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Aurain posted:FF7 is very progressive because while the redneck beats his wife, the black guy is Mr.T, no one likes the Scottish one, the Asian one is a thief, one of the white women comes across as a total bimbo and the other plays you like a fiddle, the protagonist is a cross-dresser with both physical and mental disabilities which is pretty cool. I thought Vincent was the coolest as a teenager, he kinda reminded me of Magus from Chrono Trigger, the dark optional side character. I thought Final Fantasy VIII was cool at the time too though, so... yeah. Cloud is already emo enough though, you don't need Vincent for that.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:32
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Endorph posted:One thing of a black dude being kind of a stereotype doesn't immediately turn a normal person into a racist no but a bunch of instances across every kind of media does kind of influence how people think. It doesn't make people racist but it does make them tend to view people as stereotypes, or in the case of people who are black, makes them think of themselves in limited ways, especially if they're exposed to a bunch of stereotypical portrayals while they're still a kid. Yes. This problem stems from an individual's lack of exposure and the natural human tendency to fill in the gaps in their knowledge with their "best guess" when visualizing reality. The answer to this problem is not censorship. The answer is to support teaching people to keep an open mind about things that they do not have much experience with. This concept is why my kids, despite their regular exposure to all sorts of content, have never once displayed any sort of racism/sexism/etc. It is all about changing how one thinks when exposed to content. Not changing the content itself. That is my point. You guys have excellent intentions but you are fighting against and trying to change the wrong thing.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:38
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Aurain posted:FF7 is very progressive because while the redneck beats his wife, the black guy is Mr.T, no one likes the Scottish one, the Asian one is a thief, one of the white women comes across as a total bimbo and the other plays you like a fiddle, the protagonist is a cross-dresser with both physical and mental disabilities which is pretty cool. Also the dog is the smartest.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:43
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Xavier434 posted:Yes. This problem stems from an individual's lack of exposure and the natural human tendency to fill in the gaps in their knowledge with their "best guess" when visualizing reality. The answer to this problem is not censorship. The answer is to support teaching people to keep an open mind about things that they do not have much experience with. This concept is why my kids, despite their regular exposure to all sorts of content, have never once displayed any sort of racism/sexism/etc. It is all about changing how one thinks when exposed to content. Not changing the content itself. That is my point. You guys have excellent intentions but you are fighting against and trying to change the wrong thing. You, and your kids, likely have biases that you are not aware of. I do too. So does literally everyone in this thread. Most people are not openly aware of their biases and prejudices and often will intentionally rationalize them as something else. Part (but not the whole) of why these exist is because we internalize elements of media, especially for things we don't have personal interaction with. This is extremely true for other cultures, even within the same country as you live in. You're right that teaching people is part of changing things. However people don't just learn from one source. They learn from everything around them and they internalize a lot of things without realizing it. You're right that censorship isn't the answer but criticism isn't censorship. ApplesandOranges posted:Also the dog is the smartest. That drat dog didn't even think to use a Soft on his dad. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Oct 29, 2014 |
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Oct 29, 2014 22:46
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ImpAtom posted:That drat dog didn't even think to use a Soft on his dad.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:49
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ImpAtom posted:You, and your kids, likely have biases that you are not aware of. I do too. So does literally everyone in this thread. Most people are not openly aware of their biases and prejudices and often will intentionally rationalize them as something else. Part (but not the whole) of why these exist is because we internalize elements of media, especially for things we don't have personal interaction with. This is extremely true for other cultures, even within the same country as you live in. Probably. No one is perfect but the good part is that we are highly open to changing our viewpoints which is the most anyone can hope to achieve amongst this mess. We never hurt anyone or at least we try our best not to. The fact is that stereotypes have existed in content since content was first created. Stereotypes change but their existence in content will persist forever. That is why I see little to no value fighting to change content in effort to censor stereotypes. It never fixes the core problem. Changing how we think so that exposure to that content does not as easily drive our viewpoints and decisions is much more effective imo. That plus it allows content creators to create with a greater sense of freedom which is a nice bonus.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:56
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The GIG posted:Real talk how many JRPG have black dudes that aren't Wesley Snipes, Ving Rhames, or Sitcom Dad? Not even mad at it, just wondering since those seem to be the go to for characterization. Representative Helmer from Xenosaga is not like any black actor I'm aware of. Endorph posted:Anyway, the problem with FF7 isn't really that Barret talks like Mr. T, the problem is that there's two black guys in the game and one talks like Mr. T and the other says about five sentences total. And that nameless black guy part of a sidequest full of jokes about Transsexualism and Homosexuality. Namely the only gay character in the game has a porn mustache and tries to rape you. FFVII hates all minorities. Aurain posted:FF7 is very progressive because while the redneck beats his wife, the black guy is Mr.T, no one likes the Scottish one, the Asian one is a thief, one of the white women comes across as a total bimbo and the other plays you like a fiddle, the protagonist is a cross-dresser with both physical and mental disabilities which is pretty cool. Vincent is the Goth.
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Oct 29, 2014 22:59
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ImpAtom and people like ImpAtom are the reason the entire Don Cornero segment of FFVII could never happen in todays society. So thank you brave soldiers from saving us from ever getting an FFVII remake, for it is the worst in the series.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:03
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Yuffie is good.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:04
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98.5% of the people in Japan are of Japanese descent, with those of Korean or Chinese descent taking up 0.9%. All the rest combined are in the remaining 0.6%. What I'm saying here is that most Japanese people are going to see more black people in American movies and games than in real life so, as with most things in life, we can blame the yanks for everything.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:08
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Kanfy posted:What I'm saying here is that most Japanese people are going to see more black people in American movies and games than in real life so, as with most things in life, we can blame the yanks for everything. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceCRgf5tf0g
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Oct 29, 2014 23:10
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I can't wait for the brand new Curtain Call DLC tomorrow.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:21
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I've met white people that talks the way Barrett talks. Perhaps it is you who is racist for assuming he speaks that way because of his race. Either way, a stereotype doesn't have to be negative.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:23
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Stop playing with my heart Fromz.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:23
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SolidSnakesBandana posted:I've met white people that talks the way Barrett talks. Perhaps it is you who is racist for assuming he speaks that way because of his race. Either way, a stereotype doesn't have to be negative.  Beef Waifu posted:Stop playing with my heart Fromz. Believe in the DLC and it will come to you.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:25
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It's a fairly weak Devil's advocate I will admit. Didn't Cid speak kinda the same way though?
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Oct 29, 2014 23:27
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SolidSnakesBandana posted:It's a fairly weak Devil's advocate I will admit. Didn't Cid speak kinda the same way though? Nah, Cid's thing was having a super-foul mouth. Although I'd bet dollars to donuts that if FFVII had existed in a universe with voice acting he'd have had a heavy southern accent. (I don't think they ended up giving him that in the KH/AC dub but I seriously can't remember.)
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Oct 29, 2014 23:31
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ImpAtom posted:Nah, Cid's thing was having a super-foul mouth. Although I'd bet dollars to donuts that if FFVII had existed in a universe with voice acting he'd have had a heavy southern accent. (I don't think they ended up giving him that in the KH/AC dub but I seriously can't remember.) I don't think people would have liked FF7 nearly as much if it had voice acting.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:35
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PSX era dub voice acting? Definitely not.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:37
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forbidden lesbian posted:Mr T patch should make everyone in the entire game talk like Mr. T imo It's like you're reading my mind. Can't believe I'm agreeing with forbidden lesbian but here we are
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Oct 29, 2014 23:42
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Cid speaks with a gristled voice in KH/AC/DoC, it never really dipped into southern, but you can tell they wanted to dip into hick accent at certain points.
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Oct 29, 2014 23:45
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ImpAtom posted:Nah, Cid's thing was having a super-foul mouth. Although I'd bet dollars to donuts that if FFVII had existed in a universe with voice acting he'd have had a heavy southern accent. (I don't think they ended up giving him that in the KH/AC dub but I seriously can't remember.) He has some sort of weird hick accent...I can't place what it's supposed to be. Endorph posted:PSX era dub voice acting? Definitely not. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YulwXPicfPg
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Oct 29, 2014 23:48
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Endorph posted:PSX era dub voice acting? Definitely not. If anyone was curious about FF7 with voice acting...
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Oct 29, 2014 23:51
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Barrett's Mr. T accent is kinda racist and that's okay.forbidden lesbian posted:Mr T patch should make everyone in the entire game talk like Mr. T imo
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Oct 29, 2014 23:51
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Beef Waifu posted:Cid speaks with a gristled voice in KH/AC/DoC, it never really dipped into southern, but you can tell they wanted to dip into hick accent at certain points. He definitely has that "farmer built a spaceship in his backyard" vibe. And he beats his wife. edit: Kanfy posted:98.5% of the people in Japan are of Japanese descent, with those of Korean or Chinese descent taking up 0.9%. All the rest combined are in the remaining 0.6%. This. Also, funny story time. Back in college, my black friend got to meet Yoshitaka Amano at some sort of convention and Amano was offering to draw people. Amano said he couldn't draw my friend because he didn't know how to draw black people and drew him some chocobo thing he wanted instead. It was... odd. bloodychill fucked around with this message at 23:56 on Oct 29, 2014 |
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Oct 29, 2014 23:53
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Today's topic for discussion: Will tomorrow's curtain call tracks include Vamo alla flamenco, or start a fresh round of songs out with mediocrity?
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Oct 29, 2014 23:55
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They... they dubbed an entire boss battle? Why? 
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Oct 30, 2014 00:18
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I dunno, why did someone dub Super Mario RPG as Peter Griffin? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnIMigBwOOI Will any answers of gimmick fandubs ever be answered?
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Oct 30, 2014 00:38
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NikkolasKing posted:What do people think is the best FF translation? People listed some good ones, but nobody listed FFIX, so I'm gonna do that. IX had some of the most natural-sounding dialog in the entire series, managed to make everyone likable in their own ways, and was entirely understandable. I don't remember any awkward "Engrish". The GIG posted:Real talk how many JRPG have black dudes that aren't Wesley Snipes, Ving Rhames, or Sitcom Dad? Not even mad at it, just wondering since those seem to be the go to for characterization. Let's see... FFXII had Fran, kinda. It also had Reddas, but he was sort of a Wesley Snipes/Ving Rhames combo. FFT had one black noble sitting in on one of Goltana's meetings with like a single line of dialog. Does that count?
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Oct 30, 2014 00:49
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I only played FF13 for a couple of hours, but Sazh seemed well written. I mean, relative to the source material.
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Oct 30, 2014 00:51
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SolidSnakesBandana posted:I only played FF13 for a couple of hours, but Sazh seemed well written. I mean, relative to the source material.
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Oct 30, 2014 00:56
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So, what would Kiros be then? Not that he had a lot of personality going for him in the first place.
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Oct 30, 2014 01:01
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T.G. Xarbala posted:Barrett's Mr. T accent is kinda racist and that's okay. This is p. much what I was gonna post. I certainly can't speak for all black people, but Barrett's schtick, while offensive, didn't bug me because at least there was a black dude in a JRPG. That was a big deal to 13-year old me. Also despite the Mr. T thing, at least Barrett was a pretty good guy and a good father to round that out. Krad posted:So, what would Kiros be then? Not that he had a lot of personality going for him in the first place. Boring as gently caress is what Kiros is.
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Oct 30, 2014 01:05
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Schwartzcough posted:People listed some good ones, but nobody listed FFIX, so I'm gonna do that. IX had some of the most natural-sounding dialog in the entire series, managed to make everyone likable in their own ways, and was entirely understandable. I don't remember any awkward "Engrish". This. IX is the least worst game in the series.
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Oct 30, 2014 01:07
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My only complain with FF9 is the S/he thing they went with for Quina, just because it seems awkward in dialogue. I would've either gone with 'they' or just flipped a coin for a gender.
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Oct 30, 2014 01:10
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Endorph posted:My only complain with FF9 is the S/he thing they went with for Quina, just because it seems awkward in dialogue. There are more than two genders. 
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Oct 30, 2014 01:31
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Endorph posted:My only complain with FF9 is the S/he thing they went with for Quina, just because it seems awkward in dialogue. Or done the interesting thing and have everyone call Him/her something different. Steiner sees her as a the Chef from the castle, Vivi sees him as an relative of his Grandpa, etc. ZenMasterBullshit fucked around with this message at 03:21 on Oct 30, 2014 |
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Oct 30, 2014 01:36
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Vanderdeath posted:This is p. much what I was gonna post. I certainly can't speak for all black people, but Barrett's schtick, while offensive, didn't bug me because at least there was a black dude in a JRPG. That was a big deal to 13-year old me. Also despite the Mr. T thing, at least Barrett was a pretty good guy and a good father to round that out. As for how good of a father he is, reread that last sentence.
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Oct 30, 2014 02:09
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So I got kind of tired of how inconsistent the models were in my FFVII game.  Just using the battle models for everybody in their field models, and Hi-Res "classic" models where available.
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Oct 30, 2014 02:09
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Or done the interesting thing and have everyone call Him/her something different. Steiner sees her as a the Chef from teh castle, Vivi sees him as an relative of his Grandpa, etc.
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Oct 30, 2014 02:10
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