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...of SCIENCE! posted:It's especially awkward with the Pendleton Twins, since the nonlethal takedown for them is to do a completely unrelated sidequest for some guy in a completely different map and when you get back to the pub Lord Treavor talks about how he feels bad about having them killed and then you go upstairs and there's a letter from him going "oh btw I heard you didn't actually kill them thanks The non lethal take down is to have them blinded and sold into slavery forever, and for another you kidnap the victim and hand them off to a rapist. So much better then killing. The Chaos system entirely ruined Dishonored for me. Everything about Dishonored tells you that you'll get to be this awesome assassin and deal out righteous death, and the combat is actually fun, but when you play like that you are punished with a bad ending.
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Jul 7, 2014 19:30
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" because they couldn't add new voice acting.
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The High Chaos ending isn't even a bad one and its actually more thematically appropriate to the game. The game doesn't punish you for anything, its just people getting hung up on "good" and "bad" endings. Though it is totally true that non-lethal was added kind of late so it does kind of clash. (Though I really do like that the non-lethal options are far worse than death. It really plays off the usual expectations of video game pacifism.) The Daud DLC fixed the problems with non-lethal though and hopefully 2 goes further with it.
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Jul 7, 2014 20:10
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Accordion Man posted:The High Chaos ending isn't even a bad one and its actually more thematically appropriate to the game. The game doesn't punish you for anything, its just people getting hung up on "good" and "bad" endings. Though it is totally true that non-lethal was added kind of late so it does kind of clash. (Though I really do like that the non-lethal options are far worse than death. It really plays off the usual expectations of video game pacifism.) The Daud DLC fixed the problems with non-lethal though and hopefully 2 goes further with it. The game does punish you a little in the last mission for having high chaos by having Sam purposely fire off a pistol to alerts a shitload of guards in the compound you have to infiltrate. But if you know it's coming, you can take care of him first. High chaos also increases the amount of stuff like rat swarms and weepers, which can be a problem.
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Jul 7, 2014 23:07
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The problem with the Dishonoured low/high chaos system is that a lot of people just assumed it was a moral/immoral system. At no point does the game congratulate you on using the nonlethal options or tell you that what you did was morally justified. People just got hung up on thinking nonlethtal meant good. You have to think about in terms of chaos. If a highly public figure is publicly executed by a masked teleporting assasin in the middle of a party filled with politicians that is going to cause some chaos. If instead the public figure quietly dissapears to rape island without anyone knowing where she went or see what happened to her it's going to cause rumors. If Corvo flies around beheading guards everywhere he goes there will be more corpses, which will mean more rats, which means more plague. If they keep the system in the sequel they need to be much more clear about how what you do affects public perception and the chaos it can cause so people don't bitch about the good/bad options not making sense.
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Jul 7, 2014 23:27
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I never found the increased rats and weepers an issue playing high chaos because high chaos makes you not give a gently caress. The best way to play that game was play attack ghost where you hid and blinked around then charged in on surprise attacks killing everyone and hiding again before reinforcements showed up. It was so much more satisfying than pure stealth and way more interesting than just running headlong into battle each time. If you are always on rooftops rats and weepers aren't a threat. I thought what dragged down dishonored was the story. The characters are all super obvious cliches and for such a weird world the story was incredibly generic as well. I didn't care about anyone the whole game and just tried to off everybody.
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Jul 7, 2014 23:30
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Your Gay Uncle posted:The problem with the Dishonoured low/high chaos system is that a lot of people just assumed it was a moral/immoral system. At no point does the game congratulate you on using the nonlethal options or tell you that what you did was morally justified. People just got hung up on thinking nonlethtal meant good. You have to think about in terms of chaos. If a highly public figure is publicly executed by a masked teleporting assasin in the middle of a party filled with politicians that is going to cause some chaos. If instead the public figure quietly dissapears to rape island without anyone knowing where she went or see what happened to her it's going to cause rumors. If Corvo flies around beheading guards everywhere he goes there will be more corpses, which will mean more rats, which means more plague. Doesn't the heart tell you that guards are basically normal people doing their job? Like, good honest family men?
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Jul 7, 2014 23:30
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Dishonored feels like it's trying its hardest to be a Deus Ex type game but has to concede that the audience may not be tuned into that type of game. Having to spell out certain things like you're trespassing in the Boyle estate or leave mission clues about locker combinations when it's pretty obvious what the solution is from the diary entries and so on.
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Jul 8, 2014 00:54
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kazil posted:Doesn't the heart tell you that guards are basically normal people doing their job? Like, good honest family men? On anybody who isn't a named NPC (and even on some of them, like the servants at the Hound Pits), the Heart just spits out generic lines. Said lines are a mix between "This person is an innocent soul" and "This person is a total bastard."
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Jul 8, 2014 01:17
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If at any point in a game you need to escort or walk next to NPCs they should move at one of your speeds. NPCs shouldn't move faster than your walk and slower than your run! It happens in too many games for me to list.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:20
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Elysiume posted:If at any point in a game you need to escort or walk next to NPCs they should move at one of your speeds. NPCs shouldn't move faster than your walk and slower than your run! It happens in too many games for me to list. Yet another thing in a long list of things that Skyrim does poorly. I mean, if it's an NPC coded to follow you, they keep up fine...ish. But if there's an Aaron Sorkin walk-and-talk scene going on, you don't walk fast enough to walk with them and you run too quickly for them. It's real obnoxious.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:26
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The Low Chaos ending goes on about a "golden age" and and how wonderful and enlightened Emily is while the high chaos ending harps about "mountains of corpses", so people can be forgiven for thinking it's a morality system when it comes off as something out of Fable.
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Jul 8, 2014 01:44
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I don't know, I thought the Chaos system in Dishonored worked perfectly - I went through the game as non-lethally as possible with a few exceptions (I think I killed an early target by accident, I know I killed a few guards at least indirectly, and I killed at least half the guards and the target of Dunwall Tower without any remorse), I went on to murder literally everything that moved during the last map, and I still got the best ending as far as I can tell. It really was pretty forgiving, and by the time I was on the last map I was pretty excited to let loose with all the hacking tools and lethal traps I'd been hoarding. I never did get the bone charm that made choke holds faster, though. For content, I've started a new game of Morrowind. gently caress you, Vivec. gently caress you gently caress you gently caress you. I've spent literally hundreds of hours playing this game. I know my way around Vivec, more or less. One of the very first things I did on this new character was create a spell to Fortify Speed so I could walk at a halfway acceptable rate. This ridiculous city is still a bitch and a half to get around. God help you if you use an Almsivi Intervention in the wrong place and end up at the Temple Canton unexpectedly. gently caress Vivec.
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Jul 8, 2014 02:05
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kazil posted:Doesn't the heart tell you that guards are basically normal people doing their job? Like, good honest family men? “Is this how it's going to be when we're married?"
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Jul 8, 2014 02:29
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Every time I play New Super Mario Bros. U, I get mad at myself for spending more money on this dumb loving tripe. Why aren't these games any goddamn better? (Answer: because I keep spending money on it already.) I just hate finding the star coins and secrets in these games because it's reminiscent of playing Doom and mashing the action key on every wall trying to find the secrets. They're all hidden behind fake walls. How do I know a wall is fake? Well, if I smash my face against every straight length of wall, eventually I'll find one that I can pass through. It's so childish. At least the Mario 3D games are vaguely clever about hiding their collectables, or at least they require a hard jump or a task to get them. In NSMB, they're just hidden behind fake walls. Also these games are hardly platforming games. Every level is just a gauntlet of enemies with pits that don't kill you if you somehow miss the jump. NSMB games could only be considered decent if they existed completely in a vacuum. e: Also underwater levels continue to be the same insufferable dog poo poo that they've been since Mario 1. Why do these keep ending up in Mario games? Yeah I love very slowly plodding through water and dodging bloopers, wheeeee. RyokoTK has a new favorite as of 03:20 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Jul 8, 2014 03:17
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RyokoTK posted:e: Also underwater levels continue to be the same insufferable dog poo poo that they've been since Mario 1. Why do these keep ending up in Mario games? Yeah I love very slowly plodding through water and dodging bloopers, wheeeee. Because Nintendo likes to recycle - everything. The only game where you could actually swim for poo poo in a 2D mario game was in 3 when you had the frog suit.
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Jul 8, 2014 03:26
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scarycave posted:Because Nintendo likes to recycle - everything. This is such a goddamn understatement it makes me giggle. I mean I know it was an old joke even in the 90s but Nintendo really is the world's most efficient recycling facility on the planet.
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Jul 8, 2014 03:37
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Elysiume posted:If at any point in a game you need to escort or walk next to NPCs they should move at one of your speeds. NPCs shouldn't move faster than your walk and slower than your run! It happens in too many games for me to list. This is irritating, though its kinda funny when someone is talking and walking and you walk too slow to keep up so you suddenly sprint after them then go back to walking. Repeat several times..
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Jul 8, 2014 04:37
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Why did Valve change Dota 2 stranges to "Inscribed"? Previously the "Strange" would get replaced by steadily more impressive titles (all the way up to things like rage inducing or server clearing) but now they're all just boring "Inscribed." Animal Crossing could be fun but there's like.. Nothing to do. I mean I like the home designing and such but unlike say, the Sims, that's all there is to it. Not really any minigames (other then the GCN one), no way to interact with the other people and you don't get to choose what your house changes to be like as it's on a linear upgrade path. Also why do most of the strategy games on the 3DS and Vita suck? 
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Jul 8, 2014 05:51
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Anatharon posted:Also why do most of the strategy games on the 3DS and Vita suck? Fire Emblem is all you need, friend. Unless you're gonna say it sucks, in which case we'll need to have words.
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Jul 8, 2014 05:59
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Anatharon posted:Why did Valve change Dota 2 stranges to "Inscribed"? Previously the "Strange" would get replaced by steadily more impressive titles (all the way up to things like rage inducing or server clearing) but now they're all just boring "Inscribed."
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Jul 8, 2014 06:03
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Not a problem with the game itself, but hackers in Payday 2. Sometimes I run into games with them multiple times in a row, and every time you need to bail out or you risk suddenly ending up with infinite money or skill points, or suddenly being level five infamous. If it does happen, the only way you can fix it is by resetting everything to zero and starting from scratch.
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Jul 8, 2014 07:19
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Play with goons and that problem sorts itself out. The popular HoxHud mod also has some anti-cheat systems, including letting you roll back your money totals if they suddenly jump by an obviously hacked amount.
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Jul 8, 2014 07:21
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Elysiume posted:If at any point in a game you need to escort or walk next to NPCs they should move at one of your speeds. NPCs shouldn't move faster than your walk and slower than your run! It happens in too many games for me to list. The best (as in most terrible) example of this is in Hitman 2: Silent Assassin. Unless you can hide in a nook that a guard passes by on its patrol, you're not going to fiber wire/chloroform him. There is a level that take place in the snow where one section has just thin trees for cover. It took me half a minute of sneaking before I even got in range of the guard patrolling back and forth. I'm pretty sure he was a second away from turning around again too. Mierenneuker has a new favorite as of 09:03 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Jul 8, 2014 08:54
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People give you free money and you get mad? Free skill points and money to actually use them? You payday people are loving weird. No you just cant have fun! You have to earn it!
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Jul 8, 2014 09:00
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Getting everything is short term fun. Grinding and unlocking stuff is long term fun. I don't play Payday, but I guess it's that sense of progression, that carrot on the stick, that keeps people playing.
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Jul 8, 2014 09:05
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SpookyLizard posted:People give you free money and you get mad? Free skill points and money to actually use them? You payday people are loving weird. No you just cant have fun! You have to earn it! Getting your account banned is real fuckin fun. Having to wait months for the company to reverse the hacked cash on your account (while keeping a close eye on your money so you don't spend any of it until they fix it in case you get penalised) is fun too.
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Jul 8, 2014 09:10
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John Murdoch posted:Play with goons and that problem sorts itself out. The popular HoxHud mod also has some anti-cheat systems, including letting you roll back your money totals if they suddenly jump by an obviously hacked amount. Semi related. Where do you post to get into the SA Goons group on Steam? I have been meaning to join, but I have no clue how.
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Jul 8, 2014 09:10
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The thread is in the PGS sub-forum.
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Jul 8, 2014 09:56
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Lotish posted:The Low Chaos ending goes on about a "golden age" and and how wonderful and enlightened Emily is while the high chaos ending harps about "mountains of corpses", so people can be forgiven for thinking it's a morality system when it comes off as something out of Fable. One of the first tutorial messages is also a massive  KILLING PEOPLE WILL LEAD TO A BAD ENDING pop-up. Coupled with the lack of consistency mentioned earlier and yeah, it comes across as a cheap morality system. The High Chaos ending is more thematically appropriate, but it feels kind of sour that the game tries to pretend there's any significant moral depth.
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Jul 8, 2014 10:31
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SWTOR is a fun game, but the plot somehow manages to be worse than in every other SW game. I'm still amazed by the Coruscant Jedi Knight chapter, where a Sith steals Republican superweapon plans and turns out to be the lead researcher. He stole his own project instead of developing it for his compatriots, because that's more evil, I guess? It's even worse for the Empire - instead of just being comically inept, the Sith behave like WH40K orks, slaughtering their own troops, commanders and each other under flimsiest pretexts imaginable. Yeah, it's supported by the canon - but here it's so over the top it's hard to be taken seriously.
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Jul 8, 2014 10:52
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poptart_fairy posted:One of the first tutorial messages is also a massive Only killing fucktons of people or with witnesses. If you kill and hide the bodies it's easy to get low chaos.
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Jul 8, 2014 12:39
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Yeah, I'm not disputing the actual mechanics behind it, but people are trying to paint the distinction as something deeper than mass murderer/saint. If you're 'peaceful' the game bends over backwards to smother you with how awesome everything turns out and how great a person you are.
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Jul 8, 2014 12:44
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poptart_fairy posted:One of the first tutorial messages is also a massive That's not what it says at all:  "Your actions affect the city. A high number of deaths results in more rats and weepers, different reactions, and darker final outcomes." is about the most neutral and accurate way they could have possibly explained it.
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Jul 8, 2014 13:43
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...of SCIENCE! posted:That's not what it says at all: How do you interpret "Darker final outcomes" as anything other than the "bad end"? even if just in comparison to the "normal" ending. I don't know how people get the high chaos ending without trying anyway? killing every other person you meet seems like a lot of work.
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Jul 8, 2014 14:24
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Hel posted:How do you interpret "Darker final outcomes" as anything other than the "bad end"? even if just in comparison to the "normal" ending. Nah, just bait them into fighting something like a rat swarm or weepers and grenade everything.
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Jul 8, 2014 14:30
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Hel posted:How do you interpret "Darker final outcomes" as anything other than the "bad end"? even if just in comparison to the "normal" ending. There are those pillar things that you can hack and on the bridge level they can kill a lot of guards.
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Jul 8, 2014 14:42
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So I've been playing Divinity: Original Sin and while the game is great and a lot of fun there are a few things that bother the hell out of me. 1. Keys aren't shared between characters. If you happen to pick up a random key on your mage but are controlling your warrior at the time the door/chest won't open. 2. Inventory management is atrocious. There is just so much wrong with it that I don't know where to start. I understand they want to keep them separate between characters because of the online component but maybe just combine them for single player or have your controlled characters contribute to your overall carrying capacity. 3. Speaking to animals. While great in theory having to chase around a moving pixel that actively runs away from you loving sucks. Beyond that though, the game is a blast to play and pulling off awesome telefragging/poison cloud/explosion combos never get's old.
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Jul 8, 2014 15:46
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The Missing Link DLC for Deus Ex Human Revolution Director's Cut does this thing where it strips you of all your spent and unspent praxis points, so you're baseline unaugmented from the start. You get quite a high number of points back while in the DLC area but after the final boss you get access to all your gear and your missing praxis... but not all of it. In order to stop you maxing out on augmentations from the DLC, the game caps it to a certain level and only gives you back enough points to reach that cap with what you earned in the DLC. The last time I played I ended up with less praxis points than when I entered the DLC. And yes, as was said before you cannot opt out of this DLC in the Director's Cut version, and it's pretty terrible.
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Jul 8, 2014 15:51
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m.hache posted:So I've been playing Divinity: Original Sin and while the game is great and a lot of fun there are a few things that bother the hell out of me. Seconding that the inventory management is terrible. I'd also like to be able to sort, y'know, alphabetically too. Sorting by item groups would be neat as well, instead of having to navigate tabs. And while it's not a drag per se, I wish there were more than two available companions. Larian does a pretty good job with off-beat characters, so I'd have liked to see more classes being represented with actual personalities, as opposed to having to hench rogues and earth/fire wizards and whatnot.
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Jul 8, 2014 16:10
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Illuyankas posted:The Missing Link DLC for Deus Ex Human Revolution Director's Cut does this thing where it strips you of all your spent and unspent praxis points, so you're baseline unaugmented from the start. You get quite a high number of points back while in the DLC area but after the final boss you get access to all your gear and your missing praxis... but not all of it. In order to stop you maxing out on augmentations from the DLC, the game caps it to a certain level and only gives you back enough points to reach that cap with what you earned in the DLC. The last time I played I ended up with less praxis points than when I entered the DLC. And yes, as was said before you cannot opt out of this DLC in the Director's Cut version, and it's pretty terrible. Now that I've beat the game the real kicker is that Missing Link gives you a bunch of actually quite relevant background for the last bit of the main game as well. Damned if you play it, damned if you don't.
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