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Panzeh posted:Are there any of these novels written from a French perspective? It would be kinda neat seeing what a French frigate captain and crew would do. Day 4,365 spent being blockaded in Brest. Ate a shitload of toasted cheese. Drank eleventeen bottles of the chateau lafite.
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Dec 21, 2014 08:26
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| # ? Apr 26, 2024 05:38 |
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I just encountered hog's face irl and no wonder Aubrey is a tubby man. It's easily 60% fat.
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Dec 21, 2014 09:23
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So I just finished Post Captain and there's something that's bugging me - whatever happened with the duel? It seemed like one minute it was all set to kick off, then they got called away for their jaunt to the French coast and after that everything seemed absolutely fine and it was never mentioned again. Did I skip over something?
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Dec 21, 2014 13:47
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builds character posted:Day 4,365 spent being blockaded in Brest. Ate a shitload of toasted cheese. Drank eleventeen bottles of the chateau lafite. Hey, nobody writes about First-Rates.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:33
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The French actually had quite a lot of success in the East Indies.
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Dec 21, 2014 18:58
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Owlkill posted:So I just finished Post Captain and there's something that's bugging me - whatever happened with the duel? It seemed like one minute it was all set to kick off, then they got called away for their jaunt to the French coast and after that everything seemed absolutely fine and it was never mentioned again. Did I skip over something? The general assumption seems to be that Jack apologizes while Stephen's patching him up. Or at least shortly thereafter. I think O'Brian does it purposefully since shortly into the chapter Stephen mentions "a little spot, convenient in every way" before it's fully realized that everything's fine again.
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Dec 21, 2014 19:05
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Yeah, that situation resolves itself off screen, which is a super O'brieny thing to happen. You'll get used to it.
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Dec 21, 2014 19:35
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Including a very major death, which we've discussed already in this thread.
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Dec 21, 2014 19:36
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Colonial Air Force posted:Including a very major death, which we've discussed already in this thread. Yep. Honestly, I really like when he does that. I don't feel like I needed thirty or forty pages for that death you mentioned. The death itself isn't as important as the consequences and how the survivors deal with it. Much like General Aubrey's eventual and ignominious and totally deserved death.
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Dec 21, 2014 20:08
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Yeah, I agree, but it is definitely jarring when we're so used to other media spending lots of time on those types of events. E: I'm reading a biography on Pellew right now, and he was in the Indies, away from his wife and children, for 5 years. Any news he got was 5 months delayed, and obviously wouldn't be super detailed. So from that perspective, O'Brian does a very good job of making the reader feel like they're at sea.
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Dec 21, 2014 20:28
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I was certainly jarred by (Hundred Days) Bonden's death, which felt a little perfunctory.
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Dec 21, 2014 20:30
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I had to replay that part on the audiobook because I'd actually missed it.
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Dec 21, 2014 20:32
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ItalicSquirrels posted:The general assumption seems to be that Jack apologizes while Stephen's patching him up. Or at least shortly thereafter. I think O'Brian does it purposefully since shortly into the chapter Stephen mentions "a little spot, convenient in every way" before it's fully realized that everything's fine again. There is an on screen apology but it's way way later, like maybe not even in the same book? Basically once Jack's wounded it wouldn't be sporting to ask him to duel and they're both over it anyway, it all gets basically resolved, but the officiall apology isn't till much later.
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Dec 21, 2014 21:28
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Raskolnikov2089 posted:I'll give Alan Lewrie a try. Warning: Lewrie is mad for quim and some may think the novels spend too much time on his beard splitting.
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Dec 21, 2014 22:55
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:There is an on screen apology but it's way way later, like maybe not even in the same book? Basically once Jack's wounded it wouldn't be sporting to ask him to duel and they're both over it anyway, it all gets basically resolved, but the officiall apology isn't till much later. I think it's later on aboard the Lively when Jack says he'd never accuse Stephen of lying, "Not when I'm in my right mind at least" or something to that effect, but that's the only one that springs to mind. Am I forgetting an actual apology?
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Dec 21, 2014 23:18
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ItalicSquirrels posted:I think it's later on aboard the Lively when Jack says he'd never accuse Stephen of lying, "Not when I'm in my right mind at least" or something to that effect, but that's the only one that springs to mind. Am I forgetting an actual apology? Yeah, that's what I'm referring to. And Stephen says that sometimes he has to lie but doesn't like to be reminded of it.
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Dec 21, 2014 23:37
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The Merry Marauder posted:I was certainly jarred by (Hundred Days) Bonden's death, which felt a little perfunctory. That never happened.  Hieronymous Alloy posted:Yeah, that's what I'm referring to. And Stephen says that sometimes he has to lie but doesn't like to be reminded of it. This is the kind of thing that feels way more natural after reading ten or eleven of the books.
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Dec 22, 2014 04:37
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Ah that makes sense, I presumed something might have happened off-stage that I'd missed an allusion to. These books are such a pro read. I read the first one several years ago and I'm kicking myself now for taking so long to carry on with the series. What I'm mostly learning is that everyone in the Royal Navy in Napoleonic times had the sense of humour of an embarrassing dad.
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Dec 22, 2014 11:43
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"Did you hear what I said? Did you get it? It was funny, right?"
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Dec 22, 2014 14:47
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"He said, 'cur tailed'."Colonial Air Force posted:"Did you hear what I said? Did you get it? It was funny, right?" It was the completest thing.
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Dec 22, 2014 15:16
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CroatianAlzheimers posted:"He said, 'cur tailed'." Jack's goofy obsession with this pun (planning when he can reuse it and sharing it with people who weren't even there) has made me fall in love with the series.
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Dec 22, 2014 18:55
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To be fair it goes over like a bombshell the first 10 times he uses it. Especially after everyone's had a glass or five of wine.
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Dec 23, 2014 01:43
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Ugh, man. Even though she's a tertiary character and only in the book for, like, a few pages, Dil's death in HMS Surprise gets me like a punch in the gut every time. I am of her caste.
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Dec 23, 2014 03:36
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I'm now a few chapters into Master and Commander and really enjoying it, but despite all the effort O'Brian puts into describing it, I can't picture what a "quarterdeck brig" like the Sophie is supposed to look like. All the brigs I'm familiar with (like the USS Niagara) from later in the era seem pretty straight-decked and lacking of any amenities. Are there any illustrations,. besides that of the front cover on some editions that shed light on the arrangement? O'Brian does do a great job of describing the Sophie's rigging and how it worked for his readers. It also boggles the mind that the RN had warships running around the Mediterranean with 4-pounders, instead of refitting them with heavier carronades or gunades. If the British Board of Ordnance was independent from the Admiralty back then, I suppose that could explain why they were so slow to improve the armament on their smaller ships.
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Dec 23, 2014 18:33
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There's an entire O'Brian wiki, apparently: http://patrickobrian.wikia.com/wiki/HMS_Sophie
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Dec 23, 2014 20:48
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khamul posted:I'm now a few chapters into Master and Commander and really enjoying it, but despite all the effort O'Brian puts into describing it, I can't picture what a "quarterdeck brig" like the Sophie is supposed to look like. All the brigs I'm familiar with (like the USS Niagara) from later in the era seem pretty straight-decked and lacking of any amenities. Are there any illustrations,. besides that of the front cover on some editions that shed light on the arrangement? O'Brian does do a great job of describing the Sophie's rigging and how it worked for his readers. Four pounders were perfectly sufficient to take merchants and sink any local pirates. Waste not want not! 
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Dec 24, 2014 03:34
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Owlkill posted:Jack's goofy obsession with this pun (planning when he can reuse it and sharing it with people who weren't even there) has made me fall in love with the series. That pun is the lesser of two weevils
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Dec 24, 2014 05:30
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builds character posted:Four pounders were perfectly sufficient to take merchants and sink any local pirates. Waste not want not! Here's an interesting page with some more information. I knew the Sophie's career and armament was based on the real HMS Speedy, but did not know that her construction and sailing qualities more closely match the HMS Vincejo. However, when the Vincejo was taken into British service she was given 18-pounder carronades in place of her original 6-pounders. It's very interesting to compare the sleek Speedy with the tub-like lines of the Vincejo. Even though the Speedy looks much more modern, she was launched in 1782 whereas the Spanish Navy launched the Vincejo in 1799.
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Dec 24, 2014 05:45
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I mean she's captured by a 74 in calm weather. With sweeps and stunsels out. And the 74 never bothered to set stunsels. That's just embarrassing.
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Dec 24, 2014 10:39
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I had a Jack Aubrey pun moment just yesterday, and to keep in line with our current discussion, I'm going to retell my joke here. I just finished reading a book about Edward Pellew, and at the end is his amazing victory at Algiers. Among the ships he commanded were some Dutch volunteers, including the Dutch frigate Amstel. So I asked me wife (after explaining some terminology), if they turned Amstel in to a razee, would it be Amstel Light?
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Dec 24, 2014 14:54
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But you can't rezee a single decker.
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Dec 24, 2014 15:43
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Amstel was a 44-gun frigate, I don't think she was single-decked. I can't really find any info on her, and anyway, the joke still stands.
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Dec 24, 2014 15:48
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A heavy frigate still has only the one gun deck. If you cut it down the gun deck would be the uppermost deck, you wouldn't really have gun ports and where to put the waist would be a real head-scratcher because I don't think the gangway could accommodate guns. For example USS Constitution's most usual battery was thirty 24-pounders on the gun deck and twenty two 32-pound carronades on the upper deck. Cut that in half and you'd end up with a weird upper-deck-only battery. And I don't think you could turn the oarlop deck of a frigate into a new gun deck, it would be too close to the waterline to be practical. Cut a deck off a 2-decker and you still get a gun deck for a frigate. Imagine sawing that in half at the gun deck. You'd end up with something not very stable and with not a lot of space for guns. In the end, what we can learn from this is that lite beer is terrible, has poor sea-keeping qualities and no place for cannons.
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Dec 24, 2014 16:46
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Arglebargle III posted:In the end, what we can learn from this is that lite beer is terrible, has poor sea-keeping qualities and no place for cannons. There. Joke saved!
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Dec 24, 2014 16:47
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Colonial Air Force posted:I had a Jack Aubrey pun moment just yesterday, and to keep in line with our current discussion, I'm going to retell my joke here. He who would pun would pick a pocket. Also, since I'm coming up on it soon, let's talk about how awesome Sam loving Panda is. How awesome? So awesome.
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Dec 24, 2014 17:17
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Arglebargle III posted:A heavy frigate still has only the one gun deck. If you cut it down the gun deck would be the uppermost deck, you wouldn't really have gun ports and where to put the waist would be a real head-scratcher because I don't think the gangway could accommodate guns. For example USS Constitution's most usual battery was thirty 24-pounders on the gun deck and twenty two 32-pound carronades on the upper deck. Cut that in half and you'd end up with a weird upper-deck-only battery. And I don't think you could turn the oarlop deck of a frigate into a new gun deck, it would be too close to the waterline to be practical. Cut a deck off a 2-decker and you still get a gun deck for a frigate. The whole point of razing 3rd and 4th raters was to put up some heavier cruisers to tackle the big American heavy frigates (which tended to cram as much extra armament in the way of carronades, Columbiads, and even an early version of the Gatling gun in the tops) because the smaller British 12-pounder frigates weren't up to the job. But that's still pretty funny.
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Dec 24, 2014 19:16
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That and the old Portland class 64s were obsolete by the ubiquitous French 74 design which was superior in absolutely every way.
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Dec 25, 2014 01:41
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CroatianAlzheimers posted:He who would pun would pick a pocket. As awesome as a Papist can be, not to hold it against him, the unfortunate creature. Just read through The Yellow Admiral again - apparently I had forgotten nearly all of the book, except the first third. Jack has a hell of a depressing time throughout. I'm trying to parse the affairs being had: Sophie had one in revenge for discovering Amanda Smith's letter on the advice of Diana and Clarissa Oakes I assume. Jack of course had a number, although more than the couple of women explicitly mentioned over the series. Stephen didn't have any I noticed, although he had lots of indecent thoughts when not drowning in opium. He also of course kept up his cover as old whoremonger throughout several commissions. Diana more or less implies to Stephen she had one when she thought he was parading around Mrs. Fielding, but very likely not Jagiello. But back several books - around Clarissa Oakes I think - Diana already mentioned basically the same thing she said to Stephen about Sophie in a letter - that she told Sophie that women should have affairs too if their husbands had them, and then wrote "Sophie, the silly thing takes everything so literally". So I always assumed she already had a affair back then, but doesn't seem so? Decius fucked around with this message at 17:03 on Dec 28, 2014 |
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Dec 28, 2014 16:55
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I think Sophie had been tempted but didn't until her friends sat her down and told her she should, and in the end it wasn't with the guy that Jack suspected her of having an affair with, who to everyone's surprise moved to India and got married. It's never specifically stated but Diana strongly implies that Sophie had an affair, but isn't specific about with whom. To Jack's great credit he had decided to forgive Sophie for having an affair before discovering that she actually hadn't through Stephen, who only found out her actual affair later. Although he was pretty crushed about it. They really are too similar to each other sometimes. I remember way back in Fortunes of War I was pissed at Stephen for not cockblocking Jack with Amanda Smith. He was right that it wasn't his responsibility but Jack was so obviously blundering into a trap. Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 13:21 on Dec 29, 2014 |
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Dec 29, 2014 13:16
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I just watched the film again yesterday, the cap to my age of sail film binge (largely because of Naval Action). It's still a great film, and I could watch it every day, even when Crowe somehow reverts to his native accent on a word or two. I did notice, however, that the Surprise in the film seems to have a poopdeck, and that will now forever annoy me.
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Jan 4, 2015 15:55
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