|
Why would you need to mass-produce refineries? 
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 02:02
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 24, 2024 15:59 |
|
|
Platystemon posted:Why would you need to mass-produce refineries?
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 03:32
|
|
|
Also in case biters eat a few. Now you'd have to rebuild it by hand like some kind of savage.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 03:47
|
|
|
Have a stack of everything, that way if you ever need anything, you have it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 05:29
|
|
|
What's the ratio of pumps to refineries? Is there a maximum a pipe can hold or am I fine jamming 6 pump outputs into one pipe?
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 05:39
|
|
|
Oil jacks or fluid storage technology pumps? If oil jacks, pumping out of ground, it depends on how old the source is, as they produce less and less. Storage tank for crude and single refinery is enough for me, just don't waste any on solid fuel. Lube with heavy until you have a storage tank, then crack the rest to light. Light can be cracked straight to petroleum. Petroleum should be made into sulfur/batteries/explosives and plastic. Use storage tanks for petroleum. For pump pumps, both ends of long pipelines or single near refinery. Or both. It helps against clogged and stagnant pipes, and I think it only connects forward and behind, not to the sides. Can someone check please? Could be used as in tight builds in that case.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 06:06
|
|
|
I like having a tank for sulphuric acid and lube.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 06:11
|
|
|
Pumpjacks drop in value over time. In long play games, you can pretty much consider every oil spot to be valued 0.1/sec (and the comparatively short time before then ends up just being a bonus). Since refineries need 10 oil per 5 sec (or 2/sec), the ideal ratio is 20 pumps to each refinery. In practice, 20-25 is enough for most games, but you end up getting frustrated and hunting down another 6-8 every other hour. E: Yes, Electric Pumps are good for one-way nonconnective piping. The also have a use when you are joining multiple pumpjacks that end up with a T shape pipeline: pre:[PJ] | | |*----[R] | | [PJ]
pre:
BAD GOOD BETTER
[T] (Marginal Input)
|
[PJ]----------[R] [PJ]-------[T]------[R] [PJ]------[T]*-------[R]
Evilreaver fucked around with this message at 06:39 on Jul 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 06:17
|
|
|
And don't make solid fuel. Skip it all. Get your plastics-advcircuits line up and running, petroleum-sulphur-battery-accumulator line up and running, and get your blueprints and roboports and construction bots, and spam out enormous solar/accumulator complexes with a single button.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 06:26
|
|
|
Solid fuel is basically only good as a panic or bandaid, or if you set Oil to "Woah Lots" in map creation. If you run outta coal you had better have SOMETHING (ideally solar) and fuel can do a good job tiding you over until you can truck more coal in and/or get the drat solars working. E: But yea if you are relying on solid fuel as a lifeline then something is probably wrong
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 06:38
|
|
|
You people are making me feel bad.  I was using solid fuel as a coal replacement last time i played.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 12:53
|
|
|
Thyrork posted:You people are making me feel bad. It works fine once you have adv cracking as long as you don't mind hunting down new wells ever 3-4 hours of play.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 13:50
|
|
|
Poison capsules are, hands down, the best forest-clearer.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 16:28
|
|
|
Colonel J posted:Poison capsules are, hands down, the best forest-clearer. Not as fancy as HE rockets tho'.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 16:33
|
|
|
Evilreaver posted:Solid fuel is basically only good as a panic or bandaid, or if you set Oil to "Woah Lots" in map creation. If you run outta coal you had better have SOMETHING (ideally solar) and fuel can do a good job tiding you over until you can truck more coal in and/or get the drat solars working. What else do you do with light oil before you have the tech that lets you convert it to petroleum? Sam. fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Jul 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 17:26
|
|
|
Sam. posted:What else do you do with light oil before you have the tech that lets you convert it to petroleum? Lots and lots of tanks.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 17:31
|
|
|
Sam. posted:What else do you do with light oil before you have the tech that lets you convert it to petroleum? Tank it, though my very first blue science tech is usually "advanced oil processing" so I rarely get to fill one tank Sing with me now, ♪ I'm always starved for petrol ♪ I crack that poo poo right away ♪
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 17:34
|
|
|
Not sure what you guys are doing, but I am literally overflooded by light oil, cannot split it enough because I am lazy to cramp another tank for my petrolium somwhere, all my production is running like a charm with 1k+ advances circuits, 500 of the blue ones and so much loving blue belt. The only thing that I was missing is coal. So I just started with solid fuel and...eh? It really depends on your location. My next coal was hidding behind 5+ spawner bases.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 17:39
|
|
|
Phobophilia posted:And don't make solid fuel. Skip it all. Get your plastics-advcircuits line up and running, petroleum-sulphur-battery-accumulator line up and running, and get your blueprints and roboports and construction bots, and spam out enormous solar/accumulator complexes with a single button. You're insane. Solid fuel and steam power is vital to maintaining a steady power supply when you hit maximum Isengard. My base currently has 11GJ of accumulator capacity, and that almost runs dry during the night. My base consumption is around 170 MW. My peak solar output is around 258 MW - I've got ~4.3K solar panels, according to the power output screen. I've got a block of 110 steam engines (11 rows of the optimal 1/14/10 config) producing 56 MW of steady, reliable power. I really do need to set up a second steam power block - or possibly move my steam generation entirely, since I have no more room to add additional rows at this point - it runs up against my tank farm. Supplying sufficient solid fuel is not a problem either - I've got 36 pumpjacks going, with speed modules, providing enough crude to keep my tanks relatively full. My lowest stockpile is of petroleum gas, at around 400 per tank, giving me 12k units. And this is with my plastic consumption going pretty much full bore, since I'm building up stocks of destroyer capsule precursors. (I've got 4.8k of those, but it takes for-loving-ever to make them, due to the amount of distractor capsules needed for each one, and the amount of defenders needed for each distractor.) Once I'm up to a couple chests full of defender/distractor capsules, my advanced circuit need will drop, and I'll be able to go back to stockpiling up fluids again because I won't be making so drat much plastic. One of the biggest things driving my power need, though, is my swap to a fully productivity module'd setup - everything, from miners to assemblers to chemical plants is now running at least first tier prod modules. It's been a great help in slowing my raw material consumption to the point where I'm not running around continuously trying to set up new mines before I run out of stockpiled ore. Kenlon fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Jul 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 18:34
|
|
|
From my experience so far. 6 rows of 1/14/10 require 4 chemical plants, turning light oil into fuel.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 18:43
|
|
|
Productivity and speed modules are not at all properly balanced. You are creating a huge pollution cloud due to not using efficiency modules. Example: 100kw - Base power draw 20kw - With three efficiency 1 modules or one efficiency 3 + one efficiency 1 240kw - With two speed 3 modules (+100% speed) So if you compare max efficiency vs max speed, its a 10x increase in power consumption for a 2x increase in speed. You should always just construct and place more of everything and use efficiency modules instead of speed or productivity. Pumpjacks are the only exception although I have decided to just place more pumps rather than have them create huge pollution clouds. I think the math comes out even worse for productivity modules.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 20:57
|
|
|
I like using productivity modules on expensive end products. The +120% energy draw and +80% pollution on one assembler is no big deal compared to 12% less of everything upstream—fewer mines, smelters, pumpjacks, refineries, chemical plants, assemblers; it all adds up.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 21:14
|
|
|
Pollution is a really minor concern in general, early-game two or three pillboxes (and maybe some aggression with an SMG+P) will keep you safe, and lategame nothing can break a 12-laser 2-wall pillbox, which are cheap to slap down everywhere. Power isn't really a concern either, as solars/accumulators are place-and-forget. Efficiency modules only let you forstall placing more, which lategame means driving to an open field and clicking once with a blueprint.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 21:45
|
|
|
Evilreaver posted:Pollution is a really minor concern in general, early-game two or three pillboxes (and maybe some aggression with an SMG+P) will keep you safe, and lategame nothing can break a 12-laser 2-wall pillbox, which are cheap to slap down everywhere. I keep trying to start a game with Rich/Large everything including biter bases, but small starting area. It's friggin impossible to tech to lasers without getting eaten alive. Even resorting to self-feeding AP bullet turrets isn't nearly enough - they just come faster then I can manufacture bullets to shoot them with. if any of you can manage to get off the ground with such a start I'd be super curious how you did it... For now I just made a custom map that has a small starting area surrounded by a moat with only one at least somewhat defendable chokepoint. And it's still bloody hard.
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 22:52
|
|
|
Don't get me wrong, one of the things I love about the game is that you can play however you like and it is very accommodating. If you want to use all black power and speed modules with beacons with more speed modules in the middle of a desert, you can do that. Or you can go all green power and efficiency modules in a forest and burst out of your base with Mk2 Power Armor, fifty drones, 10k explosive rockets and mush armies of nothing but small biters. You can set resources way up so you never need a second mine, or way down so you need to plant 3 at once and have Satan's Own Railway to manage all of it. 
|
|
#
?
Jul 1, 2014 23:36
|
|
|
Xel posted:Productivity and speed modules are not at all properly balanced. You are creating a huge pollution cloud due to not using efficiency modules. Pollution is utterly irrelevant. A proper defensive wall can stand off infinite numbers of biters. Production modules do what nothing else can: create additional resources out of nowhere. Use them on everything that will take them.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 10:04
|
|
|
Productivity also slows down production immensely, so unless a resource is actually scarce, it doesn't make sense to use them. Just go and get more X.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 16:13
|
|
|
You should always be using productivity on oil refineries. It's debatable on any other thing.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 16:18
|
|
|
Kenlon posted:Pollution is utterly irrelevant. A proper defensive wall can stand off infinite numbers of biters. Production modules do what nothing else can: create additional resources out of nowhere. Use them on everything that will take them. It's also not like the fuckers leave you alone if you are all solar and electric smelters with efficiency. You gotta wall up for the stray pack of biters anyway, and if you do that, might as well go full-maginot.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 17:47
|
|
|
If you're using anything but self-fueling burner loaders to move poo poo around your base then you're a witch and the devil will take your soul.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 17:55
|
|
|
FISHMANPET posted:Productivity also slows down production immensely, so unless a resource is actually scarce, it doesn't make sense to use them. Just go and get more X. When you're having to build and route trains out to an extended distance to pick up more ore, slowing down production is a good thing, not a bad thing, as it gives you more time to set up additional mining outposts. What you really want is enough ore coming in to max out your depots, both for ore and for iron/copper plates. Once you reach that point, then you should have enough to keep up with any downstream manufacturing, with the inevitable pauses between batches providing time for your smelters and miners to fill back up any deficit. I ran my base for almost ten hours with no new ore coming in (while doing major restructuring of mining/smelting/manufacturing routing) and was down to about 6 chests of copper plates, 10 chests of iron plates and 15 chests of steel when I got my ore supply restored. Depots work. EDIT: Now, since I was clearing biter nests/extending defenses/building roboport coverage/setting up train routes for a large portion of the time, I didn't have as much draw on my raw materials as I would if I didn't have my output depots full, but there was still a pretty significant quantity of manufacturing going on. Kenlon fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Jul 2, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 18:11
|
|
|
FISHMANPET posted:Productivity also slows down production immensely, so unless a resource is actually scarce, it doesn't make sense to use them. Just go and get more X. The only thing I use productivity modules for is purple science or some products that require alien artifacts. Everything else it just makes since to go with Efficiency 3 + Speed modules.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 18:53
|
|
|
If you're starving for Alien artifacts you're doing it wrong.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 18:54
|
|
|
FISHMANPET posted:If you're starving for Alien artifacts you're doing it wrong. That's a mistake I made early on, I walled myself in and fortified myself to hell and back- then when it came to get rocket defense I had zero artifacts, no power armor, lousy drones, etc etc and breaking into enemy bases guarded by Big Biters and Worms was nearly impossible. That's where the LP is now and that's probably why nobody wants to take a turn anymore  Get SMG+P and 100 artifacts asap, new players! That's enough to kit out later.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 21:04
|
|
|
Evilreaver posted:That's a mistake I made early on, I walled myself in and fortified myself to hell and back- then when it came to get rocket defense I had zero artifacts, no power armor, lousy drones, etc etc and breaking into enemy bases guarded by Big Biters and Worms was nearly impossible. That's where the LP is now and that's probably why nobody wants to take a turn anymore
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 21:08
|
|
|
tonberrytoby posted:This happens to me almost every time. The best solution is actually to load your car full of armor pricing shotgun shells and drive until you can snipe some small bases. AP shotshells cost artifacts, nerd E: to research
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 21:15
|
|
|
In those cases I like to trek out far into the wilds beyond my pollution cloud. Or just build a fuckton of distraction capsules. There's no problem distraction capsules can't solve.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 21:20
|
|
|
Evilreaver posted:AP shotshells cost artifacts, nerd
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 21:29
|
|
|
I finally beat the drat train mission in the campaign, and ended up ghost riding cars into the spawners by the iron mine to kill them, stupid crippled tech tree 
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 21:47
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 24, 2024 15:59 |
|
|
I don't get the fascination with the shotgun- pre upgraded shells. The SMG with piercing always seems to kill things better and faster for me.
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2014 22:34
|
|