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Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:
I love that the game describes a situation where it becomes easier for an individual soldier to leap a gap the more soldiers are jumping at the same time and then immediately admonishes you for wishing to 'live with an abstraction'

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unseenlibrarian
Jun 4, 2012

There's only one thing in the mountains that leaves a track like this. The creature of legend that roams the Timberline. My people named him Sasquatch. You call him... Bigfoot.

Evil Mastermind posted:

I'd say it's more like it was designed by a conspiracy nut; some guy with a wall full of index cards, articles cut out of the newspapers, and labeled strings connecting everything together because everything's connected, man.

Well, the guy running West End at the time certainly believed everything was connected. For example, he believed the profits from the Star Wars license were connected to bailing out his parents' failing shoe company, which is why eventually West End went down super-hard.

Evil Mastermind
Apr 28, 2008

unseenlibrarian posted:

Well, the guy running West End at the time certainly believed everything was connected. For example, he believed the profits from the Star Wars license were connected to bailing out his parents' failing shoe company, which is why eventually West End went down super-hard.

WEG's fall and Eric Gibbson's whole clusterfuck of everything are fascinating.

FMguru
Sep 10, 2003

peed on;
sexually
True fact: OJ Simpson killed West End Games when he allegedly murdered his ex-wife and her friend.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007




Holy cow. I wondered what happened to them. I thought they just wound down when the Star Wars license expired but I didn't know it was such a trainwreck.

Evil Mastermind
Apr 28, 2008

Midjack posted:

Holy cow. I wondered what happened to them. I thought they just wound down when the Star Wars license expired but I didn't know it was such a trainwreck.

My personal favorite part of that whole mess was when Eric tried to auction off all the WEG properties (like, for instance, Torg). As you can imagine, there were a lot of big-name interested parties (like Shane Hensley), but Eric wouldn't tell anyone who was pledging or what the current bids were. So if you were interested, I guess you were just supposed to email him an offer and hope it beat everyone elses'.

Then Eric decided he wasn't going to sell to anyone because nobody was giving him a decent offer or something. We can all see how well that worked out.

Robindaybird
Aug 21, 2007

Neat. Sweet. Petite.

Even 'less then they're worth' is more money then he had actually have at the moment, unless the asking amount is insulting, there's no reason not to take the offers.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:
Reading that rpg.net thread is fascinating. He comes right out of the gate blaming everyone else for his problems and does not stop for anything until they ban him.

Evil Mastermind
Apr 28, 2008

Kurieg posted:

Reading that rpg.net thread is fascinating. He comes right out of the gate blaming everyone else for his problems and does not stop for anything until they ban him.

What's amazing is that he pretty much goes full GMS with his "how DARE people expect the product they paid for" and getting pissed at people pointing out how much he's made a loving mess of things.

Fossilized Rappy
Dec 26, 2012
I was hoping to have this done and move onto a new book by 2015, but oh well. Let's finish off...




Chapter 5: The Azure Abyss Setting
While technically in the same world as the rest of Cerulean Seas by default, Azure Abyss is meant to have a strikingly different tone. The idea is that in the abyssal plain, there's a lot of evil and the players are supposed to be beacons of light in a sea of literal and figurative darkness. The greatest power in the abyss is the Axis of Evil Dark Trinity, a union of obitu slavers, deep drow politicians, and oculus warlords. In spite of being the epitome of Evil, their home base (named, of course, the Sinister Sink) is probably the safest place in the abyss thanks to their power, and they tend to be tolerant of other races as long as they are useful. This means that everyone ends up working together for the most part. The asterak traders come to ply their wares in the Sinister Sink, the rusalki work side by side with the Trinity as diplomats, and the austorian dwarves toil in their mines as they always have and share some of their profits in turn for the safety the Trinity provides. And...that's about it, really. Beyond the Sinister Sink, it's a big, dangerous place with lots of horrible monsters, undead, poison, traps, and general unpleasantness. Think :darksouls: but underwater.



Religion in the Underdeep
Outside of the sway of much of the Council of Nine, cults and pantheons of the old gods hold greater sway down in the depths. Of the nine gods approved by the Council, however, two are fairly well-known and widely worshiped even this far down: Saloth, the goddess of the deep drow, and the dark lord Dagon. There are also six new gods unique to the Underdeep.
  • Gorgulth, The Tentacles From Below (Chaotic Neutral): The big guy above, Gorgulth is a surprisingly kind god for a Lovecraftian entity. His domains are Chaos, Charm, Darkness, Madness, Magic, and Protection, and in spite of his whispers of insanity he genuinely cares about his worshipers and offers them protection. His most fervent worshipers are awakened starfish called the estrel (which will be seen next chapter), but the deep drow have begun to see the practical benefits of Gorgulth for the Dark Trinity as worship of Saloth has begun to wane amongst their ranks as less and less drow adhere to the Evil standard.
  • Kaydolas, What Lurks Beneath (Neutral Evil): The goddess of thieves, deceivers, and fearmongers, Kaydolas is popular with deep sea predators and characters of the Rogue class. Her worshipers are called to strike fear into their prey by attacking swiftly from the darkness or torturing them before they die. Her domains are Darkness, Destruction, Evil, Luck, and Trickery.
  • Pholos, The Luring Light (True Neutral): A giant anglerfish goddess, worshiped by the anglerfish-people known as the ceratioidi pisceans. She is unique amongst the gods of the deep in that she is not ancient at all. In fact, she is a fairly recent god, having been willed into existence entirely by the ceratioidi pisceans because they are so racist they didn't want to worship a deity that didn't look like them. Her domains are Animal, Protector, Strength, Sun, Trickery, and Water, making her one of the few non-Evil setting unique deities I've ever seen that has the Trickery domain.
  • Scalaxis, The True Goddess of Dragons (True Neutral): The primordial dragon goddess of honor and tradition. She teaches the knowledge of runes and ancient history, and places importance in those who know their place in the natural order. Her worship was once spread far and wide with the great dragons, but the Council of Nine hunted down most of her priests as heretics and placed Sebek in her stead in the shallow water realms. Her domains are Glory, Knowledge, Magic, Nobility, Rune, and Strength.
  • Torumdar, the Soul Anchor (Lawful Neutral): In addition to having a pretty great nickname, Torumdar is a primal deity who has been around since back when the dwarves were land-dwellers. The austorian dwarves worship him as the forge-father, master architect and provider of minerals, and every mine has a rock-hewn temple dedicated to him in order to protect the workers and ensure a bounty of material. His domains are Artifice, Earth, Law, Rune, and Steam.
  • Zissel, Watcher in the Darkness (Lawful Evil): The god of the oculi, Zissel is the ultimate Big Brother figure, watching at all times to make sure that his followers keep to the faith. In spite of his paranoia and tyranny, however, he does have some redeeming qualities in that he sees truthfulness and valor as laudable traits. Oh, and his holy animal is the barreleye fish, which is pretty great. Darkness, Knowledge, Law, Travel, War, and Water are his domains.



Chapter 6: Deep Sea Bestiary


Byakko (CR 8 Large Animal)
This gelatinous ambush predator is named after the White Tiger of the West from Chinese mythology and astronomical symbolism. Why? Presumably because of their association with stars and tigers, as they are said to hunt and act similar to the tigers of the days before the Great Flood, have game mechanics that are basically "tiger with a swim speed" for the most part, and have the ability to dazzle foes for 1d4 rounds with a flash of internal light for that star connection.


Demon, Echenis (CR 13 Huge Outsider)
Big, nasty, and gluttonous, echenis demons resemble gelatinous tentacled fish. These monstrosities of the hellish realms are far more dangerous than what their bloated bodies and lazy attitudes would suggest. With at-will dispel magic, a tentacle attack that forces a Fortitude save to avoid taking 1d5 Wisdom damage and being under the effects of a confusion spell for 6d4 hours, a tail slap that inflicts poison that deals 2d4 Strength damage, and a special swallow attack that forces the swallowed victim to make a DC 26 Fortitude save or be transformed into dark purple crystal, echenis demons are primed to utterly wreck anyone without a high Constitution score, be they caster or martial character. They even add insult to injury by making cavern lairs into "art galleries" of their crystallized foes.


Demon, Minion of Saloth (CR 9 Large Outsider)
A more traditional demon, for what measure of traditional a giant lobster-man with tentacle hands can have, the minions of Saloth are rabid followers of their namesake goddess that specialize in brute force combat. While definitely far less terrifying than the echenis, the minion of Saloth does share that demon's penchant for dealing with both casters and fighters alike. Their jagged plate-like teeth tear at muscle tissue to deal 1d3 Strength damage on top of 1d8 standard bite damage, while their freakish tentacle-hands have a strangling grip that prevents speech or casting of verbal spells. They also have a +7 deflection bonus to Armor Class and spell resistance 27 on the defensive side. Their most hated enemies are deep drow that have turned away from the worship of Saloth, who they mercilessly torture rather than grant the grace of a quick death.



Devil, Crustaceamid (CR 11 Large Outsider)
The crustaceamids are the footsoldiers of the devils, crawling en masse through the see as ravenous armies. Like both of the demons, these crab devils are capable of dealing ability score damage: 1d4 Constitution damage against pinned foes due to sharp beaks that line their arms. They can also press a foe up against their gelatinous chests and stick them there with an adhesive gel, which also happens to double as an attack that deals 1d6 acid damage.


Dragon, Din (CR 9 Large to CR 20 Gargantuan Dragon)
A True Neutral song dragon, the din dragons resemble a hybrid of reptile and lobster, and loves nothing more than to be left alone. They ponder things slowly, move slowly, and generally take life at a casual pace. If they actually do get into combat, however, they are not to be trifled with. Their sonic breath weapon also shatters any material as hard as stone or weaker, potentially collapsing ceilings or walls upon foes, and they can siphon HP from bioluminescent foes. Oh, and they can animate their own shed exoskeletons to act as living constructs. That's certainly unique, to say the least.


Drake, Scavenger (CR 3 Small Dragon)
When you're described as being "the seagulls of the deep", you know you're obnoxious. And indeed, the scavenger drake's goal is to be very obnoxious. These rather sickly-looking multi-limbed drakes harass larger creatures in order to steal their food or interesting-looking trinkets, and can speak just enough Dagonite (the Common of the deep) to know how to swear and insult people. Their tails have a minor paralytic toxin that paralyzes foes for 1d4 rounds, and they can also vomit balls of stomach acid that deal 1d6 damage.



Goggayya (CR 2 Medium Monstrous Humanoid)
The goggayya are your standard "Rogue in creature form" Chaotic Evil monsters. They sneak, they snatch, they torture, and they do it all because they find misery to be amusing. Unsurprisingly, they worship Kaydolas, who they claim is a giant goggayya.


Grandfather Worm (CR 5 Medium Aberration)
Gelatinous translucent worms with large eyes and tentacle-beards, the grandfather worms are effectively mercenary scholars, sharing knowledge for whoever can do the best favors for them. While they are True Neutral and hesitant to use their level 9 Sorcerer spells or burning tentacles against others, they were once a race of powerful conquerors when they and a handful of other invertebrate races were the only intelligent life to have yet evolved.


Hagfish, Giant (CR 1 Medium Animal) and Swarm (CR 2 Tiny Animal Swarm)
Hagfish are pretty great. They're dorky-looking eel-like fish with silly tentacle mouths and lots of slime. They gather in large numbers when whale carcasses hit the sea floor. Support your local hagfish today.



Imp, Squid (CR 1/3 Tiny Aberration)
Nobody's quite sure what the deal is with the squid imps. Even the grandfather worms and the zef, the two oldest races with continued records, aren't sure where they came from or what their purpose is. They're definitely not evil, but they can easily get underfoot, given that their main goal in life is to mime other intelligent creatures. They'll even go into combat alongside heroic characters, which tends to end badly for the squid imps given they are squishy little jelly things which have weak poison with a mere DC 10 Fortitude save and a 1 damage tentacle slap as their only means of offense and have a grand total of 4 HP to survive on.


Jellyfish, Death Shell (CR 14 Huge Vermin)
Weird jellyfish that dwell in spiny shells. In addition to being highly venomous, their bioluminescent organs create strange effects. These "sick lights" can either deal 1d6 Strength damage, 1d6 Dexterity damage, replicate the confusion spell, or deal 3d8 damage and nauseate the target if they live past the damage.


Jupervas (CR 23 Colossal Magical Beast)
The jupervas is a massive whale-like fish that is effectively a death sentence for most settlements when it appears. Like many primordial monsters, jupervas sleep for decades or even centuries before briefly awakening to feed, engulfing all edible matter with massive inhalations. It is also capable of unleashing a "bloop" (a reference to the mysterious undersea noise that turned out to be a quake within an iceberg, AKA an icequake) that deals 20d6 points of sonic damage in the immediate radius of the bloop that loses one die of damage every 10 feet away from the jupervas it goes. It also happens to be immune to all the stuff that the tarrasque is traditionally immune to. What ever could this mean?


Obitu Source-Mind (CR 9 Medium Plant)
These are the giant intelligent brain corals that create the obitu. Yes, corals aren't plants, but neither are fungi and they tend to be put in the Plant creature type, so whatever. Oddly enough, their intelligence was always a thing, but the ability to create obitu was the result of the obitu virus infecting these brain corals after they fell into the abyss. Source-minds are always Neutral Evil, so in spite of the will of the obitu that have come from them, they themselves are always slavery-loving curmudgeons that use their ability to cast cloud mind and control body at will, as well as a 4-saves-or-die aura that creates new obitu from bones that are psychically ripped out of their foes' bodies, to keep an entourage of slaves for whatever nefarious schemes they are thinking up.


Occylathan (CR 12 Huge Aberration)
Alas, one of the many members of the “is it an Aberration that has squid features? If so, it's Evil” club. They utilize hypnotizing bioluminescent stalks to attract prey right to their waiting beaks. While this seems like a rather wasteful use of a 14 Intelligence score, it's implied that they only pretend to be unambitious ambush predators and their true power is used to puppeteer entire cities in the deepest parts of the abyss.


Phantasmal Frogfish (CR 7 Large Magical Beast)
Frogfish are already pretty weird creatures in real life. These fantasy versions take that weirdness up a notch by having them be cow-sized magical predators with actual hands rather than superficially hand-like fins, capable of casting various illusions such as false sounds and phantasms of various fish species to trick prey. They're also braggarts and spies, often sharing confidential information they come across simply because it makes them look more clever.



Phoenix, Abyssal (CR 15 Gargantuan Magical Beast)
Truly the most majestic phoenix to have ever existed. These paragons of all that is light and good in a world of darkness are actually the same creatures as the birds of traditional lore- when the Great Flood threatened the world, they prayed to the gods to let them continue their quest to fight the forces of evil and committed collective ritual suicide as the world drowned. Luckily, the gods actually did listen to their plea, and the phoenixes were reborn in these aquatic forms. And the abyssal phoenixes certainly do have some vibrant tools: they are able to make a breath weapon that replicates prismatic spray every 1d4 rounds, a constant 50 foot aura that replicates color spray, and have an intense grapple attack that deals 4d6 electricity damage and forces a Fortitude save to avoid being blinded for 24 hours.


Plumed Serpent (CR 9 Huge Magical Beast)
While the name implies a creature akin to the couatl, or at the very least some Aztec theming, the plumed serpent is just a small sea serpent that has a plume of bioluminescent quills. It can deal a 6d6 electricity damage blast to all targets within 50 feet that are within 10 feet of each other (effectively an arcing attack rather than a radius attack) once per day, and its stomach deals steam damage rather than acid damage to swallowed foes due to a superheated gullet.


Sinkfish (CR 6 Large Magical Beast)
These creatures have the body of an eel, crab legs along their length, and a head like an anglerfish. While they are yet another ambush predator of the depths, they do have two rather unique forms of attack. One is the ability to create buoyancy-decreasing bubbles – hence the name sinkfish, actually – while the other is a special bioluminescent light show that can cause seizures in its foes. Yes, seizures. Any foe within 10 feet of the sinkfish has to make a Will save each round (DC 17 for most people, but DC 21 for spellcasters or psions) or take 1d4 Intelligence damage and be sickened. I'm not a neurological expert or anything, but wouldn't paralysis be more appropriate for replicating seizures?



Trueform, Estrel (CR 1 Small Magical Beast)
Awakened starfish that are particularly religious and tend to lead tribes of echinn. They're not actually that interesting, beyond their ability to split into two separate estrels that share class levels. Since they're starfish and all, of course.


Oculus, Vigilus (CR 8 Large Aberration) and Vilicus (CR 5 Medium Aberration)
The two larger forms of oculus. These are specifically “cultivated” specimens, reared from birth for their roles, and a note below their stat blocks states that a viden player character who becomes a vilicus/vigilus through taking metamorphosis feats will not be quite as strong even though they are technically the same. In addition to being larger, stronger, and generally more powerful than the viden life stage, each of the two other oculus life stages have an altered version of the viden's acidic tears and a new eye-based ability. The vilicus can spew its acidic tears into an adjacent square and have the ability to reroll Perception checks a number of times per day equal to its Wisdom modifier, while the vigilus has a 10 foot cone eye blast for its acid tears and gains an instant +2 bonus to Armor Class, all three saving throws, or attack and damage rolls (its choice) each round due to constant minor divination.


Viperfish, Dire (CR 4 Large Animal)
A giant version of the viperfish, of course. Its main unique trait is that its stomach holds contents like a Gargantuan creature normally would, meaning that it can swallow enemies up to size Huge whole. I'm not sure how often that would ever come up unless the players have some manner of sea creature mount or something, but it's admittedly fitting for the creature it replicates and gives it a trait that makes it unique compared to having just another giant ambush fish.



Final Thoughts
Azure Abyss manages to (perhaps unintentionally) continue the Cerulean Seas sourcebook trend from Indigo Ice of harsh environments being ruled by harsh characters, while the heroes are most likely paragons of virtue that are the odd ones out. For Indigo Ice, this was reflected by hostile barbarian cultures and prejudiced but Neutral regimes dominating the arctic landscapes, while in Azure Abyss there are Evil civilizations that band together and tolerate Neutral or even Good outsiders and allies out of pragmatism in an unforgiving underwater wasteland. It's not exactly ground-breaking or anything, but it's always interesting to see a setting have a piece of itself where it steps out of its primary conceits, in this case Cerulean Seas figuratively and literally going for a darker take on itself.

Mechanics-wise, I'd say that Azure Abyss manages to edge out Indigo Ice for fresh Pathfinder material. A glut of racial feats over general feats, everything about the Halionaut, the Seductor being a way to have unlimited mind control shenanigans if you choose to prioritize Strength alongside Charisma, and a mostly uninspired bestiary heavily dominated by creatures that fit the mold of “mind-controlling ambush predator” are its greatest flaws. By contrast, the new playable races (other than the aquatic dwarves) properly evoke that feeling of strangeness and cold pragmatism of the abyss, the Angler is a good class with interesting ideas even if it doesn't entirely match up with its intended role, and the Myxinmave has a lot more heart to it than most prestige classes I've seen. Even better is that a lot of the material could be transported to shallower waters without too much effort. If you are using with Pathfinder and have an aquatic-themed campaign, I can't see any reason why you wouldn't benefit from having Azure Abyss in your collection.


Next Time
The Cerulean Seas train is going to be derailed. With the release of yet another sourcebook for the setting, I realized that powering through them without giving myself breathing room for anything else was a dumb idea. Most – but not all, mind you – of what I have planned on covering sooner rather than later will be d20-based in some capacity, if not Pathfinder, because I'm that loser who knows d20 systems best and unironically likes them. :v:

Coming up first will be a fun law school lesson. It's a tale of the great license-based d20 boom of the 2000s, the interaction of two big name video game companies and one not so big name roleplaying game company, the intangibility of licensing, and just how much you can get away with barely altering the already written materials of a product bared around a license you've lost the rights to use.

Spoilers: the answer is a lot.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

Evil Mastermind posted:

What's amazing is that he pretty much goes full GMS with his "how DARE people expect the product they paid for" and getting pissed at people pointing out how much he's made a loving mess of things.
Apparently Mark Rein*Hagen has gone similarly off the deep end. I've seen him promote his I Am Zombie game with one hand while saying that Onyx Path should just stop producing product with the other. In the same Facebook post.

Evil Mastermind
Apr 28, 2008

I thought I Am Zombie crashed and burned after the KS funded and Mark decided to actually make a different game.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:
It's still in development but Mark's rather famously combative in his dealing with his KS backers.

quote:

"I was going to post a full update today but I decided I needed yet another night to think about my words and rarefy them to a unique level of profound sublimity wildly unfamiliar to my creative Loki. However, you first need to know – my splendiferous, so uncherubic crazies – that the game shipment is nearly there. Things are not only, at long last, underway, but there was an serious reason, health-wise (I haven't been well) for me to be off-line and out-of- touch for such a elongated interlude.

But first hear this – loud and clear – I'd rather send my kids to community college than abrogate a contract. No joke. I'd never leave a gamer and his wad stranded, ever. Never have, never will. Democracy is on its way.

So calm the f**k down. Subside. Please please plese

Full post when I wake up... "

Robindaybird
Aug 21, 2007

Neat. Sweet. Petite.

Holy gently caress, he needs to lay off the thesaurus.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:
Don't forget, while Onyx Path is stuck in the past working on games like Vampire: The Requiem and Werewolf: The Forsaken. His Allmighty Dotness is working on something new and amazing.

Succubus: The Reborn







Yeah gently caress that guy.

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 5, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!

Evil Mastermind posted:

What's amazing is that he pretty much goes full GMS with his "how DARE people expect the product they paid for" and getting pissed at people pointing out how much he's made a loving mess of things.

Well, as an Objectivist with "principals", I'm sure pointing the finger anywhere but himself is second nature.

Evil Mastermind posted:

I thought I Am Zombie crashed and burned after the KS funded and Mark decided to actually make a different game.

It seems to be in playtesting, last I heard, and is glacially being written from all indications. Writing from it exists, at least. But a half a year into waiting for it, Rein Hagen was like "hey, I don't have any progress on the game you want, but here's a playtest for a card-based fantasy game!" that used art purloined from every source imaginable. Which is acceptable for a closed playtest, but for an open playtest...

You can find the rules for it here.

Kavak
Aug 23, 2009


I think Rein-Hagen moved to Georgia (The one on the Black Sea, not the one where White Wolf is) and started a nightclub that was involved in a sex slave ring or something.

unseenlibrarian posted:

Well, the guy running West End at the time certainly believed everything was connected. For example, he believed the profits from the Star Wars license were connected to bailing out his parents' failing shoe company, which is why eventually West End went down super-hard.

I thought Bucci Retail Group was West End's parent company? I know they went bust trying to sell the Bruno Magli shoes O.J. was wearing during the murder and I think brought West End down with them.

Kai Tave
Jul 2, 2012
Fallen Rib

quote:

my splendiferous, so uncherubic crazies

"Listen up, Netpunks!"

Also what the gently caress does "I'd rather send my kids to community college than abrogate a contract" mean?

Young Freud
Nov 26, 2006

Kavak posted:

I think Rein-Hagen moved to Georgia (The one on the Black Sea, not the one where White Wolf is) and started a nightclub that was involved in a sex slave ring or something.

I also thought the Russian invasion of Georgia spooked the poo poo out him.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:
Rein*Hagen was a great ideas guy but he was apparently a pain in the rear end to work with, basically a John Romero of the tabletop world. He had a rather firey falling out with Steve Wieck during a period of bad sales in '96 and left to go be awesome on his own terms.

The Black Dog section of Pentex gives us a little insight into what his co-workers thought working with him was like, same with Bill Bridges and Phil Brucato




Kavak posted:

I think Rein-Hagen moved to Georgia (The one on the Black Sea, not the one where White Wolf is) and started a nightclub that was involved in a sex slave ring or something.

The first part at least is true I'm not sure about the second. He had to evacuate during the Russian invasion but he moved back afterwards.

Kai Tave posted:

Also what the gently caress does "I'd rather send my kids to community college than abrogate a contract" mean?

"I think people who go to community college are subhuman."

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Sorry, but this picture has made the entire setting to me. Hell, you could've just shown me that and named the book, and I'd be sold.

Siivola
Dec 23, 2012

That starfish has seen some poo poo.

Count Chocula
Dec 25, 2011

WE HAVE TO CONTROL OUR ENVIRONMENT
IF YOU SEE ME POSTING OUTSIDE OF THE AUSPOL THREAD PLEASE TELL ME THAT I'M MISSED AND TO START POSTING AGAIN
I have no real interest in Pathfinder but the art and setting for Azure Abyss are awesome! You could run something based on Graeme Base's Sign of the Seahorse - deep-sea mobsters.

Count Chocula fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Jan 5, 2015

Green Intern
Dec 29, 2008

Loon, Crazy and Laughable

Kai Tave posted:

"Listen up, Netpunks!"

Also what the gently caress does "I'd rather send my kids to community college than abrogate a contract" mean?

Rather give his kids sub-par education than back out on a contract.

DigitalRaven
Oct 9, 2012




Kurieg posted:

Rein*Hagen was a great ideas guy but he was apparently a pain in the rear end to work with, basically a John Romero of the tabletop world. He had a rather firey falling out with Steve Wieck during a period of bad sales in '96 and left to go be awesome on his own terms.

The Black Dog section of Pentex gives us a little insight into what his co-workers thought working with him was like, same with Bill Bridges and Phil Brucato


That's Andrew Greenberg (who teamed up with Bill Bridges at Holistic Design to design Fading Suns), not Mark Rein•Hagen.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.

Kurieg posted:

Don't forget, while Onyx Path is stuck in the past working on games like Vampire: The Requiem and Werewolf: The Forsaken. His Allmighty Dotness is working on something new and amazing.

Succubus: The Reborn


The idea of a party constructed only of succubi is hilarious.

How are they differentiated?
What do they get up to?
Is it just Flavor of Love crossed with King Solomon's court?

Kai Tave
Jul 2, 2012
Fallen Rib

Green Intern posted:

Rather give his kids sub-par education than back out on a contract.

Nah, I'm inclined to think it's more

Kurieg posted:

"I think people who go to community college are subhuman."

Like, it says something very specifically assholish about someone when they're casting about for an example of terrible things they'd rather do than let a contract slide and they go with "send my kids to community college!"

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Golden Bee posted:

The idea of a party constructed only of succubi is hilarious.

How are they differentiated?
What do they get up to?
Is it just Flavor of Love crossed with King Solomon's court?

I figure laypeople would rightly say the same thing about ghosts, werewolves, frankensteins, and vampires (prior to the vampire genre explosion in the 90s).

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

DigitalRaven posted:

That's Andrew Greenberg (who teamed up with Bill Bridges at Holistic Design to design Fading Suns), not Mark Rein•Hagen.

Aha, then apparently Fictonal Rein*Hagen stayed with the company longer than real Rein*Hagen, or wasn't put into the book at all. By process of elimination then he might be the developer depicted as mudering fans at a con rather than talking to them.

RocknRollaAyatollah
Nov 26, 2008

Lipstick Apathy

Kurieg posted:

Rein*Hagen

I want to imagine his life over there was far from that interesting but he would tell people that was the case in a hushed manner because it made him seem edgy or dangerous in his own mind. It kind of comes with the territory of being a privileged expat in a country like Georgia who likes to imagine they're on some grand adventure.

RocknRollaAyatollah fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Jan 6, 2015

Young Freud
Nov 26, 2006

RocknRollaAyatollah posted:

I want to imagine his life over there was far from that interesting but he would tell people that was the case in a hushed manner because it made him seem edgy or dangerous in his own mind. It kind of comes with the territory of being a privileged expat in a country like Georgia who likes to imagine they're on some grand adventure.

From the stories I heard, he was more likely trying his hand at farming than holding kinky sexy parties.

Kai Tave
Jul 2, 2012
Fallen Rib

theironjef posted:

I figure laypeople would rightly say the same thing about ghosts, werewolves, frankensteins, and vampires (prior to the vampire genre explosion in the 90s).

I would say the big difference is that none of those things are inherently tied to the concept of boning dudes. White Wolf did the whole clans et al thing to give different vampires unique schticks and powers and whatever but even without that it's still not too difficult to imagine a game where everybody is a vampire or a ghost or whatever. A game where everybody is a sexy sex-demon is a different kettle of fish.

Everything Counts
Oct 10, 2012

Don't "shhh!" me, you rich bastard!

Kurieg posted:

Aha, then apparently Fictonal Rein*Hagen stayed with the company longer than real Rein*Hagen, or wasn't put into the book at all. By process of elimination then he might be the developer depicted as mudering fans at a con rather than talking to them.

That sounds more like Justin Achilli than Rein*Hagen.

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Kai Tave posted:

I would say the big difference is that none of those things are inherently tied to the concept of boning dudes. White Wolf did the whole clans et al thing to give different vampires unique schticks and powers and whatever but even without that it's still not too difficult to imagine a game where everybody is a vampire or a ghost or whatever. A game where everybody is a sexy sex-demon is a different kettle of fish.

Arguably the classic vampire trope is straight up sex monsters. But why argue? A book of Succubi totally smacks of trying to keep the old White Wolf model chugging along as if they hadn't run out of good monsters, it's true. I wish they were secretly working on "Creatures: The Black Lagooning."

RocknRollaAyatollah
Nov 26, 2008

Lipstick Apathy

Young Freud posted:

From the stories I heard, he was more likely trying his hand at farming than holding kinky sexy parties.

I'm sure you get to be quite the baller when you roll into Tbilisi with a bumper crop of corn and a load of grapes.

Foreign farmers being given incentives to set up shop in Georgia is apparently a thing. I can actually respect that.

DigitalRaven
Oct 9, 2012




Kurieg posted:

Aha, then apparently Fictonal Rein*Hagen stayed with the company longer than real Rein*Hagen, or wasn't put into the book at all. By process of elimination then he might be the developer depicted as mudering fans at a con rather than talking to them.

Mark's alter-ego didn't get mentioned much, but he is there: Günter Häagen•Däaz. All the Black Dog names are plays on White Wolf staffers' names, but most people were never that far down the rabbit-hole of internal references.

Edit The one you're thinking of is Jason O'Kelly, the goatee'd version of Justin Achilli, as seen here.

DigitalRaven fucked around with this message at 00:23 on Jan 6, 2015

Young Freud
Nov 26, 2006

theironjef posted:

Arguably the classic vampire trope is straight up sex monsters. But why argue? A book of Succubi totally smacks of trying to keep the old White Wolf model chugging along as if they hadn't run out of good monsters, it's true. I wish they were secretly working on "Creatures: The Black Lagooning."

I remembering coming up with a 15-second game idea off some fanbook based off the Prototype games that came up in one of the early FATAL and Friends threads which was essentially, "Thing: The Invasion".

Kai Tave
Jul 2, 2012
Fallen Rib

theironjef posted:

Arguably the classic vampire trope is straight up sex monsters.

The difference here is that one of those is metaphorical while the other is literal.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

DigitalRaven posted:

Mark's alter-ego didn't get mentioned much, but he is there: Günter Häagen•Däaz.

Aha, that would be why I don't know that one because it was only referenced in The Autumn People... a Changeling book

:psyduck:

But apparently their depiction of Brucato is straight on considering he may or may not have officially changed his name to Satyros.

I have no idea how he was able to convince them to let him back on to write Changing Breeds

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Alien Rope Burn
Dec 5, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!
A true story of mine from the Origins White Wolf booth circa 199X:

"So, I hear [White Wolf Intern] is working with you now, I used to game with him a bit when he lived in [a certain state capital]."

"You hate him, don't you?"

"How did you know?"

"It's okay, everyone does."

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