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Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Something to consider: The replacement is an auto-join. Hell, you start with him. Produn/Profound joins later, and you still need to keep him alive in the battle you recruit him.

Produn, as I recall, is Swords, Axes, Tomahawks. 'Replacement' is Rapiers, Maces, Daggers. Both learn some spells. Produn is Blaze/Slow? Replacement is Tornado/Antidote?

There is a Tomahawk with a range of 1-3, mind you.

I abstain. I've seen both, used both. But I can't say which is the 'better' option nor the most suitable.

Though I say this particular recruitment is not necessarily one you'd get without knowing it.

Bloodly fucked around with this message at 06:11 on May 11, 2014

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Raitzeno
Nov 24, 2007

What? It seemed like
a good idea at the time.

gently caress Stella (and by extension gently caress Produn). Go for Backup General Notdumb, whoever that ends up being.

Shadow Ninja 64
May 21, 2007

"I stood there, wondering why the puck was getting bigger...

and then it hit me."


Let her live, because Medion is nice to the ladies.

EA Sports
Feb 10, 2007

by Azathoth
burn the witch

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



Shadow Ninja 64 posted:

Let her live, because Medion is nice to the ladies.

Going with this.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!

Bloodly posted:

Something to consider: The replacement is an auto-join. Hell, you start with him. Produn/Profound joins later, and you still need to keep him alive in the battle you recruit him.

Produn, as I recall, is Swords, Axes, Tomahawks. 'Replacement' is Rapiers, Maces, Daggers. Both learn some spells. Produn is Blaze/Slow? Replacement is Tornado/Antidote?

There is a Tomahawk with a range of 1-3, mind you.

I abstain. I've seen both, used both. But I can't say which is the 'better' option nor the most suitable.

Produn actually gets spears rather than axes. Basically, while Produn has much better spells, his replacement gets much better weapons - spears pretty much suck and rapiers are better than swords due to weapon advantage over unholy enemies and bonus to agility and critical. I would argue that the auto-recruit of the replacement makes things harder at the beginning, since it delays getting your real healer for an entire chapter.

inthesto fucked around with this message at 15:44 on May 11, 2014

POTATO BLIGHT
Oct 16, 2007
Let her live! Medion only needs to be a Lady-killer in the looks department, not the literal one.

DrDinousaur
Jan 14, 2014
Unacceptable! you must crush them because nothing says respect me like a head on a stake.

HydroSphere
Feb 11, 2014

Produn uses Swords, Spears and Tomahawks.

Spare Stella.

Male of the Century
Jan 7, 2004

PISH-POSH!
Halfway through the battle, that nobody wanted to fight anyways because it was cowardly, you lose the only actual objective to the fight. At that point continuing on is just being a dick, so let her live.

Nephrite
Aug 18, 2006
Lipstick Apathy
Let her live.

I like Produn and don't care much for the other one.

Shitenshi
Mar 12, 2013
Yikes, didn't think we'd be seeing Anafect this soon. And those portraits :effort:

Still, let her live.

vibratingsheep
Nov 2, 2013

Fudou, Gunzou. The Face of the Franchise Killer. 2004.
Being so handsome brings with it an obligation to respect the ladies. Hotnesse Oblige, as it were. Save Stella.

The Gentlemieu
Jan 1, 2013
Soiled Meat
Kill Stella

David Corbett
Feb 6, 2008

Courage, my friends; 'tis not too late to build a better world.
Let Stella live. I can't support gratuitous killing when the game gives you an easy way out.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!
Part 46: I should have thought twice about this difficulty thing

So it turns out goons are a bunch of softies and decided to spare Stella.



Personal note: Killing Stella isn't as simple as “being a jerk”. Produn and Medion are commanders on opposing sides of a war. In the chaos of a fight, putting down your weapons because “hey why not” is pretty ridiculous. Anyways, at least one Republican general is going to get a happy ending out of all this.




The story connects back together after Uryudo makes note that taking the northern path to Barrand is going to take a while.

I apologize, sir. We, the Medion army, were unable to stop the Republican army from seizing your boat.

:j: Father, have you ever heard of an Imperial prince apologizing to commoners on behalf of the Republican army?

:v: It is the first time I have seen such a thing. I can hardly believe he is of the upper class. I see these people have good intentions and I would like to assist them. We overheard your story... You and your army need to go to Barrand. Yet now you are forced to go on foot because the only ship strong enough to navigate the canal is gone. And going by the northern border bridge is quite a detour that would cost you much valuable time.

:j: There is a way for you to get to Barrand without crossing the border bridge, Prince Medion.

A way to Barrand other than the border bridge? Hmm, I've never heard of such a thing.

:v: Ah! We of Anafect have a little secret! I will share it with you if you promise to keep our secret.

You have my word, sir, as an Imperial prince.

The Medion army promises to defend this secret, on our honour, if you would share it with us.

:j: Head a ways north of Anafect. Near the waterfall is a large rock. Search it and...

And, then what?

:v: The entrance to a cave will appear. It leads under the river, to Barrand. You should be able to use that route.

Thank you very much. If this is true, we will make good time, Prince Medion.

You have my gratitude, and that of my entire army, sir.

:v: There is no need to thank us, Prince Medion. Just knowing there is an Imperial prince with your integrity will bring hope to our people.

:j: Please remember the people of Anafect hope Your Highness Prince Medion becomes the ruler of Destonia.

Well, after the end of scenario 1, Medion will be a third of the way there!

I'm a little more confident now. Even if you have few allies among the Imperial elite, you are an ally of the people, Prince Medion.

I'm happy we have support amongst the people. I think everyone has been invigorated by the village chief's words.

But it's not just the people that are giving their support. We've pledged to always be faithful to Prince Medion, haven't we Uryudo?

The path to Barrand is near. Let's get to the cave before nightfall.



But first, we need to grab this from the chief's boat.



Also, I didn't point this out last update, but Anafect is a maze of docks and boats. Lots of the boats have several entry points blocked off by NPCs, making navigating the place a nightmare. This kid in particular makes it easy to exit if you push him in this direction, but going the opposite way, he blocks you off from the weapon store completely. I have no idea why Camelot made this place such a pain to navigate.



OMGHSH Counter: 4



As we all predicted, a certain avian fellow finds us on our way out.



Yes, that is I.

Oh, I'm so glad I finally found you!

What could a Republican soldier possibly want with Prince Medion?

I'm Zero, from Flagard. I was sent by Lord Synbios to catch up to you.

If you were sent by Synbios... Why did Lord Synbios send you?

We were battling the bandit leader Shiraf on top of the train. We emerged victorious, but before his death, he said some disturbing things.

Shiraf? The bandit chief from Dusty Village?

What was it that he said?

That Medion is a nuisance to the Empire, and that you'll never reach Barrand!

Shiraf said that? He has connections with the upper levels of the Imperial army, so it doesn't surprise me that he said such things.

Then where are these bandits now, Sir Zero?

Unfortunately, right about now, they're probably headed north from the border bridge.

But now that the Synbios army has repelled the thieves' attack, won't they continue home on the train?

Unfortunately not. Someone damaged the bridge so they have to go by land.

If that's the case, why did he send you as a messenger to our army at a time when he needs every soldier?

The Republic strongly desires peace, and in the Republic, you Prince Medion, are seen as a source of hope. Please let me assist your force!



If the prince gives the Republic hope for peace, then we are probably being watched.

Watched? I see, so that's what they were up to.

So you've seen someone observing us, Zero!?



:hist101: Letting General Produn escape was a huge blunder, Prince Medion. We saw the whole thing. And now we've also caught you scheming with a Republican soldier. We witnessed everything! Lay your weapons down and surrender. If you refuse, we will take you by force!

You bastards think you've trapped us, huh? Well I'm sorry, but we will not yield to you. If you really think you can stop us, you're welcome to try!

:hist101: -tch- You're going to resist? Very well. We'll show you how terrifying the Garzel army can be!

They're going to try to prevent our advance, but we mustn't let them stop us. Let's go, Medion!




Fairly simple battle. Big open space with a lot of rough terrain. We've got a lot of new enemies this time.







Those are... some stats. The kaiser guard in particular, is packing hellish stats. My highest attacker is Bernard at 26, whereas almost everyone is sitting at 20 or 21. Right now, I really wish the weapon shop in Anafect carried upgrades, since the only reason Bernard is ahead of the pack is that he got a new arrow.



Zero starts with some pretty good stats, but remember that he starts a level or two above everyone else and with a better weapon. There's also this:



Yep, he starts with two ranks in swords. What this means, of course, is that his base stats are crap. Zero comes with even larger flaws that we'll see later.



The enemies from last fight still aren't a threat, though.




New mages can lay down some hurt, but once again the AI is its own worst enemy.




Stranded by himself, it's easy to kill the mage. Also, we get a good view of Zero's model which, like most of the others, has some drat good detail to it.




Pushing forward, the worst we have to deal with is a imperial knight for now.



Not terrifying. If I were playing on normal difficulty, that would have done about 3 damage instead.



Even criticals still put out serious damage. That probably would have been a one-shot kill without the stat boost from the difficulty level.



One thing I am noticing is that enemy dodge rates seem significantly higher on insane difficulty.



The gale ring on Medion was a great call. Without all the extra accessories I'm picking up, this game would be incredibly hard.




Campbell is still beefy enough to one-shot lesser enemies on the jacked up difficulty.




Bernard's going to be pulling more than his fair share of weight due to being the only character who got an upgraded weapon at Anafect.





Dammit, Syntesis! Your magic resist is supposed to count for more than that!




Whoops. Oh well, losing support with Medion and Uryudo isn't too big of a deal. We won't be getting the other mage for a while, and it's not nearly as easy to do that mirrored support as it is with Masqurin and Noon.






Rank 2 critical for birdman swords, called Sky High. It's pretty badass.



When we tangle with the last group, the kaiser guard sits still until you shove Medion in his face.




Jesus. Remember, Zero has the second highest attack value on the team.




He still doesn't hit too hard, though. This was a critical hit, too.





We're gonna be here a while.




Medion's critical does 9 damage, whereas Campbell's does 11. I almost feel like I'm fighting a real boss here, because this is some ridiculous durability for a filler boss.



He goes down eventually, though.




I left the second screenshot in there just to prove that I didn't make the awkward gurgle myself.



They were attacking so relentlessly, it appeared as though they were even prepared to kill the prince. Does this mean we mustn't let our guard down even among our own country's armies?

My brother is ruthless in his ambition. It does not surprise me to learn that he has little care for those who die before him, whether enemy or ally.

That's certainly true. It's survival of the fittest inside the Empire. We'd like to avoid battles with our countrymen, but there will be times when we must twist their arms and wrestle them to the ground.

What was it they said in Anafect Village? A large rock near the waterfall?



That's right, if we investigate this rock...



The game says he inspects the rock, but it's much funnier to imagine that he just swats it aside with a single backhand.



If we go through this cave, we should be able to get to the city of Barrand!

NEXT TIME: Can we beat her ninja tech- Wait, I already made that joke.

Shitenshi
Mar 12, 2013
Is it just me or does some of Scenario 2's dialogue seem a lot more bloated and clunky as opposed to Scenario 1?

Seriously.

quote:

We were battling the bandit leader Shiraf on top of the train. We emerged victorious, but before his death, he said some disturbing things.

Shiraf? The bandit chief from Dusty Village?

What was it that he said?

That Medion is a nuisance to the Empire, and that you'll never reach Barrand!
That's so disturbing, Zero. I'm guessing your feathers would be stained with shitted bricks if Shiraf had a top hat and monocle too. And then everyone else twaddles for a bit repeating each other. I remember some people used to say that Golden Sun just had a bad translation as opposed to excessive dialogue when it came out, but perhaps Camelot isn't quite the holy grail tainted by Nintendo I remember them to be.

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

Aren't we running off a fan translation here? So that probably accounts for it. The whole "repeat everything someone else says" is a very Japanese thing to do, while we English speakers find it cludgy and stupid, so if the fan translation didn't account for that...

Shitenshi
Mar 12, 2013
JRPG dialogue isn't going to win any awards, but it at least should feel streamlined enough without either repeating itself ad nauseum or only serving to prolong a rather boring scene. Synthesis and Uryudo constantly saying they can't stand war is unbelievably preachy even in a game like this, the constant repeating of how Medion is such a good prince from his advisors, or the awkward dialogue leading up to actually going to Anafect. It feels lifeless and by extension makes some of the characters feel extremely bland.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!
While I do feel that the dialogue in scenario 2 is bloated, it's really not any worse than scenario 1. There's plenty of spots in Synbios' arc where I cut as silent text box from Synbios, because there was literally nothing he could say that wouldn't be parroted by Benetram on Dantares a single line later.

I will, however, mention that the writer for Shining Force 3 filled in a lot of details as he went along. I think this contributes heavily to why Medion's arc feels lacking compared to Synbios'. Most of the plot points for Medion are more or less "fill in gaps in Synbios' story" without having a whole lot of thrust on their own. The opening of scenario 1 is "Your king has been framed for a crime he didn't commit; it's now your job to get him up and prevent full scale war from erupting." On the other hand, Medion's arc starts with "Stuff blows up, now go follow in some other guy's shadow so you can impress your dad or something."

Shitenshi
Mar 12, 2013
It might be that it does feel like too much of a counterpart story, so without anything unique to distinguish Medion, it feels like they're going through the motions as opposed to anything unique about his story. Like how relatively boring the imperial scumbags in Scenario 2's opening felt compared to Scenario 1 despite being blatantly obvious to even a hothead like Spiriel that Arrawnt and Crewart were actively loving everyone over. Which the weak characters were a problem of Golden Sun, and if they were likeable, the weird dialogue trees probably could have been endearing on some level ala Lunar or Grandia. I get they're trying to do that with Syntesis and Uryudo, but they feel like varying extremes of token comic relief and boring moral support.

Although there's no excuse for the boring convo at the beginning of Scenario 3, and some of the really awkward dialogues at the end of the game.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!
Bad news, people. I'm trying to record the next fight, and my emulator (SSF) crashes when a certain enemy tries to move. Changing to the Japanese disc and switching to an older version of the emulator doesn't do anything.

Anyone have any suggestions? I don't know any other emulators to try out. Alternatively, I can upload the saves for somebody else to try out.

Nephrite
Aug 18, 2006
Lipstick Apathy
I don't think there are any other really decent Saturn emulators out there. I can try and run your save file since I have it setup at home at the moment and I'm going through Scenario 3.

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

I don't know anything about how that emulator works, but could it be a plug-in problem? I know in some other emulators like the N64 emulators you can run into weird glitches with certain graphic plugins.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!
Well, I restarted the game from the beginning of scenario 2, and it seems to work fine now. Only took me about three hours with fast forward on. LP resumes as normal! (Though characters are going to have different stats.)

e: The emulator crash is tied to the difficulty level. :doh:

inthesto fucked around with this message at 19:37 on May 13, 2014

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

inthesto posted:

e: The emulator crash is tied to the difficulty level. :doh:

Ha! Insane truly is!

Garbonix
Oct 9, 2012

inthesto posted:

e: The emulator crash is tied to the difficulty level. :doh:

I guess you can say that guy had game breaking stats.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!
Part 48: Hark, a ninja!



This cave must have been formed by erosion caused by water. The sparkle of that fluorescent lichen is a bit unsettling.

It could be slippery in this cave with all the algae growing. Let's move, but watch your footing.





Whoa!





Fa... Father...

;thezero; That person's in danger! I've got to help him before he plunges into the waterfall!



The old man falls over the cliff and Zero dives in after him.



And then an enemy drops down on Hazuki and we get to see her sprite do a sweet backflip.

That girl is surrounded by beasts. She's in serious trouble!

She needs help quickly. We don't know the situation, but these people are obviously in trouble. We can't abandon them.

Let's be cautious, Prince Medion. The beasts are hiding in the shadows and are undoubtedly waiting for an opportunity to strike!




Now, as I've previously mentioned, if I try to play this map on insane difficulty, my emulator straight up crashes. This is what I would have had to deal with if I could play on insane:





Compare to standard difficulty:





Holy poo poo, this fight is cakewalk normally.




There's a ton of enemy spawns. Worms are a bit tanky (I forgot to capture their stats, but they have a whopping 28 HP and sizeable attack to go with it), but otherwise it's easy stuff.



Hazuki starts on the other end of the map, gets jumped by enemies, and doesn't join until you talk to her. Just like Irene. What is it with Shining Force 3 and not-Asian women?



The majority of enemies in this map are the ones that spawn behind you. Sending Medion and Campbell forward to grab Hazuki is enough while everyone else stays behind to do the real fighting.



Like I said, worms are some serious bruisers even on standard difficulty. This would have done something like 11 damage on insane.



The army of Prince Medion won't abandon those in trouble even if some see us as meddlesome.



Well, we did see him in the first chapter, so I guess the answer is technically yes.

Yasha. I believe he was the mysterious ninja working as a spy for my brother.

So, he is in your country. Since you have gone through the trouble to save me, please allow me to join your force. I'll work to repay your kindness! But before that, please save my father!



As soon as Hazuki joins, the boss and her goons spawn:



We remember how nasty succubi are from last scenario, but these enemies don't have any aggro range at all. We're at our leisure to mosey around and pick around the rest of the map.



Having a ninja that comes in early is actually a giant benefit. The magic up support will compliment Syntesis and Uryudo nicely. Additionally, shurikens count as arrows, so now we have three functional archers, but one of them also has magic and swords.




Hazuki also has a pretty cool attack animation where she also does a backflip.



Campbell checks out a pillar near the fake exit with nets us a large mithril.





Meanwhile, everyone else goes to tackle the succubus and her worms, which gets Rock and Bernard in a bit of trouble.





Which Syntesis promptly pays back.



And that's all she wrote for this fight.



Father...

Is he okay, Zero?

;thezero; When he fell over the edge, I thought it was all over, but I somehow managed to save him.



:v: Hazuki, you must've traveled down the river with me after I fell in.

You say you fell into the river... How did that happen?

Thieves were destroying the iron bridge upstream. When we fought to try to stop them, my father accidently fell into the river.

:v: If only I had not been wounded at the hands of the bandits, I could have used my ninja skills to avoid such an awful fate...

-sob- Father...

:v: Please, I ask that you allow my daughter to ally with you, Prince Medion. Please, take care of Hazuki and do not let her fall into Yasha's hands...

Yasha is a ninja under Prince Arrawnt who carries out secret activities. You seem to bear him very deep resentment.

:v: Our mission is to destroy the renegade ninja Yasha... However, if Hazuki were to fight him without the aid of my skills... she would have no chance for victory.

No, father... Don't talk like that... You'll recover...

:v: Unfortunately, this is goodbye... Hazuki... Let the Medion army take care of you, and someday, you'll grow strong... -urgh-



Poor Hazuki... It would have been one thing to be struck down by his nemesis, but to be injured in a battle with bandits...

He seemed like such a good father... Let's lend her our help.

Thank you, everyone of the Medion army, for trying to save my father. I am filled with grief now, but I can't continue to be sad forever.

Please, Miss Hazuki, take your time. It would be deplorable of me to rush you in your time of grief.

If we stay here, more beasts will show up. Please, let's get going.

Well, as Hazuki said, let's move across the river.

NEXT TIME: Let's check out the same enemies on a higher difficulty!

vibratingsheep
Nov 2, 2013

Fudou, Gunzou. The Face of the Franchise Killer. 2004.
Hurray, early game useful ninja! That hasn't happened since... ever!

Raitzeno
Nov 24, 2007

What? It seemed like
a good idea at the time.


Does that count as "show, don't tell" on a dude falling down a waterfall? Holy poo poo.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
It is interesting to have a ninja so early, but I wonder if she's actually going to be useful.

Shadow Ninja 64
May 21, 2007

"I stood there, wondering why the puck was getting bigger...

and then it hit me."


Glazius posted:

It is interesting to have a ninja so early, but I wonder if she's actually going to be useful.

Given the versatility she already represents, the fact that she still has plenty of room for growth and friendship development, and inthesto's playstyle where he doesn't bother raising most classes' secondary ranged options, I imagine she will be quite useful.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!

Shadow Ninja 64 posted:

Given the versatility she already represents, the fact that she still has plenty of room for growth and friendship development, and inthesto's playstyle where he doesn't bother raising most classes' secondary ranged options, I imagine she will be quite useful.

She comes in early enough to develop support ranks and she has the magic up support. That's literally all she needs to be useful to me.

Ardeem
Sep 16, 2010

There is no problem that cannot be solved through sufficient application of lasers and friendship.

inthesto posted:

She comes in early enough to develop support ranks and she has the magic up support. That's literally all she needs to be useful to me.

She, Syntasis, Uryudo, possibly Medion, and one other character we'll get annoyingly late in the game are going to be best buddies.

Shadow Ninja 64
May 21, 2007

"I stood there, wondering why the puck was getting bigger...

and then it hit me."


I know you were asking about other emulator options before. Last time I looked, the only two real options were whatever build of SSF you can get working right and an emulator called Cassini, but I never got the latter working right when I was trying to play this game a couple years back.

EA Sports
Feb 10, 2007

by Azathoth
Yabause got alot of work put into it a year or two ago, I don't know if its as good as ssf though.

vibratingsheep
Nov 2, 2013

Fudou, Gunzou. The Face of the Franchise Killer. 2004.

EA Sports posted:

Yabause got alot of work put into it a year or two ago, I don't know if its as good as ssf though.

I used Yabause at the beginning of my LP, it had serious problems with any kind of transparency, so the screenshots weren't great.

inthesto
May 12, 2010

Pro is an amazing name!
I've been playing around on insane difficulty, and frankly it really is insane. In the interest of not slowing down the updates, I'm going to keep the difficulty on standard, but this brings me to a question: would people be interest in a bonus runback where I go through the game again on insane? I'd probably do it as a live stream with edited versions stuck on YouTube since it's far less time consuming on my part.

Shadow Ninja 64
May 21, 2007

"I stood there, wondering why the puck was getting bigger...

and then it hit me."


inthesto posted:

I've been playing around on insane difficulty, and frankly it really is insane. In the interest of not slowing down the updates, I'm going to keep the difficulty on standard, but this brings me to a question: would people be interest in a bonus runback where I go through the game again on insane? I'd probably do it as a live stream with edited versions stuck on YouTube since it's far less time consuming on my part.

I would be interested in it as long as it came after you finished the whole game proper. Alternately, maybe you could just do the premium disc stuff on Insane (if that has a difficulty setting at all, that is).

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Male of the Century
Jan 7, 2004

PISH-POSH!
I'm not really sure what benefit playing on Insane would really give, it doesn't add anything to the fights, like how challenge mode SF2 changed a ton of stuff. Sure, there's higher numbers on the enemies, but the fights are all still the same just harder, which as a viewer doesn't show through at all unless you post an entire update of "Whoops we all died to crits haha ok lets try again" but that honestly isn't very interesting.

The fact that your characters don't gain any benefit from Insane either just makes it so that at the end you wont be able to :unsmigghh: nearly as hard, if at all.

Male of the Century fucked around with this message at 03:41 on May 16, 2014

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