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TravelLog posted:What makes Hoshigami so terrible and is there an LP of it? Leaving aside the horrible game balance issues where one level's difference made the lower-levelled unit lose 10% accuracy and damage while their opponent gained the same (81% effectiveness versus 121%), where each extra level made the problem worse (64%/144%, 49%/169%)... and the whole ridiculous coin mechanic... The LP was abandoned because a dialogue choice many, many hours ago with two very similar options decided whether or not a character would be recruited. The LPer had accidentally chosen the wrong option, and basically said 'gently caress it'.
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Aug 2, 2015 06:15
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Yapping Eevee posted:The LP was abandoned because a dialogue choice many, many hours ago with two very similar options decided whether or not a character would be recruited. The LPer had accidentally chosen the wrong option, and basically said 'gently caress it'. That said, there was more than enough to answer the question "what makes it so terrible", but you do need archives.
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Aug 2, 2015 06:37
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TravelLog posted:What makes Hoshigami so terrible and is there an LP of it? To add to what the others have said, the characters are all the same - you can only make them have different spells, but that's all; the spells are also no match to default physical attacks. And so you end with a game in which the best and optimal strategy is grinding levels and points for rewards between every battle and kill whatever is thrown at you, preferably using a single character so that it'll be quicker. And the only remotely unique mechanic, the Attack Session, requires you to prepare a few of your characters turns in advance so that they ping-pong an enemy between them and you might end up stealing the enemy's equipment. If the enemy doesn't just gently caress off when you were setting your elaborate plan, that is. On the upside, it has timed hits. RareAcumen posted:OFS' LP of it is more than satisfactory for me actually. It seems far too complicated for me to play and I'm just more used to FFTA's version where everyone just gets stronger weapons instead of armors affecting health and such. Then I'd recommend Front Mission 3 - there's some hidden stuff and gimmick stages (escort, special clear conditions) which I suppose is the requirement in those types of games, but you can grind money and levels if needed and usually it's only a game over if all of your party dies. And there's a battle save in case you wouldn't want to play on an emulator, you can skip story scenes, too. And NG+ with all of your skills available for setting up, which is nice because they're randomly activated and learnt. There was also Front Mission 4 on the PS2, but I haven't finished that one - I like it, but is seems really complicated and not really intuitive. Szurumbur fucked around with this message at 09:17 on Aug 2, 2015 |
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Aug 2, 2015 09:11
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RareAcumen posted:OFS' LP of it is more than satisfactory for me actually. It seems far too complicated for me to play and I'm just more used to FFTA's version where everyone just gets stronger weapons instead of armors affecting health and such. People obsess over FFT the same way they obsess over FF5 because of all the knobs it gives you to play with, but don't let them scare you away from a good game. The only advice I usually give to new players is not to underestimate Chemists when you first get access to Priests/White Mages. Chemists can heal instantly and never fail a revive. Priests can heal multiple people at once, but they have to charge up their heals and revives and have a percent change to fail to revive a character. The Item skill is really, really good. edit: Here's how you handle the birthday system. "Oh, Bob isn't going to do much damage to that thief. I guess he better attack someone else." hey girl you up fucked around with this message at 16:20 on Aug 2, 2015 |
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Aug 2, 2015 16:17
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Wonderslug posted:That said, there was more than enough to answer the question "what makes it so terrible", but you do need archives. Thank you everyone for the insight and link. Good lord.
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Aug 2, 2015 18:19
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PFlats posted:Yeah, don't read a breaking the game LP and assume that the game's too complex for you. It's actually far easier to play blind than Tactics Ogre (characters dying is way more forgiving in FFT and you can move after acting) but there are so many little things you can do with the class system to break the game wide open and eliminate all challenge. The first time I beat it, I knew nothing whatsoever about how it worked, and did just fine. No, what I meant was 'I've seen the entire game already so I think I'm good and don't really feel like playing it.
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Aug 2, 2015 18:28
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So, about those 30 glass pumpkins without retreating or charioting... I did it, but only after hitting the wall, giving up, and coming up with an idea so absurd it was great. "What if I just run all 100 floors of the PotD and pick up all the drops and glass pumpkins along the way?"  I got my dude with the special class on floor 41, and I got setup with 80% of the drops I need for levels 35+. Of course this means that I still have to do the PotD at least 2 more times all the way through, but hey progress? So by late September/early november, I'll be back to give a trip report on all the fun of farming Orichalcum for forks to fight the post game "super bosses". The good thing about Orichalcum is that you can steal it from certain monsters in the post game ruins. The bad news: you need steal at rank 8. 
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Aug 5, 2015 15:57
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poo poo like that and crafting made me use hacks and I don't regret it one bit.
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Aug 6, 2015 16:04
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Marogareh posted:poo poo like that and crafting made me use hacks and I don't regret it one bit. It's one of those times where a memo that says 'No one has ever done something and thought "Man, I wish that was more of a pain in the rear end to achieve than it was!" Don't make dumb bullshit for your game.'
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Aug 6, 2015 16:52
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Crafting feels like the first draft of a new gameplay mechanic. But it's not like it'll ever get patched, so patch it yourself 
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Aug 6, 2015 17:02
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victrix posted:Crafting feels like the first draft of a new gameplay mechanic. The three changes it desperately needs are the removal of failure chances, and the ability to mass-produce, and getting rid of the loving animation. I've made Wootz Steel. I know the flaws of crafting. They're carved into my soul. Anything else? Some way to make low level classes catch up faster, something with the complicated-rear end system of flags for extra dungeons or at least not tying so much equipment to books dropped in byzantine circumstances in extra dungeons... and why the gently caress is all the good gear except for robes and chokers dropped in byzantine circumstances in the Palace of the Dead? Basically make crafting not suck and make crafting matter more than your caster's augment element ranks so that the Palace of the Dead is an endurance marathon and not pausing every floor for ten to ten thousand minutes getting important drops. loving Daedalus Racks man.
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Aug 6, 2015 18:21
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Getting new classes could do with being easier too, I prefer the Final Fantasy Tactics method of 'You know enough skills in this class to use this class' system.
RareAcumen fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Aug 6, 2015 |
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Aug 6, 2015 18:56
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RareAcumen posted:Getting new classes could do with being easier too, I prefer the Final Fantasy Tactics method of 'You know enough skills in this class to use this class' system. What's wrong with having to kill one specific Necromancer in one obscure branch of a bonus dungeon but only if you met the obscure recruitment requirements for the unique Necromancer and have her in the team?
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Aug 6, 2015 19:22
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:What's wrong with having to kill one specific Necromancer in one obscure branch of a bonus dungeon but only if you met the obscure recruitment requirements for the unique Necromancer and have her in the team? Well, when you put it that way...
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Aug 6, 2015 19:33
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As I've mentioned before: I've done crafting legit. I got Glass pumpkins legit (with chariot, screw titles) I got Necromancer legit I've done post game content legit. I'm still 45% sane. If I can do it anybody can.  Note: I'm not being serious here, yes it has some bad systems that I wish could be modified.
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Aug 6, 2015 20:00
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:What's wrong with having to kill one specific Necromancer in one obscure branch of a bonus dungeon but only if you met the obscure recruitment requirements for the unique Necromancer and have her in the team? To be fair though, if you've been a long time fan of the Ogre Battle/Tactics Ogre series, you have been abused long enough to think this type of thing is normal. Let's talk about getting the best ending in Ogre Battle. As much as there are ridiculous requirements the makers of this version hate you much less than normal. Being able to chariot is amazing. And even better being able to do multiple quick saves in battle without them being over written upon load is the only way I can keep sanity for the all titles run. Best believe I abuse CHARIOT when going for rare drops. You plan out your turns in advance and pick a good spot to quick save. Then you load your quick save and CHARIOT until you get your drop. You then exit and perform the right action and check the Warren report obsessively to make sure you didnt accidentally finish a battle where it counted you using CHARIOT. No one is actually insane enough to just play through without abusing that method.
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Aug 6, 2015 20:09
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waah posted:Best believe I abuse CHARIOT when going for rare drops. You plan out your turns in advance and pick a good spot to quick save. Then you load your quick save and CHARIOT until you get your drop. You then exit and perform the right action and check the Warren report obsessively to make sure you didnt accidentally finish a battle where it counted you using CHARIOT. Yeah this is what I was alluding to a while back talking about Glass Pumpkin drops. Still chugging away at my all-titles run
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Aug 6, 2015 20:14
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I just modded all that poo poo. The game is still well in excess of 100 hours even with crafting and insane drop %s hacked. One thing I didn't find the last time I was playing this is whether or not it's possible to mod the AI to adjust their loadouts to make them more dangerous. iirc they didn't scale well past a certain point in the game, and I was looking into modding at least their gear (and possibly their skills, can't remember, it's been awhile). I still haven't done the post game, those of you who have done it without cheats must have much longer passenger commutes than I
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Aug 6, 2015 20:29
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Just binge-read this whole LP. What happened to Caitua there...yeesh. That was rough.
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Aug 7, 2015 20:07
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Sordas Volantyr posted:Just binge-read this whole LP. I'm also re-reading the LP and man, it seems like Denam managed to not make any decent friends that he stuck around with for the most part. Vyce was basically Dio the whole time, Caitua almost seems like she's got an Oedipus complex with her brother, she's so obsessed with keeping his attention on her.
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Aug 8, 2015 01:33
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RareAcumen posted:I'm also re-reading the LP and man, it seems like Denam managed to not make any decent friends that he stuck around with for the most part. Vyce was basically Dio the whole time, Caitua almost seems like she's got an Oedipus complex with her brother, she's so obsessed with keeping his attention on her. Catuia catches a bad rap because 16 bit sprites can't really convey war atrocities and ethnic cleansing. Through the lens of everyone else she loves being massacred, most likely in front of her very eyes, it makes sense that she is overly clingy.
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Aug 8, 2015 02:30
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Dio is way better than Vyce. 
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Aug 8, 2015 02:42
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waah posted:Catuia catches a bad rap because 16 bit sprites can't really convey war atrocities and ethnic cleansing. Through the lens of everyone else she loves being massacred, most likely in front of her very eyes, it makes sense that she is overly clingy. Not clingy enough to actually join Denny's wacky crew, mind.
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Aug 8, 2015 02:57
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Bregor posted:Dio is way better than Vyce. Truth.
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Aug 8, 2015 02:57
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waah posted:Catuia catches a bad rap because 16 bit sprites can't really convey war atrocities and ethnic cleansing. Through the lens of everyone else she loves being massacred, most likely in front of her very eyes, it makes sense that she is overly clingy. There's clingy and then there's telling the brother you grew up with your whole life that he's rejected you and you were never really a part of his family. And then when he risks life and limb to save you after you abandon him you decide that he's clearly using you and off yourself. Catuia is an overly dramatic dimwit. I forget her age, but if the writers were going for typical teenager nonsense in a war setting with her, they hit the nail on the head.
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Aug 8, 2015 03:33
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Bregor posted:Dio is way better than Vyce. Depends on what Vyce we're talking about. Chaos Vyce is a punk.
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Aug 8, 2015 04:39
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waah posted:Let's talk about getting the best ending in Ogre Battle. Go on...
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Aug 8, 2015 04:57
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TravelLog posted:Go on... Revisit stages you'd have no reason to revisit and go to towns you have even less reason to look at to get a key item; repeat over a dozen times.
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Aug 8, 2015 05:22
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:Revisit stages you'd have no reason to revisit and go to towns you have even less reason to look at to get a key item; repeat over a dozen times. Also do it quickly because spending time in stages you've already won costs you money and (IIRC) decreases the meter you need to have capped out to get the best ending. Fortunately GameFAQs existed by the time I got into Ogre Battle. It's one of my favorite games of all time.
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Aug 8, 2015 05:33
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Also, using competent troops to fight is unsporting, so make sure not to level too high! Deploy plenty of weaklings, it shows moral fibre. Of course you'll probably need an actually competent kill team or two to actually make any progress since the bulk of your army will be getting horsewhipped, so try to rotate them frequently so they don't gain too much XP and start mainlining babies. Too soon, I mean. There will almost definitely be some baby eating. But don't liberate towns with them, it's bad PR to ride into the town square in a carriage made of bones with flames spewing from your eyesockets. Nobody likes a bully or a showoff, especially one with baby in their teeth. I am exaggerating only slightly. More than once I got into a kind of alignment death spiral where most of my army was too weak to capture anything and I had to rely on Warren and his cronies to kill tons of poo poo, leading to them becoming too evil to become liches. Think about that for a moment. Wonderslug fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Aug 8, 2015 |
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Aug 8, 2015 05:54
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Don't take too long to clear a map and beat the boss because the people want liberated and they want liberated now goddamnit. Ogre Battle had some utterly horrible mechanics. I was stunned to see that OB64 actually managed to make some things worse, like requiring some towns to be liberated with good guys and others with evil. Really the entire Chaos Frame thing was garbage and the person behind it is a black-hearted monster. e: And don't forget the best ending requires you to let an evil witch live after you beat her, which hits your rep, because you need her in order to recruit Tristan or whatever the Zenobian guy's name is.
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Aug 8, 2015 07:15
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Evil Fluffy posted:Don't take too long to clear a map and beat the boss because the people want liberated and they want liberated now goddamnit. I'm not sure I would call Deneb evil. Insane maybe. Also, I'm pretty sure you don't need to spare Deneb to get Tristan.
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Aug 8, 2015 07:20
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mauman posted:I'm not sure I would call Deneb evil. Deneb killed a bunch of people to make undead pumpkin servants. That's pretty evil.
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Aug 8, 2015 07:31
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Mr. Lobe posted:Deneb killed a bunch of people to make undead pumpkin servants. That's pretty evil. Well, ok....She's evilish. Plus she sorta gave up on that stuff - redemption is a big thing for heroes. She's not really Capital E! evil.
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Aug 8, 2015 08:11
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mauman posted:Well, ok....She's evilish. Plus she sorta gave up on that stuff - redemption is a big thing for heroes. She's not really Capital E! evil. It's suggested that she's powerful enough to have spare bodies and that she's probably existed for a very long time in the Ogre series, so she probably just has a warped sense of right and wrong from all of that. I don't know if she ever gets redemption so much as it is that her sociopathic whimsy is sometimes used for probable good.
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Aug 8, 2015 08:16
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Deneb is evil - she may also be amusing in her sociopathy or whatever, but there's no excusing what she'd done. I still rescued her, because I had no idea about the Chaos Frame and hey, new unit, but the villagers who are mad with you for doing that are right.
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Aug 8, 2015 08:20
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I'm pretty sure you don't need Deneb to get the best ending.
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Aug 8, 2015 08:21
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Mr. Lobe posted:It's suggested that she's powerful enough to have spare bodies and that she's probably existed for a very long time in the Ogre series, so she probably just has a warped sense of right and wrong from all of that. I don't know if she ever gets redemption so much as it is that her sociopathic whimsy is sometimes used for probable good. Eh, I didn't mean she necessarily redeemed herself. I meant that sparing her despite her actions in the first game is supposed to be a thing - heroes trying to redeem the villains. I'd agree she's more of a nominal hero then anything. And yeah, she seems to follow more of a blue and orange morality then black and white. Which comes back to my first point that I find her more insane then evil.
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Aug 8, 2015 08:21
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Yeah I don't think Deneb affects any endings in MotBQ. Also Deneb is awesome what is wrong with you
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Aug 8, 2015 14:33
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Bregor posted:Yeah I don't think Deneb affects any endings in MotBQ. Deneb is insane but awesome. The other guys and gals covered a lot of the things about Ogre Battle: March of the Black Queen, but there is a lot more that is just mean. From pixel hunts, to order of finding people and things, to completely random loot (you can end up with a princess like by atage 5, or never). The best thing about OB though has to be the worst ending, which requires you to be on the path of the best ending for about 2/3rds of the game. You then have thr choice to recruit a demon and ~all he wants~ is for you to let him have the holy sword Brunhyldr. That ending basically tells you that you created hell on earth as of course the demon double crosses you.
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Aug 8, 2015 15:06
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