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You can mod that bullshit with all sorts of bells and whistles but in the end it is still bullshit.
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Sep 7, 2014 22:58
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Thoughtless posted:If you avoid using Fidget's spells combined with Dust Storm it's actually fairly challenging. It sucks to not be able to use your best abilities but hey, a lot of Metroidvanias are like that. (see Castlevania SOTN) I've never encountered a single thing in Skyrim that can't be stunlocked up to and including dragons. Destruction is boring because you're just spamming fireballs mostly, but it does decent damage.
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Sep 8, 2014 01:39
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Kimmalah posted:I've never encountered a single thing in Skyrim that can't be stunlocked up to and including dragons. Destruction is boring because you're just spamming fireballs mostly, but it does decent damage. So long as you're doublecasting with Impact, I think anything can be stunlocked. Plus mages have access to Paralysis, which is just as stupid except that it doesn't work on dragons or automata.
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Sep 8, 2014 02:38
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Playing Resident Evil Darkside Chrnoicles. The shaky cam poo poo doesn't annoy me much but the seemingly unavoidable damage sure as poo poo does. And do I really need to protect my partner as well? He has a lifebar and everything...
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Sep 8, 2014 06:35
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Alteisen posted:I'd like to add that WS has also been plagued by numerous bugs, everytime the devs "fix" something they break like 10 others, my favorite so far is guild leaders(just the leader) having their entire attunemment wiped, Carbine's answer to this lovely bug? "Roll and alt and do it again". That TBC chart's incredibly pedantic. First off the 3 bubbles in green are just a door out in the world which 50 players were opening every second letting anybody walk through. Knock off another 4 bubbles for bosses\dungeons that are just open to everyone, why even mention that in an attunement guide? Then they're listing level 65 dungeons you've been doing on your way to the level cap, just stuff you would have had to have done unless you just stood in 1 zone grinding 10,000 orcs. The nightbane quest is 4 bubbles and only 1 person needs to do it to summon him for the raid to kill. A few more bubbles spent on "Be able to buy key" followed up by "buy key." It's just an amazingly nit-picky guide. To get to my complaint about TBC though, the only time attunement is more complex than "easy dungeon unlocks hard dungeon" and actually gets to be a pain in the rear end is for the privilege of going to Tempest Keep so you can have the honor of having your guild break up and all your friends quit because of the Kael'thas fight. gently caress Kael'thas and his long rear end whiny speech and ten minute intro every time you attempt the fight. You don't even get to damage the actual boss until phase 5 or something. There's just these 4 minions that you fight one at a time, then all together, and it takes way too long to get to the actual fight. It adds absolutely nothing but a time sink and an emo elf is just talking at you the entire time about his fictional problems. When I quit playing Kael'thas was nicknamed "The Guildbreaker" because so many people just got to that fight and uninstalled. Friendships were ended right and left over players not being skilled enough to get through the end of the fight before getting sick of the beginning. I really hope raid design never got worse than that, but I suspect it has.
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Sep 8, 2014 14:01
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Overweight Shark posted:To get to my complaint about TBC though, the only time attunement is more complex than "easy dungeon unlocks hard dungeon" and actually gets to be a pain in the rear end is for the privilege of going to Tempest Keep so you can have the honor of having your guild break up and all your friends quit because of the Kael'thas fight. gently caress Kael'thas and his long rear end whiny speech and ten minute intro every time you attempt the fight.
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Sep 8, 2014 14:24
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As someone who has never played an MMO, what the heck is attunement?
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Sep 8, 2014 14:31
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RyokoTK posted:As someone who has never played an MMO, what the heck is attunement? A quest to open a door. If you want to get the best loot you need to kill a boss. That boss is in a dungeon. The dungeon's door is locked. To create a key you must bring the blacksmith 30 rotting bear asses.
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Sep 8, 2014 14:38
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RyokoTK posted:As someone who has never played an MMO, what the heck is attunement? A big chain of usually very time consuming tasks needed to get into the places where you can find the best loot. It's called attunement because iirc the first real instance of it was in WoW where the dungeon would just kill you if you hadn't completed the quest chain. Nowadays they mostly busy work to get a key to the raid.
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Sep 8, 2014 14:42
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Overweight Shark posted:A quest to open a door. If you want to get the best loot you need to kill a boss. That boss is in a dungeon. The dungeon's door is locked. To create a key you must bring the blacksmith 30 rotting bear asses.
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Sep 8, 2014 15:48
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Skyrim is the game that really cemented into me the idea that Bethesda can't do anything except presentation right. Sure, the game looks pretty as gently caress, and wandering around the game world and seeing all this cool poo poo, and the thought of being a mage and blowing up dragons or whatever is awesome. But then you actually play - then you find out the combat is bad, the magic is worse, the stealth is ridiculous, quests are poorly designed, the game is buggy as hell, dialogue is stilted, and few of the hundreds of dungeons are worth the time. But it looks pretty (after mods) and has been hyped up for years, 10/10.
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Sep 8, 2014 15:50
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The thing with the attunement is that half the things on the list are the actual endgame content. Tempest Keep, SSC etc are proper, hard, endgame raids that you had to do to get to the biggest baddest of them all. It's not *just* busywork (though there's plenty of that, and it sucks) - it's like complaining that you have to get through the early planets in Mass Effect to get to the later ~endgame~ ones. My spergy pet peeve is any fantasy RPG where you constantly get referred to as 'adventurers'. Or worse, ones who treat it like a profession, like 'oh my son is a farmer, and my daughter went off to be an adventurer'. It's just dumb as hell. Wandering the world heavily armed fighting things is something you do because important plot poo poo is going down. Imagine Lord of the Rings if they ran into a bunch of other Fellowships along the way that just sort of dithered around killing miscellaneous poo poo and living off a somehow endless supply of 10,0000 year old ruins, because work is work and it's not taxed or whatever. Basically, turning heroism into a profession in order to cram game mechanics/D&D tropes where they don't belong.
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Sep 8, 2014 16:10
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Strategic Tea posted:The thing with the attunement is that half the things on the list are the actual endgame content. Tempest Keep, SSC etc are proper, hard, endgame raids that you had to do to get to the biggest baddest of them all. It's not *just* busywork (though there's plenty of that, and it sucks) - it's like complaining that you have to get through the early planets in Mass Effect to get to the later ~endgame~ ones. It's such an easy thing to explain, too. Oh, my son went off to destroy the lich lord. Oh, my daughter joined a group of people/vigilantes dedicated to protecting the motherland. This guy wants to kill this guy for revenge, glory, riches but he first needs to amass followers to encounter his armies.
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Sep 8, 2014 16:42
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I dunno, I can see people considering "adventuring" to be like the philosophy majors of their time. Like, you're not some idiot pothead wandering around aimlessly with a tinfoil sword, you're an Adventurer! Just because one dude chucked a magic ring into a volcano doesn't justify everyone else doodling around Gondor hoping to scrounge up enough cash to order a pizza.
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Sep 8, 2014 16:48
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It's really just another word for mercenary, or freelancer. But it sounds more ~*~heroic~*~
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Sep 8, 2014 16:52
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It never bothered me in the Elder Scrolls series because there's so many ancient ruins and weird-rear end caves and vampire lairs and poo poo that it seems like wandering around aimlessly treasure-hunting would be a feasible career path as long as you know how to hold a sword.
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Sep 8, 2014 17:09
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Strategic Tea posted:Imagine Lord of the Rings if they ran into a bunch of other Fellowships along the way that just sort of dithered around killing miscellaneous poo poo and living off a somehow endless supply of 10,0000 year old ruins, because work is work and it's not taxed or whatever. Isn't that basically the Rangers' entire schtick? Tunicate has a new favorite as of 17:38 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 17:15
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You have to admit that "murder hobo" wouldn't look as good on a resumé. Actually that kind of reminds me: Borderlands 2 has characters constantly being impressed that I'm a "vault hunter" without really ever making clear what that means or why it's so special. It seems like anybody could call themselves one.
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Sep 8, 2014 17:32
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Tunicate posted:Isn't that basically the Rangers' entire schtick? They're more of a decrepit army turned nomad, still protecting the ruins of their kingdom and the people beyond. That's the thing, like Calavreon said there are so many slight changes that make it work much better. They joined the army, they turned to banditry, they're travelling to find their lost uncle. Anything that doesn't suggest they've taken 'you all meet in a tavern and go kill a vampire' not as a perilous adventure but a day job.
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Sep 8, 2014 17:51
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StandardVC10 posted:You have to admit that "murder hobo" wouldn't look as good on a resumé. The Vault Hunter stuff was from the first game.
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Sep 8, 2014 18:02
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StandardVC10 posted:You have to admit that "murder hobo" wouldn't look as good on a resumé. I think this is because Handsome Jack has killed almost all the vault hunters already so it's significant that you've survived that long, since apparently you're one of the last. Although it still seemed weird to me that people act like you're really special or their only hope or whatever, since they didn't make the player characters have plot dialogue until the last major DLC so you just stand there awkwardly while they're very impressed that you're a mystical magical vault hunter.
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Sep 8, 2014 18:04
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Strategic Tea posted:They joined the army, they turned to banditry, they're travelling to find their lost uncle. Give them that specific of a goal though, and it suggests there's some kind of normal life that they came from and will return to, which seems like it should be true but doesn't match up with the player's experience. I once read this article about how fantasy worlds have a weird ironic relationship to the "heroic" deeds that take place in them, because they're not designed for anything else. Especially in games, where the extraordinary stuff you do as the hero may be literally the only thing that happens in the world-- everything else is just referred-to, by canned dialogue or text or whatever. Expand this to the scope of something like WoW and heroic questing starts to look like some kind of digital sharecropping, to the point where players will literally farm their adventures out to Chinese sweatshops because they're just too loving boring. It's surreal. There's probably some kind of life lesson about how fantasy can't shoulder the burdens of reality but i'm not gonna try to think about it now.
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Sep 8, 2014 18:14
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StandardVC10 posted:You have to admit that "murder hobo" wouldn't look as good on a resumé. From now on, anytime is see "adventurer" in an RPG, I'm going to mentally substitute it with "murder-hobo". "Welcome, brave murder-hobos. You're our only hope!"
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Sep 8, 2014 18:36
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Strategic Tea posted:My spergy pet peeve is any fantasy RPG where you constantly get referred to as 'adventurers'. Or worse, ones who treat it like a profession, like 'oh my son is a farmer, and my daughter went off to be an adventurer'. It's just dumb as hell. Wandering the world heavily armed fighting things is something you do because important plot poo poo is going down. Imagine Lord of the Rings if they ran into a bunch of other Fellowships along the way that just sort of dithered around killing miscellaneous poo poo and living off a somehow endless supply of 10,0000 year old ruins, because work is work and it's not taxed or whatever. I agree that games kinda overblow it (especially MMOs, where adventurers outnumber civilians a thousand to one), but the idea of heavily-armed dudes wandering around fighting things is roughly 900 years old: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knight-errant
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Sep 8, 2014 19:12
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I've heard "freelance murderer and salesman", which also fits pretty well.
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Sep 8, 2014 19:32
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"Adventurer" is just another name for an errand boy, a thing do-er, an oddjobsman. Adventuring sounds more bombastic and heroic and poo poo, just the same way "wizard" or "sorcerer" sound better than "magician." In fantasy worlds where you have spiders as big as cows and packs of lizards colour-coded by tooth sharpness, even going into the forest and picking mushrooms for supper is quite an adventure. If some alchemist doesn't want to send research notes to a colleague in the next town over because he knows he'll get waylaid by fish men, he'd be looking to hire someone who's good with a sword or that can sneak around undetected. The fact that the random migrant worker that answers his want ad is also the chosen one with the magic crystal pendant that will finally kill Satan is irrelevant, but by the time you actually talk to the pope of crystal pendants you've built up a reputation of "chump that will find you bear teeth in exchange for clean socks and pocket change."
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Sep 8, 2014 20:39
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My following question is thus what does the Pope need bear teeth for
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Sep 8, 2014 21:07
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Calaveron posted:My following question is thus what does the Pope need bear teeth for He's making his own mechanized suit like in that episode of Hannibal. NoEyedSquareGuy has a new favorite as of 21:12 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 21:10
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cobalt impurity posted:"Adventurer" is just another name for an errand boy, a thing do-er, an oddjobsman. Adventuring sounds more bombastic and heroic and poo poo, just the same way "wizard" or "sorcerer" sound better than "magician." In fantasy worlds where you have spiders as big as cows and packs of lizards colour-coded by tooth sharpness, even going into the forest and picking mushrooms for supper is quite an adventure. If some alchemist doesn't want to send research notes to a colleague in the next town over because he knows he'll get waylaid by fish men, he'd be looking to hire someone who's good with a sword or that can sneak around undetected. I always like going through the woods or a dungeon in some game and finding to corpse of the last "adventurer" that got sent on my errand. 
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Sep 8, 2014 21:33
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Kimmalah posted:I always like going through the woods or a dungeon in some game and finding to corpse of the last "adventurer" that got sent on my errand. One of the better mods for Skyrim adds in three or four NPC adventurers like you that you can run randomly into out in the wild questing. It was nice to enter a dungeon only to find the Vampire nest inside already wiped out by a guy just as decked out in gear as you (why is the PC in Elder Scrolls games the only dude with decent gear in the entire world?) picking their corpses clean of loot.
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Sep 8, 2014 21:55
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Esroc posted:One of the better mods for Skyrim adds in three or four NPC adventurers like you that you can run randomly into out in the wild questing. It was nice to enter a dungeon only to find the Vampire nest inside already wiped out by a guy just as decked out in gear as you (why is the PC in Elder Scrolls games the only dude with decent gear in the entire world?) picking their corpses clean of loot. When I played Oblivion for the first time I didn't realize you actually had to rest to level up. So when I found out I could I ended up blowing through like 30 levels at once and suddenly every random thief in the game was wearing full Daedric or glass armor. Had to scrap that character because the game was suddenly unplayably difficult.
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Sep 8, 2014 21:58
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Esroc posted:One of the better mods for Skyrim adds in three or four NPC adventurers like you that you can run randomly into out in the wild questing. It was nice to enter a dungeon only to find the Vampire nest inside already wiped out by a guy just as decked out in gear as you (why is the PC in Elder Scrolls games the only dude with decent gear in the entire world?) picking their corpses clean of loot. The original Stalker game tried something like that, with the added part of the NPCs would also do story bits but realized that it was kind of annoying to be playing and have everything already completed by an NPC.
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Sep 8, 2014 22:00
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muscles like this? posted:The original Stalker game tried something like that, with the added part of the NPCs would also do story bits but realized that it was kind of annoying to be playing and have everything already completed by an NPC. It was also an idea considered by Molyneux for either Fable 2 or 3 (I don't remember which, I think 2), with the added bonus that you could open up a treasure chest and find that these other Heroes had already taken the loot. It was left on the cutting-room floor after someone realized that a feature that does literally nothing at all but inconvenience and rob the player for no reason may not be the best design decision.
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Sep 8, 2014 22:43
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Esroc posted:One of the better mods for Skyrim adds in three or four NPC adventurers like you that you can run randomly into out in the wild questing. It was nice to enter a dungeon only to find the Vampire nest inside already wiped out by a guy just as decked out in gear as you (why is the PC in Elder Scrolls games the only dude with decent gear in the entire world?) picking their corpses clean of loot. Yeah you'll occasionally run into adventurers or alchemists in the base game, but they're always idiots in bad equipment and (not surprisingly) dead. Although there are a few competent NPCs, like the guy who will challenge you to a wizard duel and the Ebony Warrior who tracks you down for a challenge when you hit level 80-something.
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Sep 8, 2014 22:55
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In, Nier: Yes, Aerie Shades keep telling me I'm the bad person as you keep attacking me non-stop. I sure do feel really monstrous about defending myself. Also, farming.
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Sep 8, 2014 23:31
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scarycave posted:In, Nier: Hey You started it. Those first prologue shades don't attack you at all.
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Sep 8, 2014 23:39
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Mokinokaro posted:Hey You started it. Those first prologue shades don't attack you at all. The only shade I've ever felt bad about - was the library one. And the one in Nier's village. Because neither attack you, and in both cases you have to attack. The study shade has a shield only you can break (and a fuckton of health), the village shade can only be attacked by you, because the other two guys wait outside. And I guess the one with the robot because he didn't really do poo poo. If the Aerie shades didn't over react to Nier's ethnic-cleansing ramblings and didn't start the whole brawl - the Aerie would still be there and I could still get Eagle eggs for my spear.
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Sep 8, 2014 23:56
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Byzantine posted:I agree that games kinda overblow it (especially MMOs, where adventurers outnumber civilians a thousand to one), but the idea of heavily-armed dudes wandering around fighting things is roughly 900 years old: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knight-errant Fight people, not things. Their livelihood is fueled by agrarian economies, and was just as likely to involve raiding these economies as protecting them.
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Sep 9, 2014 00:23
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Phobophilia posted:Fight people, not things. Their livelihood is fueled by agrarian economies, and was just as likely to involve raiding these economies as protecting them. I don't really see how that's different. It's not like there are monsters to kill in real life and if you go around killing animals then you're just a hunter or poacher or something along those lines.
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Sep 9, 2014 02:21
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cobalt impurity posted:The fact that the random migrant worker that answers his want ad is also the chosen one with the magic crystal pendant that will finally kill Satan is irrelevant, but by the time you actually talk to the pope of crystal pendants you've built up a reputation of "chump that will find you bear teeth in exchange for clean socks and pocket change." This works best in Ryuutama, but that's a game where if when you get into town and ask if there's anything anyone needs doing here, and the Innkeeper answers "Well, if you muck out the stables you can sleep in them for free, and we've got a steel washtub out back you can use, and Widow Mary needs some help with her beet harvest and I'd bet she's got some old clothes you could wear and all the beets you can carry', you'd be all 'SWEET! This trip's already paid for itself!'
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