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Xaris posted:loving yes. I just finished WoR (I know I know, I'm am a slow reader) and it was great. The last 15% was a total page turner which I had to finish in one sitting. I was just talking to girlfriend that I'll be loving old by the time he finishes SA but ~1.5 year turnaround would be great since I'm craving more so good to know there may be another one next year. Just finished the first two SA books myself and I massively enjoyed them. quote:It's actually quite amazing how far Brandon Sanderson has come in terms of writing female characters. Between Emperor's Soul and WoR, he's really come a long way. Shallan was actually quite a pleasure to read this time around compared to four years ago where it was kinda so-so at best. Or characters in general! I had read the first three mistborn books previously and thought the magic system was interesting and there was some fun worldbuilding, but found the characters pretty cardboard-y. WoK was a big step forward as far as putting interesting characters into interesting worlds and WoR improved further. Guess now I've got a two year wait to investigate more of his back catalog. My favorite one-chapter character was Lift, who I hope we see some more of in later books as I found her banter highly amusing. “The Prime’s quarters,” Lift said. “That’s the direction the food went.” “What is it with you and food?” “I’m going to eat their dinner,” she said, soft but intense. Gawx blinked, startled. “You’re . . . what?” “I’m gonna eat their food,” she said. “Rich folk have the best food.” “But . . . there might be spheres in the vizier quarters. . . .” “Eh,” she said. “I’d just spend ’em on food.” Stealing regular stuff was no fun. She wanted a real challenge. Over the last two years, she’d picked the most difficult places to enter. Then she’d snuck in. And eaten their dinners. “Come on,” she said, moving out of the doorway, then turned left toward the Prime’s chambers. “You really are crazy,” Gawx whispered. “Nah. Just bored.” “Why don’t they notice you?” Lift whispered. She’d never asked him, despite their months together. “Is it ’cuz only the pure in heart can see you?” “You’re not serious.” “Sure. That’d fit into legends and stories and stuff.” “Oh, the theory itself isn’t ridiculous,” Wyndle said, speaking out of a bit of vine near her, the various cords of green moving like lips. “Merely the idea that you consider yourself to be pure in heart.” “I’m pure,” Lift whispered, grunting as she climbed. “I’m a child and stuff. I’m so storming pure I practically belch rainbows.” I'm certainly hoping that after everything that happened in WoR there won't be that much Kalladin moping about in the next book -- seemed to me like he actually made some progress sorting his poo poo out.
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Aug 5, 2014 05:22
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Quinton posted:I'm certainly hoping that after everything that happened in WoR there won't be that much Kalladin moping about in the next book -- seemed to me like he actually made some progress sorting his poo poo out. Yeah. I felt that his time of moping is over with by the end, thank god. I also didn't quite get how he "killed" Syl the first time. Seemed like he was trying to draw on her power to save people? I think it would have made more sense if "killed" her by trying to use his power to attempt to kill someone in cold blood (i.e. Amaran) than by trying not to die in a fall
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Aug 5, 2014 08:15
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Xaris posted:Yeah. I felt that his time of moping is over with by the end, thank god. I also didn't quite get how he "killed" Syl the first time. Seemed like he was trying to draw on her power to save people? I think it would have made more sense if "killed" her by trying to use his power to attempt to kill someone in cold blood (i.e. Amaran) than by trying not to die in a fall Book 3 Preview spoilers He was back to being mopey and his hometown being destroyed just gives an excuse of another round of "the world fucks Kalladin" Plotting to kill the king went against the Radiant's ideals and thus was a breach of his oaths harming Syl, she tried to hold on and used her last bit of power saving him from that fall. This is probably what happened to the original Radiants they betrayed their oaths for some mystery reason and that's how they killed their spren like people keep saying they did.
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Aug 5, 2014 08:23
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Xaris posted:Yeah. I felt that his time of moping is over with by the end, thank god. I also didn't quite get how he "killed" Syl the first time. Seemed like he was trying to draw on her power to save people? I think it would have made more sense if "killed" her by trying to use his power to attempt to kill someone in cold blood (i.e. Amaran) than by trying not to die in a fall Yeah that had me scratching my head as well. Perhaps she was sufficiently weakened by his conflicting oaths that she couldn't support such a sudden/large surge. Been catching up on the last 10-20 pages of chatter now that I no longer fear WoR spoilers and regarding Jasnah "dying" and turning up again, I had and have mixed feelings... - I feel like "stabbed through the heart a second time and left in a pool of blood" says "yeah really dead", and clearly Shallan had to believe Jasnah gone to just go ahead and sink the ship, and okay there were numerous "where's the body" hints, but then there were numerous epigraphs seemingly confirming her death... - All that said, I think the story benefited from taking Jasnah off the board so that Shallan would be forced to sink or swim on her own (and I was happy to see her be successful rather than repeatedly captured and rescued or whatnot). I just think that the act of putting Jasnah out of the action could have been done less awkwardly. There seems to be a theory that Adolin is doomed so that Kalladin and Shallan can become romantically entangled, which I hope is not what we actually get. Especially because I love the fact that for maybe the first time (that I recall) in any big fantasy series I've read, neither party to an arranged marriage is horrified by the prospect, which has to score some serious novelty points. By the time I finished the second book I had mostly forgotten just how clunky the prologue to the first book was (which gave me some serious concerns, but thankfully things got rapidly better). It was definitely a horrible failure at "show don't tell." I'm glad that most of the later introduction of magic system details was far less Player's Handbook style. Okay, complaints about Szeth's revival I get (though it didn't bother me), but "Eshonai's dead" makes no sense to me -- POV characters just do not die off-camera in a book like this.
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Aug 5, 2014 08:41
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So many variations of the theme of white and nerdy in the line for the Liverpool signing. Edit: Got some questions about soul casting answered, solidity of personality matters as much as practice, the deformation that occurs in the soul casting Ardents is a risk to radiants but much less so. Rumda fucked around with this message at 13:13 on Aug 5, 2014 |
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Aug 5, 2014 12:29
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Rumda posted:So many variations of the theme of white and nerdy in the line for the Liverpool signing. I'd argue but you're exactly right. Didn't realise he had so many fans up here, half an hour early and I was queuing outside.
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Aug 5, 2014 14:11
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Glokta posted:I'd argue but you're exactly right. Didn't realise he had so many fans up here, half an hour early and I was queuing outside. Standouts from my end of the line; A guy with a literal straw fedora A guy who if he tidied himself up a bit could cosplay as an especially dishevelled Hound.
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Aug 5, 2014 14:35
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Neither of them were me so I'm ok. There was a guy dressed like some kind of Victorian magician near me but there's a magic shop near my work so I'm used to it. I'm already dreading reading more Sanderson in case I end up with a new favourite I want signed.
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Aug 5, 2014 14:45
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Glokta posted:I'm already dreading reading more Sanderson in case I end up with a new favourite I want signed. One of the few times living in Utah is an advantage. The "white and nerdy" theme runs just as strong here, though. I almost dislike going to events because of it.
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Aug 5, 2014 15:21
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From what I overheard between Brandon his publicist and the SciFi fantasy section manager the next time he us in Liverpool will be an evening event.
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Aug 5, 2014 16:32
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So, I finished Way of Kings and I've started Words of Radiance. I have some questions. Does WoR like heavily get into the Shadesmar/Heralds/Radiants/Worldhoppers/Shardholders (like, the 16 epic shards not swords)/Cosmere and poo poo like that? Because I keep seeing so much info around on Wikis and discussion forums about all that stuff and it's not touched upon very much in WoK. But everywhere I look people are talking about "this guy is a herald, that guy is a worldhopper" and stuff like that, and after reading WoK I have no idea where people are getting this from. Is this all explained in WoR? For example, in the prologue of WoK and WoR, people have pointed out how so and so person or persons are "obviously" Heralds in disguise. How in the hell are people figuring that out? Or the whole idea of "worldhopping?" I mean, I understand the concept of it and what it means, but how did people figure that out? Will I learn about this stuff in WoR or is this all stuff people have gleaned from interviews with Sanderson and other non-book stuff?
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Aug 6, 2014 07:13
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Damo posted:So, I finished Way of Kings and I've started Words of Radiance. It's pretty unimportant to the plot. Heralds aren't really going to be super-in-focus until the second set of 5 books for stormlight, and the worldhopping stuff is basically cameos for fans. That said, trying to spot the hidden heralds is kinda fun. There's one character in WoR who you'll know more about if you recognize the earlier appearance, but it doesn't really change anything about the book.
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Aug 6, 2014 07:16
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Well, I mean I am a pretty big fan, I've read all of his Cosmere books. I'm left wondering how people figure this poo poo out, because I'm a pretty focused reader and it seems like I'm missing a bunch of poo poo other people aren't. Even if it's not important to the immediate plot, the background stuff interests me and I want to know how people are figuring out secret heralds and poo poo like that.
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Aug 6, 2014 07:29
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Partly it's inside hints (or confirmations of guesses) from signings, partly it's stuff from unpublished books like White Sand. For example, the guy who makes the maps in Stormlight is from the world featured in the Shadows For Silence short story. That was confirmed after a fan asked, since nobody else uses 'Shadows!' as a curse. Some of the hints Brandon gives are too vague to really know for sure. For example, there's a terriswoman hidden in Warbreaker, and there are characters native to Roshar hidden in earlier works. There's other stuff too, like decoding the phonetic script used for Alethi text in stormlight illustrations, or deciphering some of the other coded messages/epigraphs - that's more of a sufficient manpower type thing. Some of the stuff is just plain speculation, too, like maybe a couple of characters having been switched out. Or some random beggar maybe being a herald. Tunicate fucked around with this message at 07:38 on Aug 6, 2014 |
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Aug 6, 2014 07:36
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Ok cool thanks. One other thing that's bugging me, not that it's important, is the whole Alethi women's (or is it not just Alethi women, but all Vorin women?) Safehand/Freehand stuff. Is this explained in WoR? Or is the whole point just that fantasy land women's propriety includes hiding their left hand (is it always the left, for that matter?) after puberty, and there's no real rhyme or reason to it anymore than real world women shaving hair off certain parts their body and other stuff like that? Is it just What They Do, and there is no practical reason? When it first appeared in the beginning of WoK I assumed there was some weird Sanderson Magic reason for it, but it was never explained, and the more the story went on the more I realized it can't be a magic reason because no one really does magic. At least save a very, very small portion of special people. Then, I finished WoK and was left confused by it not being explained at all. Seemed like a weird thing to constantly point out most every time a woman character is shown but never to explain it. Like, what's the point of it's significance and omnipresence in being described if there's nothing behind it past fantasy land women's propriety? I do get a kick of how Alethi men get all flustered, horny, and feel naughty at the sight or mere thought of an uncovered Safehand. So funny. Damo fucked around with this message at 08:06 on Aug 6, 2014 |
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Aug 6, 2014 08:00
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There's some rationale in WoR, though from a meta-text point of view, Brandon was inspired by how Korean customs consider the bottoms of the feet to be extremely rude.
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Aug 6, 2014 08:14
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Damo posted:I do get a kick of how Alethi men get all flustered, horny, and feel naughty at the sight or mere thought of an uncovered Safehand. So funny. Yeah, and it's pretty weird how excited American men get at the thought of seeing uncovered mammary glands. I mean, what's up with that? Some women even inject or implant inorganic material into theirs to make them more "attractive", however that is supposed to work. I think it is just a funny fantasy thing. We think it's weird because nobody has ever tried sexualizing a part of the body we find normal. As for the flustered nature of Alethi men, I think it's just Sanderson's squeamishness about sex making itself known.
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Aug 6, 2014 09:04
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Grundulum posted:Yeah, and it's pretty weird how excited American men get at the thought of seeing uncovered mammary glands. I mean, what's up with that? Some women even inject or implant inorganic material into theirs to make them more "attractive", however that is supposed to work. Um, I think you completely missed my meaning by that comment. I wasn't saying or implying that men in Roshar getting aroused from an uncovered Safehand is stupid writing or a stupid idea from Sanderson, or whatever you interpreted it as. I genuinely enjoyed it in the exact same way you did. It's a funny little twist on what is and isn't considered appropriate or whatever. I wasn't making GBS threads on it, I legitimately thought it was interesting and I got a kick out of it. Like you said, it's just a body part that in real world customs isn't sexualized, but in Roshar it is (for reason I was trying to find out, not that there needs to be one), so it's only natural that an Alethi man would react like that. I only brought up the purpose behind hiding the Safehand because I am just curious if there is some meaning behind that I missed, or that is going to be explained in WoR, other than what I mentioned previously -- that is, it just being worldbuilding stuff around Alethi customs, and a little fantasy twist on what is considered adhering to propriety for women in Roshar. I thought maybe there is some other reason for it past it being fantasyland woman's propriety that I might have missed. Even if there isn't a reason beyond worldbuilding with regards to customs, that's fine by me as well. Exploring stuff like that is one of the things that makes Fantasy books what they are. So, yeah. Don't trip, friend. Damo fucked around with this message at 09:28 on Aug 6, 2014 |
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Aug 6, 2014 09:17
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Damo posted:I only brought up the purpose behind hiding the Safehand because I am just curious if there is some meaning behind that I missed, or that is going to be explained in WoR, other than what I mentioned previously -- that is, it just being worldbuilding stuff around Alethi customs, and a little fantasy twist on what is considered adhering to propriety for women in Roshar. I thought maybe there is some other reason for it past it being fantasyland woman's propriety that I might have missed. Even if there isn't a reason beyond worldbuilding with regards to customs, that's fine by me as well. Exploring stuff like that is one of the things that makes Fantasy books what they are. I think for safehands to have a magical reason there would need to be a gender-specific type of magic, which while not impossible doesn't really seem like the sort of thing Brandon Sanderson would do. Do female Ardents need to keep their safehands covered? I don't recall reading it one way or another, but becoming and Ardent seems to be the way to go to deny conventional gender stereotypes in Alethi culture.
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Aug 6, 2014 09:34
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I could have sworn I read something about safehands having to do with the occupational differences between sexes (like men being farmers and warriors and women being artists and scholars)
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Aug 6, 2014 09:49
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Grundulum posted:As for the flustered nature of Alethi men, I think it's just Sanderson's squeamishness about sex making itself known. This got me thinking about Sanderson and how he writes sex stuff and cursing. I know, it's a tired topic, but I've never chimed in personally. Feel free to skip it if you don't care. Sex in Fantasy books. Just the phrase brings up terrible memories. Overall, Sanderson's prudish nature with Sex is honestly one of the nicer things with his writing. A nice break from the norm, and it spares us from some possibly disgusting, cringeworthy, overlong poo poo. Lord knows we've had enough descriptions of manhoods glistening wetly and other disgusting stuff thanks to GRRM and other fantasy authors. Another nice benefit is that you can feel less reluctant to recommend it to friends and family, which is nice. B.W. Sanderson -- A family company!. He could be a bit more realistic about how he treats sex. Sex is a thing that happens. Most everyone does it (and did it throughout history) and it isn't a bad thing. Well, it can be, in various ways, but you know. Some people have sex a lot, just because it's fun. Some people have sex before marriage as well. It's unfortunate how Brandon seems so reluctant to have characters who view sex in these ways because of his own personal feelings and opinions. It's not that a character's sex life always is super important. It's an example of his personal morals winning over his writing. Doing that can limit so much possibility if it expends past sex. As a writer, don't you kind of have to write about people with different morals than you? This is something which Sanderson (and all writers) obviously does considering he's written his fair share of murderous psychopaths. But the buck stop at sex. He'll make Vin and Elend wait until their wedding night because that's what he'd do. I don't see why being open with writing about people with deplorable motives and opinions about anything but sex is fine, but throw sex in there and we've got a problem. In his writing he could also seem less afraid and reluctant to say that someone have had sex, or are having sex. As it is now, the few times he implies sex going on it's so drat vague and subtle that he might as well not mention it. It's can be very YA-ish (to be fair, though, take out the constant decapitations and the other most extreme violence, and Mistborn basically is a YA book). He could do with describing sex more naturally, and less like parents trying to talk about it in innuendo while their children are listening. Or writing a character who's seems so reluctant and uncomfortable with the topic you can sense how badly they want to change the subject. Lastly, there is the (lack of real-world) cursing. I like the in-world cursing, like storm this or storming that. I dig that cursing workaround, but only when the writer(s) come up with a word that isn't lovely. Now, I know that using real world curses can contrast with a fantasy writer's vision for their book's world. So I'm in the minority here probably, but I really wish he'd throw in some more serious real world curses here and there. Just at really tense or dramatic moments sparingly. For me, a well placed curse from a character who barely or never cursed in the past can add a lot to an epic situation. And while Storm this and that is cool, it doesn't have the real world history, connotation, and experience a person has with the word being used that adds an instant understanding of the feelings in that moment. So I'm for some real world cursing, used sparingly and appropriately when it fits the situation and character. Maybe don't use gently caress, though. I think gently caress can easily be overused and take you out of the story quicker than other curse words. So gently caress gently caress, and use poo poo, rear end in a top hat, bitch, or whatever instead. My main reasoning behind the cursing is that almost EVERYBODY ON THE PLANET curses on some level. Especially soldiers fighting a war! And the rest of the people probably would curse if you put enough pressure/fear/anger/stress/annoyance/etc on them. Cursing seems natural to human nature. People sometimes really need some sort of inappropriate, intense, and vulgar language to express themselves more fully. And while it is fantasy land, these are still human beings he writes about on some level. All this considered, for me, it can add a lot to moments that are already intense and epic. Most fantasy book authors use tons of real world words/nouns/names/whatever, as a result of them not wanting to rename a chicken something else, then constantly having to remind you that a chicken is now called a gibbylap, all of which adds nothing to the story. So as we know, yes, a different fantasy world would have different names for everything. Especially considering their whole basis of language would be different. So writers have to take liberties, calling a chicken a chicken. So, adding some real world curse words into the mix really makes a difference in immersion to the story, for me. One final thought. To be fair, it's impossible for any of us to know what exactly motivates his decisions. Maybe it's his personal morals, maybe he's just writing what he considers the best he can for his story. Maybe a mix. However, regarding Vin and Elend, in the annotations he basically admits making them wait for marriage because of his personal morals. So there's that. Sorry for the length of the post. tldr A bunch of stupid  don't bother.
Damo fucked around with this message at 12:16 on Aug 6, 2014 |
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Aug 6, 2014 10:58
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I agree with most everything you typed. I honestly spent a lot longer on that one sentence you quoted than the entire rest of my post, because I wanted to convey an idea with the minimum amount of wrong or extra information. Do sailors in Stormlight -- or anyone, really -- have a reputation for swearing or being foul-mouthed? It has been a while since I read either book, but I can't remember anything like that.
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Aug 6, 2014 11:54
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To be fair none of his characters are in positions to have much sex nobody wants to read bridge-man orgies. Adolin maybe but considering he hops to a new girl every week also unless they have a condom fabrial I doubt Dalinar would think a dozen Kholin-bastards running around would be honorable.
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Aug 6, 2014 18:35
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Damo posted:I only brought up the purpose behind hiding the Safehand because I am just curious if there is some meaning behind that I missed, or that is going to be explained in WoR, other than what I mentioned previously -- that is, it just being worldbuilding stuff around Alethi customs, and a little fantasy twist on what is considered adhering to propriety for women in Roshar. I thought maybe there is some other reason for it past it being fantasyland woman's propriety that I might have missed. Even if there isn't a reason beyond worldbuilding with regards to customs, that's fine by me as well. Exploring stuff like that is one of the things that makes Fantasy books what they are. Brandon Sanderson partially explained this in an interview here: http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/446239-q-a-with-brandon-sanderson---way-of-kings quote:"My burning question for Brandon is did I miss the explanation, world building moment or historical gem that explains why women have a safe hand and why they must keep it covered?" I think it's really neat worldbuilding-- and it also explains why only women are allowed to read and write in Vorinism, given that you can do that with one hand. Most of the sciences as well. And so forth.
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Aug 6, 2014 21:13
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I think Jasnah's research material includes some notes on that in WoR.
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Aug 6, 2014 21:48
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Speaking of Jasnah, Brandon just published a short mini-chapter of her point of view during (WoR huge spoiler) getting stabbed and fleeing to Shadesmar. I personally think the book would have been greatly improved if he'd included this chapter before, or perhaps right after Shallan's PoV. You can read it here: http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/08/stormlight-archive-scene-after-words-of-radiance
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Aug 6, 2014 21:53
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Nah, that's the kind of passage you put into the prologue of the next book in the series.
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Aug 6, 2014 22:38
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Iunnrais posted:Speaking of Jasnah, Brandon just published a short mini-chapter of her point of view during (WoR huge spoiler) getting stabbed and fleeing to Shadesmar. Yeah he mentioned that he would be posting this yesterday when I asked about personality and soul-casting. Compare; “You,” she command, “will change.” “I am a rope,” one of them said. “I am—” “You will change.” To Shallan's pleading to the stick or even the ship.
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Aug 6, 2014 23:24
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Rumda posted:Yeah he mentioned that he would be posting this yesterday when I asked about personality and soul-casting. Cool. Get any other inside intel on that? I'm guessing there's some feedback if you're a wishy washy person, to explain those freaky soulcaster people. "I am a rock," it said. "Oh no," Charlie Brown replied, "now I am too."
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Aug 6, 2014 23:46
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Rumda posted:So many variations of the theme of white and nerdy in the line for the Liverpool signing. Tunicate posted:Cool. Get any other inside intel on that? Yeah pretty much its to do with your soul, the Ardents are weaker and more at risk of deformation due to doing all the work themselves, and why the soulcaster fabrials shatter gemstones so regularly, where as Jashnah only did after the ranged soulcasting. I've got a slight inkling that the Shin Stone Shaman elders may intentionally under go the deformation but I'm most likey wrong Rumda fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Aug 6, 2014 |
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Aug 6, 2014 23:52
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Rumda posted:I've got a slight inkling that the Shin Stone Shaman elders may intentionally under go the deformation but I'm most likey wrong Might be something else. They don't get spren in Shinovar, they basically don't even get hit with Highstorms, they trade for all their metal, I got the impression they do their own farming.
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Aug 7, 2014 13:23
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api call girl posted:Might be something else. They don't get spren in Shinovar, they basically don't even get hit with Highstorms, they trade for all their metal, I got the impression they do their own farming. In WoK, in the scene where they meet the trader from Shin, they talk about how in Shin society warriors are the lowest rung on the social ladder, while farmers are the highest.
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Aug 7, 2014 15:03
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I was guessing that the Stone Shamans are the descendants of the Knights Radiant order of the Stonewardens. I was thinking that Cultivation hid them in Shonovar after the day of Recreance.
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Aug 8, 2014 08:46
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Weren't the "stone shamans" mentioned in passing a single time in two books?
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Aug 8, 2014 11:33
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Ithaqua posted:Weren't the "stone shamans" mentioned in passing a single time in two books? I honestly didn't even remember them being mentioned until I saw it here...
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Aug 8, 2014 14:31
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Ithaqua posted:Weren't the "stone shamans" mentioned in passing a single time in two books? They are pretty much who Szeth refers to every time he says They, those that named him Truthless and banished him. Stone shamans may not be the right word but since stone shamanism is the religion of the shin and they seem to be in charge of spiritual matters it fits. Rumda fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Aug 8, 2014 |
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Aug 8, 2014 14:46
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I figured safe hand business was due to lack of toilet paper in their world.
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Aug 10, 2014 10:35
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Don't the men wipe their asses, then?
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Aug 11, 2014 08:14
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His Divine Shadow posted:Don't the men wipe their asses, then? Weern't you paying attention to Adolin's poop talk? A real man has someone to wipe him. 
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Aug 11, 2014 10:36
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Karnegal posted:Weern't you paying attention to Adolin's poop talk? A real man goes in his armor and has someone hose him down. Fixed that there for ya. Also I find it rather humorous that a decision on the part of the author to avoid cringeworthy explicit sex scenes must be because of some repressed sexual something something... Pretty sure Vin and Elend are banging before they get married, Sanderson simply doesn't spend much time on it because it's usually less than a fade to black and he's writing for a different general audience than GRRM. I mean does anyone actually enjoy that stuff? Whenever I recommend Butcher I always have to qualify that the dumb romance bondage sex only lasts for a book or two and isn't super important, it's nice to have a book series I can recommend without that baggage
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Aug 11, 2014 12:37
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