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thrawn527 posted:Keeping in mind this isn't actually a defense of Castle in that regard, but this is true of all crime procedurals, isn't it? Castle, NCIS, Elementary, Bones, etc. all seem to do this. Sure, they use "evidence and detective work", but most cases just end with a confession, given by someone who doesn't have a lawyer, and very often after the person asking the questions has lied or threatened the suspect somehow. Oh I agree, it's the same with most US crime shows. The difference, for me, is that I liked Castle initially whereas I don't watch NCIS etc for much the same reasons (also they're mostly trash on a basic level of quality). I think it stands out so much to me because I grew up watching things like The Bill on UK television. The Bill was a twice weekly police proceedural where it wasn't even a matter of discussion, they'd cut to the interview room and you would see the officers starting the tape recorders and there's just another extra in the scene playing the part of the solicitor. Everyone had a solicitor, even if it was just the duty solicitor, and it was routine, no inferences drawn. It didn't actually change much about the basic structure of the programme, but it also didn't create an extremely unhealthy prejudice in the back of the viewer's mind. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Sep 30, 2014 |
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Sep 30, 2014 21:21
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GraPar posted:You're The Worst just got a Season 2 This is the best news. I hope they find a better way to market it going forward because the campaign they did before the show started airing was horrible and almost made me miss a great show.
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Sep 30, 2014 21:30
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I think Castle's a little worse about it than the other shows mentioned because Beckett's entire approach to police work (in the first couple of seasons that I watched at least) was to gather some evidence, see who the most likely suspect is, and then proceed to yell at him/her and accuse them of the crime until they would either give her some info or crack and confess. At least a show like Elementary will often discount a suspect because Sherlock or Watson realize that they couldn't have done it. Castle just has the cops accuse everyone until eventually they get it right.
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Sep 30, 2014 21:30
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I don't have to like Roman Polanski to like his movies and I don't have to like Lena Dunham to like Girls. Deal with it.  thrawn527 posted:I've never seen Castle as being any worse about this than any other show. The amount of times Gibbs on NCIS has countered, "Do I need a lawyer?" with, "Do you think you need one?" or, "Why, have you done anything wrong?" is rather absurd. Brooklyn 99 also features a lot of heinous abuses of police discretion, but you have to keep in mind that its not a documentary, and neither is Castle. I've said it a hundred times in the Castle thread, but Castle's biggest problem is its rigid adherence to its format. The killer is ALWAYS the last person Beckett fingers, her conclusion is ALWAYS based on investigation that takes place off-screen and the killer ALWAYS confesses, even when there's no storytelling need for him to confess.
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Sep 30, 2014 21:31
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hope and vaseline posted:So Bunheads was good for the one season it was on? Yeah it was. There were some growing pains with attempts to both imitate GG while also stepping out of its shadow. However, it mostly righted the ship by the end and really should've deserved a second season.
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Sep 30, 2014 21:54
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VDay posted:I think Castle's a little worse about it than the other shows mentioned because Beckett's entire approach to police work (in the first couple of seasons that I watched at least) was to gather some evidence, see who the most likely suspect is, and then proceed to yell at him/her and accuse them of the crime until they would either give her some info or crack and confess. At least a show like Elementary will often discount a suspect because Sherlock or Watson realize that they couldn't have done it. Castle just has the cops accuse everyone until eventually they get it right. The Glades kind of one ups this because the detective pretty much ruins all the suspect's lives, if you think about it.
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Sep 30, 2014 21:55
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:Oh I agree, it's the same with most US crime shows. The difference, for me, is that I liked Castle initially whereas I don't watch NCIS etc for much the same reasons (also they're mostly trash on a basic level of quality). That makes sense, and it would be nice to have a show act like that here. I guess, having only ever watched American crime shows, that's the only thing I've known. So, while I'm extremely vocal when things like that happen in real life, and tell everyone I know to never talk to the police, when it happens on TV I just kind of accept it as a kind of annoying but inevitable part of the format.
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Sep 30, 2014 21:57
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Sorry for the double post, but:Doctor Butts posted:The Glades kind of one ups this because the detective pretty much ruins all the suspect's lives, if you think about it. Yeah, this happens a lot, too. Very often they'll show a husband, for example, grusome pictures of his now dead wife's dead and mangled body to try and illicit a reaction. And every time I can't help but think, "Jesus Christ, if this guy didn't kill his wife, that is a horrible thing to show him that he'll be bringing up in therapy for years to come." NCIS is also the worst about this. Gibbs did (I stopped watching last season) this probably at least once every other week.
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Sep 30, 2014 22:09
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Fooz posted:Girls is alright. I thought it was a nepotism thing but I was wrong apparently. Nepotism gets on my nerves more than Dunham. I think what you're thinking of is Judd Apatow taking an interest in Dunham, which is allegedly the only reason HBO gave Girls a shot in the first place. That's not nepotism since they're not related. It's the kind of thing that happens all the time to young filmmakers. The latest season of Girls was actually good, the first two were really not.
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Sep 30, 2014 22:33
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thrawn527 posted:Sorry for the double post, but: Horrible deplorable misconduct is basically the bread and butter of crime procedurals. When the good guys don't commit actual crimes or brutality in the course of the episode you're looking at an abnormal episode. This may or may not reflect reality. Probably does though.
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Sep 30, 2014 23:59
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zoux posted:Yeah actually since internet discussion of her leads invariably directly into how ugly she is and how gross she is naked it is a unique situation. I'm sure there are people who legit don't like the show that aren't misogynists, but the level and strength of the dislike for the show and how much of that is personally directed at Dunham comes from a deeper place. The level of vehemence is way out of proportion to the quality of the show. I think it's a pretty terrible show and think the idea that calling someone out for not paying talent makes you a "hater" is pretty laffo, but I think she's actually kinda okay looking and she seems like an alright person in every other respect. Am... am I the strange one?  IRQ posted:Horrible deplorable misconduct is basically the bread and butter of crime procedurals. When the good guys don't commit actual crimes or brutality in the course of the episode you're looking at an abnormal episode. It certainly does for SVU at the very least. I couldn't tell you about NCIS because every version of that show is so crushingly loving boring.
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Oct 1, 2014 00:31
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The original Law & Order was probably best for cops' actions. Any time the cops would step out of line on a suspect/defendant's rights they'd get smacked down at trial.
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Oct 1, 2014 00:39
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Shows like NCIS and L&O pulling the "only the guilty need lawyers" is not nearly as bad as true crime shows doing the same thing. Just about every episode (at least the ones I've been forced to watch) has a cop or the narrator imply that a guy is guilty because he lawyered up. It's so loving irresponsible to repeat that bullshit.GraPar posted:You're The Worst just got a Season 2 This is great news. E: You forgot to mention that they're moving it to FXX, which is about as good as cancellation. Married is staying. 
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Oct 1, 2014 00:51
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Holy poo poo Manhattan Love Story is already making me want to put a gun in my mouth.
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Oct 1, 2014 01:33
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JohnSherman posted:E: You forgot to mention that they're moving it to FXX, which is about as good as cancellation. Married is staying. It won't be expected to get big ratings on FXX. Then again that didn't save any of the other low rated stuff on FXX.  At least it's getting another season. (RIP Hello Ladies)
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Oct 1, 2014 01:33
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For all the poo poo that NCIS gets on this forum, I think it deserves some credit for building a sprawling, interconnected universe. They have been doing for years what Marvel and DC are just getting around to now.
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Oct 1, 2014 02:36
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A boring interconnected universe
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Oct 1, 2014 02:41
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That post was a joke, right?
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Oct 1, 2014 02:44
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JohnSherman posted:For all the poo poo that NCIS gets on this forum, I think it deserves some credit for building a sprawling, interconnected universe. They have been doing for years what Marvel and DC are just getting around to now. Personally I appreciate their pioneering the art of tandem keyboarding.
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Oct 1, 2014 02:49
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precision posted:I think what you're thinking of is Judd Apatow taking an interest in Dunham, which is allegedly the only reason HBO gave Girls a shot in the first place. That's not nepotism since they're not related. It's the kind of thing that happens all the time to young filmmakers. I enjoyed the first two enough, but I couldn't make it all the way through season three. The other characters were alright but Hannah just got worse and worse.
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Oct 1, 2014 03:15
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Wandle Cax posted:I enjoyed the first two enough, but I couldn't make it all the way through season three. The other characters were alright but Hannah just got worse and worse. I feel like the difference was that in seasons 1 and 2 it wasn't really all that clear that Hannah was supposed to be a deeply horrible person. Season 3 made it crystal clear. Though I would agree if you also said she's the weakest cast member (in every season).
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Oct 1, 2014 04:24
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JohnSherman posted:For all the poo poo that NCIS gets on this forum, I think it deserves some credit for building a sprawling, interconnected universe. They have been doing for years what Marvel and DC are just getting around to now. Law and Order has been doing it longer.
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Oct 1, 2014 04:44
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Ravane posted:I lost my father four years ago at the age of 18, which is why I empathized with Jack from the beginning, given his situation. But that resolution had me bawling like a kid. My dad is still alive
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Oct 1, 2014 05:06
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In the Monday 9pm time slot, the incredibly disappointing Scorpion was only down 3%, a smaller drop than even TBBT, to a 3.2 while Sleepy Hollow fell 15% to a 1.7. I'm surprised Scoprion held so strong. Meanwhile, Monday Night Football owned everything with a 5.3. The closest was TBBT at 4.8 which basically takes place before MNF, and the next closest was The Voice at 4.0.
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Oct 1, 2014 08:24
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Josh Lyman posted:In the Monday 9pm time slot, the incredibly disappointing Scorpion was only down 3%, a smaller drop than even TBBT, to a 3.2 while Sleepy Hollow fell 15% to a 1.7. I'm surprised Scoprion held so strong. Yeah it's doing really well which is a little surprising considering how awful it is. Maybe after the pretty cool ridiculous action in the pilot, people, like me, watched the second episode to see if there would be anything close to that level of excitement in the continuing series. Of course the answer is a resounding no. More likely is it had Big Bang as a lead in so it's capturing that demographic of people who enjoy cringe worthy stereotypical nerd characters on TV. Only this time in a bad NCIS style package.
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Oct 1, 2014 09:21
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JohnSherman posted:For all the poo poo that NCIS gets on this forum, I think it deserves some credit for building a sprawling, interconnected universe. They have been doing for years what Marvel and DC are just getting around to now. Yeah that's a pretty extensive CBS procedural universe they have going there. hope and vaseline posted:Yeah Rory tends to get a little insufferable after season 3 when her tantrums basically consist of not being appreciative of all the great opportunities she has in life. Eh, still a great show with a fun recurring cast and Emily would consistently deliver the best burns. At least Rory being spoiled eventually comes full circle when she has an affair because she thinks she deserves everything and everyone. Rapey Joe Stalin posted:It's mostly a drip drip drip of Just World "only the guilty need a defence" stuff but sometimes they just straight up coerce confessions. VDay posted:I think Castle's a little worse about it than the other shows mentioned because Beckett's entire approach to police work (in the first couple of seasons that I watched at least) was to gather some evidence, see who the most likely suspect is, and then proceed to yell at him/her and accuse them of the crime until they would either give her some info or crack and confess. At least a show like Elementary will often discount a suspect because Sherlock or Watson realize that they couldn't have done it. Castle just has the cops accuse everyone until eventually they get it right. But yeah, it would be nice if it weren't an unquestioned good thing.
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Oct 1, 2014 09:45
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Wandle Cax posted:Yeah it's doing really well which is a little surprising considering how awful it is. Maybe after the pretty cool ridiculous action in the pilot, people, like me, watched the second episode to see if there would be anything close to that level of excitement in the continuing series. Of course the answer is a resounding no. More likely is it had Big Bang as a lead in so it's capturing that demographic of people who enjoy cringe worthy stereotypical nerd characters on TV. Only this time in a bad NCIS style package. Scorpion is what would happen if the guys from BBT decided to fight crime and the general public loves bbt
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Oct 1, 2014 09:59
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Pillowpants posted:Scorpion is what would happen if the guys from BBT decided to fight crime and the general public loves bbt I think BBT is pretty funny (low standards) and found Scorpion to be loving awful.
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Oct 1, 2014 10:33
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Cardboard Box A posted:At least Rory being spoiled eventually comes full circle when she has an affair because she thinks she deserves everything and everyone. I've never managed to get past season 5 of Gilmore Girls because I completely lose interest in Rory after she breaks up Dean's marriage. There's also a lot less Richard and Emily in the latter seasons, which is a shame cause they're the best characters on the show.
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Oct 1, 2014 11:08
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Richard and Emily are the best, and they still turn up in almost every episode. The show was never about Rory to me, it's all Lorelei. Rory's just there as a plot device to keep the words per minute ratio up in conversation and provide a reason for the grandparents to be involved so much.
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Oct 1, 2014 11:23
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EvilTobaccoExec posted:My dad is still alive I spoilered it because it revealed an important plot point in the finale, not because I'm conceited about my own life.
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Oct 1, 2014 12:35
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Jack's dad was dead in the pilot.
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Oct 1, 2014 12:36
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Irish Joe posted:Jack's dad was dead in the pilot. Yeah, but his return in the finale was what I was spoilering it for. Guess it doesn't matter.
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Oct 1, 2014 12:38
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Ravane posted:Yeah, but his return in the finale was what I was spoilering it for. Guess it doesn't matter. Well you didn't say he returned in the finale until just now! (note I don't actually care just pointing that out)E: Since we are on LOST. I dropped out the season after the one where the main characters were in cages and not doing anything. Is it worth returning to finish even if I know Jack's dead dad returns (and all the actual real spoilers like the purgatory thing)? I got really bored that season and it might have been due to the writer's strike that went on at the time stretching the season break out, but I just never came back to the show. I felt like it was moving at a snail's pace. Does the show go pass crawling speed again like it was in season 1? An Ounce of Gold fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Oct 1, 2014 |
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Oct 1, 2014 14:32
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Jack's dad comes back over and over throughout the whole show. It's not a big spoiler. Here's a spoiler - dead people come back all the time on this show. There's time travel and smoke monsters so anything can happen.
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Oct 1, 2014 14:38
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thrawn527 posted:That makes sense, and it would be nice to have a show act like that here. I guess, having only ever watched American crime shows, that's the only thing I've known. So, while I'm extremely vocal when things like that happen in real life, and tell everyone I know to never talk to the police, when it happens on TV I just kind of accept it as a kind of annoying but inevitable part of the format. Law and Order always had a lawyer in the room, who mysteriously would shut the hell up as the suspect gives up everything. Jack McCoy! EDIT: Lost is not worth it. Punch out now. Shageletic fucked around with this message at 14:50 on Oct 1, 2014 |
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Oct 1, 2014 14:46
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SymfonyMan posted:Well you didn't say he returned in the finale until just now! The back third of seasons 3 and most of 4 and 5 has a cracking pace, because they'd worked out the rough direction of where they wanted to go but weren't locked into actually wrapping it up.
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Oct 1, 2014 14:53
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SymfonyMan posted:
That season didn't start well, but the latter part of it was the peak of my personal enjoyment of the series.
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Oct 1, 2014 15:37
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Shageletic posted:EDIT: Lost is not worth it. Punch out now. This is good advice.
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Oct 1, 2014 15:45
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Gonz posted:The season 2 finale of Ray Donovan was bonkers as poo poo. A whole hell of a lot of loose ends tied up in 55 minutes. Season 3 should be interesting. We really missed out not having a Season 2 thread. The second season was a strong improvement over the first and the performances are killer.
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Oct 1, 2014 16:46
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