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i made a thing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZqKbswB0H8
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Mar 4, 2015 17:16
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Boxturret posted:"criminals have also used shoes" mmmmmods
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Mar 4, 2015 17:19
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blugu64 posted:I refuse to believe that a country that sells citizenship for dollars, doesn't have situations like this often enough to not have a process for this. yeah but the point is their shonky citizenship process lost them access to the visa waiver program and is probably making it harder and harder for their citizens to get into other countries, which is why they're running around making people re-apply for passports, presumably with the intention of cutting off the flag-of-convenience dickheads like ver
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Mar 4, 2015 17:22
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one can hope his selling st kitts passports for bitcoins scheme will bite him in the rear end
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Mar 4, 2015 17:27
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i hope it starts a legal battle where every country goes "not my citizen"
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Mar 4, 2015 17:40
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So, if he becomes stateless, who would have legal jurisdiction over him? The UN? Nobody? He would be, in a real and true sense, decentralized. International. Above reproach. If he were to absorb the blockchain into his body, why. . . He would become the Bitcoin Jesus. Then nobody could harm Bitcoin without harming his physical corpus meatus, which proviso vis a vis is illegal, as it were.
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Mar 4, 2015 17:45
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:So, if he becomes stateless, who would have legal jurisdiction over him? The UN? Nobody? He would be, in a real and true sense, decentralized. International. Above reproach. If he were to absorb the blockchain into his body, why. . . He would become the Bitcoin Jesus. Then nobody could harm Bitcoin without harming his physical corpus meatus, which proviso vis a vis is illegal, as it were. maritime law.
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Mar 4, 2015 17:50
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:So, if he becomes stateless, who would have legal jurisdiction over him? The UN? Nobody? He would be, in a real and true sense, decentralized. International. Above reproach. If he were to absorb the blockchain into his body, why. . . He would become the Bitcoin Jesus. Then nobody could harm Bitcoin without harming his physical corpus meatus, which proviso vis a vis is illegal, as it were. nobody. it's so hosed up that there's a un convention about stateless persons because they have no legal protections.
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Mar 4, 2015 17:52
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also, the US is not a signatory to the stateless person convention, lol
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Mar 4, 2015 17:54
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duTrieux. posted:nobody. it's so hosed up that there's a un convention about stateless persons because they have no legal protections. wait, like he would become an outlaw in the old-fashioned sense? i'm kind of hoping for it now because it's hella ironic
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Mar 4, 2015 17:58
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ianal but i think most countries would just deport him to the us because that's where he was born, but i don't know what happens then. the us allows citizens to renounce their citizenship without first securing one elsewhere, though, so there should be protocol somewhere
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Mar 4, 2015 18:00
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Edminster posted:wait, like he would become an outlaw in the old-fashioned sense? i'm kind of hoping for it now because it's hella ironic no, he would still be under the legal jurisdiction of wherever he was when his passport was revoked, but he'd lose the ability to travel and every other protection that a valid passport confers. it's like the worst of every possible world. he'd be ineligible for virtually everything while totally at the mercy of local authorities. when Mehran Karimi Nasseri got stuck at charles de gaulle airport without papers that didn't make him immune to prosecution by france if he committed a crime. duTrieux. posted:ianal but i think most countries would just deport him to the us because that's where he was born if he was abroad and st. kitts revoked his passport he'd probably be deported back to st. kitts because that's the last country that legally accepted responsibility for him. the us wouldn't accept him, and i doubt any airline would agree to transport him there because they'd just be stuck taking him back when he was refused entry. shadok fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Mar 4, 2015 |
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Mar 4, 2015 18:05
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I love that the immigration lawyer dude pulled ver's credit files
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Mar 4, 2015 18:05
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here's what the state department has to say about statelessness on the 'so you want to renounce your citizenship...?' pagequote:D. DUAL NATIONALITY / STATELESSNESS so basically he could be deported back to the us, but i don't know what happens after that. probably an ICE detention center
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Mar 4, 2015 18:06
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duTrieux. posted:also, the US is not a signatory to the stateless person convention, lol 1930 - Forced Labour Convention, not ratified 1948 - Freedom of Association and Protection of the Right to Organise Convention, not signed 1949 - Right to Organise and Collective Bargaining Convention, 1949, not signed 1950 - Convention for the Suppression of the Traffic in Persons and of the Exploitation of the Prostitution of Others, not signed 1951 - Convention relating to the Status of Refugees, party to only the 1967 protocol 1951 - Equal Remuneration Convention, not ratified 1954 - Convention relating to the Status of Stateless Persons, not signed 1958 - Discrimination (Employment and Occupation) Convention, not ratified 1960 - Convention against Discrimination in Education, not ratified 1961 - Convention on the Reduction of Statelessness, not signed 1962 - Convention on Consent to Marriage, Minimum Age for Marriage and Registration of Marriages, signed but not ratified 1964 - Employment Policy Convention, 1964, not ratified 1966 - International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights, signed but not ratified 1966 - First Optional Protocol to the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, not signed 1969 - Convention on the Non-Applicability of Statutory Limitations to War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity, not ratified 1972 - Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty, signed but withdrew in 2002 1977 - American Convention on Human Rights, signed but not ratified 1977 - Protocol I (an amendment protocol to the Geneva Conventions), not ratified 1977 - Protocol II (an amendment protocol to the Geneva Conventions), not ratified 1979 - Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women, signed but not ratified 1981 - Occupational Safety and Health Convention, 1981, not ratified 1989 - Second Optional Protocol to the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, not signed 1989 - Convention on the Rights of the Child, signed but not ratified 1990 - United Nations Convention on the Protection of the Rights of All Migrant Workers and Members of Their Families, not signed 1991 - United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea 1992 - Convention on Biological Diversity, signed but not ratified 1994 - Convention on the Safety of United Nations and Associated Personnel, signed but not ratified 1996 - Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty, signed but not ratified 1997 - Kyoto Protocol, signed with no intention to ratify 1997 - Ottawa Treaty (Mine Ban Treaty), unsigned 1998 - International Criminal Court, signed by not ratified 1998 - Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court, signed but not ratified 1999 - Optional Protocol to the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women, not signed 2000 - United Nations Convention against Transnational Organized Crime, signed by not ratified 2002 - Optional Protocol to the Convention against Torture, not signed 2006 - International Convention for the Protection of All Persons from Enforced Disappearance, not signed 2007 - Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, signed but not ratified 2008 - Convention on Cluster Munitions, not signed
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Mar 4, 2015 18:20
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despite all my rage i am still just an iPad on a stick
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Mar 4, 2015 18:21
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Clearly we just have to exile him to an abandoned oil rig or nuclear test island somewhere so that he can be his own state.
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Mar 4, 2015 18:23
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A florist in our area often publically complains that BitPay owes him money and won’t answer his customer support queries (self.Bitcoin) submitted 10 hours ago by ItsMillerIndexTime I highly doubt his story since I have never heard similar complaints about BitPay. Has anyone else had a similar problem? It would be great to have this resolved, as this is not the first time the local media has gone to him for the “beware, you might never get your money” angle. Most recent article: http://www.dailygazette.com/news/2015/mar/03/use-bitcoin-increase-not-without-problems/?print (print page to get around paywall) Relevant quote: Except that the transactions never materialized as cash in his account. Or only fractions of them did — like $2 on a $75 transaction. He contacted customer support, but his queries went unanswered.
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Mar 4, 2015 18:26
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shadok posted:no, he would still be under the legal jurisdiction of wherever he was when his passport was revoked, but he'd lose the ability to travel and every other protection that a valid passport confers. it's like the worst of every possible world. he'd be ineligible for virtually everything while totally at the mercy of local authorities. i was thinking the other way around, because "they may be rendered stateless and, thus, lack the protection of any government. " makes it sound exactly like the original concept of outlawry which was 'congrats you hosed up so bad we are ejecting you from society. good luck having a giant target on your back because it is now open season on your rear end'
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Mar 4, 2015 18:26
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:maritime law.
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Mar 4, 2015 18:26
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Roger can be a citizen of the sea, his flag is blue with gold fringe
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Mar 4, 2015 18:29
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Edminster posted:good luck having a giant target on your back because it is now open season on your rear end
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Mar 4, 2015 18:33
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so what happens if he has no state - he obviously cant leave st kitts, which doesnt sound too bad compared to being trapped in the airport or whatever, but he wouldnt be legally allowed to have a job or rent an apartment would he? hed be a permanent hobo? that owns
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Mar 4, 2015 18:39
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Edminster posted:i was thinking the other way around, because "they may be rendered stateless and, thus, lack the protection of any government. " makes it sound exactly like the original concept of outlawry which was 'congrats you hosed up so bad we are ejecting you from society. good luck having a giant target on your back because it is now open season on your rear end' right, but when they talk about "the protection of any government" they're talking about protecting you from the government of the country you're travelling in, not from the general populace. in theory if i'm travelling and i get into some kind of legal jam, the passport i'm carrying implies that the government of canada or the UK will be irritated if i'm mistreated, and if i'm not offered at least the same legal rights as a local would get. it's not much but it's better than nothing. if you're really stateless you don't even get that, not to mention things like reciprocal treaties for emergency medical treatment. also, i've been reading fun articles about the st. kitts passport debacle in their local papers: Taxpayers To Foot The Bill For SKN Passport Recall. some highlights: - they've been doing citizenship-for-passports since 1984, but the documents started getting extra-dodgy in 2012 when the st. kitts government decided to make them even more enticing to rich foreigners trying to get around sanctions by no longer including place-of-birth and history of name changes in the ID information, which is why canada stopped accepting them for visa-free travel - citizenship and passport sales may represent up to 25% of st. kitts' GDP - the government is now terrified that the schengen zone will follow canada and impose mandatory visas making the passports all but worthless - actual inhabitants are not happy at the prospect of seeing their passports made useless, not to mention being stuck paying for reissuing 6,000 passports to rich foreign assholes if ver ever ends up back in st. kitts he should get a warm welcome from the locals. ANAmal.net posted:so what happens if he has no state - he obviously cant leave st kitts, which doesnt sound too bad compared to being trapped in the airport or whatever, but he wouldnt be legally allowed to have a job or rent an apartment would he? hed be a permanent hobo? even if they refuse to give him a new passport he still has the SKN nationality he bought, so he's good... for now. that immigration lawyer suggested that they might subsequently strip him of his citizenship on some pretext (didn't disclose felony conviction?) to try and demonstrate to canada and europe that they're cracking down please let us in. shadok fucked around with this message at 18:47 on Mar 4, 2015 |
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Mar 4, 2015 18:45
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shadok posted:if ver ever ends up back in st. kitts he should get a warm welcome from the locals. at the end of the day he's still a white dude with money
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Mar 4, 2015 18:47
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how much money does he actually have?
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Mar 4, 2015 18:48
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300k less than he used to
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Mar 4, 2015 18:49
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A Pinball Wizard posted:A florist in our area often publically complains that BitPay owes him money and won’t answer his customer support queries (self.Bitcoin) Lol, must be a paid shill obviously
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Mar 4, 2015 18:49
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ANAmal.net posted:300k less than he used to according to the lawyer blog if he paid $300k to expatriate he would have been listed in an irs publication he is not listed in said publication
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Mar 4, 2015 18:50
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Alan Smithee posted:at the end of the day he's still a white dude with
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Mar 4, 2015 18:50
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incidentally some of you might be wondering why anyone in the caribbean gives a gently caress if they can easily travel to canada or not. weirdly, canada has a closer relationship with that region than you might think. to the point where there have been many actual no-kidding movements to have caribbean countries join canada as a new province or territory.
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Mar 4, 2015 18:51
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shadok posted:incidentally some of you might be wondering why anyone in the caribbean gives a gently caress if they can easily travel to canada or not. weirdly, canada has a closer relationship with that region than you might think. to the point where there have been many actual no-kidding movements to have caribbean countries join canada as a new province or territory. That would be rad for vacationing snow geese
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Mar 4, 2015 18:52
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theflyingexecutive posted:how much money does he actually have? apparently not as much as he claims: quote:It should also be noted that Mr. Ver has not yet appeared upon the list of US renunciations, despite having expatriated almost a year ago. It is noteworthy that this list only contains “Covered Expatriates” , who are individuals who renounce either their US citizenship or long-term resident alien status AND meet certain net worth or tax paid thresholds. This may be because he will be on a future list or like his claim to live in Japan, his claimed net worth or US tax bill is a bit inflated. also, as mentioned in the last sentence, dude doesn't actually live in japan. which solves the mystery of how the hell a felon got to live in japan: quote:Next according to credit information, since his release, it would appear that Mr. Ver has been living in California and Hawaii rather than Japan as he claimed. That would make sense, as the Japanese are very leery of letting even visitors in with criminal records, let alone issuing some type of residence status. While he apparently has been at least interviewed by journalists in Japan, it would be interesting to find out if he ever disclosed to the Japanese his criminal past. While he may be doing a bit of “resume expansion” for “street cred” regarding claiming living in Japan, its not criminal. However, it does undermine any claim he might have that he “tried to submit a bunch of proof he lived in Japan” to American officials who refused to accept it. It would also explain why he applied for a B1/B2 visa at the American visa office in Barbados (responsible for St. Kitts and Nevis) rather than Tokyo (which deals with legal residents of Japan). really, everyone who hasn't go back and read the whole article. it's really a pro-click and probably the best info on ver we've ever gotten.
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Mar 4, 2015 18:57
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shadok posted:- citizenship and passport sales may represent up to 25% of st. kitts' GDP
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Mar 4, 2015 19:01
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also lol, the money required to be a covered expat is actually relatively small:quote:If you expatriated after June 16, 2008, the new IRC 877A expatriation rules apply to you if any of the following statements apply. ~150K a year income or 2 million net worth. if Ver doesn't have that much he really is a small fry.
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Mar 4, 2015 19:03
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a libertarian stuck on an island where rich assholes hide their money :jizz:
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Mar 4, 2015 19:07
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shadok posted:incidentally some of you might be wondering why anyone in the caribbean gives a gently caress if they can easily travel to canada or not. weirdly, canada has a closer relationship with that region than you might think. to the point where there have been many actual no-kidding movements to have caribbean countries join canada as a new province or territory. that's pretty nice, actually. a bigger ex-colony helping out a bunch of smaller ex-colonies 
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Mar 4, 2015 19:09
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CampingCarl posted:Google says the GDP is 765.9 million USD (2013). That is a lot of passport money. maybe he meant government revenue
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Mar 4, 2015 19:09
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Its likely that most of Ver's "net worth" is in Bitcoin right? So wouldn't that be the reason he doesn't show up on the list?
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Mar 4, 2015 19:20
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Sir DonkeyPunch posted:maybe he meant government revenue i saw multiple articles saying variations of this: but they may just be quoting each other, or some canadian bureaucrat who pulled the number out of his rear end. it takes a minimum "investment" of $250K to get citizenship in SKN. they said the recall of passports issued between 2012 and 2014 would cover about 6000 documents. if every single one of those was a CIP passport, that'd be $1.5 billion worth, but most of those are probably for real people.
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Mar 4, 2015 19:20
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