|
Breadallelogram posted:If every 1 in 10 people on the street are dangerous, that's a lot of dangerous people. Oh hey, now we're nitpicking fake percentages people pulled out of their rear end to make a point  The point wasn't the number, the point was that the majority of people out there are harmless. There are a lot more general assholes then there are genuinely "bad" or dangerous people.
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 05:33
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 19, 2024 05:27 |
|
|
Going back to the other episode, the sense of dread I felt when the daughter stepped off the train was a testament to performance. This is a comedy show. I knew, logically, that there was a zero percent chance that something terrible would happen to her. That's not the show this is. But the performances were so convincing that the dread was still almost palpable. Louie C.K. is pretty durn talented.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 05:53
|
|
|
Jake Armitage posted:Not a single person was mean to her in the entire episode though. Louie was perfectly nice to her, and liked her as a person. Dave Attell was having a really friendly conversation with her, and genuinely happy for her for landing a good job. Everyone liked her, its just that no one finds her attractive for gee I wonder what reason. Jim Norton(?) calls her gross. Did Louie's whole interaction with the elevator remind anyone else of his bit about helping some old woman in LaGuardia?
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 06:13
|
|
|
Jake Armitage posted:Not a single person was mean to her in the entire episode though. Louie was perfectly nice to her, and liked her as a person. Dave Attell was having a really friendly conversation with her, and genuinely happy for her for landing a good job. Everyone liked her, its just that no one finds her attractive for gee I wonder what reason. It's a really spot-on critique of masculinity, double-standards, and (not-a-spoler)hating on fat people, which I've been told I'm not supposed to talk about.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 07:18
|
|
|
This thread is just part of my dream. I don't like this dream anymore! It's not a good dream!
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 07:55
|
|
|
Pigbog posted:This thread is just part of my dream. I don't like this dream anymore! It's not a good dream! Speaking of which, Louie's kids are two of the greatest child actors I've ever seen in my entire life. Every time they're on screen, I believe everything that's going on. That's rare. On the scale of Jake Lloyd in Phantom Menace to Justin Henry in Kramer vs. Kramer, it's rare to find child actors who make you feel things other than "ugh. What a terrible child actor." Nothing but kudos up in here.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 09:15
|
|
|
beanieson posted:did they lose the license for that song or something? It really was great. Here's a good chat with Louis from Opie & Anthony a few years back, in which he talks about the theme song - it's a pretty interesting story. The song discussion starts at about 30 mins in, but if you're interested in the production of the show, the whole segment is good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izX44iTNO8k
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 11:20
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:If you can't change the subject into something more people want to talk about, your topic is less interesting. It was an episode about how women and fat people (and fat women) are treated differently. Expect some discussion on the matter. I've tried to move on from the topic, and it didn't happen. What you are completely incapable of understanding is that no one is saying it's OK to make fun of fat people. No one is saying it's OK to treat fat people poorly. People are saying, repeatedly and with good cause, that comparing the struggles of minorities to the struggles of fat people is completely loving ridiculous. On that note, thanks to this thread, I discovered that white guys are far more likely to get testicular cancer than black guys.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 11:39
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:The story she tells details very explicitly that tons of guys are willing to have sex with her, but none of them are willing to admit it publicly. They like her. Everybody likes her. Louie likes her. But they're all unwilling to show this to the world, because they'll be mocked for loving a fat girl. Do you not just feel better when you're with girls that you're more attracted to? And also - what makes you think Louie likes her? He displays none of his usual idiocy that he does around girls that he's into. No Wave fucked around with this message at 12:16 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 12:13
|
|
ozza posted:Here's a good chat with Louis from Opie & Anthony a few years back, in which he talks about the theme song - it's a pretty interesting story. The song discussion starts at about 30 mins in, but if you're interested in the production of the show, the whole segment is good.
|
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 12:19
|
|
|
"Louie" is pretty good at taking real people and putting them into a sitcom/cartoon world where things like the garbage crew scene from 4x01 happens. The best thing about realistic characters? They're not perfect. Just because Sarah Baker gave a great monologue doesn't necessarily make her right - but it is how people do, and are allowed to, feel. Having characters with realistic flaws is the best thing about the show, it doesn't feel like you're watching a 22 minute recurring character sitcom where nothing ever really changes between the cast as they resolve each situation in the same way that whatever got cancelled last year did. It's nice we have a show where the main character can take an absolute beating from the people around him in ways you know people keep to themselves in reality. It's why I like Curb Your Enthusiasm so much too - sometimes Larry David is absolutely right, sometimes he's wrong and you feel like screaming at him in absolute frustration. When show creators don't really care about alienating the audience from the lead character from time to time, you get smarter shows out of it. This season has been absolutely amazing so far, but let's please not look down on s3 like someone earlier did. Sure, some of the episodes weren't of the calibre from s1/s2 but holy poo poo the David Lynch/Late Night arc was just... incredible. e: the missing intro might just be more about giving them that extra minute to squeeze storyline in. It's gotten to the stage where the audience doesn't need a theme song to be interested, everyone knows what 'Louie' is now.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 12:31
|
|
|
Tokelau All Star posted:I really enjoyed the scene of Louie and his ex-wife standing silently in the hall. I really felt like they were two people that knew each other so well that there was an entire unsaid conversation in those brief moments. To me, given the same events with a married couple, they would have left the room to cry/hug over the trauma. Instead, because they're divorced, they "couldn't" both comfort each other or have a conversation about it.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 13:06
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:Going back to the other episode, the sense of dread I felt when the daughter stepped off the train was a testament to performance. This is a comedy show. I knew, logically, that there was a zero percent chance that something terrible would happen to her. That's not the show this is. But the performances were so convincing that the dread was still almost palpable. Louis CK did an amazing job of acting like a regular freaked-out parent. It was amazing that they had his daughter (the one on the subway with him) act as his mental anchor.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 14:00
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:The story she tells details very explicitly that tons of guys are willing to have sex with her, but none of them are willing to admit it publicly. They like her. Everybody likes her. Louie likes her. But they're all unwilling to show this to the world, because they'll be mocked for loving a fat girl. Guys have sex with women they don't want to date, and vice versa. You can be attracted to someone enough to want to gently caress them, but not attracted enough to them to want to date them. And the reasons aren't entirely, always, or even normally, "what would other people think." I think that's something that you're missing here. Those kid of omissions made the rant feel more "real," as the poster above me said, but also not as poignant as it could have been if it were more perfectly manufactured, as a lot of the statements have caveats or differing perspectives.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 14:19
|
|
|
LividLiquid posted:The story she tells details very explicitly that tons of guys are willing to have sex with her, but none of them are willing to admit it publicly. They like her. Everybody likes her. Louie likes her. But they're all unwilling to show this to the world, because they'll be mocked for loving a fat girl. I think the issue people have is this carries a massive set of assumptions on her part which unfortunately make her appear more entitled than frustrated. This is exacerbated by the fact that in the episode Louie just doesn't seem all that into her. The tone and presentation suggests that we are supposed to empathize but the show made a huge misstep by making that part of the speech rest on this assumption when all the available evidence suggested that said assumption was false. I think this is more a failure on the part of the show than anything else - we're supposed to identify with this women and rethink the way that we treat fat women but it fails to demonstrate that people are not loving her for no reason other than they are embarrassed by being seen with her. This ends up conflating men who just aren't into fat women (which is totally fine, can't deny someone their preferences unless they diddle kids or blow goats) and men who are into fat women but don't express it because they are cowing to social pressures. The latter is a terrible thing for every person involved and reflects some seriously hosed up attitudes on the part of that man. This a really minor misstep that wouldn't bug me if Louie wasn't such a great show already. But it does bug me a bit more than it should, if only because I could go on for pages about how hosed society is when dealing with fat women - from the double standard to the focus on appearance over health to the billion-dollar 'fitness' industry exploiting this in ways that emphasize form over function and offer nothing in terms of healthy living. It is absolutely mad that society tells women they can't lift weights when lifting weights is an essential part of getting in shape, that it tells them to buy into temporary fad diets that don't work and then shuns them for failing to lose weight when they are trapped in a maze of disheartening bullshit. Then they get smacked with moral judgments tailor made to convince them that they are inherently flawed as people opposed to just temporarily living an unhealthy lifestyle. By focusing on sex the show misses a golden opportunity to explore all these issues, instead focusing on a sexual aspect that are ultimately deeply personal, contradicted by the other parts of the bit and ultimately a more a symptom of the counterproductive way that society treats fat women. I was kinda ripped when watching this though so I may have totally misinterpreted the whole thing.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 15:10
|
|
|
Bifner McDoogle posted:I think the issue people have is this carries a massive set of assumptions on her part which unfortunately make her appear more entitled than frustrated. This is exacerbated by the fact that in the episode Louie just doesn't seem all that into her. The tone and presentation suggests that we are supposed to empathize but the show made a huge misstep by making that part of the speech rest on this assumption when all the available evidence suggested that said assumption was false. I think this is more a failure on the part of the show than anything else - we're supposed to identify with this women and rethink the way that we treat fat women but it fails to demonstrate that people are not loving her for no reason other than they are embarrassed by being seen with her. This ends up conflating men who just aren't into fat women (which is totally fine, can't deny someone their preferences unless they diddle kids or blow goats) and men who are into fat women but don't express it because they are cowing to social pressures. The latter is a terrible thing for every person involved and reflects some seriously hosed up attitudes on the part of that man. I've had a lot of male friends, and I talk about stupid and weird poo poo with them. Embarrassing poo poo. Not one of them has ever been into fat girls. I don't think there are all that many men who take fat over thin out there, and I don't think it's an issue of shaming. Bifner McDoogle posted:This a really minor misstep that wouldn't bug me if Louie wasn't such a great show already. But it does bug me a bit more than it should, if only because I could go on for pages about how hosed society is when dealing with fat women - from the double standard to the focus on appearance over health to the billion-dollar 'fitness' industry exploiting this in ways that emphasize form over function and offer nothing in terms of healthy living. It is absolutely mad that society tells women they can't lift weights when lifting weights is an essential part of getting in shape, that it tells them to buy into temporary fad diets that don't work and then shuns them for failing to lose weight when they are trapped in a maze of disheartening bullshit. Then they get smacked with moral judgments tailor made to convince them that they are inherently flawed as people opposed to just temporarily living an unhealthy lifestyle. By focusing on sex the show misses a golden opportunity to explore all these issues, instead focusing on a sexual aspect that are ultimately deeply personal, contradicted by the other parts of the bit and ultimately a more a symptom of the counterproductive way that society treats fat women.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 15:25
|
|
|
No Wave posted:I've had a lot of male friends, and I talk about stupid and weird poo poo with them. Embarrassing poo poo. Not one of them has ever been into fat girls. I don't think there are all that many men who take fat over thin out there, and I don't think it's an issue of shaming. Chubby chasers who are embarrassed about liking fat women are definitely a thing, they are just misogynist creeps though so its easy to not ever interact with them if you have a discerning taste in friends. Those guys are in the extreme minority, however, you and I know that at least. Other people don't though, which is part of why people see the same speech in different ways I think. But you're 100% right on the second bit, the appeal of Louie is that its a personal show that deals with awkward personal issues and it is unfair of me to be mad at the show for not doing what I want it to do when that would go against the tone and comedic style.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 15:40
|
|
|
ozza posted:Here's a good chat with Louis from Opie & Anthony a few years back, in which he talks about the theme song - it's a pretty interesting story. The song discussion starts at about 30 mins in, but if you're interested in the production of the show, the whole segment is good. Automata 10 Pack fucked around with this message at 15:49 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 15:43
|
|
|
No Wave posted:I don't think this is a knock on the show at all though. Sarah isn't a stand-in for all fat girls - there are fat girls in relationships in America (duh). Louie's constantly about how Louie himself participates and exacerbates his own repetitive cycles of misery. She does the same thing - she goes after guys who aren't into her. There's a simple solution to her problem, but really, the inability to settle is almost every lonely single person's problem. I -think- what Louie was getting at was that a lot of "average"* men who will probably invariably end up with a chubby woman do not treat them in the same manner that they do women that they feel are out of their league in that interim period before they settle for whoever they want. They know the big woman is good for them, are relatively attracted to them, and realize it's about as good as they're going to do because they're the social equal to them. But they don't "claim" them in public or chase after them in the same way because they have dreams of getting "better" even though they don't merit it themselves. They want to be perceived as a top-level guy, but aren't, so they're extremely self conscious about being too close with the larger woman that they actually know they'll probably end up with and like well enough. This is different from the top tier guys, who might flirt with or have sex with a larger woman and not be bothered at all because they've been with enough "hot" women that outside perception doesn't matter. Someone can't look down at you for being around a big woman one day when you've also been with "hotter" women than they can ever dream of being with. When you've been with 100 women of all different types, having a large woman as part of that variety isn't going to mean much. If you've been with two, and both are large, it means something different. So there's a layer of confidence that comes with relative dating success on a superficial level that a lot of self conscious middling guys don't have, but "hotter" more experienced guys do. *a bunch of quotes added in to show that I'm talking about the wide ranging social views of attractiveness and tiers and not what I ascribe to on a personal level The problem is that, even on the show, Louie isn't really on that middling level, even if he presents himself as such. To make the living he makes, even in the context of the show, means that he'll be with "hot" women enough where he doesn't really fit into the general mold of what he's trying to portray at times. Entertainers that are good enough to make a living entertaining have a rather wide selection almost as a default. So there's a bit of a disconnect in what was portrayed as to what was intended there. And it has happened at other times as well. Sorry if I rambled there a bit - I hope it made sense. It's a hard concept to express without making it sound like personal judgments. Darko fucked around with this message at 16:30 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 16:16
|
|
|
...well, come to think of it it does kind of undermine the point you're trying to make if in the previous episode we see "schlubby everyman" Louie being totally familiar with Jerry Seinfeld like they're old friends, and then going on to gently caress Yvonne Strahovski.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 16:29
|
|
|
EL BROMANCE posted:It's nice we have a show where the main character can take an absolute beating from the people around him in ways you know people keep to themselves in reality. It's why I like Curb Your Enthusiasm so much too - sometimes Larry David is absolutely right, sometimes he's wrong and you feel like screaming at him in absolute frustration. When show creators don't really care about alienating the audience from the lead character from time to time, you get smarter shows out of it.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 16:30
|
|
|
Darko posted:I -think- what Louie was getting at was that a lot of "average"* men who will probably invariably end up with a chubby woman do not treat them in the same manner that they do women that they feel are out of their league in that interim period before they settle for whoever they want. They know the big woman is good for them, are relatively attracted to them, and realize it's about as good as they're going to do because they're the social equal to them. But they don't "claim" them in public or chase after them in the same way because they have dreams of getting "better" even though they don't merit it themselves. They want to be perceived as a top-level guy, but aren't, so they're extremely self conscious about being too close with the larger woman that they actually know they'll probably end up with and like well enough. This is a really bizarre attitude to me that does not line up with my own experiences at all. I'm gay, though, is this really a common way that people think about women and relationships? My experience has more been more that men who are just loving around are shallow because they are not looking for a committed relationship, that they basically chase the hottest people available because they are looking for something shallow and temporary and are going to focus on it for that reason. Then when they go for a serious relationship the range of personalities they are looking after narrows and the range of body types they are into increases. The whole hierarchy you've set up here seems pretty out-there to me but I only understand shallow relationships between two men, not so much between men and women.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 16:57
|
|
|
Darko posted:I -think- what Louie was getting at was that a lot of "average"* men who will probably invariably end up with a chubby woman do not treat them in the same manner that they do women that they feel are out of their league in that interim period before they settle for whoever they want. They know the big woman is good for them, are relatively attracted to them, and realize it's about as good as they're going to do because they're the social equal to them. But they don't "claim" them in public or chase after them in the same way because they have dreams of getting "better" even though they don't merit it themselves. They want to be perceived as a top-level guy, but aren't, so they're extremely self conscious about being too close with the larger woman that they actually know they'll probably end up with and like well enough. But I do think it's actually interesting that she's accusing Louie of being unrealistic while being unrealistic herself. This is why claiming someone who's not interested in you is being unrealistic is always funny - perhaps it is you who is being unrealistic? Bifner McDoogle posted:This is a really bizarre attitude to me that does not line up with my own experiences at all. I'm gay, though, is this really a common way that people think about women and relationships? My experience has more been more that men who are just loving around are shallow because they are not looking for a committed relationship, that they basically chase the hottest people available because they are looking for something shallow and temporary and are going to focus on it for that reason. Then when they go for a serious relationship the range of personalities they are looking after narrows and the range of body types they are into increases. The whole hierarchy you've set up here seems pretty out-there to me but I only understand shallow relationships between two men, not so much between men and women. Most single dudes I know would gently caress anyone not gross for a month. Why not? I don't really understand the distinction between "dating short-term" and "fuckbuddy". No Wave fucked around with this message at 17:10 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 17:03
|
|
|
Wraith of J.O.I. posted:Larry David is always right Haha, that's totally making me want to rewatch all of CYE and somehow back him in every situation. I bet that would be amazing. Kind of how in wrestling TV shows, one of the commentators is always backing the bad guy, no matter what he does.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 18:03
|
|
|
Bifner McDoogle posted:This is a really bizarre attitude to me that does not line up with my own experiences at all. I'm gay, though, is this really a common way that people think about women and relationships? My experience has more been more that men who are just loving around are shallow because they are not looking for a committed relationship, that they basically chase the hottest people available because they are looking for something shallow and temporary and are going to focus on it for that reason. Then when they go for a serious relationship the range of personalities they are looking after narrows and the range of body types they are into increases. The whole hierarchy you've set up here seems pretty out-there to me but I only understand shallow relationships between two men, not so much between men and women. From my experiences, and what I've seen in seeing the inner workings of dating sites and stats and such: Men typically have these kinds of categories: - not interested in any way - friend but not sexually attracted - friend and would have sex with - would have sex with, but wouldn't really want to be friends with - would have sex with and date - would have sex with and would marry/be long term with I wouldn't call any of that "shallow," it's just the differences in attraction levels, and the ability to separate sexual attraction from dating attraction and friendship attraction. Factors are dependent on personality, looks, compatibility, etc. That's also what causes a lot of dating issues, people often think there's in the final category of "would marry" when they're in one of the others (and it's often about how honest the two people are with each other). If a guy meets someone that he feels like he's maxed out with, he's going to date her, period, in most cases. Since most people want to end up being with someone, beggars/choosers comes into play, so where a person lies in these categories changes from person to person, and depends almost entirely on where that person sees themselves and who they think they can achieve. Louie approaches his dating/relationship writing from this general perspective, from my observations (as does Larry David in an extreme way); the issue being, as No Wave stated above me, that he sometimes writes himself as a "regular guy" when we have to remember that he's still a rather popular comedian that gets "hot" women from time to time in that universe. It's a weird disconnect. Larry David generally does a better job of writing that kind of thing, as he created multiple characters in Seinfeld with different demographics to cover the range (Jerry was famous enough for practically anyone, but extremely picky partially due to that, George had upper-middle struggles, etc.), or pretty much writes himself in his actual situation. I think Louie is a bit better when not writing specifically about relationships/dating, whereas Larry David (and Stephen Merchant/Ricky Gervais) are possibly at their strongest on those subjects.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 18:19
|
|
|
ozza posted:Here's a good chat with Louis from Opie & Anthony a few years back, in which he talks about the theme song - it's a pretty interesting story. The song discussion starts at about 30 mins in, but if you're interested in the production of the show, the whole segment is good. Thanks for posting this. Very interesting.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 19:41
|
|
|
Thanks for those responses No Wave and Darko, that sort of mindset gone wrong actually helps explain a whole hell of relationships my friends have started in their college years. It also explains how social pressures would lead them to try to maintain relationships which were clearly terrible, I guess the lines between fuckbuddies and serious relationships are more blurred than I thought.
Bifner McDoogle fucked around with this message at 22:06 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 22:03
|
|
|
King Vidiot posted:...well, come to think of it it does kind of undermine the point you're trying to make if in the previous episode we see "schlubby everyman" Louie being totally familiar with Jerry Seinfeld like they're old friends, and then going on to gently caress Yvonne Strahovski. Especially when one of the messages of that episode was that women aren't interested in men for the same reasons men are interested in women. She didn't jump on Louie because he's on her level looks wise, she was into him because he was funny, obviously successful enough to appear at billionaire fundraisers and hanging with Seinfeld, etc. He knows drat well that equating his looks with a woman's looks isn't realistic in today's society. He could have made possibly a profound comment about that, but went with this instead. I still think if everyone reversed the roles of that episode they'd see how disturbing it actually was. Louie constantly, aggressively asks out a beautiful girl at the club, no matter how many times she politely refuses. He gives her a $1200 purse or pays off some $1200 debt or something which guilts her into spending a day with him. When she gives him the "look, its not that you aren't a great guy, because you are" speech after he won't ease up, he gets angry and aggressive and lectures her for 15 minutes about what a piece of poo poo example of society she is because she won't have a relationship with him. Finally, defeated, she reluctantly holds his hand and plays interested for the rest of the day. The end. I'd be horrified if I watched that play out. Honestly, if you are going to stick with this "men and women are all the same and should be treated the same" line of thinking, at least be consistent. The Pamela story line was disturbing to me for that reason, because he was being the "aww man you friendzoned me!" guy that no one should ever be. Every time he brought it up he made her uncomfortable by putting her in the position of having to explain to him why she wouldn't have a relationship with him, which is a really messed up thing to do to a friend. There's only two ends to that exchange: either she finally puts her foot down and hurts his feelings enough that he stops that nonsense, or she caves in and fucks him which is insanely uncool. There is no good end to it, and you guys are really missing the fact that that exact same scenario just played out in front of you in reverse. Jake Armitage fucked around with this message at 23:10 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 23:04
|
|
|
Bifner McDoogle posted:Thanks for those responses No Wave and Darko, that sort of mindset gone wrong actually helps explain a whole hell of relationships my friends have started in their college years. It also explains how social pressures would lead them to try to maintain relationships which were clearly terrible, I guess the lines between fuckbuddies and serious relationships are more blurred than I thought. Well you're almost there. I would say there's minimal social pressure. Guys will put up with a lot of poo poo from a girl if she's hot and puts out. Sure their guy friends may comment a lot about how hot she is and pat him on the back but trust me the guy is a willing participant.
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 23:20
|
|
|
Jake Armitage posted:I'd be horrified if I watched that play out. Honestly, if you are going to stick with this "men and women are all the same and should be treated the same" line of thinking, at least be consistent. The Pamela story line was disturbing to me for that reason, because he was being the "aww man you friendzoned me!" guy that no one should ever be. Every time he brought it up he made her uncomfortable by putting her in the position of having to explain to him why she wouldn't have a relationship with him, which is a really messed up thing to do to a friend. There's only two ends to that exchange: either she finally puts her foot down and hurts his feelings enough that he stops that nonsense, or she caves in and fucks him which is insanely uncool. There is no good end to it, and you guys are really missing the fact that that exact same scenario just played out in front of you in reverse. Pamela also seemed far from uncomfortable. She thought it was funny. I can imagine the scenario in which she is uncomfortable, but she wasn't. Plus, in the airport later, the joke is clearly on him. (I'm actually not sure which episode you're referring to, but there may have been a scene where he was being annoying and pathetic. I forgot it, probably. But IIRC he gets punished for being pathetic and annoying, so I think there's nothing wrong with that portrayal.) I totally agree with you about the S4E3 scene, though. No Wave fucked around with this message at 23:29 on May 15, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 15, 2014 23:21
|
|
|
Jake Armitage posted:He gives her a $1200 purse or pays off some $1200 debt or something which guilts her into spending a day with him. When she gives him the "look, its not that you aren't a great guy, because you are" speech after he won't ease up, he gets angry and aggressive and lectures her for 15 minutes about what a piece of poo poo example of society she is because she won't have a relationship with him. Except you forget the part where he says, quite casually, that it's because he's fat, and then she says "no, you're not fat", and then Louie goes on a rant that's not about gender politics but instead about how fat men can't date hot women because blah blah entitlement, men's rights, blah. If you swap the genders it turns into something completely different. It doesn't matter if you can't see that it's different, it is. Men and women are not on an equal playing field when it comes to dating, and how they're treated by the opposite sex. I'm not going to go into the whys because it's already been discussed over and over in a circular argument, ad nauseum. edit: Also you added "beautiful"... which changes it even further. Louis C.K. is not a bad looking guy but he's not ruggedly handsome. It'd be more like if Louie and Vanessa's roles in the episode were reversed, and she was the successful comedian and he were just somebody who worked at the club. King Vidiot fucked around with this message at 00:09 on May 16, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 00:07
|
|
|
Thank you for saying all that so I didn't have to. So we're pretty much done with stand-alones, right? The next several episodes are going to be big arcs like the Letterman run was?
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 00:18
|
|
|
No Wave posted:I think a guy's allowed to be honest with a woman if they're hanging out together, even if his feelings are inconvenient. He's allowed to be honest once. That's fine. But when he persists is when it gets uncomfortable. No Wave posted:Pamela also seemed far from uncomfortable. She thought it was funny. I can imagine the scenario in which she is uncomfortable, but she wasn't. Rewatch the finale, when he takes her to the airport, but think from her perspective. Maybe it was just my reading, but it was painful. She was just trying to have a nice goodbye and he made it really odd and uncomfortable, just standing there like an idiot puppy dog while she's saying out loud "just wave to me idiot". My read was she just wanted to have this play out like it would with two friends, and he just couldn't or wouldn't. King Vidiot posted:Except you forget the part where he says, quite casually, that it's because he's fat, and then she says "no, you're not fat", and then Louie goes on a rant that's not about gender politics but instead about how fat men can't date hot women because blah blah entitlement, men's rights, blah. You still for some reason think beauty is or should be the main criteria for selection in women, as it pretty clearly is in men, which it isn't. She wouldn't say "you're not fat! that's not why!" but in the real world she might say "it's not because you're poor and drive a lovely car and have no social value whatsoever!" No guy wants to be honest with a girl and say yeah I might date you if you lost 40 pounds. Have you ever tried it? Try it. Good luck with that. And no woman would want to admit the real reason she's not attracted to a man, and honestly for the sake of politeness she shouldn't. The thing is though its insane to me that people really think those reasons would be the same for men as women. I can't see how you could spend any amount of time on Earth and honestly believe that. For better or worse, right or wrong, and I'm not making a judgement here, men and women are expected to bring different things into a relationship. Women will get called out for gaining weight and letting themselves go after marriage way more often than a man would (if he would at all), and men will be shamed for letting a woman take care of him while he sits at home doing nothing, or taking care of the kids, or whatever. I don't really want to argue whether its right or wrong, that's a whole other discussion, its just the way the world is now. King Vidiot posted:edit: Also you added "beautiful"... which changes it even further. Louis C.K. is not a bad looking guy but he's not ruggedly handsome. See above. I'm making an equivalent swap here. A beautiful man with no job who lives with his parents is not as valuable in the real world as a beautiful women with the same situation. His looks are irrelevant. I mean, it was the plot of the very last episode for gods sake! Jake Armitage fucked around with this message at 00:39 on May 16, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 00:24
|
|
|
Jake Armitage posted:Rewatch the finale, when he takes her to the airport, but think from her perspective. Maybe it was just my reading, but it was painful. She was just trying to have a nice goodbye and he made it really odd and uncomfortable, just standing there like an idiot puppy dog while she's saying out loud "just wave to me idiot". My read was she just wanted to have this play out like it would with two friends, and he just couldn't or wouldn't.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 00:39
|
|
|
King Vidiot posted:edit: Also you added "beautiful"... which changes it even further. Louis C.K. is not a bad looking guy but he's not ruggedly handsome. It'd be more like if Louie and Vanessa's roles in the episode were reversed, and she was the successful comedian and he were just somebody who worked at the club. EDIT: Oopsie, double-posted. No Wave fucked around with this message at 00:44 on May 16, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 00:41
|
|
|
King Vidiot posted:edit: Also you added "beautiful"... which changes it even further. Louis C.K. is not a bad looking guy but he's not ruggedly handsome. Louis CK is an old, bald, overweight ginger with hideous facial hair and a terrible sense of style. His only attractive qualities are his fame and fortune. Irish Joe fucked around with this message at 01:08 on May 16, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 01:06
|
|
|
He's pretty funny as well.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 01:28
|
|
|
King Vidiot posted:...Louis C.K. is not a bad looking guy... You're just like Louie when he said she wasn't fat. He's an overweight bald ginger. That's like a trifecta of male un-attractiveness.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 04:59
|
|
|
Irish Joe posted:Louis CK is an old, bald, overweight ginger with hideous facial hair and a terrible sense of style. His only attractive qualities are his fame and fortune. He and Seinfeld both use observational humour but Louis' shtick of "Oh look at me, I'm pathetic and hopeless" is tired and kind of odd given his recent successful tours and stand-up career. It often makes me sad and feeling sorry for them when people who make their living from their public persona can't even be bothered to have a healthy diet and get in some exercise.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 11:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 19, 2024 05:27 |
|
|
You mean the last two episodes, right? I certainly found the first pair way funnier/better. I'm going to assume his old doctor "died" because Ricky Gervais lost a ton of weight, which would make all the whining seem a bit silly, especially considering he's over 50 now: 
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2014 13:33
|
|