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The only real thing I can say for the Ivy bossfight is that at least it isn't yet another Titan Thug fight?
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Sep 28, 2014 08:36
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I guess the main problem with the Ivy boss fight is that it may not be a Titan thug fight, but it feels like one with one extra step added. Wait for thug to charge, hit with a batarang. Wait for Ivy to open bulb, hit with a batarang and explosive gel. Sure, it's a giant plant, but characteristically it's not a very unique fight. It could be anyone. Killer Croc was in a sewer, Scarecrow is a mind fight, and Bane is basically the epitome of Titan thug. And then there's Ivy who's just...not very interesting. There's a fight in a later game that's similar, but Ivy is probably the weakest fight in the game.
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Sep 28, 2014 08:43
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Your spoilery AO observation is correct.
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Sep 28, 2014 08:55
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I forgot my favorite thing about the entire Ivy sequence: the delivery on "I told you to go back to your cell." It sounds as though he genuinely thought she was going to do as he asked and is sincerely upset that she didn't.
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Sep 28, 2014 08:58
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It has been a while since I played Asylum, but I seem to recall that you could sneak up to plants and they wouldn't launch spores.
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Sep 28, 2014 09:29
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Sindai posted:I forgot my favorite thing about the entire Ivy sequence: the delivery on "I told you to go back to your cell." It sounds as though he genuinely thought she was going to do as he asked and is sincerely upset that she didn't. I honestly would've been tickled if Poison Ivy had gone back to her cell, but was still going ahead and doing the takeover thing from there.
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Sep 28, 2014 09:36
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I kinda think Joker ran into Ivy when she was just about to leave the botanical gardens, maybe to go back to her cell because welp Batman won this round, and then he hopped her up on Titan.
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Sep 28, 2014 10:18
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Yeah, I'd always put Ivy's craziness in this incarnation down to her being shot full of drugs. Her better depictions usually emphasise that she's perfectly happy if simply left alone with her plants; one imagines she'd be quite content to sit the night out in the botanical gardens otherwise. Sure, you might need gas masks to go and pick her up in the morning... Fanwank, perhaps, but it didn't bother me when I played the game. I'm surprised it's taken us this long to see the remote control batarang. It's always one of the first upgrades I go for, and it's perfect for taking out troublesome snipers. It's also an excellent distraction in the Predator segments before the heartbeat sensor collars show up.
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Sep 28, 2014 12:55
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Somehow I never thought of using it for snipers, honestly. I'm used to the City version which is significantly more controllable.
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Sep 28, 2014 13:23
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Tell you what really annoyed me re. Ivy in this incarnation; she's like Samus from Other M - always going on about 'babies', etc. She's supposed to be misanthropic and tired of all people not... well, this.
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Sep 28, 2014 13:30
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I love how that last normal thug in the room with the elevators charges Batman while screaming like a maniac...and Batman just drops him with an uppercut and goes back to finishing off the Titan thug. That's so Batman.
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Sep 28, 2014 16:09
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The entire Arkham series handles women really poorly and Ivy is the worst example of it in this game. All of her "pained" screams sound more like she's getting off and her outfit is just - ugh. She's not wearing pants and it's not like she left any behind in her cell so did the guards just not give her pants? And if Ivy just refuses to wear them, why is she wearing the top? The one piece made of leaves that she often wears in the comics is less titillating than this is, and it's more in character. And the most irritating thing of all - she's still wearing this same outfit in Arkham City, when she could be wearing anything she loving wants to. The whole thing just screams of trying to impress teenage boys, and they couldn't even do it in a way that makes sense (and even if they had done it right, it would be unnecessary because teenage boys will already be creaming their pants over getting to play as Batman).
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Sep 28, 2014 16:26
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CuwiKhons posted:The entire Arkham series handles women really poorly and Ivy is the worst example of it in this game. All of her "pained" screams sound more like she's getting off and her outfit is just - ugh. She's not wearing pants and it's not like she left any behind in her cell so did the guards just not give her pants? And if Ivy just refuses to wear them, why is she wearing the top? The one piece made of leaves that she often wears in the comics is less titillating than this is, and it's more in character. And the most irritating thing of all - she's still wearing this same outfit in Arkham City, when she could be wearing anything she loving wants to. Harley's not handled any better, though that might be more in line with the character and her constant need to appeal to Mr. J.
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Sep 29, 2014 03:32
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I think the Arkham series in general suffers from the problem of maybe a handful of villains getting focused on by the writers, while the rest are just "Grr, rawr, Batman." I mean, let's look at this game. Joker: Has been shown to be a master planner, expert chemist, skilled at evading both Batman and island security, etc. Harley: Fairly good at evading Batman, makes a number of decent traps, sexualized quite a bit but still manages to be competent... though neither the game nor Batman acknowledge that fact. Zsasz: Were it not for the fact that he's named, I'd have mistaken him for a random henchman. Scarecrow: Legitimately unsettling to both Batman and the player, manages to evade detection and seem almost ethereal the entire game, still poses a threat no matter how many times you break his illusions. Bane:  Killer Croc: Kinda unsettling, but his whole deal boils down to "Boy, I sure love eating people." Once the initial fear wears off, he's quite bland. Ivy: Legs legs legs, boy I sure love plants, MOAN Riddler: Not actually present. His inferiority complex is demonstrated well, though.
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Sep 29, 2014 03:45
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Hobgoblin2099 posted:I think the Arkham series in general suffers from the problem of maybe a handful of villains getting focused on by the writers, while the rest are just "Grr, rawr, Batman."
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Sep 29, 2014 03:55
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I'm genuinely disappointed the anti-titan antidote that you just spent forever getting, with the long Killer Croc section and everything, is just... dropped in a cutscene and never actually used. Would have been better if it got dropped, we had the (admittedly kind of lackluster) Ivy fight, and then Batman snags it off the floor and finishes her off with a quick shot of magic plot cure. Because honestly, now I feel like all that time dicking around in the sewers was pointless. Also like one of Batman's more interesting characteristics just isn't in this game - his refusal to kill people. Okay, I guess Ivy's not dead because she's in the next game but looking at that cutscene, I'm not sure I really believe that wasn't potentially fatal, and Batman doesn't seem to care. Same thing happened to Bane and Scarecrow. I guess he did try to save Scarecrow from Croc, but then after the guy fell in the water he just shrugged it off as a loss. I know it's been a long day, Batman, but come on! I know from experience this game is generally a joy to play but I feel like the writing is pretty weak in places.
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Sep 30, 2014 00:54
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Batman did pick up the cure, it just wasn't shown. Its still has a role to play.
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Sep 30, 2014 01:03
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grandalt posted:Batman did pick up the cure, it just wasn't shown. Its still has a role to play. My mistake then, though I wish we'd been shown that. This is about where I stopped playing - not because I didn't like the game, my brother took the Xbox games with him to uni and I never bought my own copy - so I don't know how it goes from here on out, and I'm not saying the dropped cure has been bugging me for years but the dropped cure has been bugging me for years.
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Sep 30, 2014 03:29
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Yeah, there are a number of little details that the game glosses over. Batman never picking up Scarecrow's bag of fear gas that he was threatening to drop into the water, for instance.
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Sep 30, 2014 03:50
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GirlCalledBob posted:I'm genuinely disappointed the anti-titan antidote that you just spent forever getting, with the long Killer Croc section and everything, is just... dropped in a cutscene and never Also like one of Batman's more interesting characteristics just isn't in this game - his refusal to kill people. I know I always feel really, really bad when I accidentally do something that should essentially have killed someone, like Batclaw a goon over a ledge that leads to a lethal drop. Or an infinite abyss. You got me replaying this game, and just tonight I got to about where you are without having seen anything past Killer Croc, and then watched the videos since. And now am kicking myself over a number of stupid things I missed. I missed the Sewer map, I even went looking to see if that ledge on the way out of the Batcave after Poison Ivy smashes the place had a Riddler Trophy, but didn't see the place to glide to. 
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Sep 30, 2014 04:03
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JT Jag posted:I think Arkham City does a slightly better job of giving depth and characterization to a larger variety of villains, but that often results in you not seeing certain villains as much as you'd like to. I think if you want this, it can't be an action game. The core gameplay here is fighting, so everything else is going to have less priority than that. But if it were modelled more on something like LA Noire (or what LA Noire was trying to be) then you could have villains who are more than a combat gimmick.
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Sep 30, 2014 16:12
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CuwiKhons posted:The entire Arkham series handles women really poorly and Ivy is the worst example of it in this game. All of her "pained" screams sound more like she's getting off and her outfit is just - ugh. She's not wearing pants and it's not like she left any behind in her cell so did the guards just not give her pants? And if Ivy just refuses to wear them, why is she wearing the top? The one piece made of leaves that she often wears in the comics is less titillating than this is, and it's more in character. And the most irritating thing of all - she's still wearing this same outfit in Arkham City, when she could be wearing anything she loving wants to. I think there was a b:tas episode where she tried to go straight and get married, and seemed to be genuinely happy. But when she found out that she was infertile due to being a plant monster she knocked out her husband and started growing plant clones of him to serve as her new family. VVV e: not what I meant. Kurieg fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Sep 30, 2014 |
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Sep 30, 2014 16:51
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Kurieg posted:I think there was a b:tas episode where she tried to go straight and get married. Hurr hurr.
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Sep 30, 2014 17:28
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Tiggum posted:I think if you want this, it can't be an action game. The core gameplay here is fighting, so everything else is going to have less priority than that. But if it were modelled more on something like LA Noire (or what LA Noire was trying to be) then you could have villains who are more than a combat gimmick.
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Sep 30, 2014 18:26
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I'd play it. I really liked the crime scene reconstruction segments in Origins.
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Sep 30, 2014 18:40
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On the other hand, the investigation scenes in City are kind of hilarious. "Hey, brick dust. I happen to know for a fact that this was used only 1974 so if I narrow down all of the buildings in Gotham to ones built that year, I should be good." It was some seriously Superfriends poo poo and I loved it. Makes me think I could be the world's greatest detective too if I had a computer with terrabytes of RAM that gets information through people's dreams. Let me download all of the municipal passwords real quick *takes four seconds* e: as I think on it, it's really only the female villains that are handled poorly, the other female characters are pretty alright. Kind of unimportant aside from Oracle but still not bad. I guess they wanted "outcast from society and its norms" and sort of took the easy way out for the female villains. ManlyGrunting fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Sep 30, 2014 |
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Sep 30, 2014 18:43
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If a Batman game ever went more towards a detective mystery than an action game, I'd hope for an homage to this scene: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SO0WW2QXIYc BATMAN: (searching for clues) gently caress, gently caress, gently caress, mother gently caress. ROBIN: Holy gently caress, Batman!
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Oct 1, 2014 05:56
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Time for the roundup y'all! This will cover the rest of the interview tapes in the game. Assuming I didn't forget any. The Riddler Roundup/Polsy - Interview Tapes: Chronicle of Arkham 16-24, Harley Quinn 4/5, Scarecrow 3/4/5, Riddler 3/4/5Character bios: Alfred Pennyworth, Prometheus, Hugo Strange, Maxie Zeus  Predator: Invisible Predator Extreme/Polsy Predator: Survival Tactics Extreme/PolsyOf particular note is the guest list I mentioned before which Batman takes off of Harley.  The people listed, in order: Selina Kyle is Catwoman, Harvey Dent is Two-Face, Jervis Tetch is the Mad Hatter, Basil Karlo is Clayface, Waylon Jones is Killer Croc, Oswald Cobblepot is the Penguin, Arnold Wesker is the Ventriloquist, and Luke Oliver is that one inmate who was based on the contest winner. As far as I can tell the reason some names have smiley faces/are crossed out is because those villains aren't in the Asylum at the time of the party. Just a neat touch!
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Oct 1, 2014 10:33
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This was an interesting video as a studying mental health worker.
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Oct 1, 2014 12:19
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Enjoy your laughs about canine companions, but you villains won't joke when you stand before the pawsome might of Ace the Bat-Hound! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ace_the_Bat-Hound Or is it Sputnik fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Oct 1, 2014 |
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Oct 1, 2014 12:49
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Can't get the idea of an actual bat-hound out of my mind now. I guess it'd have a tiny shotgun to get the pesky fuckers out of the air?
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Oct 1, 2014 13:07
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Are you joking, the best Batman companion was not Bat-dog, but Batman Jones. Also, I frankly find it really annoying having 'evil' strong female characters automatically hate men as if that is a... inherent part of being evil; it's a simplistic and gross writing technique.
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Oct 1, 2014 13:30
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Or is it Sputnik posted:Enjoy your laughs about canine companions, but you swarthy villains won't joke when you stand before the pawsome might of Ace the Bat-Hound! I don't think swarthy means what you think it means. You should probably sort that out before you get yourself into trouble.
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Oct 1, 2014 14:55
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dscruffy1 posted:Of particular note is the guest list I mentioned before which Batman takes off of Harley. Joker should've known Catwoman and Penguin wouldn't be there, they're not Arkham inmates. They always go to Blackgate, because they're just bad people, not crazy.
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Oct 1, 2014 15:20
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Long video so a couple of notes while I listen: Bruce Timm and Paul Dini attempted to recreate their success with Harley by introducing villainess Livewire in the Superman animated series. She wasn't particularly popular, but she did eventually get added to the comics as well. People have talked for ages about how Arkham is incredibly unhelpful to its inmates and a few different explanations have been put forth. Arkham Asylum: Living Hell offers one of my favorites: the island has a literal gate to hell on it and the ambient evil energy coming off of it corrupts everything on the island and prevents anybody from ever getting better. A Serious House on Serious Earth, from which this game takes many, MANY cues, has Amadeus Arkham actually blaming Batman for it long before Batman even existed - he claimed that he kept seeing a huge bat demon that was haunting his family and perpetuating evil on the island. The circular carvings he left in his cell (and the ones that Sharpe left) were supposed to be a spell to ward off the demon. Since Batman isn't literally a demon, they obviously don't work. Scarecrow's had a couple of backgrounds. In the Nolan movies, he was a psychologist at Arkham. In the comics universe and the animated series, he was a college professor who was fired for being too extreme of a teacher (he fired a gun in class to scare his students). I HIGHLY recommend Scarecrow: Year One, a short two issue comic which really delves into his backstory. In short, he grew up on a dilapidated farm in Georgia, raised by his ultra religious great grandmother who badly abused him for anything and everything. He was bullied by kids at school but it was his grandmother who really damaged him. One of her favorite punishments for him was to force him to sleep in the abandoned chapel on their property - which was full of crows. And his grandmother had actually trained the crows to attack him by leaving dummies dressed in his clothes in the chapel, covered in rat guts and blood so that the crows associated him with food. Crane later killed his father for being a deadbeat that ditched his family and he tried to kill his mother for abandoning him to his grandmother but Batman stops him. At least in that comic - he does later succeed in killing her. Curiously, he doesn't kill his (much) younger sister and though initially irritated that his mother bothered to take care of her but not him, he never ends up hurting her or even displaying any animosity towards her. This may just because the writers forgot about her though. Batman's no kill rule has been the source of so many loving arguments but I think Batman explains it the best: If he started killing criminals, where would he stop? If it's okay to kill Joker, is it okay to kill Harley, an manipulated abuse victim? If it's okay to kill Harley, is it okay to kill Riddler, who has tried to reform and better himself? If it's okay to kill Riddler, is it okay to kill Hatter, a schizophrenic who often genuinely can't tell reality from his hallucinations? There's got to be a line somewhere and it's much easier to draw the line at not killing anybody.
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Oct 1, 2014 15:42
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Did someone say Maxie Zeus? Samovar posted:Are you joking, the best Batman companion was not Bat-dog, but Batman Jones. It's like Batman bin Suparman became a comicbook character. 
Blueberry Pancakes fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Oct 1, 2014 |
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Oct 1, 2014 15:45
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Your comments about tuning forks made me remember my brother telling me a story about his high school physics class. The teacher gave them all tuning forks to study sound waves. And I'm a little fuzzy but either the teacher told them not to put the fork in their mouths because a former student did this, or a student in my brother's class did this. But a student put the fork in his mouth to feel the vibrations throughout his body but put the wrong end in and shattered all his teeth. What I'm trying to say is putting a tuning fork against a broken bone sounds like a loving awful idea.
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Oct 1, 2014 16:23
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Okay, that was pretty darn good, thanks, Jenner, for bein' in that video and bein' cool, and thanks to Scruffy for doin' that.  And Quincy Sharp being the Spirit of Arkham. It was fairly obvious, but drat if it didn't pull me in, both in this game (where you find out), and the next (where his plans have come to fruition, and Fun happens). This, in essence, is one of the things I like about the Arkham series: It's got a multi-layered plot, and while their characterisation isn't always great (Poison Ivy and Bane being the worst examples), it's got enough good writing that I tend to only slightly go "Ugggghh..." at the rest. And a party next too, hosted by Joker. Oh, what fun we shall have!
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Oct 1, 2014 16:27
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SloppyDoughnuts posted:Your comments about tuning forks made me remember my brother telling me a story about his high school physics class. The teacher gave them all tuning forks to study sound waves. And I'm a little fuzzy but either the teacher told them not to put the fork in their mouths because a former student did this, or a student in my brother's class did this. But a student put the fork in his mouth to feel the vibrations throughout his body but put the wrong end in and shattered all his teeth. You can tell if a bone is broken by putting a tuning fork against it. If the patient screams out in agony, the bone is definitely broken!!
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Oct 1, 2014 16:44
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Minor nitpick of one totally not important thing Jenner said; Prometheus wasn't a god. Prometheus was a Titan. Titans and Gods were different beings, and had a power struggle over Olympus, which Zeus eventually won. Prometheus sided with Zeus. 
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