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Big Mean Jerk posted:All of the timber supports in this construction are the wrong shade of cherry and some of the nails aren't in the boards right now, it must be a terrible building! More accurate.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:06
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Why are people in this thread so quick to shout down criticism? I think people are rightly dubious of criticism coming from people along the lines of, "Well, I read the leaked script and watched the unfinished workprint, and let me tell you, this is not a complete episode of television!".
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Sep 7, 2014 17:06
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Big Mean Jerk posted:All of the timber supports in this construction are rotten and some of the nails aren't the right size, but I'm sure it'll make a fine building! I can see what you're trying to get at, but I'm going to argue art, especially visual mediums, become a lot more than the sum of its parts when completed. It's all about how the different parts work in the proper context of one another. Kind of how like a score can completely change the meaning and mood of a scene. A lot of the individual element aren't meant to be seen outside of production, and are usually quite poo poo (I work in production, you'd be surprised at how much total crap gets turned in and polished into something presentable. It's impressive). At least, that's how I feel. I felt it came together nicely, but everyone takes away something different.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:10
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Android Blues posted:I think people are rightly dubious of criticism coming from people along the lines of, "Well, I read the leaked script and watched the unfinished workprint, and let me tell you, this is not a complete episode of television!". It's true that a terrible script can turn into a decently entertaining episode. But I don't think a terrible script can ever make a great episode. I read the opening scene of Deep Breath and it was terrible. Watching it on screen and it was also terrible, as were the Vastra and crew scenes (so most of the episode). Though to be fair this episode was entertaining nonsense, while hearing about scenes like the spoon duel out of context did make it sound worse than it was.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:18
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What is 12 working out on those chalk boards at the start of the episode? I read it mentioned that he's still formulating the way to save Gallifrey in the pocket dimension but didn't he work it out by the time of his 11th incarnation? I guess the whole actual saving of Gallifrey still kind of confuses me.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:20
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AndyElusive posted:What is 12 working out on those chalk boards at the start of the episode? I read it mentioned that he's still formulating the way to save Gallifrey in the pocket dimension but didn't he work it out by the time of his 11th incarnation? I guess the whole actual saving of Gallifrey still kind of confuses me. It's saved, but he still needs to find a way to find it, and pull it back into this universe.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:23
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I happen to like episodes where the Doctor meets a famous person from history, fights with some throwaway villain and has fun. The Van Gogh, Shakespeare and Charles Dickens episodes all stand out as ones I can recall clearly, compared to some of the other one-off episodes. They aren't always great (though the Madame de Pompadour episode was fantastic), but it's always entertaining to see the Doctor interact with a legendary person.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:30
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He's been working on chalkboards all season, and I think it's a really good way to do a "season arc" kind of thing subtly. It's definitely building up to something, but it doesn't dominate the episodes it's in or create a sense of manufactured mystery. Capaldi's really fantastic as the Doctor, incidentally. I love...I guess the way to describe it is, if this had been a Tennant episode, he probably would have been right way more often and screwed up way less. Making him smart, cynical, charismatic and comically fallible is a really good approach and lets Clara shine by being the goal-oriented voice of reason.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:30
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You could really tell Gatiss just loved writing Capaldi too. He loves writing Sherlock-esque snark and know it can be pulled off by the actor. For Big Finish people, you should really listen to Phantasmagoria if you haven't already; I think it's one of Gatiss' finest Who contributions.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:34
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marktheando posted:It's saved, but he still needs to find a way to find it, and pull it back into this universe. Ah that makes sense then. I suppose he can't just leave it floating around in there without bringing it back. Regarding this episode, I can only echo whats been mentioned by claiming I wasn't expecting much from it this week and it pulled through really well. That archery contest was the highlight for me. I was also fond of the call backs to the 3rd Doctor with the fencing and the Venusian Aikido chop to disarm Robin Hood in order to be captured. Edit: and oh god how could I forget the "I think you'll find I have a certain GENETIC ADVANTAGE" line during the Who Can Die Slower argument. "It definitely would be me though, wouldn't it?"  AndyElusive fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 17:37
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FWIW, I found the episode dumb but fun. The spoon bit was the only part I really hated.
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Sep 7, 2014 17:43
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I really enjoyed this episode, it had just the right amount of humour and sillyness that you'd expect from the Doctor, but also had him be a great foil. I love that they've turned the tables and Clara is in fact the voice of reason. Really like Clara as a companion who is in some ways smarter than the Doctor. I loved at the end when the Doctor is like " Well obviously he's a robot, no wait yeah that's a rubbish plan. But I wasright about the TREES!!"I loved that there was a spoon versus sword fight and the call backs to a more physical doctor, also his judo chop. I thought it was a great episode and the banter between Robin Hood and the Doctor was great. I really think this episode is where we fully get to see Capaldi's Doctor, it's been three episodes he's had the previous two to kind of flesh out a bit, and now we're seeing the actual Capaldi Doctor. Him being a bit childish in nature, but old in appearance is a great thing to do. Matt Smith and others kind of played him as a silly guy but with the weight of the centuries and being young. Capaldi plays him as a guy who doesn't have the weight of centuries on him but truly young at heart which is great. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 17:48
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I have just re-watched Robot of Sherwood and I have finally found out what it is I don't like about the new Doctor. And that is Peter Capaldi. He is not the Doctor. I don't relate to him as the Doctor. He doesn't act like the Doctor. He is not the Doctor. There is nothing Doctorish about him in any sense shape or form. This distresses me considerabley because I have loved all the Doctors since NuWho, and enjoy even really lovely episodes (fear hear I liked, Love and Monstors I DID NOT). I really dislike Doctor 12 so much, and its not through want of trying. There is nothing I like about this series and out of five of us in my family who are avid Who fans, there is only one who actually likes Doctor 12. I wonder if that's a statistic where viewing audiences are concerned. 1 in 5 who likes him can equate to 4 out of 5 who no longer watches. And I will watch things that are enjoyable, not out of a life long obsession induced fan loyalty. Myrddin_Emrys fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 17:58
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You're a very brave poster.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:00
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:He is not the Doctor. I don't relate to him as the Doctor. He doesn't act like the Doctor. He is not the Doctor. There is nothing Doctorish about him in any sense shape or form. Out of the 12 Doctors, how many have you watched?
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Sep 7, 2014 18:01
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I guess I hate fun because I thought this was absolute bobbins. At least Ben Miller was enjoying himself. I liked Capaldi in the first couple of episodes but he was unbelievably one-note 'grumpy old man' here.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:02
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thexerox123 posted:Out of the 12 Doctors, how many have you watched? Im 42, ive watched Who since Pertwee, whats your point?
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Sep 7, 2014 18:02
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thexerox123 posted:Out of the 12 Doctors, how many have you watched? Why does that matter? He's not going to go and watch the first 40 years to appreciate Capaldi and he shouldn't have to.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:03
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PriorMarcus posted:Why does that matter? He's not going to go and watch the first 40 years to appreciate Capaldi and he shouldn't have to. I think its a valid question. Im a life long fan, but I don't enjoy Capaldi, I don't know why, but I just cant connect to him like I have the others.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:04
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PriorMarcus posted:Why does that matter? He's not going to go and watch the first 40 years to appreciate Capaldi and he shouldn't have to. Just in terms of the "He is not the Doctor. He does not act like the Doctor." Because a lot of the classic Doctors are not at all like any of the newer Doctors.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:05
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This happens with the audience after every regeneration, right? The audience goes through this really crazy shift because the main character goes through it as well. Doctor Who never seemed like a show that doesn't mind losing a portion of its audience due to a new actor taking over the protagonist because it has always gained new ones as well as maintaining their core fans.
AndyElusive fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 18:05
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AndyElusive posted:This happens with the audience after every regeneration, right? The audience goes through this really crazy shift because the main character goes through it as well. Doctor Who never seemed like a show that doesn't mind losing a portion of its audience due to a new actor taking over the protagonist because it has always gained new ones as well as maintaining their core fans. Well it doesn't always gain new ones, I'm pretty sure the viewership is down since the David Tennant era. And Colin Baker and McCoy didn't attract many new viewers.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:07
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AndyElusive posted:This happens with the audience after every regeneration, right? The audience goes through this really crazy shift because the main character goes through it as well. Doctor Who never seemed like a show that doesn't mind losing a portion of its audience due to a new actor taking over the protagonist because it has always gained new ones as well as maintaining their core fans. This is what bothers me. I took to 9 as a new Doctor who has history we have yet to learn. I took to 10 at a time when I thought 9 had so more more to give us, more stories to tell. I took to 11 immediately and became the ultimate Doctor to me when I thought I would absolutely hate the guy. 12. Well 12 I don't know. Its like Capaldi isn't even trying to act like the Doctor, he just playing some guy with a magic box who happens to be called the Doctor. Its not working for me.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:09
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:This is what bothers me. In what way is he not acting like the Doctor? Could you be specific?
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Sep 7, 2014 18:11
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marktheando posted:In what way is he not acting like the Doctor? Could you be specific? Actually no I cannot. He just does not work for me, isn't that enough?
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Sep 7, 2014 18:13
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marktheando posted:Well it doesn't always gain new ones, I'm pretty sure the viewership is down since the David Tennant era. It does gain new fans, but the number gained will not always equal the number lost. Its a family show, designed to be watched by a broad audience including a lot of children. The nature of a long running show aimed at that audience is such that it will always be gaining and losing viewers as children start watching it or decide that they have grown out of it.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:13
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:Im 42, ive watched Who since Pertwee, whats your point? I think the point was that Capaldi's doctor has been compared quite a bit to the 1st and 3rd. You made a statement that there's nothing doctor like about him so it's helpful to know what you're comparing against.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:14
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Episode owned. Fairly certain the negative posters are Dalek clones sent to spread discord, because as we all know, Daleks hate fun.  Jerusalem posted:At the end of the first episode he lands in Glasgow instead of London, walks away to get Clara coffee and shows up three weeks later at her school. When has the Doctor ever been able to hit his target the vast majority of the time, though? Like, One had issues because he was still fairly young, but by Eleven and Amy you'd think he'd finally know how it works. Even if you take the TARDIS interrupting his various journeys so he can help people, he still has a tendency to miss by a few weeks/months, because what are a few weeks/months when you've lived thousands of years? SimplyCosmic posted:I, for one, am still shocked that they managed to not only to convince Anthony Ainley to come back from the dead to play the Sheriff, but also took the time to update the Xeraphin central chamber set from Timeflight. "Perhaps, Doctor, it is the rich that will steal... from you. Mwa ha. MWA ha ha."
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Sep 7, 2014 18:14
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:Actually no I cannot. He just does not work for me, isn't that enough? Well you can like or dislike whatever you want. But it doesn't really make for interesting discussion if you can't give a reason.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:15
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Chokes McGee posted:When has the Doctor ever been able to hit his target the vast majority of the time, though? Like, One had issues because he was still fairly young, but by Eleven and Amy you'd think he'd finally know how it works. Even if you take the TARDIS interrupting his various journeys so he can help people, he still has a tendency to miss by a few weeks/months, because what are a few weeks/months when you've lived thousands of years? It also doesn't help that the TARDIS is supposed to have six pilots instead of just one.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:22
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:Actually no I cannot. He just does not work for me, isn't that enough? Try not to get too annoyed if people who do enjoy Capaldi want to understand your point of view more, if just for the sake of discussion. For me it's appealing because he DOESN'T feel 100% like any of his recent incarnations. I don't get the feeling that he's really THE DOCTOR we've grown to understand and know. We're learning about a NEW Doctor. There's sparks of past selves in there, but it's clear this is a very different man, thrust into the role that's been carved out by his previous selves and is a bit annoyed and very cross about it.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:23
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marktheando posted:Well you can like or dislike whatever you want. But it doesn't really make for interesting discussion if you can't give a reason. I just don't want go through pages of 'your obviously not a real fan' 'your opinion sucks' 'you don't know what your talking about' 'I actually really hate him too but im so biased I will convince myself hes loving great' type arguments. I don't like him, he doesn't work for me, surely this is enough. Im so sorry Whovians but you do have to admit that Capaldi is a bit poo poo. EDIT AndyElusive posted:Try not to get too annoyed if people who do enjoy Capaldi want to understand your point of view more, if just for the sake of discussion. Please don't confuse my irritation with being irritated at forum posters. Im irritated with myself because I am such a huge Who fan for so many years of my life, and I am suddenly faced with an internal rejection of something I have always immensely enjoyed. Its not a pleasant feeling. Myrddin_Emrys fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 18:23
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:Im so sorry Whovians but you do have to admit that Capaldi is a bit poo poo. Uhhh, no, no we don't. I personally love him and already know that he's going to be among my favourite Doctors.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:26
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:
Not compared to at least any of the past 3 Doctors.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:26
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:I just don't want go through pages of 'your obviously not a real fan' 'your opinion sucks' 'you don't know what your talking about' 'I actually really hate him too but im so biased I will convince myself hes loving great' type arguments. I don't like him, he doesn't work for me, surely this is enough. Why? If you can't explain why you dislike him, what compels me to agree with your "argument"?  I like Capaldi quite a bit, and if you can't be arsed to explain why I shouldn't, your just stomping your feet and saying "I don't like him and you shouldn't either" is stupid at best, trollish at worst. e:sp jng2058 fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 18:28
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I think right now, three episodes in, that the problem is that Capaldi is playing HIS version of the Doctor, rather than THE Doctor as written. It's why the scripts read like poo poo. Hopefully soon the writing will catch up with his interpretation and vice versa so that things will level out. I'm still hoping they stop giving him lots of action to do, watching Capaldi begin a spoon fight only to cut to a long shot of a bad stunt double is loving horrible, and its even worse when he's trying to rush prisoners out of the dungeon only to awkwardly shuffle after them at a shuffle.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:29
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PriorMarcus posted:You're a very brave poster. You know, my mother phoned me up last week to say the exact same thing. Which was strange, but okay: I think I can see where they're coming from. I see less continuity of character here than in either of the other NuWho regenerations, and I think people are going to have a correspondingly more difficult time adjusting. It's not helping that Capaldi doesn't seem to be getting a whole lot of "Why is there never a big red button" lines (that's the line that really sold Hurt as the Doctor to me). marktheando posted:I'm pretty sure the viewership is down since the David Tennant era. LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT GRAPHS. PriorMarcus posted:I'm still hoping they stop giving him lots of action to do, watching Capaldi begin a spoon fight only to cut to a long shot of a bad stunt double is loving horrible, and its even worse when he's trying to rush prisoners out of the dungeon only to awkwardly shuffle after them at a shuffle. Oh, there was a stunt double?  I never notice this stuff.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:30
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Myrddin_Emrys posted:He is not the Doctor. I don't relate to him as I'm not going to try argue you into liking him, because that would be stupid, but I highly doubt your family's opinions of Capaldi's performance are representative of all fans. Just look at this thread. Even the people who haven't liked the episodes have mostly been positive about Capaldi. I'm not sure this thread is really a representative sample either, but it's probably better than one guy's family.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:30
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jng2058 posted:Why? If you can't explain why you dislike him, what compels me to agree with you "argument"? I don't want you to agree with my argument, im just telling you how I feel. If you enjoy Capaldis Doctor then that's brilliant. You obviously have seen something in him that I have yet to see and wish I could. I don't want you to change your opinion, im just telling you mine.
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Sep 7, 2014 18:31
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DJ Ramshackle posted:Overall, Spare Parts was a brilliant introduction to Big Finish and audiobooks in general for me and I look forward to the next one. Just need to figure out which one... Actually, go for The Marian Conspiracy first, THEN JUBILEE
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Sep 7, 2014 18:32
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