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Theglavwen posted:I literally don't have time to type any more than this, but here in what you've repeatedly said is the crux of your fallacy. There are only two votes here in the sense that there are only two outcomes for the weather tomorrow, rain or not rain. This is true, but it's meaninglessly true, practically axiomatic. The problem arises where you're attempting to equate this meaningless triviality with something that should have meaning to the variety of people discussing the relative merits of just what specific weather may, in fact, occur tomorrow. Come now, the votes can be put into two categories: restrain ??? use or tap into ??? The votes in the latter category may exist on a continuum, but effectively there are two big choices.
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Aug 20, 2014 17:38
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What if we stopped for a second and adjusted our Balls so that two of them cling to our legs? If they carry us we could shoot while our Balls stick tight to us for the charge. We'd be able to advance and fire at the same time.
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Aug 20, 2014 17:41
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John_A_Tallon posted:What if we stopped for a second and adjusted our Balls so that two of them cling to our legs? If they carry us we could shoot while our Balls stick tight to us for the charge. We'd be able to advance and fire at the same time. Or, we could put Paebel on our shoulders with our old bow and go all sorts of Master Blaster on the gobopedes.
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Aug 20, 2014 17:45
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I will also stop after this. It is a great vote and a very cool moment in the game, from my point of view. A and Not-A are different in kind. All of Not-A is a difference in degree. There are many ways to describe the nature of the difference in kind, but that is the essence of it. Perhaps the difference in kind has inherent meaning. Perhaps not. I am treating it as if it does. So too is Basscop, for example, it seems to me. Sogol fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Aug 20, 2014 |
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Aug 20, 2014 17:46
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Yeah, I'm not going to write a bunch of words about it, but 'Don't use powers you do not understand' is Enkidel 101 at this point and I think we've flunked it enough already.
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Aug 20, 2014 17:56
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Mr. Wednesday posted:Yeah, I'm not going to write a bunch of words about it, but 'Don't use powers you do not understand' is Enkidel 101 at this point and I think we've flunked it enough already. That's Ishamal 101. We always flunk that class. Enkidel 101 is "Ooooo, what's that shiny thing do? I'm HUNGRY" We ace that class.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:00
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A
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Aug 20, 2014 18:01
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A
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Aug 20, 2014 18:06
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A
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Aug 20, 2014 18:10
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Sogol posted:That is an attribution. It is clear that Enkidel is experiencing a conflict. Option A begins with "gently caress. No. Stop." quote:You see a woman being menaced by half a dozen thugs in an alley. They're all unarmed, but they're also both much larger and stronger than you. Being a noble heroic type, you rush forwards to save the woman anyways! As you run screaming your battlecry, you... So how many options are there? You could argue that there are only two, armed and unarmed, and you'd be right. You could argue that any usage of weaponry is escalating the situation and could have unpredictable negative consequences and you'd be right. You could argue that fighting barehanded is in keeping with the teachings of our wise sensei, and you'd be right again. But if you argue that anyone voting for anything other than A actually wants to kill everyone they meet and are deluding themselves if they think or argue otherwise and that they should just be honest about their murderous tendencies, you are a very silly person. (Though, admittedly, anyone walking around with that kind of arsenal strapped to themselves most probably does have some serious issues, but the analogy has to stretch somewhere) Now on another matter, to those of you saying that Ishamal kept telling us not to do this poo poo, I'd like to run a quick reminder of something: Diogines posted:As you and your Balls packed up your possessions from your prolonged stay in the House of El, the Cohen Avram, the high ranking priest who invited you to join the House of El speaks with you again. Avram says to you "The offer remains open, for a few years at least and I hope to see you return to this House soon. Ishamal is cautious as he teaches you, which he must be for the only resources he has to rely upon are his own. Here, there are many teachers and many who can aid you and your lessons will pass far, far more swiftly. I hope you might return soon to take them. But if you do not, if I do not see you again in the years ahead, then I say to you Child, walk with El and remember, Do Not Destroy." Ishamal's caution is not borne out of the fact that any mucking about with reality is so dangerous that it can't be risked - his caution is borne out from the fact that he doesn't have the resources on hand to correct and contain mistakes. It's the same reason why someone would be more cautious teaching someone how to sail in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean during storm season than he would be if he were teaching that someone how to sail in a small, sheltered Mediterranean bay. There's an important difference there - it means that we CAN do things that Ishamal advises against without automatically dying or loving everything up. Now am I saying that experimentation is therefore risk-free? No. Am I saying we should push the limits of Ishamal's teachings each and every chance we get? Hell no. Am I saying that what we are about to try will absolutely and guaranteed have zero negative consequences? Oh, God no. What I AM saying is that a certain degree of risk is acceptable - that there ARE times when it is just possible to snatch fire from the gods and get away with it. And I believe, for reasons that I will admit are as ill-informed as anyone else's here, that this may be one of those times. And if it should turn out that this is not one of those times? Well, sometimes you gotta get your eternally regenerating liver plucked out by eagles to get something magical. (I'll admit, though - personally I may be willing to plump for a little more risk than I usually would because I'm a bit frustrated with recent goon voting to repeatedly sit on our hands. The safest course in war is often the most dangerous, and yet that's the option we kept picking anyways and as a result the Norcs have been calling the shots this entire time and all we've been doing is reacting to it, which is not somewhere an army wants to be.)
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Aug 20, 2014 18:15
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I could have sworn that I saw a count last night. I checked the thread and could not find it again. Maybe it was only posted in IRC? Who did it? Voting remains open until tonight, but I would like to know what the count is at now.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:24
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Changing whatever my vote was to B now. Sorry counters.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:24
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Diogines posted:I could have sworn that I saw a count last night. I checked the thread and could not find it again. Maybe it was only posted in IRC? Who did it? Voting remains open until tonight, but I would like to know what the count is at now. HiHo ChiRho posted:Vote count is up: I'm not sure if it's current though.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:27
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Obscil posted:I'm not sure if it's current though. it is
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Aug 20, 2014 18:29
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Hot Dog Day 80 posted:it is Umm. Actually looking this over it needs to be cleaned up. some people's names appear twice in it.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:35
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my vote is for whatever option triggers an update soonest ugh
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Aug 20, 2014 18:42
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falcon2424 posted:These look like powers we can invoke, and the ???? are expenditures of [???]. With that in mind... and I can't believe I'm taking this risk, I'm changing my vote from A to B.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:44
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Obscil posted:Umm. Actually looking this over it needs to be cleaned up. some people's names appear twice in it. seems to be taken care of now
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Aug 20, 2014 18:52
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Obscil posted:Umm. Actually looking this over it needs to be cleaned up. some people's names appear twice in it. Should be fixed now
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Aug 20, 2014 18:56
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Looks like we're splitting the atom, folks. Everybody got your safety goggles on?
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Aug 20, 2014 18:58
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Changing my vote from F to A because I have been conviced. Let´s hope that whatever happens this all works out. e: My vote was still logged as B apparently but still changing to A.
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Aug 20, 2014 18:59
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Paradise Lost: Nerds arguing over semantics. Please save us, Diog.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:03
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HiHo ChiRho posted:Should be fixed now I changed my vote to A, if it's not too late to update your count!
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Aug 20, 2014 19:06
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Vote change from k to b.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:11
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Cathair posted:That sure is a lot of passive-agressive verbage to tell people that they're voting wrong, Sogol. You've got that classic propagandic argument style going on where you discuss the pros and cons of a thing, and reach a rational conclusion, except for the fact that some of the givens you've based your argument on are actually just assumptions that should themselves be subject to debate, not ready to be taken as fact. lol if you read any of sogol's posts also changing from k to b team boring go home
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Aug 20, 2014 19:18
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spacetimecontinuu posted:my vote is for whatever option triggers an update soonest ugh A few moments pass as you charge, screaming with your Balls, your battlecry, EEEEELLLLLL! King Ahaz battles the tallest of the Norcs, his Mighty Men beside him. Your attention is upon your own battle, the imminent danger of the large demons in front of you. Yet a few other details at the periphery of your vision, the edge of your hearing may have drawn some small part of your attention. HEEEEELP MEEEEE!!! The men of Ibleam charge across the ice bridge. Death rains down upon them in the form of flaming logs which crash into them. You hear the battlecries of the men of Ibleam. You hear the roars of agony of those maimed. Your attention is upon the foe right in front of you, but perhaps you hear more? "HELP ME! F-- TH.. LOVE OF EL! Heeeeelp mmm.e....e.....!...."  ... n-n-noooooo! ....elp me..... ....anyoe... ...aaaaaah! E.....eee....e...l.... .....someone.... .....elp m-.... A pang of dread strikes your heart. Something is wrong. Something is monstrously, terribly wrong. You hear other voices screaming, their pleas full of panic, fear and terror, crying out.  Mother! ...elp.. El! Fath-r! -ave- El-! 2. You.... S. You cannot deal with their agony now, you have your own struggle to bare. Harden your heart to their suffering and continue with the charge. T. Fall, weeping and screaming as you clutch your head in agony, possibly not comprehending what is happening but mortified in horror by it none the less. There is something truly terrible occurring. U. Change course, make for the dying men. You will help them, somehow when you get there. You don't know ho- N-N-Nooooo! Mother! Help me! ... don't know how to help them, but you will figure it out when you get there. V. Something else. Fill in. I have limited time to respond to questions before the update tonight.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:26
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A RICH WHITE MAN posted:lol if you read any of sogol's posts also changing from k to b team boring go home Calling A-voters team boring seems kinda disingenuous since either way we're charging screaming to battle with a swarm of demons. e - S
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Aug 20, 2014 19:27
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Plan Neraren Neraren posted:V - We can't ignore their suffering, but it is a symptom. If we want to stop it, we have to take out the cause, which is right in front of us. We fight so that the killing will stop. Cornuto fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Aug 20, 2014 |
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Aug 20, 2014 19:29
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S - We have to figure this poo poo out someday. But not right now.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:30
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It's Just the facts of life.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:31
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V - We can't ignore their suffering, but it is a symptom. If we want to stop it, we have to take out the cause, which is right in front of us. We fight so that the killing will stop.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:32
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V Keep course. The dying men die to save their homes and their people. Many more will face that awful fate if we don't act. Steel your heart Enkidel. Worse is yet to come. Remember the first time Naomi kissed you. Pladdicus fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Aug 20, 2014 |
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Aug 20, 2014 19:32
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Neraren posted:V - We can't ignore their suffering, but it is a symptom. If we want to stop it, we have to take out the cause, which is right in front of us. We fight so that the killing will stop.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:33
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A variation of harden your heart. Remember the way we dealt with it last time. Remember the peace. Remember the love. Those loving monsters are in the way of that! This one instead! Neraren posted:V - We can't ignore their suffering, but it is a symptom. If we want to stop it, we have to take out the cause, which is right in front of us. We fight so that the killing will stop. Voting Plan Neranen Affi fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Aug 20, 2014 |
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Aug 20, 2014 19:33
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Oh an update, nevermind
alpaca diseases fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Aug 20, 2014 |
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Aug 20, 2014 19:36
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spacetimecontinuu posted:my vote is for whatever option triggers an update soonest ugh Teach us, Poster-Who-Makes-the-Post-that-makes-the-Diog-Post. S - I'm all for being pissed at the enemy for causing this, but if we focus on the suffering to try and steel ourselves against the enemy, we're just going to end up a blubbering incapacitated mess.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:37
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Task Manager posted:Teach us, Poster-Who-Makes-the-Post-that-makes-the-Diog-Post. We're capable of great things when we all work together with Enkidel.
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Aug 20, 2014 19:38
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Diogines posted:Well okay then! brother,, mad noble, thx for this!! if I had that emoticon where the eyes are hearts I would use it cuz I love you Task Manager posted:Teach us, Poster-Who-Makes-the-Post-that-makes-the-Diog-Post. 
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Aug 20, 2014 19:42
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V - EEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLL!!!!!! You are aflame Enkidel, brighter than the sun! alpaca diseases fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Aug 20, 2014 |
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Aug 20, 2014 19:45
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Neraren posted:V - We can't ignore their suffering, but it is a symptom. If we want to stop it, we have to take out the cause, which is right in front of us. We fight so that the killing will stop. +1
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Aug 20, 2014 19:46
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