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I came to this thread seeking wisdom. I currently work at a company where most people have horrible communication skills. The entire structure is built around social BS and they are a highly complex web hosting company that is barely held together by hopes and dreams on the inside. I've been here 6 months and am at my wits end because no one wants to do anything to improve any of it, but they keep saying they need to figure out a way to make it operate better. Every time I try to outline how to make it work I'm ignored because I'm not respected. I'm already having multiple instances where I'm tempted to just walk out because too many people keep passing the buck and leaving people like me who actually try to fix it to pick up the mess. There's too much mess and not enough people like me though. Now they're starting to push "accountability" my direction without any way to push back. It seems everyone here just wants to do as little as possible and no one actually wants to do what is needed to make it work. Too much effort is lost in simply trying to figure out what needs to be done, much less how it should be done because no one communicates details or documents anything. They don't believe in standardizing procedures so everything is a one-off case without any details on how it's supposed to function and they want to now add accountability and metrics. It feels like a situation that is a setup for failure. Am I judging the situation too hard? I see clear and decisive things that would improve productivity but none of it is ever taken into consideration, much less deployed. Essentially they seem to be saying what I want to hear then turn around and do the exact opposite. Am in the wrong if I jump ship and go somewhere where people actually do their jobs and has less stress?
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May 13, 2015 15:54
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evol262 posted:99% of the people with these complaints ("I'm a passenger in my own life and I have no idea how to take control to change anything!") would have their problems solved by reading philosophy. Not huge dry stuff either. This, this, and this are cheap, readable in an afternoon, and directly address that issue. In my case, I could just work more on improving my skillset instead of getting home and just drop to the floor because it's too drat hot to do anything
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May 13, 2015 15:56
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Internet Explorer posted:Well, when someone mentioned people who make posts that are annoying to read (paraphrasing, phone posting) and 3 people reference you by, and just you, by name within an hour, maybe your posts are annoying to read? Very informative and have pushed me to learn more about non-ESXi/XenServer/Hyper-V virtualization, but still very annoying to read. Almost like you're a Linux developer! Honest Thief posted:I'd say some good old Dostoevsky would help more, maybe not jump straight to Karamazov Brothers but start with some Notes From the Underground. Being happy is actually simple, just a matter of acceptance; but everyone's rorsharch nowadays. Making it through Dostoevsky is kind of the problem, and Dostoevsky tends to reach for God as an answer to an inscrutable world of full of despair. I recommended the other books because they're all about "how do I actualize my own life" and forcing you to realize that you are making decisions which determine the outcome of your life constantly rather than just being pushed along by the whims of whomever.
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May 13, 2015 16:04
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DarkMoJo posted:I came to this thread seeking wisdom.
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May 13, 2015 16:07
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Honest Thief posted:start with some Notes From the Underground. Being happy is actually simple, just a matter of acceptance; but everyone's rorsharch nowadays.
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May 13, 2015 16:08
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Honest Thief posted:but its haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaard So is my dick, but you don't hear me complaining. Seriously, though. I have been meaning to pick up The Myth of Sisyphus for a while. Evol recommended it around the same time I was trying to get out of my lovely last job. I think sometime this week I'm just going to go to the local book store and special order that and The Rebel. Go on a Camus kick. Is there a virtual solution for studying for the CCENT like there is for the MCSA? I want to try to get as much done as I can in the weeks between these next two semesters, since a lot of junior admin positions seem to want a mix of system and network knowledge.
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May 13, 2015 16:11
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22 Eargesplitten posted:So is my dick, but you don't hear me complaining. I would check out http://www.gns3.com/ or http://virl.cisco.com/about-virl-2/
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May 13, 2015 16:16
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evol262 posted:Making it through Dostoevsky is kind of the problem, and Dostoevsky tends to reach for God as an answer to an inscrutable world of full of despair. I recommended the other books because they're all about "how do I actualize my own life" and forcing you to realize that you are making decisions which determine the outcome of your life constantly rather than just being pushed along by the whims of whomever. Bhodi posted:Wait, what? It's about a loathsome, bitter, belligerent old man as he transforms his self-hatred into hating the world in general as an overall defense strategy while crying at the unfairness of it all. Not the best role model, I guess except as a warning. Why on earth would you suggest STARTING there?
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May 13, 2015 16:18
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GNS3 + a router image will appropriately emulate most of what you need for the CCENT. I understand Cisco has a thing now that can emulate switches but I'm not sure how pricing works for it. e: f, b. 
12 rats tied together fucked around with this message at 16:21 on May 13, 2015 |
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May 13, 2015 16:19
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Honest Thief posted:Because people stuck in a rut tend to feel like that, so like Bernhard's Concrete seeing those feeling exteriorised helps.. you're not meant to go "yeah, this dude had it right!" Then again, people watch reality shows to buoy themselves up, so what do I know, I deal with computers, not people. Still, I think positive messages (you're awesome!) are better than negative ones (don't be like this idiot)
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May 13, 2015 16:39
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DarkMoJo posted:Am in the wrong if I jump ship and go somewhere where people actually do their jobs and has less stress? Nobody is ever in the wrong for quitting provided that they do so in a professional manner. Depending on the scale of the BS you deal with, sometimes we won't fault you for quitting in an unprofessional manner.
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May 13, 2015 16:44
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I really enjoy my job-- like, I don't mind waking up in the morning and sometimes look forward to coming in and accomplishing something. I'm on track to become the network admin in <1 year, certs are paid for and I get to touch a lot of neat technology. Small, public University IT. Pay sucks, everything else is great. Future is uncertain, though-- IT Director is retiring next year and this university has started a trend of outsourcing operations, although no mention has been made about our department. I have an interview tomorrow. It would be with the county courthouse, I'd be a one-man IT department for around a dozen employees. I'd work directly under the county judge. Pay starts at 2k above what I'm making now, but I think I can talk them up some more because I wouldn't take the job at that rate. I know it sounds like I'm putting the cart before the horse here, but I've got an inside source that they've only got two applicants and the other one has very little experience. Oh well, I won't really be able to make any kind of decision until I learn more about their workplace, anyways.
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May 13, 2015 16:53
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Personally I wouldn't take that court job as everyone I've spoke to doing the one-man-band IT job has hated it, and a dedicated IT guy for 12 members of staff means you'll be busy for your first month or two while you sort a load of poo poo out and make some improvements/changes, then you'll spend 90% of your day on SA. While it is awesome at first, the novelty wears off after a few months and time drags really, really, really slowly. I quit my last job because of this.
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May 13, 2015 16:57
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The people mad at evol are generally pissed off that he won't contribute to the self-pity that many posters here feel.
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May 13, 2015 17:01
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psydude posted:The people mad at evol are generally pissed off that he won't contribute to the self-pity that many posters here feel. It's more standard human decency than self-pity, goons in general including this thread have trouble with that concept pretty often.
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May 13, 2015 17:15
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Honest Thief posted:This is a derail best fit for book bark, but while Dostoevsky's are inherently religious, I don't think he's so much about reaching for God, at least in the Christian sense Not that there's anything necessarily wrong with it, I just see it as kind of a copout. I guess if we're saying Camus says "maybe there's a point, but it doesn't matter either way", and Sartre saying "there's a point, and it's it's living authentically", and Nietzsche saying "there's no point, and it doesn't matter, but you should transcend the morality of others and live for yourself", putting God at the end of the rainbow is a cheap a priori trick. 22 Eargesplitten posted:Seriously, though. I have been meaning to pick up The Myth of Sisyphus for a while. Evol recommended it around the same time I was trying to get out of my lovely last job. I think sometime this week I'm just going to go to the local book store and special order that and The Rebel. Go on a Camus kick. Honestly, it starts with, basically "there's only one serious philosophical question, and it's why shouldn't I kill myself?" and only gets better. You didn't make the choice to be here, but how can you make choices that let you live your life the way you want to instead of just ending the farce? It's a fun read.
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May 13, 2015 17:20
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There's human decency and there is "requiring coddling" and at the risk of using an inflammatory generalization that makes me sound like a crotchety old man, the millennial generation seems to need a lot more of the latter. A little tough love is sometimes required in life.
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May 13, 2015 17:24
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Ahdinko posted:Personally I wouldn't take that court job as everyone I've spoke to doing the one-man-band IT job has hated it, and a dedicated IT guy for 12 members of staff means you'll be busy for your first month or two while you sort a load of poo poo out and make some improvements/changes, then you'll spend 90% of your day on SA. While it is awesome at first, the novelty wears off after a few months and time drags really, really, really slowly. I quit my last job because of this. This is where I'm at for the most part at my new job. LOTS of downtime. Not in a bad lazy way, it's just I came in to the most well organized, documented environment that I've seen. I've made some slight changes here and there to improve things but nothing time consuming and hard to implement. I'm using the downtime to study for certs, improve my powershell skills, and setting up labs to play with. I'm also using the time to learn more about SEO and passive income and side businesses. So dont discount down time! I'm sure after about a year I'll be bored senseless but for now it's really nice.
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May 13, 2015 17:26
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Honest question about career change, what are some practical advises for doing it? In terms of still working at you do and pursuing a change on technology or business client.evol262 posted:I mean more in the sense that he takes the same leap as Kierkegaard. "Well, life is pretty meaningless, and we need to make our own meaning, but is there a point to it all? Of course! There's God!"
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May 13, 2015 17:26
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Dark Helmut posted:There's human decency and there is "requiring coddling" and at the risk of using an inflammatory generalization that makes me sound like a crotchety old man, the millennial generation seems to need a lot more of the latter. A little tough love is sometimes required in life. I don't see the vast majority of "help me" posts in here "requiring coddling", they're mostly just from people who genuinely need help and don't have someone in real life to turn to with experience. As for your retarded age/generation prejudice, you can gently caress right off with that dumb poo poo.
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May 13, 2015 17:28
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Tab8715 posted:Do tell... I stopped listening after he told me Microsoft was far superior because you couldn't get into the kernel and start screwing with things, making all linux inherently unsecure. It still makes my head hurt.
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May 13, 2015 17:30
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CLAM DOWN posted:I don't see the vast majority of "help me" posts in here "requiring coddling", they're mostly just from people who genuinely need help and don't have someone in real life to turn to with experience. As for your retarded age/generation prejudice, you can gently caress right off with that dumb poo poo. Oh I didn't even read his post, I was too busy snapchatting selfies and switching jobs.
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May 13, 2015 17:31
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CLAM DOWN posted:I don't see the vast majority of "help me" posts in here "requiring coddling", they're mostly just from people who genuinely need help and don't have someone in real life to turn to with experience. As for your retarded age/generation prejudice, you can gently caress right off with that dumb poo poo. I agree, 95% of the people asking for help have questions about career progression, 5% are people who are trying to borrow some spine from experienced professionals. And stow all that millennial talk, especially if you are a goddamn baby boomer
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May 13, 2015 17:32
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CLAM DOWN posted:I don't see the vast majority of "help me" posts in here "requiring coddling", they're mostly just from people who genuinely need help and don't have someone in real life to turn to with experience. As for your retarded age/generation prejudice, you can gently caress right off with that dumb poo poo. Do MOST of them? Absolutely not. And my statement was clearly a generalization as advertised. "Here's how it looks from another perspective". When you have a guy who basically wrote a short novel spanning 10 posts about the hell he's gone through and how many pages of supportive help for him and he's STILL trying to go back, I'm simply saying maybe a tougher message is required. But sure, I'll gently caress off. Not going to derail any further, just passing the time til we find out what happened when he inevitably went back to work.
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May 13, 2015 17:36
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CLAM DOWN posted:I don't see the vast majority of "help me" posts in here "requiring coddling", they're mostly just from people who genuinely need help and don't have someone in real life to turn to with experience. As for your retarded age/generation prejudice, you can gently caress right off with that dumb poo poo. I seem to recall you berating someone in this very thread for not understanding how DHCP worked. How is that any different from what you're complaining about now?
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May 13, 2015 17:38
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ElGroucho posted:And stow all that millennial talk, especially if you are a goddamn baby boomer We have one "millennial" employee right now, and she is one of the god drat hardest workers we have.
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May 13, 2015 17:39
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DarkMoJo posted:They don't believe in standardizing procedures Yeah no that can't really work. How do you measure something if everything is measured differently? You need standards before you can get meaningful metrics.
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May 13, 2015 17:41
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The Fool posted:We have one "millennial" employee right now, and she is one of the god drat hardest workers we have.
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May 13, 2015 17:42
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psydude posted:I seem to recall you berating someone in this very thread for not understanding how DHCP worked. How is that any different from what you're complaining about now? I don't have any memory of that and can't find anything related to that in my post history, and my posts here are mostly about the non-technical aspects of IT anyway so I think you might be confusing me with someone else. Either way, a technical discussion is completely different than a actual prejudice/stereotype against an entire generation/age category.
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May 13, 2015 17:42
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certain posters are pretty apologetic about lovely companies because it doesn't happen in their environment so obviously another company would never treat an employee bad WHY ARE YOU NOT THANKING YOUR MERCIFUL JOB CREATOR so i just ignore them and move on
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May 13, 2015 17:49
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I complained about a guy who hasn't posted in 12 years and within a day we've descended into backstabbing anarchy what the hell people
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May 13, 2015 17:59
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Honest Thief posted:Just one? Millennial's range from 1979 to current Everything I've seen implies 1990+ Gen x would be 1970s and 1980s Wikipedia seems to agree with me, but acknowledges ambiguity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation#Western_world
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May 13, 2015 17:59
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The Fool posted:Everything I've seen implies 1990+ 
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May 13, 2015 18:03
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The guy who keeps working at his abusive job is an idiot who needs to grow a pair and leave. But that certainly doesn't mean that all millennials can be painted with a 'needs to be babied' brush. That's mostly media bullshit and the changing perceptions of (rather spoiled) boomers.
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May 13, 2015 18:05
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Mrit posted:The guy who keeps working at his abusive job is an idiot who needs to grow a pair and leave. But that certainly doesn't mean that all millennials can be painted with a 'needs to be babied' brush. That's mostly media bullshit and the changing perceptions of (rather spoiled) boomers. Also that dude is an Assuie so he had to have some balls, growing up fighting Kangaroos, Kiwi birds, and giant man eating arachnids. What happened between then and now?
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May 13, 2015 18:38
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CLAM DOWN posted:I don't see the vast majority of "help me" posts in here "requiring coddling", they're mostly just from people who genuinely need help and don't have someone in real life to turn to with experience. As for your retarded age/generation prejudice, you can gently caress right off with that dumb poo poo. Millennials notwithstanding (since I don't think they're any better/worse than anybody else), all of the threads in SH/SC have some kind of bias where "real life experience" translates to "the man is trying to gently caress you, so gently caress him first", "attachment to your job is being a goon in a well", or "here's how loving important I am, so you should try to follow in my footsteps", despite the fact that almost none of us would act this way in real life. It's like weird internet tough guy syndrome where the oppressed, antisocial IT guy has delusional power fantasies, and the amount of "you should tell your employer X" (with the obvious subtext that the poster would never have the balls to say that, and hopefully has enough social awareness not to even if they have the spine) is inane. It's harder to give relatively nuanced advice about how to get ahead. There's a definite middle ground between game theory and being a doorstop that you can navigate to get to a job where you're happy, doing interesting stuff, and don't have horrible expectations set on your or PTSD from getting there. But it's easier to pretend that the world is a nasty, brutish, dog-eat-dog place and you can only get ahead by doing that. I'd wager that many of the goons here who don't "require coddling" actually do in real life. Nothing wrong with that. But the  rants people go on when they have to justify their decisions is just at odds with our position in the business and how it works.
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May 13, 2015 18:39
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DarkMoJo posted:Am I judging the situation too hard? I see clear and decisive things that would improve productivity but none of it is ever taken into consideration, much less deployed. Essentially they seem to be saying what I want to hear then turn around and do the exact opposite. Am in the wrong if I jump ship and go somewhere where people actually do their jobs and has less stress? This sounds like a mirror image of the company I'm at now, it's not really advice but try and take some time off. If you're loaded with tons of responsibility keeping everything running, everyone gets to see everything go to poo poo around them while you're away. For me it's a very harsh reminder to send out that people rely on me far too much (and that we need to hire new people/train current people to take care of the day-to-day donkey work nevermind the IT poo poo) 
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May 13, 2015 19:03
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Dark Helmut posted:When you have a guy who basically wrote a short novel spanning 10 posts about the hell he's gone through and how many pages of supportive help for him and he's STILL trying to go back, I'm simply saying maybe a tougher message is required. Yes, that could and may be true or it's someone in poor mental health and needs actual attention from a medical professional?
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May 13, 2015 19:07
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Tab8715 posted:Yes, that could and may be true or it's someone in poor mental health and needs actual attention from a medical professional? It is almost like this person saw a medical professional and also ignored their advice as well to a point.
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May 13, 2015 19:11
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nielsm posted:Yeah no that can't really work. How do you measure something if everything is measured differently? You need standards before you can get meaningful metrics. This is the EXACT situation / problem my current company is in.
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May 13, 2015 19:21
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