yeah, but do you REALLY know any girls?" of all things. I still really want to hear the rape joke that was so vile a dude decided that his dream of building electronics was not worth pursuing. In fact, this joke must've been so bad that the person in question decided to straight up quit rather than say something like "hey man, that's kinda hosed up, perhaps you shouldn't say dumb things in class and ruin it for everyone." For all our faults, engineers actually do a pretty good job of judging people and things on their merits, which is why none of this rings true to me.
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Apr 8, 2014 06:23
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Haha, sorry about your experiences dude and how mine are logically impossible.
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Apr 8, 2014 06:39
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Okay, that makes more sense, thanks for explaining. I have to say though, this:Pycckuu posted:I don't want to make any accusations or jump to any conclusions and I'm trying to figure out the details and circumstances of these events, but I'm having a really hard time getting any answers. will probably get you farther than just "tell me the rape jokes TELL ME THE RAPE JOKES." It does seem like you got a bit annoyed so I understand why you might have gotten stuck phrasing your request that way, but as I'm sure you can tell, it reeks of bad faith.
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Apr 8, 2014 06:43
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Decided to break my multi-year lurking spree to comment in this thread. I'm a woman in the last year of undergrad doing a math/biology degree. When I took a CS class (not an intro class, for those of you who think this somehow matters) for shits and giggles two years ago the guys occasionally made weird sexist jokes with one another in class until the only other female student told them to shut up. I have a bunch of friends in physics and engineering. Some of them are hot and blonde and they're pretty concerned about not being taken seriously as scientists by their peers, prospective employers, etc. Like this is an actual, professional concern for them. I've been creeped on in some fairly low-key but still off-putting ways by male faculty and senior scientists at professional gatherings, I've heard people openly condescend to my friends, refusing to believe they're in this field or that field, whatever. But on the whole I think I've been treated extremely fairly by other students and faculty and I have no substantive complaints about my experience in college. I think if you talk to most women they'll tell you a similar story. Here's the problem, though -- you can have a great time in college and people can be super-nice to female students and very active about recruiting them, but by the time most people reach higher ed they've already internalized this idea that guys build things and women can't do math and yadda yadda. This is the reason why early intervention and role models and all that poo poo matter, and why efforts to make things more equitable in academia sometimes come off as empty gestures. The playing field in college is much more level than it is in grade school, where social pressure to conform to gender stereotypes is higher and the things that draw women into STEM fields -- decent pay, intellectual freedom, etc. -- aren't readily apparent. I certainly wasn't encouraged to pursue math/science/engineering/CS/(etc.) as a kid, and it took me until two semesters into a Classics degree (lol) to make the switch. My sister dropped out of AP Computer Science in high school because, as the only girl in class, she was sick of having to put with teenaged boys' antics or something. Now you can blame her, and all the other girls who early on decide that STEM isn't for them, for not sticking it out, but she was 16 and the opinion of Joe Schmoe in 3rd period evidently mattered to her. When you're an adult in college you have enough emotional maturity to put inconsequential poo poo (e.g. one-off rape jokes?) behind you, but at that point it's often too late to develop an interest in male-dominated fields as a newcomer, especially if you lack the sometimes-requisite mathematical background for programs in the hard sciences/engineering. I'd be interested in hearing what posters in this thread who think it's totes fine and normal that women don't participate nearly as much as men do in certain fields think about female representation and performance in STEM fields in other countries/among different cultures (speaking as a student in the US). Two years ago, I was the only white, domestic female student in my 25-person advanced calculus class at a mostly-white school, which could have happened independently of cultural forces w.r.t. gender and math education but I kind of have my doubts. Also, not to be an rear end but I think some of you might want to at least consider the idea that your female friends might not be being 100% open/honest when talking with you about their experiences in traditionally or currently male-dominated fields. Nobody likes to sound whiny!
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Apr 8, 2014 06:48
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I liked your post, Troutful. To Pycckuu and other posters who are asking for evidence before concluding that gender bias exists: here's another angle you could use to think about it. In the US, women were historically barred from entering various fields. Example: a woman didn't graduate from medical school until 1849, and even then, for decades afterwards, a lot of women ended up founding their own medical schools instead of trying to break into the ones that were already established. Buttressing laws and policies, of course, are beliefs and attitudes. There were rules preventing women from getting into certain institutions, and behind those rules were widespread beliefs that women couldn't do doctor's work, couldn't vote responsibly, etc. People started to disagree and then they pushed to get these rules overturned, but these policy changes didn't cause the opposing view to immediately evaporate. Even when a law or policy is repealed, the beliefs that originally fomented the law are still going to persist. Example: compare racist attitudes/behavior towards black people immediately after Jim Crow laws were repealed vs. racist attitudes/behavior towards black people now. It's not gone, but there's definitely a change, and the change didn't start from zero. Given that this is where society has come from, how likely do you think it is that there is no gender bias that persists w.r.t. women and various career paths?
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Apr 8, 2014 07:23
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There's been a lot of good theories about SJWs so far. I just want to leave a few theories/notes. Of course, I don't reject the notion of social justice but am focused on unhinged, extremist and hateful people masquerading as progressives on the internet. + 'Doth protest too much.' A constant and hyper-sensitive policing for any perceived racial, gender, or sexual slights can be a psychological mechanism used to conceal hidden racist, sexist or homophobic thoughts. A person realizes they possess bigoted attitudes, which creates cognitive dissonance and results in them over-identifying with "oppressed peoples." Yet they still act in a racist way, like the white girl who goes up to the Middle Eastern Christian and prostrates herself about how terrible white people like her treat Muslims (she's still stereotyping). This is also where you get the "Stormfront or Tumblr?" game. The white girl who calls herself a "transnigger" and thus cannot be racist. Or the goon who railed against rape culture but secretly publishes lots of rape erotica. These people are the left-wing equivalents of right-wing conservative ideologues who secretly desire anal sex / prostitutes / etc. + Internet competition. The internet fuels a hyper-competitive arms race for attention. The most attention-seeking people (narcissists) thrive in this environment, and behaving in the most extreme and outrageous manner is a way to out-do the competition. Suey Park's interviews revealed she was not interested in the specifics of what she was saying when she got called out on it, but how provoking the online masses was a means of promoting her personal brand. Social justice politics for these people is just a vehicle to fulfill their narcissistic impulses. If social justice politics ceased being effective at doing this, they would switch in an instant to another form of politics that did. (For example, see Brandon Darby, an ultra-left anarchist who became a Tea Party ideologue. Also had a history of sociopathic/narcissistic and disruptive behavior.) + Identity politics in the Obama era taken to an extreme. Since the election of Barack Obama, the U.S. has entered into a bloodless social conflict over race and identity. This is an updated form of the culture wars that replaced the one fought over evangelical Christianity and red states vs. blue states in the 2000s. Liberals have invested their own self-worth in a black president, and his election has also fueled a racist backlash among elements of the political right. At the same time, the right believes liberals unfairly use accusations of racism as a weapon, while the left believes racism exists everywhere and is simultaneously hidden and concealed (and is mounting a counter-attack against social progress). Both sides are correct. The result is an escalating atmosphere of mutual hostility and suspicion. The social justice wars are simply an unedited and more extreme form of what's playing out on Fox News and MSNBC every night and will most likely recede in a few years. It's important to note that SJWs are typically ultra/extreme left-liberals and not Marxists or revolutionary leftists. Some Marxist groups are now attempting to incorporate SJW/intersectionality/privilege politics but this is an opportunistic attempt to capitalize on a fad, and will most likely cause more harm than good. BrutalistMcDonalds fucked around with this message at 10:04 on Apr 8, 2014 |
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