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MrNemo posted:Why not both? Kal returns, tells his parents everything that's happened and his mother blames him for his brother's death while his father is utterly crushed that he's a warrior and not a healer. They have a huge fight and Kal leaves. THATS enough angst to make him go through to the other side, giggling and laughing the entire way as he butchers the nobility of the world with wild abandon. 
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Feb 21, 2015 04:53
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Thyrork posted:THATS enough angst to make him go through to the other side, giggling and laughing the entire way as he butchers the nobility of the world with wild abandon. That would at least be interesting and entertaining.
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Feb 21, 2015 04:58
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Don't forget he'll probably see his childhood crush, married to the old lighteye rear end in a top hat that runs his town, and she'll probably have had some kids with him too.
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Feb 21, 2015 05:04
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Thyrork posted:THATS enough angst to make him go through to the other side, giggling and laughing the entire way as he butchers the nobility of the world with wild abandon. So he'll end up just like Kelsier? 
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Feb 21, 2015 07:44
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New Shadows of Self cover has been revealed http://brandonsanderson.com/shadows-of-self-cover-reveal-updates/
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Feb 24, 2015 02:15
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I like the idea that Kaladin's parents don't blame him for his brother's death and are accepting of everything he is and has done which fucks him up due to his guilt complex and self-destructive urges.
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Feb 25, 2015 02:26
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Pwnstar posted:I like the idea that Kaladin's parents don't blame him for his brother's death and are accepting of everything he is and has done which fucks him up due to his guilt complex and self-destructive urges. I do too, but I'd like to see some growth away from that as the series continues and he keeps being set up to be one of the end all be all badasses who are capable of changing the world.
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Feb 25, 2015 17:55
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Just finished Firefight, and I'm disappointed at the things I predicted and pleased at the things that surprised me. Super-spoilers follow. Way back I predicted that Calamity was a Super-Epic that was gifting its powers, so I was a little let down when that happened. It was also painfully obvious when Firefight was around, and helping David, with the bathroom door swinging and such, though I think that was supposed to be obvious. I had thought that Mizzie was actually an illusion of Firefight's, all to set up a love triangle dramabomb, but thankfully neither of those happened. I was also glad to learn that Steelheart was just a bully, and his whole city wasn't some altruistic thing and he tried to avoid using his powers. As for the fear = weakness, I think it's more what's in your nightmares, and it's facing that terror and breaking through it that makes the difference. How that relates to Fortuity's powers is a challenge, but I wonder if maybe they were wrong about them, or else that it's rejection from pretty women that does it rather than pretty women themselves. I agree with the comments that the book feels a little disjoint, like there were several plot lines that were put together or changed direction a lot. It wasn't bad, just not as cohesive as I'm used to seeing from Sanderson.
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Feb 26, 2015 00:39
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Apparently Steelheart was a mall cop before he became an epic. Explains a lot.
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Feb 26, 2015 03:24
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Just finished Firefight. It was pretty enjoyable!~ it really is a superheroes novel and it's done pretty drat well
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Mar 3, 2015 01:50
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Man I just finished reading Words of Radiance and I can't wait for the next one, there's so many questions stil. I'm going to spoiler tag my impressions just in case, so major spoilers ahead. Ending felt like a Oprah show, everyone gets super powers, except Adolin, he gets to butcher Sadeas instead. I was not expecting Szeth to live, and even more, to become the first member of the Skybreakers and to be pairing with the Herald of Justice, I expect a lot of Shin guys to be facing death next book. Justice  I'm still a bit confused with the Ghostbloods and Sons of Honor faction, they both seem to be heading towards the same goal? They both want the Heralds back and the way they were doing it was to make the voidbringers return. So what exactly do they win by trying to murder Amaram? I have no idea where the Heralds will fit in all of this, aren't they supposed to be the gods, representative of each section of the Knights Radiant? At least Justice didn't seem very interested in joining up with the rest of the Radiants, up to now at least. Also wtf is up with War? He seems to think he is too late to stop the voidbringers yet from everything said the Heralds are returning because the voidbringers returned themselves. Wit rules by the way, and that twist at the end, the gently caress  I'll definitely have to re-read this after some time, at least before the next book comes out. I'm really enjoying this, even more than what I enjoyed Mistborn.
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Mar 3, 2015 19:21
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theghostpt posted:I'm still a bit confused with the Ghostbloods and Sons of Honor faction, they both seem to be heading towards the same goal? They both want the Heralds back and the way they were doing it was to make the voidbringers return. So what exactly do they win by trying to murder Amaram? That's not quite how I understood it. The Sons of Honor want to bring about the return of the Voidbringers, because that would also mean the return of the Heralds. The intentions of the Ghostbloods are less clear, but they don't seem to have the same religious fervor. Also, Galivar thought that Szeth was sent by the Ghostbloods, and that it was too late (to prevent the return of the Voidbringers). If Galivar thought that they would kill him, then they are presumably not interested in the return of the Voidbringers, which may also be the reason for the attempt on Amaram's life. theghostpt posted:I have no idea where the Heralds will fit in all of this, aren't they supposed to be the gods, representative of each section of the Knights Radiant? At least Justice didn't seem very interested in joining up with the rest of the Radiants, up to now at least. Also wtf is up with War? He seems to think he is too late to stop the voidbringers yet from everything said the Heralds are returning because the voidbringers returned themselves. Did you not read the prologue of Way of Kings? All Heralds save Talenel (War as you call him) survived the last Desolation and did not return to Damnation. They abandoned their oaths, left their Knights Radiants behind and just chilled out incognito. They are also not god, since God in the Vorin religion is the Almighty (Honor), and they are simply his heralds
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Mar 3, 2015 19:39
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Torrannor posted:That's not quite how I understood it. The Sons of Honor want to bring about the return of the Voidbringers, because that would also mean the return of the Heralds. The intentions of the Ghostbloods are less clear, but they don't seem to have the same religious fervor. Also, Galivar thought that Szeth was sent by the Ghostbloods, and that it was too late (to prevent the return of the Voidbringers). If Galivar thought that they would kill him, then they are presumably not interested in the return of the Voidbringers, which may also be the reason for the attempt on Amaram's life. You're absolutely right  That prologue was odd and I definitely had lost track that it was about Talenel, makes sense that he is broken being left in Damnation alone. I definitely have to re-read it now. So we have a bunch of Heralds around Roshar doing whatever, Honor dead, killed by Odium who took the tranquiline halls and is directly linked to the voidbringers. I guess they might not be interested in joining up the Knights Radiant again? Although Justice just appointed a Skybreaker anyway,
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Mar 3, 2015 20:07
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theghostpt posted:You're absolutely right There's a fair amount of hints about the Heralds throughout the books. I believe that Brandon has suggested we've seen many, if not all of them, in the pages of the novels so far. The ones I can recall include several present during the events leading to the assassination of Galivar (the Justice herald, I believe, was talking to another), and the Herald of the Lightweavers is the woman going around destroying statues. Another one is probably a beggar from the prologues. Basically they're everywhere, but apparently 'twisted' by either their abandonment of duty or something else into either opposing what they formerly believed (see: Herald of justice murdering people or not because of the letter of the law, not the spirit, artistic herald defacing art).
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Mar 3, 2015 23:22
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Velius posted:Another one is probably a beggar from the prologues. There are actually a couple theoretical beggar Heralds. One is the drunk from the assassination night prologue in WoK, which is who I assume you were referring to. There's also a guess that the crazy homeless beggar guy from the Axies interlude in WoK (the one who has made a city out of trash) is actually one of the Heralds.
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Mar 4, 2015 14:32
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Velius posted:There's a fair amount of hints about the Heralds throughout the books. I believe that Brandon has suggested we've seen many, if not all of them, in the pages of the novels so far.
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Mar 5, 2015 06:43
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ShadowGlass posted:I'm pretty sure Brandon said we've seen all of the Heralds already. But I've also only figured out the ones you've mentioned. Seen, but sometimes their influence, not necessarily directly
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Mar 5, 2015 07:19
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DarkHorse posted:Just finished Firefight, and I'm disappointed at the things I predicted and pleased at the things that surprised me. Super-spoilers follow. I finished it recently and really liked it. I didn't feel it was that disjointed, maybe not as tight of a story as Steelheart but pretty drat fun read. I didn't see some of it coming but I did predict early on that Regalia was trying to get Professor to use his powers to turn him evil so he could join her, so I was kind of close  . Also it was pretty obvious Megan was good and helping, either thats just Sanderson's often unsubtlety coming through or I dont think he wanted you to ever think she was evilNot sure if I like Calamity being a super dude gifting powers, it would have been more interesting as some strange phenomon but I guess it fits in with his sandersonverse if its just some shard of some corruptgod dude
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Mar 6, 2015 00:39
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Steelheart series isn't in the cosmere.
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Mar 6, 2015 03:41
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Just finished reading the two Stormlight books. Bought WoK after Christmas and have been casually reading them. Definitely feel like I got my money's worth as they're HUGE books. At one point in WoK I stopped at looked at the progress bar (bought the Kindle versions and didn't take notice of the # of pages or look at the chapters) and had a wtf-moment as I was only like 30% through after several weeks. I also felt like each chapter had some meat in it. I can't remember feeling like I was reading padding and with the size of these I'm thankful he didn't decide to split them into two or three books each and charge more - because he definitely could have. I enjoy the world building. I've gone back a few pages and it seems like these link it with the other series and I can see similarities with the way magic works (or maybe he just has this goto theme) but it's still enjoyable. gently caress Kaladin, though. What a douche. Syl should have picked Dalinar instead. That guy has his poo poo together. I enjoyed the Lift chapter.
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Mar 6, 2015 06:51
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asdfsdfg posted:Just finished reading the two Stormlight books. Bought WoK after Christmas and have been casually reading them. Definitely feel like I got my money's worth as they're HUGE books. At one point in WoK I stopped at looked at the progress bar (bought the Kindle versions and didn't take notice of the # of pages or look at the chapters) and had a wtf-moment as I was only like 30% through after several weeks. Not sure how much Dalinar has his poo poo together, there's a huge-rear end minefield somewhere in his past. Also he gets to bond Stormfather, so yeah, that's going to be pretty cool.
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Mar 6, 2015 06:57
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He's not an angst-ridden teenager, for starters. It sounds like they all have hosed up pasts and that is a pre-requisite for a spren coming around. He could've been the chosen one, man. But yeah, the Stormfather thing ought to be interesting.
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Mar 6, 2015 07:11
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I'm not sure what will hit people harder, that one of the top two Highprinces was just murdered by the other's son, or that Dalinar's quite literally going to have the right hand of God on speed dial.
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Mar 6, 2015 07:31
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He's the spren of a dead god who really just doesn't like him. No shards for you, bro. Plus you're a goddam failure.
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Mar 6, 2015 07:45
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The idea of Kaladin as an "angst-ridden teenager" I see repeated in this thread is pretty dumb. I think he is completely justified with the world in which he lives given the circumstances of the last few years of his life. He went from an optimistic young man to a betrayed soldier to an exploited slave to captain of the guard in... what, I think it's like a 3-4 year period? I guess I understand the sentiment of "I am tired of reading about the angst of a young man", but Kaladin being pissed at poo poo makes a lot of sense to me.
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Mar 6, 2015 08:08
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Doesn't change the fact that his wallowing is annoying to read and you can only take so much of it, if I wanted to be depressed I'd read a Jean Ziegler book about Africa, not some fantasy book.
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Mar 6, 2015 08:18
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Tahirovic posted:Doesn't change the fact that his wallowing is annoying to read and you can only take so much of it As someone who has a great interest in the entire field of storytelling, "I don't want to read about people who are sad" is really confusing for me.
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Mar 6, 2015 08:26
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Kaladin is legit mentally ill. He's got Seasonal Affective Disorder as well as his whole PTSD/Survivor's guilt so its not really a case of just him getting over himself. It get frustrating to read though for sure, though maybe that's the point?
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Mar 6, 2015 08:36
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Pwnstar posted:It get frustrating to read though for sure
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Mar 6, 2015 08:41
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cams posted:I guess I just don't understand why so many people are frustrating reading about an angry young man who is completely justified in being as angry as he is. Obviously everyone is gonna like certain things and dislike others, I'm just surprised at how seemingly-unanimous this sentiment is in here. Kaladin's story has been one of the most compelling to me in these books. Different strokes, dude. I didn't have a huge problem with Kaladin's part in WoR, but I can understand why someone would. Kaladin's depression and PTSD keeps getting triggered by the same things (storms, inability to trust nobles, etc.) And while this is an accurate depiction of his particular disorders, as part of the narrative it can leave the reader feeling like Kaladin is regressing or trapped in stasis in his character development.
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Mar 6, 2015 08:47
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Yeah Kaladin's story is engaging but every time he starts moving forward with his life he has another breakdown and starts regressing because he can't accept good things happening. There's also the dramatic irony thing where we know Dalinar is a cool dude who would be able to help Kaladin and vice-versa but Kaladin won't trust him because he's a noble and totally just like all the others and you just want him to shut up and be happy for once. Like the part where he and Shallan are having their adventure they overcome adversity and grow to like each other a bit and you are thinking ok cool, Kaladin is moving on yay. Then he sees that she is engaged to Adolin and he immediately regresses to thinking she's just another lighteyes who only cares about power and money etc etc.
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Mar 6, 2015 09:40
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Pwnstar posted:Yeah Kaladin's story is engaging but every time he starts moving forward with his life he has another breakdown and starts regressing because he can't accept good things happening. There's also the dramatic irony thing where we know Dalinar is a cool dude who would be able to help Kaladin and vice-versa but Kaladin won't trust him because he's a noble and totally just like all the others and you just want him to shut up and be happy for once. Again, I get that it is possible for some people to not particularly enjoy Kaladin's arc so far, it is the consensus of hatred for his characterization I've seen in this thread that is strange to me.
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Mar 6, 2015 09:46
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cams posted:Yeah, i find this completely believable and it would be really weird to me if he suddenly turned around on a deep-seeded hatred that is based on a man he trusted killing a bunch of people and enslaving him in order to gain power. People like character arcs and stories with beginnings, middles, and ends. Depression is the beginning and middle on loop.
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Mar 6, 2015 10:00
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Superstring posted:People like character arcs and stories with beginnings, middles, and ends. Depression is the beginning and middle on loop. I'd actually say Adolin is the character we've seen the most change from so far and it's pretty clear we've only seen the beginning of where he's going.
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Mar 6, 2015 10:12
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cams posted:Were two books in to a ten book series, which characters have had arcs with a beginning, middle, and end? Each of the main characters have arcs that complete within a single book, even if their larger arcs aren't going to be completed until the end. It's like how Luke Skywalker finishes an arc at the end of ANH even if his overall one isn't finished until Jedi.
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Mar 6, 2015 10:18
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Superstring posted:People like character arcs and stories with beginnings, middles, and ends. Depression is the beginning and middle on loop. Thats the point though your supposed to feel frustrated mood disorders ARE frustrating and persistent. What gets me is people who say thats bad writing or poor storytelling, its not.
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Mar 6, 2015 12:11
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Rumda posted:Thats the point though your supposed to feel frustrated mood disorders ARE frustrating and persistent. What gets me is people who say thats bad writing or poor storytelling, its not. It might not be bad writing or poor storytelling but it isn't exactly fun to read for me if the same thing happens time and time again. As others said, every time you think he might finally be less sulky he finds some detail that puts him back into his "must hate lightseyes" state of mind where he is depressed and sees no future for himself. If he was an internet poster I'd label him as emo.
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Mar 6, 2015 12:22
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Rumda posted:Thats the point though your supposed to feel frustrated mood disorders ARE frustrating and persistent. What gets me is people who say thats bad writing or poor storytelling, its not. Same thing happened with The Magicians on here, with goons acting like quentins depression was somehow a negative as opposed to the entire point. Goons don't like sad brains.
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Mar 6, 2015 12:23
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Not every thing written HAS to be 'fun'.senae posted:Goons don't like sad brains. Rumda fucked around with this message at 12:28 on Mar 6, 2015 |
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Mar 6, 2015 12:24
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Rumda posted:Thats the point though your supposed to feel frustrated mood disorders ARE frustrating and persistent. What gets me is people who say thats bad writing or poor storytelling, its not. I don't think that it's bad storytelling. Just trying to explain to cams why people get frustrated with a frustrating subject depicted accurately frustratingly.
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Mar 6, 2015 12:59
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