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Knifegrab posted:So is the whole point of SLI VR support to be that one card renders one eye so the two viewpoints are each handled symmetrically by the gpu's? Thats the idea. The other features of VR do not work with SLI, asynchronous time warp being the main one.
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Oct 9, 2014 18:52
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r0ck0 posted:Doesn't fix the fact that the heat pipes don't line up correctly on the GPU. Yeah, I don't really care about the backplate, the cooling performance being affected because they reused an older design is what bugs me. They have a good reputation but I'm not going to buy one of their cards when they obviously tried to cut corners. I have yet to see them really own that either, its been PR stuff about how it meets Greenlight specs and etc.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:23
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beejay posted:Is this sarcasm? They have offered backplates several times in the past and this doesn't fix anything. Have you not read any of the posts by people who OWN the evga 970 and have no issues with either the performance or noise? Or are you just being a dick to be a dick.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:26
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veedubfreak posted:Have you not read any of the posts by people who OWN the evga 970 and have no issues with either the performance or noise? Or are you just being a dick to be a dick. I personally care about the heat sink having a gap over one of the heat pipes more than I care about there being a backplate on a card. I love me some EVGA, in the past anyway, but gotta evaluate moving forward, which leaves us with a design that simply fails to achieve the performance and features of competitors' models, including limited DP outputs compared to Gigabyte, and before the BIOS patch no fan auto-off unlike several makers out there. What I see this generation from them is designs cut down to maximize profit in a bean-counter kind of fashion, similar to Gigabyte back in prior generations. Company practices change, and it's definitely possible that they accepted the Greenlight standard as plenty-good-enough and assumed others would do so as well; as you note, it isn't that the ACX cooler is balls (even with the lovely contact), it's just not competitive right now for reasons that I am not willing to overlook. Also not impressed with them cutting down power delivery. Even if it performs better than the rote minimums allowed by Greenlight, that has an impact on stability, especially when overclocking, and all nVidia and ATI cards ~sort of overclock on their own now. Greenlight should ensure it isn't crap, that's what Greenlight is for, but when paying a premium for a brand name - as you do with EVGA - you want to get features that justify the price when compared to other brands. Seems pretty straightforward to me, and again I have bought from EVGA for a very long time now, relatively speaking.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:39
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Agreed posted:I personally care about the heat sink having a gap over one of the heat pipes more than I care about there being a backplate on a card. I love me some EVGA, in the past anyway, but gotta evaluate moving forward, which leaves us with a design that simply fails to achieve the performance and features of competitors' models, including limited DP outputs compared to Gigabyte, and before the BIOS patch no fan auto-off unlike several makers out there. All of these issues are only with the 970 though. And only on the ACX 1.0 cooler though. Considering I watercool everything the heatpipes not all making contact just makes me chuckle but wouldn't be a deal killer for me. What is annoying me is that the Classified version is replacing the triple dp with 2 dvi + 1 dp. That's just assinine.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:44
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EVGA owner checking in, 970 SSC ACX 2.0 model. No problems with temperatures or noise. Have it clocked at 1472 with no issues, could go higher but haven't felt the need to push it till it crashes yet. I'm running it full load as I type and it's not going past 55c. I don't think the ACX 2.0 even has the heatpipe issue, I've attached a pic of what I believe the cooler looks like on the underside according to some other forums. It's a bit funny how much of a hit a companies reputation can take over second hand knowledge.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:45
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Second-hand info becomes news when the party responsible for giving first-hand info fails to do so, or at least that's my experience. They haven't been communicating super well.
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Oct 9, 2014 19:49
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Nobody likes more noise for less heat dissipation, but its very relative. We're comparing 970's with 970's and splitting a few hairs (or quite a few hairs) but its nothing like comparing any 970 to say, a reference cooler 290. Or really, a lot of cards. Personally I wouldn't get one but that's because I will make a purchase decision based on tiny differences. It's just not going to matter for a lot of people. EVGA felt the heat, I doubt its going to happen again
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Oct 9, 2014 19:51
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The thing is EVGA is considered premium in a lot of people's minds, and so for example when they slip up it can be a bigger hit than it seems. If someone was used to EVGA, was ready for an upgrade, and then they start hearing bad things about EVGA's offering, they hold off, maybe they aren't sure about the other brands out there and then they end up not buying anything. I myself had a bad experience with EVGA last year, switched to AMD, have been tossing around the idea of a 970 considering how good of a chip it is, but not confident in EVGA right now and the MSI fan thing... just makes me want to not buy anything and see what happens next.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:09
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beejay posted:The thing is EVGA is considered premium in a lot of people's minds, and so for example when they slip up it can be a bigger hit than it seems. If someone was used to EVGA, was ready for an upgrade, and then they start hearing bad things about EVGA's offering, they hold off, maybe they aren't sure about the other brands out there and then they end up not buying anything. I myself had a bad experience with EVGA last year, switched to AMD, have been tossing around the idea of a 970 considering how good of a chip it is, but not confident in EVGA right now and the MSI fan thing... just makes me want to not buy anything and see what happens next. ASUS has a great cooler and a good VRM setup, why not just go with that?
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Oct 9, 2014 20:10
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Cooler misalignment is not new, apparently. The Asus DC2 290 and 290X had the same problem, and ACX on the 760 had the exact problem ACX on the 970 has. No wonder those were poor compared to the competition.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:14
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Hace posted:ASUS has a great cooler and a good VRM setup, why not just go with that? I keep hearing horror stories about their warranty support, but they would be my next choice, and just hope I don't need to RMA.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:17
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Starting to sound like a broken record. Why don't more people recommend the gigabyte card? With 3 display ports, 2 dvi and 1 HDMI, proprietary monitor connection with support for four 4k monitors, comes equipped with a back plate, heatsink also makes contact with the VRM for additional cooling. It seems like the best card out. http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/gigabyte_geforce_gtx_970_g1_gaming_review,9.html This guy shows the gigabyte card is the only one that doesn't throttle when overclocked. http://www.overclock.net/t/1516121/gtx-970-comparison-strix-vs-msi-gaming-vs-gigabyte-g1
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Oct 9, 2014 20:21
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For Dolphin especially, I'd like to push the MSI 970 a bit further, as it seems to have some trouble on near-maximum settings. Is there like a guide to GPU overclocking using afterburner for someone who has never even owned a desktop card until now?
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Oct 9, 2014 20:22
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beejay posted:I keep hearing horror stories about their warranty support, but they would be my next choice, and just hope I don't need to RMA. Same here but I've had to RMA motherboards before and it went without issue. Of course I'm in Canada so they often contract with a company who handles most of it on their behalf, not sure whats up in the US.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:24
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I always thought people thought MSI was the gold standard 
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Oct 9, 2014 20:25
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MSI has had the best cooling and noise performance the past couple of times but right now there's some controversy about possibly faulty fans and whether the problem is caused by a too-sticky sticker on a fan or whether it's a hardware or software issue, or what.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:29
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beejay posted:MSI has had the best cooling and noise performance the past couple of times but right now there's some controversy about possibly faulty fans and whether the problem is caused by a too-sticky sticker on a fan or whether it's a hardware or software issue, or what. Might be the "quietest" but does not have the best cooling. The gigabyte card is cooler and doesn't throttle when overclocked. edit: I put quietest in quotes because they all are sufficiently quiet. r0ck0 fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Oct 9, 2014 |
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Oct 9, 2014 20:31
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I also heard that the 970 MSI has some lovely output options.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:31
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r0ck0 posted:Starting to sound like a broken record. Gigabyte has, in the past, been a very cheap producer of video cards and motherboards. I agree it's odd, but a history of total lemons every so often have made buyers wary. It also doesn't help that they seem to be pricing at a premium over ASUS and MSI, which is difficult to swallow considering their history and closer adherence to the reference PCB (a cost saver). I own a Gigabyte 670, and there is nothing wrong with it, and if you feel the 970 is the right card for you and you want the features Gigabyte offers, buy it. They have generally decent warranty support and the card itself is shaping up well, but many people will be guided by history, whether it is still accurate or not, and look to a brand that currently has abetter reputation.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:35
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EoRaptor posted:They have generally decent warranty support and the card itself is shaping up well, but many people will be guided by history, whether it is still accurate or not, and look to a brand that currently has abetter reputation. That worked well for the EVGA supporters, oh wait. Just saying you can't always judge a new thing by the performance of the old. I was planning on getting an evga since my 560 evga has been great, overclocked well, but not this time. Perhaps gigabyte has learned from their past cost saving mistakes.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:38
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I've never had any issues with my Gigabyte boards, but then again I always buy the top end boards meant for hardcore oc'ing. As for EVGA, the reason I basically only buy their cards is due to their support. I have had to RMA a motherboard due to a *ahem* improper leak testing method (forgot to unplug the 8pin on the board) and the RMA was super easy. Same with RMA'ing the XFX 6970 I had lose its mind. Wish EVGA made AMD cards 
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Oct 9, 2014 20:52
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r0ck0 posted:Why don't more people recommend the gigabyte card? With 3 display ports, 2 dvi and 1 HDMI, proprietary monitor connection with support for four 4k monitors, comes equipped with a back plate, heatsink also makes contact with the VRM for additional cooling. It seems like the best card out. Just for my anecdotal evidence, my Gigabyte 7950 has honestly been not-so-great of an experience. Card suffered from coil whine starting about a week into its life, and the fans have gotten progressively louder. I've had it for around 18 months now, and one of the display port outputs just died on it. I haven't started the RMA process yet, so I can't attest to how good/bad it is, but none of my Asus cards have given me issues like this before. I do like the Gigabyte's outputs (which is why I bought the 7950 I did), but I'm wary of their quality. That being said, Greenlight (in theory) should reduce/prevent those issues.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:54
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Siochain posted:Just for my anecdotal evidence, my Gigabyte 7950 has honestly been not-so-great of an experience. Card suffered from coil whine starting about a week into its life, and the fans have gotten progressively louder. I've had it for around 18 months now, and one of the display port outputs just died on it. I haven't started the RMA process yet, so I can't attest to how good/bad it is, but none of my Asus cards have given me issues like this before. I do like the Gigabyte's outputs (which is why I bought the 7950 I did), but I'm wary of their quality. That being said, Greenlight (in theory) should reduce/prevent those issues. Apples to oranges, my friend. Thats an AMD card, there is no comparison to nVidia.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:56
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EoRaptor posted:Gigabyte has, in the past, been a very cheap producer of video cards and motherboards. I agree it's odd, but a history of total lemons every so often have made buyers wary. I've never heard of Gigabyte nvidia cards having issues though. I heard they had some problems with the AMD r9 series - not sure if this was the 280 or 290 with the memories getting really overheated at times and the cooler staying at low rpm due do the heat sensor being exclusively on the GPU or something similar? Anyway i bought a Gigabyte 970 because it was the first thing that came in stock (i was up for either Gigabyte, MSI, Asus or Zotac and that's what came first). I've not been exactly abusing her so far, only played TW2, Borderlands 2, Crysis1 and some Mass Effect 2 so far and i've not had an issue with. Build looks solid as well, will post itt if anything arises. Btw has Gigabyte's reputation for being cheap with MB components really followed them in the GPU market or are people not exaggerating when they say GB had lovely GPU builds as well? Curious if this was/is a consistent issue.
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Oct 9, 2014 20:56
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everythingWasBees posted:For Dolphin especially, I'd like to push the MSI 970 a bit further, as it seems to have some trouble on near-maximum settings. Is there like a guide to GPU overclocking using afterburner for someone who has never even owned a desktop card until now? Nothing should be stressing dolphin, short of 4xIR + 4xSSAA w/ OpenGL. Do you have adaptive power disabled for Dolphin? If it's on, it'll constantly try to downclock your GPU and create stutter.
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Oct 9, 2014 21:00
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r0ck0 posted:That worked well for the EVGA supporters, oh wait. Just saying you can't always judge a new thing by the performance of the old. I was planning on getting an evga since my 560 evga has been great, overclocked well, but not this time. Perhaps gigabyte has learned from their past cost saving mistakes. I was only commenting on the current disinterest in Gigabyte, not providing any facts about which video card is best. nVidia's greenlight program has really helped card makers not be complete poo poo, and the brand as a whole has benefited, so you a very unlikely to get something that doesn't perform to specification. if you need the extra display ports and don't need the comfort of the goon hivemind, buy it. You will only change the history of a manufacturer by reporting your experiences with it, not by complaining that current experiences don't seem to merit current opinion.
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Oct 9, 2014 21:04
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EoRaptor posted:I was only commenting on the current disinterest in Gigabyte, not providing any facts about which video card is best. nVidia's greenlight program has really helped card makers not be complete poo poo, and the brand as a whole has benefited, so you a very unlikely to get something that doesn't perform to specification. if you need the extra display ports and don't need the comfort of the goon hivemind, buy it. You will only change the history of a manufacturer by reporting your experiences with it, not by complaining that current experiences don't seem to merit current opinion. Yes, I understood what you meant and was agreeing with you in my post.
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Oct 9, 2014 21:06
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Agreed posted:I am actually kind of curious how a review site might incorporate the paywalled features into their thing. Anyone think of a good example off the top of your head? I keep going back to the "if you mess with it, it isn't really a benchmark anymore" thing. As an addition to running the "official" comparable mode a review site may also want to run in a different configuration, possibly at a higher resolution, with AA set up differently, etc. to test some other part of the system's performance that they don't feel the stock test hits hard enough. As long as they use the same settings for each run it's just as useful as a benchmark, just not comparable to anyone else's results unless they too used the same settings. Avalerion posted:They are also releasing a new bios which supposedly fixes the sound/temp issues some people have been complaining about. Link: http://www.anandtech.com/show/8568/the-geforce-gtx-970-review-feat-evga/15. The updated BIOS is actually already out: http://forums.evga.com/EVGA-GTX-970-ACX-20-Firmware-Update-v11-m2228516.aspx Agreed posted:including limited DP outputs compared to Gigabyte Worth noting that so far no one except Gigabyte has offered a non-stupid output configuration so that's not really a knock on EVGA but rather a bonus to Gigabyte for putting in some extra effort (as well as a knock on nVidia for both introducing that lovely port layout on the 680s and allowing it to stay around through now). As for the whole heatpipe drama, the pictured coolers certainly will not deliver their maximum potential cooling capability. Since these coolers were designed for much hotter running cards, that shouldn't be a problem as far as stock or close to stock clocks are concerned. It is definitely true that if you want to get the most overclocking out of your 970 the affected EVGAs are not for you. The more I read in to it though the more I'm not sure why the general reaction seems to be "this is terrible" instead of "this isn't as good as it could be". Mine has a tracking number now, so early next week we'll see if I get to eat my words. I'm running an EVGA GTX550 Ti FPB right now which is idling at 59C with the fan turning 1230 RPM according to Arx Control. I don't think it's really audible over the rest of the system at desktop, but certainly makes itself known while gaming. I expect the 0 RPM firmware to make the idle quieter, we'll see how it gets during gaming.
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Oct 9, 2014 21:56
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wolrah posted:The more I read in to it though the more I'm not sure why the general reaction seems to be "this is terrible" instead of "this isn't as good as it could be". Among folks with a brain cell or two it tends to be. I've run into some idiots who remain pissed that nVidia didn't completely lap the massive GK210 chip cards with GM204. Internet tends to bring out extreme statements where a measured response would do, but that's been the case since it existed as such. Everything's terrible and The Worst. I'm probably guilty of that somewhat toward AMD, though at least I have a reasonably broader perspective there. This is just a concerning change from EVGA, or at least it seemed to be - FactoryFactory as usual brings up good points when he notes that this is hardly the first time something like this has happened. But in the land of people seeking and finding their version of optimal, an all-around inferior product that costs ~as much is not going to be an easy sell. That shouldn't be too surprising, regardless of whether someone's language acknowledges that it's a rather slight difference of degree and not a massive difference of kind between the various cards.
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Oct 9, 2014 22:17
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Why is GM204 > GM210? And for that matter why is GM200 > GM204? NOTHING MAKES SENSE ANYMORE. Also, 3xDP is supposed to be the reference outputs, yes? Hmm, Microcenter has 2 Asus 980s in stock....... veedubfreak fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Oct 9, 2014 |
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Oct 9, 2014 23:09
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veedubfreak posted:Why is GM204 > GM210? And for that matter why is GM200 > GM204? NOTHING MAKES SENSE ANYMORE. Yes, but nobody is following reference board design except PNY.
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Oct 9, 2014 23:11
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e: nvm
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Oct 9, 2014 23:14
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EVGA also has the coil whine issue iirc compare to something like the Asus or MSI 970 Gaming with better electrical components.
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Oct 9, 2014 23:41
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DaNzA posted:EVGA also has the coil whine issue iirc compare to something like the Asus or MSI 970 Gaming with better electrical components. People were reporting that that Zotac 970 has coil whine. Out of curiousity I did some research and found this: This is the Zotac 970 (the non-amp version) board:  Here is a reference 670 board:  Hmmmmmm. Anyway it seems the consensus is the whine can sort itself out if you run some nonstop benchmarks, or there might be a way to apply nail polish to the Yageo R22 chokes. I'll wait to see how mine actually behave when I get them.
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Oct 10, 2014 00:36
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Stupid question which I don't know if I should be asking in this particular thread, but here goes: I read somewhere that all electrical products cause coil whine, some may be louder than others but it is something that can be "controlled" to a certain extent, for instance limiting the fps which the card is producing. Is this true? Do all electrical products cause coil whine and can it be controlled? I have absolutely zero knowledge on the subject and I am hoping that someone might enlighten me. Been trying to google this poo poo but haven't found an answer that was satisfying enough. Maybe it's because I don't understand the technical mumbojumbo or I may be to stupid to get it, poo poo it might even be a combination of the two, but I still don't get it. Help. 
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Oct 10, 2014 01:15
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coil_noise It is produced by components that consist of physical coils of metal, like voltage transformers. You're not going to hear anything audible from anything else like say a resistor.
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Oct 10, 2014 01:28
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Thats a reference 970 not a 670, typo? What do you mean with the nail polish, why would that help? Are you saying the zotac board is cheap since they stuck with the reference design and didn't put in any 
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Oct 10, 2014 01:35
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Oct 10, 2014 01:44
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r0ck0 posted:Thats a reference 970 not a 670, typo? What do you mean with the nail polish, why would that help? Are you saying the zotac board is cheap since they stuck with the reference design and didn't put in any Not a typo, I'm saying the reference 670 and the Zotac 970 (which might also be reference I dunno) are the same board, even down to components besides the GPU itself and the size of the ram. And popping open the cover on the chokes and putting a drop of nail polish on them can with a lot of boards prevent the coil noise once the polish hardens, because it buffers the coil's physical vibration. I see you fast-talked Microcenter into giving you Pre-Sequel vouchers when you know drat well they don't come with those cards :P I would have done the same thing.
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Oct 10, 2014 02:02
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