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PriorMarcus posted:No. It was the same Moffat as last time. And enough nudging and winking to make sure you knew it was. Just because you repeatedly call out how you're copying a previous script doesn't make it ok, Moffat.
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Aug 23, 2014 23:57
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Cleretic posted:Fortunatley, Moffat at least agrees with you there. Moffat-level ruse detected.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:00
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Really weird episode. First half was terrible, then it became enthralling and incredible at the restaurant scene all the way up until the moment the Pater Nosters returned. Then it got poo poo again. That new intro is awful though.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:03
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Odd intro episode. Capaldi delivers a great initial Doctor. It seemed to me that they were trying to go for the "regeneration-gone-wrong" thing that C Baker tried and failed to pull off. But this time they seem to have given it a much a much more solid basis to work from. The elements of why the Doctor has chosen an older face, and a face from his past, are referenced and there are big hints dropped that this is going to be a running motif of this season. Nice to see Clara being elevated from being a plot device into a full-blown companion. Really, the overall plot of this episode was a bit rubbish and JLC and Capaldi's performances were the best thing about it. I really don't know why Moffat felt the need to make this into a Girl in the Fireplace sequel/prequel/parallel. Fireplace was one of his best moments on Who, and it didn't need any kind of Whoniverse expansion. This could easily have been a regular-length episode. A lot of the slapstick stuff around Straxx just didn't work and could have been dropped. It's great to have a comedy sidekick in the form of someone who doesn't realise they're being funny. When they start being written as deliberate comedy characters then it just becomes cringeworthy. Nitpicking aside, I really enjoyed this episode. It wasn't until the final 10 mins of "ooh unfolding to-be-revealed mystery happenings" that I got annoyed. I thought that that was the thing this season was supposed to be moving away from. For a season that's supposed to be moving away from season-long mysteries in favour of strong single-episode stories it really laid down a huge number of open plot threads.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:04
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duz posted:And enough nudging and winking to make sure you knew it was. Moffat couldn't even come up with a new look for the opening himself, so anyone who thinks he has any fresh ideas left is hosed from here on out. The greatest hits tour rolls on.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:05
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Green Wing posted:Wait, what? What yaoi joke did I miss? The young men in Clara's subconscious who Strax thought were doing sports and then '... it could be sport'.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:06
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Also, the intro. Bad CGI clocks and gears because those things are in a watch and watches are timey-wimey. Scary Capaldi eyes are a good thing in the intro sequence. Everything else in it are the bad things. I've no idea why it has reverted to mid-90s CGI or why the title theme sounds like it's being played through a soundboard where the controls are set to Auto-Preset #3: Random Wibble.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:09
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Sleep of Bronze posted:The young men in Clara's subconscious who Strax thought were doing sports and then '... it could be sport'. Thu gay agenda!!!!
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Aug 24, 2014 00:09
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Sleep of Bronze posted:The young men in Clara's subconscious who Strax thought were doing sports and then '... it could be sport'. Clara thinking about sexy young men doing sexy things isn't equivalent to yaoi
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Aug 24, 2014 00:09
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Comrade Fakename posted:The woman at the end was obviously the new iteration of the Master. She called herself "Missy", i.e. "the Mistress". That, plus her talking about the Doctor was only about a half-notch less sexual than the Simm/Tennant scenes, as well as the slightly Doctor-y dress and parasol, as well as Moffat's too-vehement "The Master sucks and is smelly and I totally won't ever use him" statement made it pretty clear to me. I'm willing to be wrong, but it seems like exactly the sort of season-arc reveal he's been doing the last 4 years.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:20
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I really hated the episode until about half way through then it got better, when Capaldi started being the Doctor, which I'm pretty sure he threw that Clockwork automaton out of the escape ship. Capaldi is kind of scary but also endearing, I think that's pretty great. He's a great actor and did great with the poo poo sandwich he was served. Also, why not just have like a scene with both them just going to town on each other seriously just throw in some hot lizard on human action. I felt I was getting beat over the head with the fact that their lesbians or whatever. I mean I don't mind it and its a cool thing but like every 4 minutes they're like " yeah if you are confused we totally are a lesbian lizard couple".
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Aug 24, 2014 00:23
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Hollismason posted:I really hated the episode until about half way through then it got better, when Capaldi started being the Doctor, which I'm pretty sure he threw that Clockwork automaton out of the escape ship. I thought that was really obvious too. A robot not self-terminating is pretty basic Asimov. The Doctor not killing is a guideline, not a rule, and one he breaks a lot.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:24
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That was superb. Capaldi is on fire in the role and Clara finally has a distinct character and some charisma in scenes. Giving her and the Doctor a bickering, antagonistic relationship is a really good angle and how they felt about each other was explored in a fairly complex way. Vastra, Jenny and Strax are essentially the Moffat era's Jackie and Mickey, and my gosh are they much preferable in that role.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:25
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If you took a drink every time they mentioned them being a lesbian lizard couple you'd die of alchohol poisoning. Yes, we get it they're a couple. Why did they just mention that like what seemed like every other scene. Like that's all the scenes with Clara and them were, just reinforcing and clearing all I guess doubt. It's like Moffat thought people were confused, and just had to remind us every scene, Yep they're a couple. I mean they even managed to write a contrived way to get them to kiss on screen. No poo poo you can hold air in your lungs? Really? It's like every scene they held up a sign that said " PROGRESSIVE"
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Aug 24, 2014 00:27
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I did like the clear "God, guys, I remember they're a couple, honest!" moments with Jenny for how unsubtle Moffat was in trying to answer the criticism. And while the veil scene was a little over-wrought, she was really good, with the "Oh, it's an act? Then how come I'm still serving the tea?" and her getting caught up in Clara's speech. EDIT: You don't remember how much poo poo he caught for seeming to forget that they're a couple the last few times they appeared? This was so clearly him trying to make up for it, it was funny.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:29
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I don't see much wrong with that. Gay representation is sparse enough on TV that I don't see it as a problem that the writing takes care to hammer it home. Plus, it's really only like what, three times? Briefly?
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Aug 24, 2014 00:29
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That wasn't my issue, the issue was that it was just bad writing with how its brought up every single time as just a " Hold on a second, on a side note let me tell you about this relationship in case you were confused". Yeah you know what would have just cemented the whole relationship in like 1 sentence and 1 scene just have them kiss and say they love each other. It's lovely writing to have other characters talk about their relationships with another character to clear it up to the viewer instead of just showing it to the viewer with a simply scene of them embracing or telling each other they love each other. Instead of writing 4 seperate instances where anothe character explains the relationship have one scene showing the relationship. It's like if you were watching a Romantic movie and the entire movie the two people only spoke to 3rd parties about how much they loved each other and never actually said it to each other. It's just loving weird.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:37
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I quite liked the first half of this, to be in a minority. I liked that it firmly focused on Clara, and how it managed to make Victorian London seem totally alien and lonely through having so many characters repeatedly dismiss or diminish humans. Clara seemed lost in this to me in a way that reminded me more of Arthur Dent in Hitchhiker's than anything: obviously it's not to that level, but it's something to me that the comparison can even be made. I also liked that people kept making GBS threads on her for having completely understandable reactions to things, as it heightened that sense of total alienation from the world. But yes. Doctor Who in a universe that's more inhuman than wonderful is an appealing idea to me, and I liked the flashes of that coming through in this. I strongly suspect this is something only I got from the episode, but don't really care: I found it more enjoyable than any episode for donkey's years. I'm excited about this. I hope it doesn't all gently caress up. e: I did think it was quite strange that Clara and Matt!Doctor were all freaking out about the Doctor being old when from their point of view he was positively ancient a few hours ago, but I know this is the sort of thing most people won't notice or care about. vegetables fucked around with this message at 00:39 on Aug 24, 2014 |
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Aug 24, 2014 00:37
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I think it's more like that Victorian London felt lonely because they only had the budget for ten extras.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:39
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PriorMarcus posted:I think it's more like that Victorian London felt lonely because they only had the budget for ten extras. I mean lonely in the sense of alienation rather than the sense of "nobody is here"; just not being clear what with it being past midnight.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:41
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Aug 24, 2014 00:45
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Woo, Doctor Who officially returns tonight. Are the goons that haven't  d it already still here?
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Aug 24, 2014 00:46
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Deakul posted:Woo, Doctor Who officially returns tonight. All of us have already watched it when it came out in the UK through iPlayer
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Aug 24, 2014 00:47
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That was mostly bad, but the bits that were good were excellent, mostly thanks to Capaldi and Coleman. I read the lovely opening scene from the leaked script, so I was expecting worse. Looking forward to an episode not written by Moffat.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:50
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Peter's delivery of "Something's wrong... and I don't know what, but I think I blame the English" was another highlight.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:56
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Hollismason posted:If you took a drink every time they mentioned them being a lesbian lizard couple you'd die of alchohol poisoning. Yes, we get it they're a couple. Why did they just mention that like what seemed like every other scene. This has been something that's bugged me ever since #9 and RTD's reboot of the franchise. Not any kind of "gay agenda", but just that the producers have felt the need to shoehorn characters' sexuality into scenes. I really don't give a flying gently caress about who is loving who, and none of it contributes anything to the stories. Jenny and Vastra are loving. I'm fine with that. I don't need reminding every 5 mins. Every time the show brings up how totally normal same-sex relationships are it reinforces how much time it spends emphasising same-sex relationships. This episode was by far the worst offender. There were a lot of times during this episode where the Vastra/Jenny relationship was basically BDSM, because same-sex couples can't have normal relationships. Just leave the sexual relationships unspoken. This episode would be shorter and better for it.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:57
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Stephen Moffat owns and you're all dumb if you think otherwise. Actually, I never understood the hate he gets. Then again, I've only ever watched 2005 Who.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:10
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You're on TV, DoctorWhat.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:14
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Just saw DoctorWhat on BBC America!
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Aug 24, 2014 01:14
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I was wondering if it was DoctorWhat or if someone else was insane enough to get that crazy rear end coat.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:15
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The new opening is terrible. I think I liked the original one that inspired this.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:16
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WHO DA MAN!? I'm the man.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:17
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Didn't like a lot of the dialogue-heavy parts early on, but it was good when they started fighting the bad guys. Surely it would have been easier to make a balloon out of cloth then human flesh. You need that skin to keep yourselves pretty, robotmen!
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Aug 24, 2014 01:18
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Ugh the new theme.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:21
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Mooseontheloose posted:Ugh the new theme. Am I the only one that likes it? The music, not the graphics. I like that weird, high sound to the melody (is that a theremin? I'm bad with instruments).
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Aug 24, 2014 01:24
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Cleretic posted:Am I the only one that likes it? The music, not the graphics. I like that weird, high sound to the melody (is that a theremin? I'm bad with instruments). I dunno, am I the only American watching BBC America? I figured there would be in the thread talking.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:25
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I'm watching. I didn't see what was so bad about the new intro. It was nothing special but I don't understand why it's getting as much hate as it is.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:28
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I absolutely adore the new theme and intro. gently caress the haters.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:28
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Mooseontheloose posted:I dunno, am I the only American watching BBC America? I figured there would be in the thread talking. I'm watching via the TWC app.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:30
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This whole conversation with Vastra is stupid and annoying but I can't place why.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:35
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