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Wolpertinger posted:I have not been paying attention to all the cosmere theorizing lately - what in the world is a Perpendicularity? It's news to me too, but I gather it's a place where it's possible to travel between worlds. http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/21537-what-are-perpendiculars/
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Mar 13, 2015 02:50
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Wolpertinger posted:I have not been paying attention to all the cosmere theorizing lately - what in the world is a Perpendicularity? It's from a short Stormlight 3 Preview scene. Apparently Jasnah needed to find one to leave shadesmar.
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Mar 13, 2015 02:56
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Based on the name and description, I imagine it is conceptually similar to a wormhole.
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Mar 13, 2015 03:08
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So I just finished Way of Kings and I thought it was pretty good. I kind of liked how Dalinar finally got his poo poo together in the end and stopped being so indecisive. Shallan was eh, but I didn't mind the slice-of-life and teenage girl naivety sections in contrast to the other characters. Szeth's sections reminded me of a Platinum action game. And Kaladin...I think he's okay. He keeps flip flopping between despair and hope but has a massive amount of self-pride despite it all.
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Mar 15, 2015 23:38
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As someone who's only read book 1 of the way of kings, and doing the second, it seems that the ama focused on a lot of meta stuff from other books. Where should I start?
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Mar 16, 2015 00:06
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tithin posted:As someone who's only read book 1 of the way of kings, and doing the second, it seems that the ama focused on a lot of meta stuff from other books. Where should I start? Brandon Sanderson is kind of weird among fantasy authors in that he has this elaborate meta-plot going on in the background of most of his books, and he's really open to talking about it. The books don't even touch on it for the most part. Almost everything known about the wider universe comes directly from him blabbing about it on the internet and at conventions.
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Mar 16, 2015 00:26
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It's one of the reasons I am not more of a fan. If you didn't follow all the Q&A stuff Sanderson does you would never know that these worlds are interconnected at all. I hope that's something he corrects in the third Stormlight book.
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Mar 16, 2015 01:15
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The Ninth Layer posted:It's one of the reasons I am not more of a fan. If you didn't follow all the Q&A stuff Sanderson does you would never know that these worlds are interconnected at all. I hope that's something he corrects in the third Stormlight book. With all the world hoppers, hoid, and more in depth explanation of the shards it seems like it's going to be more important.
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Mar 16, 2015 01:34
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The Ninth Layer posted:It's one of the reasons I am not more of a fan. If you didn't follow all the Q&A stuff Sanderson does you would never know that these worlds are interconnected at all. I hope that's something he corrects in the third Stormlight book. There's a lot of background stuff, but it does require a lot of  to find it if you don't have any foreknowledge.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:31
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There's one REALLY obvious world cross the the second stormlight novel. Read warbreaker first, it's worth it. Warbreaker is also enjoyable enough on its own, even if maybe not his best. That said, the third mistborn novel explains the "cosmere" concept fairly clearly, and once those concepts are clear, you can see how the other novels fit into place. Then you can start digging for details, like the names of the various shard holders-- only obvious by trying to discern the etymology of some of the made up names of places and things. Iunnrais fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Mar 16, 2015 |
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Mar 16, 2015 06:00
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amuayse posted:So I just finished Way of Kings and I thought it was pretty good. I actually liked Shallan's chapters and Kaladin's flashback chapters the best. Shallan has a memorable personality (some people say all Sanderson's female leads are all the same, but this isn't true; Vin is basically the opposite of Shallan) and she was mostly trying to figure out the same aspects of the setting I was interested in. The flashbacks had the most plot progress of any of the narratives. Dalinar's chapters got kind of repetitive, and Kaladin in the present was just draining to read about because the universe just kept making GBS threads on him. I liked Words of Radiance better, in part because it gave Dalinar and Kaladin interesting things to do for more of the book. Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Mar 16, 2015 |
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Mar 16, 2015 13:15
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The Ninth Layer posted:It's one of the reasons I am not more of a fan. If you didn't follow all the Q&A stuff Sanderson does you would never know that these worlds are interconnected at all. I hope that's something he corrects in the third Stormlight book. Mistborn, Elantris, Warbreaker and Stormlight Archives spoilers following. A part of the epigraphs from The Way of Kings: quote:Ati was once a kind and generous man, and you saw what became of him. Rayse, on the other hand, was among the most loathsome, crafty, and dangerous individuals I had ever met. He holds the most frightening and terrible of all the Shards. Ponder on that for a time, you old reptile, and tell me if your insistence on nonintervention holds firm. Because I assure you, Rayse will not be similarly inhibited. One need only look at the aftermath of his brief visit to Sel to see proof of what I say. In case you have turned a blind eye to that disaster, know that Aona and Skai are both dead, and that which they held has been Splintered. Presumably to prevent anyone from rising up to challenge Rayse. So, here they mention the world in which Elantris and Emperors Soul take place. The similarity between Aona and AonDor is striking. Connecting Ati (who held the shard of Ruin) to Atium is a bit more difficult, but still doable. Sazed mentioned Adonalsium and shards, which ties nicely into something in the epigraphs of Words of Radiance: quote:The worlds you now tread bear the touch and design of Adonalsium. Our interference so far has brought nothing but pain. My path has been chosen very deliberately. Yes, I agree with everything you have said about Rayse, including the severe danger he presents. However, it seems to me that all things have been set up for a purpose, and if we—as infants—stumble through the workshop, we risk exacerbating, not preventing, a problem. These are all hints that these worlds are connected, though the appearance of Nightblood makes it relatively clear, at least to anybody who read Warbreaker. So you cannot say that it's impossible to know about it without Word of Brandon, though it's quite hidden until Szeth got Nightblood in Words of Radiance.
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Mar 16, 2015 15:28
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The connected universe stuff isn't important in any way beyond being able to go "heh thats familar" as you are reading the books.
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Mar 18, 2015 10:27
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Pwnstar posted:The connected universe stuff isn't important in any way beyond being able to go "heh thats familar" as you are reading the books. At least until the end of Stormlight or the third Mistborn trilogy, but that not gonna be for like... 15-20 years I'd guess.
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Mar 18, 2015 13:10
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The reread for the end game is going to take at least 6 months.
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Mar 18, 2015 20:29
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amuayse posted:What's the most advanced tech in a Sanderson book? The second Mistborn trilogy got guns, trains and cars, and the people begun building their first sky scraper while figuring out electric lights... which actually makes me wonder about the time frame the Cosmere stories happen relative to each other, has Sanderson said anything about this?
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Mar 18, 2015 20:56
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Avalerion posted:The second Mistborn trilogy got guns, trains and cars, and the people begun building their first sky scraper while figuring out electric lights... which actually makes me wonder about the time frame the Cosmere stories happen relative to each other, has Sanderson said anything about this? They used to be in roughly chronological order, but that's sorta broken down, and Sanderson isn't quite finalized on the exact details. This is my best guess from memory. A Long Time Ago Dragonsteel/Liar of Partinel/Whatever Shattering of Adonalisium A few thousand years later? Or something? Elantris A couple decades later: Emperor's Soul A few centuries or millennia later Mistborn 1-3. The Manywar in Warbreaker 300 years later Warbreaker Alloy of Law Stormlight Archive. The way distant future: Sixth of the Dusk
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Mar 18, 2015 21:04
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I would be unreasonably pleased if Someone from Alloy of law turned up in stormlight archives with the technological difference intact. "Hello, nice sword you got there, but this gun of mine kind of makes it moot." 
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Mar 18, 2015 23:00
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It would be a lot better if someone from later on in the Mistborn future history turned up in their allomancy-powered spaceship. This has been promised. E: (allomancy-powered spaceships, that is; I'm unaware of any promises for them to show up on Roshar) E: again: I have no idea what to spoiler tag and what not to in this thread. There's so much unpublished material of which I have no idea how common the knowledge is. thespaceinvader fucked around with this message at 23:44 on Mar 18, 2015 |
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Mar 18, 2015 23:41
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thespaceinvader posted:It would be a lot better if someone from later on in the Mistborn future history turned up in their allomancy-powered spaceship. Current spec is that they cameo in Sixth of the Dusk.
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Mar 19, 2015 00:07
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Tunicate posted:The way distant future: For some reason my brain assumed the space people from Sixth of Dusk are actually Elantrians. I don't know if there was a subtle clue I didn't realize I picked up on behind that assumption or if its just wild conjecture. Which makes sense to me because: Their powers and tech allow for advanced travel. Advances lead to spacefaring warships. Spacefaring warships + Shard Magic leads to cross Cosmere travel. Hence traveling to Sel through the Shadesmar is "Difficult" only because its actively guarded. e; Disclaimer: I actively avoid the 17th shard forums, I only read what Sanderson himself said. M_Gargantua fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Mar 19, 2015 |
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Mar 19, 2015 00:37
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I think the dangerous travel was clarified to be based on local environmental conditions. I'm guessing it's future mistborn just because that ambassador faked his death, so he's likely a kandra
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Mar 19, 2015 02:42
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I finished Way of Kings and did not like it one bit. It's the only Sanderson book I've read and it will likely remain the only one. I kept waffling back and forth between Sanderson being a completely clueless writer and an incredibly deliberate one. Some of it reads like fan-fiction for some other author's setting. Particularly anything dealing with Shardblades/plates, spren, and any time magic is involved. Sanderson is never content to let the reader assume that spren are around. He's gotta mention it every drat time. Same thing with stormlight. There's probably a whole chapters worth of "...stormlight leaked from something..." It became really exhausting to have to trudge through these constant reminders that this is a fantasy world. Please don't forget. I could have probably looked past those annoyances if the plot had been engaging. I don't think the series of events were particularly bad, they were just stretched far too much. So many chapters where the plot barely progressed at all. Instead there's pitiful character moments that don't win me over at all. Dalinar is boring, Kaladin is depressed yet powerful, and Shallan is clueless. Maybe Sanderson deliberately made the characters unlikable, though I can't figure out why he would. It was just a big uninteresting mess. Especially considering how many folks had touted Sanderson's world building. That aspect in particular fell ridiculously flat for me.
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Mar 20, 2015 01:42
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It' s easy to start off on the wrong foot with Way of Kings, because the first chapter feels extremely videogame tutorialey. I'd say try Warbreaker ( http://brandonsanderson.com/books/warbreaker/warbreaker/warbreaker-rights-and-downloads/ ), since it's free, and if you don't like it (particularly the Lightsong segments), Sanderson probably isn't to your taste. Tunicate fucked around with this message at 01:54 on Mar 20, 2015 |
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Mar 20, 2015 01:47
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Tunicate put it well, but i'm genuinely curious as to your preferred fantasy (writer) is, apophenium, if you would be so kind as to share? 
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Mar 20, 2015 01:52
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Thyrork posted:Tunicate put it well, but i'm genuinely curious as to your preferred fantasy is, apophenium, if you would be so kind as to share? The only really big fantasy thing I've read is the Malazan Book of the Fallen, but I liked it to a hyperbolic degree. I've read ASoIaF as well, and it was fine. I'm reading Perdido Street Station (China Mieville) right now and really loving it. Also liked the Lies of Locke Lamora quite a bit. I don't really know what the difference is. All things considered I probably should have loved Way of Kings.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:01
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Read him at his best: http://www.amazon.ca/The-Emperors-Soul-Brandon-Sanderson/dp/1616960922 Still one of the books that I'm going to keep no matter how much I move around in life.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:12
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apophenium posted:The only really big fantasy thing I've read is the Malazan Book of the Fallen, but I liked it to a hyperbolic degree. I've read ASoIaF as well, and it was fine. I'm reading Perdido Street Station (China Mieville) right now and really loving it. Also liked the Lies of Locke Lamora quite a bit. I don't really know what the difference is. All things considered I probably should have loved Way of Kings. I was just having this conversation with a friend (like, literally 15 minutes ago), because I'm trying right now for the fourth(?) time to read Malazan Book of the Fallen. I described Brandon Sanderson as the anti-Steven Erikson: Sanderson has a tendency to explain everything that's happening, in full detail, right away, and leaves very little for you to pick up as you read. Erikson just throws you into his world, starts a bunch of plots running, and says to the reader, "gently caress you, figure it out from context clues" Sanderson's over-exposition irks me a bit, but it's way better than Erikson's books... I can't get invested in the world or any of the characters because I can't figure out what they're doing or why they're doing it. It's insane. I've read the first book at least 3 times and I still can't tell you anything about the plot other than this: - There are some thieves that kidnap a girl - There are some soldiers occupying a foreign city - There's a guy named after a gardening implement who can turn into a dragon for some reason And maybe something about some mages and a guy whose spirit is trapped in a doll? Then literally every single one of those plot threads is dropped in the second book, and it starts up again with a new set of equally incomprehensible plot lines. I give up about a quarter into the second book because I feel like I should be getting some sort of pay off by that point. I hear so many good things about the series and I really want to like it, so I keep convincing myself that I'm just missing something and give it another shot.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:17
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SystemLogoff posted:Read him at his best: Yeah, actually, I retract my previous advice. Do this.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:19
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apophenium posted:Sanderson is never content to let the reader assume that spren are around. He's gotta mention it every drat time. How are you going to assume spren are around? You, the reader, have no real idea what does and does not cause a spren to appear. That's kind of one of the mysteries of the world that slowly makes more sense as the series progresses - what spren are and what can cause them to appear. He has to tell the reader they're around. I actually liked being reminded. Things like 'fear spren' are interesting because it makes it hard, if not impossible, to hide how if you're afraid of something. Or any other sort of emotional spren. It changes social dynamics a bit, being able to read people that well in certain situations.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:21
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Yeroc2 posted:I actually liked being reminded. Things like 'fear spren' are interesting because it makes it hard, if not impossible, to hide how if you're afraid of something. Or any other sort of emotional spren. It changes social dynamics a bit, being able to read people that well in certain situations. This is cool and good but didn't actually ever happen in the story. Spren were mostly ignored by the characters themselves, other than like, rotspren, which were deadly, which made their inclusion seem incredibly indulgent and unnecessary (to me). Ithaqua I like your post. One of the things I noticed Sanderson doing occasionally was over-informing the reader, for sure. Like towards the end when Kaladin goes super-saiyan one of the bridgemen literally says "Something just changed. Something important." This kind of stuff happened any time the plot shuddered forward by any degree. I don't mind a little hand holding by the author so the major themes land, but Sanderson's voice came through too strong in WoK. Like a dad at a museum gleefully explaining why their child should care about such and such and how important blah was. Granted, WoK is my only experience w/ Sanderson compared to the 11 Malazan books I've read. Sanderson seems much more taken with his world than I ended up being.
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Mar 20, 2015 03:07
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Ithaqua posted:Then literally every single one of those plot threads is dropped in the second book, and it starts up again with a new set of equally incomprehensible plot lines. I give up about a quarter into the second book because I feel like I should be getting some sort of pay off by that point. I hear so many good things about the series and I really want to like it, so I keep convincing myself that I'm just missing something and give it another shot. Oh man, Deadhouse Gates is so loving good. I'm currently rereading it at the moment. I highly encourage you to finish that book and if you still didn't get into it, then Erikson's style probably isn't your thing. Some of the most seriously badass stuff that happens in the series happens in DG. The thing about Erikson's writing is some plot points get dropped, and others don't get revisited until later books, but a lot of stuff eventually gets revisited. You just have to go with it and sometimes understand you won't know what the hell is going on. You might eventually get enlightened later on, you might not. On a reread the books take on a whole new light because you start to fully understand all the cryptic deck readings and conversations that gods are having...usually. I mean, I can think of several plot points started in DG that don't get straightened out or explained until like, 20 pages from the end of the series. I can think of others that never have been explained and you can only guess what was happening.
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Mar 20, 2015 03:35
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Ithaqua posted:I was just having this conversation with a friend (like, literally 15 minutes ago), because I'm trying right now for the fourth(?) time to read Malazan Book of the Fallen. I gave up on Malazan when I came across a chart of book releases vs chronology and how it all fit in and it looked like a toddler drew all over a football play after John Madden had it for an hour.
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Mar 21, 2015 00:50
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Evil Fluffy posted:I gave up on Malazan when I came across a chart of book releases vs chronology and how it all fit in and it looked like a toddler drew all over a football play after John Madden had it for an hour. 
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Mar 21, 2015 01:10
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Is that you, unified Zelda timeline??
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Mar 21, 2015 01:45
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It's really, really not as complicated as that looks. Like, if you can handle the idea that "Book 1 takes place here, Book 2 takes place there, Book 3 takes place at book 1's place again but at the same time as book 2 , book 5 is before everything" and poo poo like that it's not exactly difficult to comprehend. Also the stuff on the very left and right (ICE and B/KB books) could be completely eliminated as it isn't main series stuff anyway.
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Mar 21, 2015 02:29
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I've tried reading Malazan 3 times and I always give during Midnight Tides because it just whips out a new set of characters that I have no investment in compared to the great character built up during the first 4 books. I know the 6th book continues with the main story line, but I want to finish the 5th book, which kills all my interest. The 2nd and 3rd book are some of my favorites in fantasy, but the 5th book is just a showstopper.
L-O-N fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Mar 21, 2015 |
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Mar 21, 2015 16:10
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That's too bad because that is one of the best in the series.
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Mar 21, 2015 17:29
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I liked the first two books of the Stormlight Archives but Shallan really needs to stop blushing all the time, it's embarassing
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Mar 22, 2015 01:25
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L-O-N posted:I've tried reading Malazan 3 times and I always give during Midnight Tides because it just whips out a new set of characters that I have no investment in compared to the great character built up during the first 4 books. I know the 6th book continues with the main story line, but I want to finish the 5th book, which kills all my interest. The 2nd and 3rd book are some of my favorites in fantasy, but the 5th book is just a showstopper. Echoing what Hand Row said, the 5th book introduces some of the best characters in the entire series. I found it fun to watch it all merge back together at some point once I figured out when the book is taking place with respect to the first 4 books. But we should probably stop talking about Malazan in the Sanderson thread 
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Mar 22, 2015 06:03
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