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ShadowHawk posted:By your reasoning an Ubuntu developer who is supporting his package on Ubuntu and makes it work by this process would count as "unsupported" in Ubuntu and "supported" in Debian. no that is just fine. that is a desirable state. unfortunately that is not a guarantee, or even an expectation, in universe. once you enable the universe repo, you get the carefully maintained packages, and also three categories of broken poo poo: Notorious b.s.d. posted:Any given package might be untouched (bad), get backported security updates (good), be updated religiously from upstream (really bad), or replaced with something completely different from debian (really, really bad).
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Sep 22, 2014 22:53
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ShadowHawk posted:By your reasoning an Ubuntu developer who is supporting his package on Ubuntu and makes it work by this process would count as "unsupported" in Ubuntu and "supported" in Debian.
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Sep 22, 2014 22:55
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ShadowHawk posted:Similarly, a wholly working piece of software, tested and supported but requiring no changes from Debian, would somehow count as "unsupported" by you. It's like complaining that Ubuntu isn't supporting software because we're being good open source citizens and upstreaming our fixes. i don't care which fixes get upstreamed, i care which fixes are guaranteed to be made available as updates in a timely manner, and which things they break universe is a hodgepodge disaster i can predict nothing
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Sep 22, 2014 22:56
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:no that is just fine. that is a desirable state.
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Sep 22, 2014 22:57
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ShadowHawk posted:Make up your drat mind. Either you want it fixed Debian first and synced/merged to Ubuntu ("bad") or you want it supported and fixed in Ubuntu first ("really bad" or "really, really, bad") i give zero shits about where it comes from, i care about what happens after a release replacing things at random is really, really bad
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Sep 22, 2014 22:58
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:what? you remove the minimize and maximize buttons from the window frame like an rear end in a top hat and then as an additional gently caress you to your users you start making apps draw their own window frames in order to ignore the hidden dconf preference that isn't even in Tweak Tool
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Sep 22, 2014 22:59
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pseudorandom name posted:you remove the minimize and maximize buttons from the window frame like an rear end in a top hat and then as an additional gently caress you to your users you start making apps draw their own window frames in order to ignore the hidden dconf preference that isn't even in Tweak Tool this is loving hilarious
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Sep 22, 2014 23:00
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pseudorandom name posted:you remove the minimize and maximize buttons from the window frame like an rear end in a top hat and then as an additional gently caress you to your users you start making apps draw their own window frames in order to ignore the hidden dconf preference that isn't even in Tweak Tool It's in Tweak Tool, and CSD apps respect it. 
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Sep 22, 2014 23:27
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:i give zero shits about where it comes from, i care about what happens after a release I'm not sure you understand what ShadowHawk is saying. The Ubuntu "universe" is basically the same exact packages as what's in Debian. So why do you like Debian and hate Ubuntu?
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Sep 22, 2014 23:29
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Suspicious Dish posted:I'm not sure you understand what ShadowHawk is saying. The Ubuntu "universe" is basically the same exact packages as what's in Debian. So why do you like Debian and hate Ubuntu? greybeard stymie
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Sep 22, 2014 23:31
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(The answer is that all of Debian's packaging is poo poo and Ubuntu just copies it in.)
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Sep 22, 2014 23:37
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what do y'all think about software vendors providing their own packaging and repos for their software on a variety of distros and not bothering to get it included because they don't want to sync up their release schedule with ubuntu or rhel
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Sep 22, 2014 23:38
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Suspicious Dish posted:It's in Tweak Tool, and CSD apps respect it. the actual dconf pref isn't a pair of booleans and Tweak Tool isn't capable of fully configuring it and I don't know what a CSD app is, but all the GNOME apps that draw their own title bar using the lovely adwaita theme ignore the pref entirely
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Sep 23, 2014 00:00
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counter strike go runs like rear end on linux
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Sep 23, 2014 00:39
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pseudorandom name posted:the actual dconf pref isn't a pair of booleans and Tweak Tool isn't capable of fully configuring it and I don't know what a CSD app is, but all the GNOME apps that draw their own title bar using the lovely adwaita theme ignore the pref entirely Feel free to come up with a better UI for GNOME Tweak Tool about configuring it. We've never had any way of configuring it other than two booleans, besides hitting some weird command line key. No other OS lets you tweak it in weird ways either. CSD (client-side decorated) apps are apps that draw the titlebar. The screenshot shows both nautilus and GNOME Tweak Tool, both apps that draw their own toolbar (note the search icon in the titlebar of both) obeying the hint that was set and showing the Minimize and Maximize buttons.
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Sep 23, 2014 00:56
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Suspicious Dish posted:
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Sep 23, 2014 01:08
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pseudorandom name posted:the actual dconf pref isn't a pair of booleans and Tweak Tool isn't capable of fully configuring it and I don't know what a CSD app is, but all the GNOME apps that draw their own title bar using the lovely adwaita theme ignore the pref entirely bro Suspicious Dish just posted a screenshot demonstrating that you're maybe it was broken on 3.12 or 3.10 idk gnome 3 is a real late bloomer tho there's no denying that.
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Sep 23, 2014 01:38
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:konsole thanks Notorious b.s.d. posted:The problem with Ubuntu isn't a matter of taste. It's not that I don't like Unity, or I have bad feelings about Shuttleworth, or that the logo doesn't agree with me. It's much more fundamental: The Ubuntu model for development is broken. interesting
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Sep 23, 2014 01:44
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Mr Dog posted:bro Suspicious Dish just posted a screenshot demonstrating that you're I was phone posting and Awful.app lost the ability to zoom in on images in iOS 8. Have a screenshot:  Oh, and the old version of Tweak Tool didn't have two booleans, it had a drop down menu that it rendered a single pixel high because it couldn't match menu:minimize,maximize,close to any of its options and then didn't bother to set any of them to be active. (Not that this matters now except as an amusing and typical failure mode.)
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Sep 23, 2014 01:53
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That's bizarre. Again, it works perfectly for me: Is this GNOME 3.12?
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Sep 23, 2014 02:25
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Suspicious Dish posted:I'm not sure you understand what ShadowHawk is saying. The Ubuntu "universe" is basically the same exact packages as what's in Debian. So why do you like Debian and hate Ubuntu? debian continues to update those packages after a release, just like centos. ubuntu is a crap shoot. sometimes packages get patched. sometimes they get hosed with. sometimes they get abandoned. enabling universe means you never know what you're gonna get Notorious b.s.d. fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 02:50
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ShadowHawk posted:Moreover, if what you care about is actual releases, the Ubuntu versions will be more up to date since Ubuntu releases more often (even if you only count LTSes). the LTS is something ubuntu gets right, it's infuriating that debian has indefinite release cycles and only 1 year to migrate after a new version comes out. i cannot imagine running a business under those circumstances of course, the only part that gets "released" and supported is the canonical core. so i guess that's great if i want to run php applications
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Sep 23, 2014 02:51
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Cocoa Crispies posted:what do y'all think about software vendors providing their own packaging and repos for their software on a variety of distros and not bothering to get it included because they don't want to sync up their release schedule with ubuntu or rhel well if you're selling software you pretty much have to do this. it doesn't always make sense to have linux distributors being the ones shipping your software
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Sep 23, 2014 02:57
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it doesn't make sense in the first place. Linux is the only platform where you have thirty exclusive clubs you have to convince to ship your software. Everyone else just has an open platform or an app store.
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Sep 23, 2014 02:58
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Suspicious Dish posted:it doesn't make sense in the first place. Linux is the only platform where you have thirty exclusive clubs you have to convince to ship your software. Everyone else just has an open platform or an app store. you have a lot of luck getting your patches accepted for explorer.exe or solaris management console? open source is a different animal.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:03
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This belongs here In the beginning there was command line by Neal Stephenson E: gently caress phone posting
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Sep 23, 2014 04:01
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:you have a lot of luck getting your patches accepted for explorer.exe or solaris management console? yeah normal ones are like big cats that are fuckin' cool or or like a fuzzy yellow dog that wants you to search linux is like a nematode or an amoeba or like a gross fuckin' bug that you really don't want to deal with unless you're one of those weirdo grown-ups that still thinks a spider is an acceptable pet just like a crossbow is a thing you should own
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Sep 23, 2014 04:09
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Cocoa Crispies posted:... unless you're one of those weirdo grown-ups that still thinks a spider is an acceptable pet just like a crossbow is a thing you should own i.e. an open source developer
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Sep 23, 2014 04:11
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:i.e. an open source developer 
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Sep 23, 2014 04:13
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Cocoa Crispies posted:yeah normal ones are like big cats that are fuckin' cool or or like a fuzzy yellow dog that wants you to search
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Sep 23, 2014 09:31
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:the LTS is something ubuntu gets right, it's infuriating that debian has indefinite release cycles and only 1 year to migrate after a new version comes out. i cannot imagine running a business under those circumstances When a newer Debian package is known to be better after Debian Import Freeze, it gets synced manually (or a particular patch from it put into just the -ubuntu version). I have, personally, done this process with all manner of random universe packages. This particular procedure, incidentally, is much more direct support than Debian Testing gets, which is an almost entirely automated process.
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Sep 23, 2014 19:50
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Suspicious Dish posted:Is this GNOME 3.12? 3.12? unreleased software? what do you take me for, a Gentoo user?
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Sep 23, 2014 22:57
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pseudorandom name posted:3.12? unreleased software? what do you take me for, a Gentoo user? Sorry, I didn't realize you were a time traveler. http://www.gnome.org/news/2014/03/gnome-3-12-released/
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Sep 23, 2014 23:04
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I know Linux on the Desktop is supposed to suck but every time I run an application it runs and I'm able to get my poo poo done. Gnome even does that thing I like where I just hit the Windows key or whatever FOSS nerds call it and type the first few letters of whatever I want to run and there it is. I was told this wasn't how it was going to be. Should I use xorg-twm instead? It looks sort of poo poo.
Sauer fucked around with this message at 23:39 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 23:09
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Suspicious Dish posted:Sorry, I didn't realize you were a time traveler. quote:GNOME 3 is available to install through most GNU/Linux distributions. Many offer the chance to try a demo before you install.
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Sep 23, 2014 23:18
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Sauer posted:the Windows key or whatever FOSS nerds call it no, the meta key mine has a tiny ubuntu sticker on it covering the windows logo
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Sep 23, 2014 23:48
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ShadowHawk posted:that's the super key
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Sep 24, 2014 00:30
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It's the Windows key. I am an authority on Linux. It is the Windows key. Now shut up about keyboard arguments.
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Sep 24, 2014 00:44
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Soricidus posted:it should really be meta, but 1990s idiots running emacs on commodity pc hardware with no meta key decided to use alt for that instead, and when pc keyboards finally got more keys they were so used to treating alt and meta as the same that they decided to make the meta key produce a different modifier instead. yeah "escape meta alt control shift" doesn't make sense if meta and alt are the same button
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Sep 24, 2014 00:45
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Cocoa Crispies posted:yeah "escape meta alt control shift" doesn't make sense if meta and alt are the same button (and he will ignore me because I didn't say gnu/linux)
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Sep 24, 2014 00:57
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