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fiery_valkyrie
Mar 26, 2003

I'm proud of you, Bender. Sure, you lost. You lost bad. But the important thing is I beat up someone who hurt my feelings in high school.
Gamer, did Nth roleblock any of the cops on N2?

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Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

I'm going to keep believing in the Dethy because I like logic puzzles. I feel like the idea of a dethy with a traitor as a minigame fits nicely for Ecco and is a nice twist.


From that, if you guys recieve results as TOWN or SCUM. Then the Clarent-aligned is SCUM.
FV got a town result on town, Spoonsy got a town result on confirmed town. WWM got a town result on town. Merk is paraanoid. Punt had to be Insane.

And from there, Clarent-aligned recruited Quidnose. A recruiting SCUM faction, yeah that's a cult. Wins wasn't recruited so there are still two other recruits out there, so there is a minimum for 3 cultists about.

With 4 cops (1 being scum), 1 confirmed town, myself as town, that leaves 3/5 of:
100YrsofAttitude
choaslord
Hal Incandenza
Max
Quinquereme

as potential cultists art a minimum.


Am I being paranoid?

Iseult
Apr 21, 2010

hoc est bellum
Hell Gem
Sorry for missing most of the last two days guys - really bad timing with work and time zones, AND OUR BID ON A HOUSE WAS ACCEPTED!! :slick:


Amoeba, I think it's really suspicious that you're so focused on finding out who the Clarent alignment is (is it even definitely a cult?), and calling them a scum cult when they're definitely not scum. Ecco posted this about wins:

EccoRaven posted:

And two: he was not a conspirator. Quite the contrary! Though cleverly disguised, he was in fact Laurence de Pêche, Lady Clarent's elder son and heir to Peachtree Hall (Georgette's plot notwithstanding).

And look at the WW flip:

EccoRaven posted:

It turns out WW was an angry, bitter servant, and a traitor who was plotting the death of Lady Clarent. It was good that he died.

I'm sure you didn't forget the name of this game is Lady Clarent's and her sister Georgette, the scum faction, is trying to kill her. So how on earth would Clarent being a scum cult make sense?

It would only make sense from your p.o.v. if you were scum and didn't care who dies as long as it's not scum.

In addition, wins being a rolecop and calling you out makes me think you are in fact the fireball murderer, and you didn't use it last night case someone was watching you after wins called you out.

##vote Amoeba



And on an unrelated note,

Amoeba102 posted:

And don't go down the road that Gamer isn't town - Nth said they were confirmed masons.

How come Nth didn't flip as a mason? Does that usually not show up in the flip?

Iseult
Apr 21, 2010

hoc est bellum
Hell Gem
Looking back at the time stamps, (if I calculated correctly) there was still a whole day before the deadline when wins was killed and he never got to post why he asked Amoeba to claim.

In that context this is pretty awful.

Amoeba102 posted:

I've been waiting for wins. But I've kind of gotten bored.

##vote wins32767

Iseult
Apr 21, 2010

hoc est bellum
Hell Gem

chaoslord posted:

Quinquereme, would you vote wins? Why or why not? Dont need to actually move your vote if yes since I'd rather we wait, but I'm curious about your thoughts on things as they are now after you've had some time to reflect

Too late on this one sorry.

Going back there's just so little he posted and I can't read it now without knowing his alignment. He reads more absent than scummy to me but I honestly don't know how much of that is actually a genuine read and how much is based on knowing.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

Quinquereme posted:

Sorry for missing most of the last two days guys - really bad timing with work and time zones, AND OUR BID ON A HOUSE WAS ACCEPTED!! :slick:


Amoeba, I think it's really suspicious that you're so focused on finding out who the Clarent alignment is (is it even definitely a cult?), and calling them a scum cult when they're definitely not scum. Ecco posted this about wins:


And look at the WW flip:


I'm sure you didn't forget the name of this game is Lady Clarent's and her sister Georgette, the scum faction, is trying to kill her. So how on earth would Clarent being a scum cult make sense?

It would only make sense from your p.o.v. if you were scum and didn't care who dies as long as it's not scum.

In addition, wins being a rolecop and calling you out makes me think you are in fact the fireball murderer, and you didn't use it last night case someone was watching you after wins called you out.

##vote Amoeba



And on an unrelated note,


How come Nth didn't flip as a mason? Does that usually not show up in the flip?


The Clarent flavour is quite possibly a ruse and is something Ecco has done in the past. Ecco plays with conventions. But in the end, it's flavour and doesn't guide the game. What I'm looking at is the supposed Insane cop getting a TOWN result when results are TOWN/SCUM. Ergo the real result would be SCUM. We've also seen a recruit, see Quidnose's flip.
So, scum and recruiting. Yeah I'm going to go with Clarent-team being a cult since it's based more on in game evidence than the flavour.

More on that, Quidnose was recruited and flipped as "Clarent-aligned ??". Not Clarent-aligned Vanilla. It's more obsfuscation to avoid the obvious conclusion that Clarent's are not good people.

If you want to look at how wins played his rolecop. He probably got a result on one of my secret roles (I'm unsure on the details since they are secret), and felt he could twist it. If he were pro-toen (read that as clarent is pro-town) and he had something bad he would have come right out with it. He had plenty of time to respond after I responded to him. He didn't have anything good, and the dethy claiming was a good distraction. I don't think he had anything useful and the way he played it was more scummy to me than townie. He softly claimed something and never followed through, more likely hoping to get a spooked reaction he could use. And when I didn't react as he hoped, he dropped it quietly.

Everything fits, Clarent is bad.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

Quinquereme posted:

Looking back at the time stamps, (if I calculated correctly) there was still a whole day before the deadline when wins was killed and he never got to post why he asked Amoeba to claim.

In that context this is pretty awful.

You've said something like this before. Yeah, there was a whole day left till deadline. But wins last post was asking me to claim on Jul 18, 22:22, I voted on Jul 20 22:20. So in those 48 hours wins couldn't come in and say anything? You'll excuse me if I got bored waiting for him to elaborate.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

Quinquereme posted:

And on an unrelated note,


How come Nth didn't flip as a mason? Does that usually not show up in the flip?

Because he had a power role and sometimes mods don't put mason in the flip when it's secondary.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

And congratulations on the house. Sydney prices suck so I hope you still have at least one limb remaining.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

Quinquereme posted:

Ok Punt didn't post much at all and I'm not getting any feelings from his stuff at all.

In case anyone smarter wants to have a look, here are all the people that mentioned Punt since I have them all open:
D2
zzyzx says he's worth looking at
Max agrees

wins votes him
100 agrees with wins

And of course anything from the masonry.

What was the point of looking at people voting for or being suspicious of Punt after he was dead?

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




I'm at a loss but my track record for being consistently wrong as town is untouched at least.

I'm going to re-read what I can. I don't know how wise it would be ignore the dethy context but I'm going to do so for the time being. I'll take it into account once I've made my reads.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

I'm getting a little overwhelmed, but my gut says Quin and Hal are bad guys. Sad to say it.

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




Amoeba102 posted:

I'm getting a little overwhelmed, but my gut says Quin and Hal are bad guys. Sad to say it.

Quin really? She's putting in her time and she's posting well and honestly. I don't read her as scum in the slightest. Your role power is wrong to many in so many ways, especially the fact that it comes to you in bits and pieces, that's the number 1 thing that I suspect about you though you seem to post ok. I feel that the thing people are harping you on, like how you questioned Squiggly for so long before voting, I feel I've seen you do that pretty regularly.

I don't know about Hal. I haven't gotten to him yet but he's not someone I actually feel is town.

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




Amoeba102 posted:

##vote Walrus Whiskers

Your day 1 is pretty much just commentary mainly on the Keane max bit and a bit of back and forth with quidnose. You hammer Walrus but I couldn't see if you ever really cared about that vote.

Day 2 you start by calling Quidnose town due to his paranoia and after arguing with Squiggly you lay your vote down there.

I don't find much necessarily incriminating. I could say you overly focus on the dethy and there's a bit of role fishing in speculating that the roleblockers are scum otherwise they'd of revealed themselves, but that's all I get. Again your powers and role are suspicious because I dont know why you wouldn't know what it is right off the bat, but that's not a good enough reason in itself. And besides your powers don't seem to hurt town so so far so good.

merk
May 20, 2003

##interact
I got a SCUM result on Nth, so that looks to confirm that I'm paranoid.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

merk posted:

I got a SCUM result on Nth, so that looks to confirm that I'm paranoid.

That's what I figured. Having the result be SCUM fits my picture of the game in regards to Punt being Insane and Clarent being bad too.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

100YrsofAttitude posted:

Quin really? She's putting in her time and she's posting well and honestly. I don't read her as scum in the slightest. Your role power is wrong to many in so many ways, especially the fact that it comes to you in bits and pieces, that's the number 1 thing that I suspect about you though you seem to post ok. I feel that the thing people are harping you on, like how you questioned Squiggly for so long before voting, I feel I've seen you do that pretty regularly.

I don't know about Hal. I haven't gotten to him yet but he's not someone I actually feel is town.

I just get a gut feeling she is Clarent aligned and evidence to me in the game points to Clarent being bad for the town despite what the flavour would lead yopu to believe.

Amoeba102
Jan 22, 2010

100YrsofAttitude posted:

Your day 1 is pretty much just commentary mainly on the Keane max bit and a bit of back and forth with quidnose. You hammer Walrus but I couldn't see if you ever really cared about that vote.

Day 2 you start by calling Quidnose town due to his paranoia and after arguing with Squiggly you lay your vote down there.

I don't find much necessarily incriminating. I could say you overly focus on the dethy and there's a bit of role fishing in speculating that the roleblockers are scum otherwise they'd of revealed themselves, but that's all I get. Again your powers and role are suspicious because I dont know why you wouldn't know what it is right off the bat, but that's not a good enough reason in itself. And besides your powers don't seem to hurt town so so far so good.

Secret role stuff is weird. I gather it's the only reason I was told I got targeted for a the firekill - because the secret role/power was discovered. If you get what I mean.

Spoonsy
Dec 6, 2005

Yeah, life is hilariously cruel.
Grimey Drawer
Just wanted to chime in that I got poo poo roleblock flavor last night.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

We have a nightkill that looks and smells like a werewolf and now we have a player that is bulletproof but they don't know it with apparently a strange result from a role-cop (I am not happy wins did in fact have a result but didn't come back to explain it, but maybe something came up in his life or something.) I don't think it would be a stretch to think that Amoeba is the one responsible for the werewolf-looking kill. I don't know how much I believe their claim that they didn't know about being bulletproof, but whatever.

FV, what was your theory on Wins yesterday? I'm interested in your thoughts since there isn't much here in the thread that you've shared. Chaoslord too, I suppose.

Also, as a final note, I was recruited into the Clarent group last night. I'm not super happy about having my alignment change mid-game since I was perfectly happy with what I had (VT) but them's the breaks The win condition has remained the same, but from what I can understand, it comes with an additional condition that one of the original members of the group must be alive by the end of the game in order for us to win now, so it's a weird masonry-survivor group that only wins with the town. Honestly, the message I got wasn't super clear.

I do know who else is in the group, but I can personally only talk to the person that recruited me. I'm not going to out anyone else from the group because that is their decision to make, but I honestly see no reason in hiding this information since the win condition still aligns with town.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

Also, in case you are wondering: "that seems over-powered for town" they can apparently only recruit town members who are VT. If they target anyone with a power role or scum, either the recruiter or one of the recruits dies.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

Also, Wins was one of the original members, which is why he had a power role. I guess his role-cop ability would help them find VT people they could safely recruit.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

I eagerly await this thread exploding while I sip my coffee and wake up and maybe realize this wasn't the best idea.

Spoonsy
Dec 6, 2005

Yeah, life is hilariously cruel.
Grimey Drawer

Max posted:

I eagerly await this thread exploding while I sip my coffee and wake up and maybe realize this wasn't the best idea.

If they can only recruit VT, is it safe to assume that everyone they've recruited is town and that they themselves are town-aligned? That's the feeling I got from wins' death flavor

Gamerofthegame
Oct 28, 2010

Could at least flip one or two, maybe.
I don't know why everyone whines about thinking about the flavor when that's literally is the crux of the game; Clarent isn't just the town, she's the mayor. Clarent recruits people into pseudo mason doc and turns them into town+, with the goal of keeping Clarent alive. So Clarent-aligned are just town. There's lots of mason-doc recruiting town!

fiery_valkyrie posted:

Gamer, did Nth roleblock any of the cops on N2?

His roleblock schedule was; Quidnose N1, but he was "locked behind a door." I assume this means it was either a jailor or Clarent-recruitment is some psuedo-jailor thing, too.

N2&3, Hal.

Hal is potentially the fire killer, but Amoeba claimed he tanked that N2, so it's doubtful. There wasn't a fire kill last night, either, so that's weird.


A quick glance to dethy, tho; When the argument is "it's wins or zz or gamer!" and all three of us are town what's the kink in the argument.

Gamerofthegame
Oct 28, 2010

Could at least flip one or two, maybe.
ps someone make a "dudes town! Probably town. Dunno about them!" chart tia.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

Spoonsy posted:

If they can only recruit VT, is it safe to assume that everyone they've recruited is town and that they themselves are town-aligned? That's the feeling I got from wins' death flavor

Yes, that is how I understand it.

And please god no don't invoke Lumpen, but it is probably useful.

Gamerofthegame
Oct 28, 2010

Could at least flip one or two, maybe.
Oh, nearly forgot.

I am not a roleblocker. We're twins, so I showed up as one to any rolecops because they got me confused with Nth. I was just his bait.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

Gamerofthegame posted:

I don't know why everyone whines about thinking about the flavor when that's literally is the crux of the game; Clarent isn't just the town, she's the mayor. Clarent recruits people into pseudo mason doc and turns them into town+, with the goal of keeping Clarent alive. So Clarent-aligned are just town. There's lots of mason-doc recruiting town!


His roleblock schedule was; Quidnose N1, but he was "locked behind a door." I assume this means it was either a jailor or Clarent-recruitment is some psuedo-jailor thing, too.

N2&3, Hal.

Hal is potentially the fire killer, but Amoeba claimed he tanked that N2, so it's doubtful. There wasn't a fire kill last night, either, so that's weird.


A quick glance to dethy, tho; When the argument is "it's wins or zz or gamer!" and all three of us are town what's the kink in the argument.

Since the fire kill ostensibly actually happened but was absorbed by Amoeba, I don't think that was Hal. It's possible whoever has the fire kill is a town vig, and they are just choosing not to use it. This isn't a clever way to wink and say maybe I have the answer, because I have no idea what is up with that kill.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

For the Dethy thing, does the result from the cops come back as literally SCUM or is it simply NOT-TOWN.

Since Wins technically has an alternate alignment, that could explain why that flip happened the way it did. zzyzx biting it right after makes me think that the werewolf/beast/whatever kill is not random since it would seem like if it wasn't wins, it must be zzyzx, so it shouldn't be a thing where the player isn't aware that they are some secret serial killer (this actually happened to me a long time ago in Heroes 2 Mafia, so I'm not pulling this out of my rear end.)

Spoonsy
Dec 6, 2005

Yeah, life is hilariously cruel.
Grimey Drawer

Max posted:

For the Dethy thing, does the result from the cops come back as literally SCUM or is it simply NOT-TOWN.

Since Wins technically has an alternate alignment, that could explain why that flip happened the way it did. zzyzx biting it right after makes me think that the werewolf/beast/whatever kill is not random since it would seem like if it wasn't wins, it must be zzyzx, so it shouldn't be a thing where the player isn't aware that they are some secret serial killer (this actually happened to me a long time ago in Heroes 2 Mafia, so I'm not pulling this out of my rear end.)

For the record, all of our results have been either Town or Scum, nothing "Not" anything

Max
Nov 30, 2002

Then I dunno.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

This game has also been kinda frustrating for me, because I think I've picked up on a lot of people hanging around and watching but actively not participating. That usually screams scum at me, but it turns out there are a million loving mason docs or something where people are chatting with each other, and not actually posting in this thread.

WHICH WAY MADNESS
Apr 28, 2009

You recall this living nightmare, you take comfort in its familiar pain. You smell fermentation and can hear a dull, unending beeping. Someone shouts in a language you do not know.
You love your family. YOU. LOVE. THEM.
Welcome to Red Lobster. Come see what's fresh. Today.

Amoeba102 posted:

Either the dethy isn't a dethy, or Clarent-aligned doesn't return as TOWN and only shows up as TOWN to the Insane.

We discussed this in the mason group, it depends on when wins was recruited. Punt investigated wins n1, wins could have been investigated n2.

The worst part of all this is that we get nothing resolved in terms of figuring out sanity.

Also Amoeba, what is your role? Because clearly wins knew something about you, being a rolecop and all.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

Wins wasn't recruited. He started Clarent aligned.

WHICH WAY MADNESS
Apr 28, 2009

You recall this living nightmare, you take comfort in its familiar pain. You smell fermentation and can hear a dull, unending beeping. Someone shouts in a language you do not know.
You love your family. YOU. LOVE. THEM.
Welcome to Red Lobster. Come see what's fresh. Today.

Amoeba102 posted:

I'm going to keep believing in the Dethy because I like logic puzzles. I feel like the idea of a dethy with a traitor as a minigame fits nicely for Ecco and is a nice twist.


From that, if you guys recieve results as TOWN or SCUM. Then the Clarent-aligned is SCUM.
FV got a town result on town, Spoonsy got a town result on confirmed town. WWM got a town result on town. Merk is paraanoid. Punt had to be Insane.

And from there, Clarent-aligned recruited Quidnose. A recruiting SCUM faction, yeah that's a cult. Wins wasn't recruited so there are still two other recruits out there, so there is a minimum for 3 cultists about.

With 4 cops (1 being scum), 1 confirmed town, myself as town, that leaves 3/5 of:
100YrsofAttitude
choaslord
Hal Incandenza
Max
Quinquereme

as potential cultists art a minimum.


Am I being paranoid?

No, you're just wrong. We can't prove anything about sanities. We can't prove a cult would return as scum.

What do you mean, wins wasn't recruited?

Max
Nov 30, 2002

I said this earlier. The Clarent group started with some members. Flavor wise, they are members of the actual Clarent family (you saw this with Win's flip.) They can then make attempts in the night to recruit VT to join their group.

WHICH WAY MADNESS
Apr 28, 2009

You recall this living nightmare, you take comfort in its familiar pain. You smell fermentation and can hear a dull, unending beeping. Someone shouts in a language you do not know.
You love your family. YOU. LOVE. THEM.
Welcome to Red Lobster. Come see what's fresh. Today.

Amoeba102 posted:

I'm getting a little overwhelmed, but my gut says Quin and Hal are bad guys. Sad to say it.

Nice OMGUS.

I realize Quin was pinging me earlier, but I like his posting today.

You're right on with Hal, though.

Max
Nov 30, 2002

It's why Wins has a power role, he started that way. I guess their balanced by not being able to recruit town power roles, since that would be pretty OP.

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Max
Nov 30, 2002

Max posted:

It's why Wins has a power role, he started that way. I guess their balanced by not being able to recruit town power roles, since that would be pretty OP.

JFC, "they're." I'm usually good about that one.

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