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Daztek
Jun 2, 2006



Guys, you just need to calm down.

quote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbj9rg62ep4 Anyone remember this game? It looked like this... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midtown_Madness_(series) This little gem, Midtown Madness. Fun as hell and relatively well-received despite its simplicity... http://www.gamespot.com/reviews/midtown-madness-review/1900-2542555/

Remind anyone of another game? Perhaps... Grand Theft Auto? It should, since this game was developed by none other than Rockstar San Diego. This tech was later spun into the Midnight Club series https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-wEhiGwyHw... and eventually became GTA 3-5.

Why is this important? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockstar_Advanced_Game_Engine - This engine evolved out of the same engine that originally powered Midtown Madness, while Rockstar was still "Angel Studios" (the Angel Game Engine). It took over a decade and several titles to get that ONE game engine to where it is, with integration of technologies from several other technology partners. As Rockstar released titles year after year, they could take lessons learned and refine their technology base (their "knowledge trust") and build new and evolutionary games from titles that could benefit from the same technologies/mechanics.

Now, 15 years later, we have GTA V. GTA V STILL took years, hundreds of millions of dollars, and a few hundred people to make.

Star Citizen and Cloud Imperium Games are building this brain trust with their studios. They are creating technologies that will be able to be reused in future games for generations to come. We all should be patient and appreciate that we're getting to hopefully see the birth of an entirely new powerhouse of games development born and grow right in front of us. We shouldn't, however, lose sight of what it truly takes to make a large and successful gaming company nor the games they produce.

Keep calm and game on!

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Chalks
Sep 30, 2009


Derek said SC would have failed by 2016 and it's already 2064 and they're still making it so SUCK IT

Decrepus
May 21, 2008

In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.


"He couldn't find his own dick wouldn't it smell."

What a good insult typed by an intelligent and not angry hughmon.

Justin Tyme
Feb 22, 2011


AC 2.0 will be 64-bit and will have FPS gameplay, that isn't very unbelievable. They've had the engine converted to 64 bit for a long-rear end time at this point. It'll be a functioning game but it'll lack everything a space game needs. It'll literally just be a sandbox deathmatch in a giant world with no mining, trading, buying/selling of ammo/fuel, etc you know things that make space games space games.

The Illfonic thing reminds me of how funny it was when they were doing the big branch merge and their weekly updates had a house-is-on-fire chipper attitude to them, like "there are thousands of merge failures between the branches but we just gotta iron them out one by one! :downs:". I can imagine they found out very quick that they need to redo it all completely because it was a giant hopeless mess.

Fil5000
Jun 23, 2003

HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

Vire posted:

Holy poo poo I just noticed they removed the downvote button from that subreddit. Amazing.

from what I understand of reddit the downvote button is still there, the css is just hiding it, so it's still technically possible to downvote things there

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



Daztek posted:

Guys, you just need to calm down.
[quote]As Rockstar released titles year after year, they could take lessons learned and refine their technology base (their "knowledge trust") and build new and evolutionary games from titles that could benefit from the same technologies/mechanics.
[/quote]

i have found the flaw in their analogy

A Neurotic Jew
Feb 17, 2012

by exmarx

Vire posted:

But we saw them shooting in some demo footage and playing a match wouldn't that be fps gameplay that Illfonic did? I don't see how that wording gets out of it he said all the work? Key word all.

My guess is that he means all the work that went into integrating the FPS into the PU (which incidentally means degrading the entire project). The work put into an individual module never happened because there never was an individual FPS module, what FPS module, I don't know what ur referring to.

Octopode
Sep 2, 2009

No. I work here. I manage operations for this and integration for this, while making sure that their stuff keeps working in here.

D_Smart posted:

It's exactly what Ben said.

They were going to release Star Marine ages ago.

I said it was on indefinitely hold.

They denied it.

Then it was.

Then they totally poo poo-canned it as a stand-alone module.

Then they said gently caress it, we're just going to leapfrog the whole thing and shove it into the "baby" PU as part of that release. Why? Well they went 64-Bit and so they can't exactly shove that into the current 32-Bit abomination that is AC 1.0x.

Which is precisely why they can't release "game play" modes in this first release. It doesn't exist. They're still working on it. And will then tack it on top of 2.0x at some point down the road. Probably Dec if miracles are still a thing.

So, are you saying that if it is possible, in the game, to engage in a shootout with other players/AI, that somehow doesn't count as FPS game play because it's not in its own game mode with rules, scorekeeping, and the like; or are you saying that it will not be possible to engage in shooting things from first person whatsoever in the initial 2.0 release? Your sticking point over the specifics of the wording "FPS game play" makes your claim a bit confusing.

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK
Sep 11, 2001



Octopode posted:

So, are you saying that if it is possible, in the game, to engage in a shootout with other players/AI, that somehow doesn't count as FPS game play because it's not in its own game mode with rules, scorekeeping, and the like; or are you saying that it will not be possible to engage in shooting things from first person whatsoever in the initial 2.0 release? Your sticking point over the specifics of the wording "FPS game play" makes your claim a bit confusing.

lol

Justin Tyme
Feb 22, 2011


i'm the guy who decided it was a good idea to develop several modules simultaneously by several different studios separated by large geographical distances all while making fundamental changes to the game engine itself

it's easy, just cntrl-f replace all the ints to doubles!

Deki
May 12, 2008

It's Hammer Time!

Bootcha posted:

You're thinking of Garriott. I met him with Lesnick and the WC CIC crew. Nice guy.

When I was an idiot kid considering getting into the games industry, I noticed a lot of the books I read on game development were written by people who worked under Garriott, and at least two had sections gushing over some groundbreaking thing that some Ultima game pioneered. His stock might have fallen in recent years, but there's a lot of goodwill for him in the games industry if those books were anything to go by.


Meanwhile I had no loving idea who Chris Roberts was until I started reading the original GBS star citizen mock thread.

Vire
Nov 4, 2005

Like a Bosh

Justin Tyme posted:

AC 2.0 will be 64-bit and will have FPS gameplay, that isn't very unbelievable. They've had the engine converted to 64 bit for a long-rear end time at this point. It'll be a functioning game but it'll lack everything a space game needs. It'll literally just be a sandbox deathmatch in a giant world with no mining, trading, buying/selling of ammo/fuel, etc you know things that make space games space games.

The Illfonic thing reminds me of how funny it was when they were doing the big branch merge and their weekly updates had a house-is-on-fire chipper attitude to them, like "there are thousands of merge failures between the branches but we just gotta iron them out one by one! :downs:". I can imagine they found out very quick that they need to redo it all completely because it was a giant hopeless mess.

Wouldn't this actually be somewhat encouraging though? That might actually be the start of a real video game vs what we have seen so far which is nothing.Just the ability to fly around shoot a ship then get out and then shoot a man would be something I guess.

Sarsapariller
Aug 14, 2015

Occasional vampire queen

Octopode posted:

So, are you saying that if it is possible, in the game, to engage in a shootout with other players/AI, that somehow doesn't count as FPS game play because it's not in its own game mode with rules, scorekeeping, and the like; or are you saying that it will not be possible to engage in shooting things from first person whatsoever in the initial 2.0 release? Your sticking point over the specifics of the wording "FPS game play" makes your claim a bit confusing.

So, are you saying that if it is possible to move and shoot a gun, nothing else, you will declare the FPS feature-complete as promised and on time?

Octopode
Sep 2, 2009

No. I work here. I manage operations for this and integration for this, while making sure that their stuff keeps working in here.

Sarsapariller posted:

So, are you saying that if it is possible to move and shoot a gun, nothing else, you will declare the FPS feature-complete as promised and on time?

No, but I'm not the one making claims about what will or will not be included.

Nuclearmonkee
Jun 10, 2009


Based on what has been released thus far I am confident that whatever comes out in 2.0 will be buggy poo poo and eagerly await the hilarious resultant gifs.

Dapper Dan
Dec 16, 2004
Probation
Can't post for 3 years!
Again with those stupid loving analogies to game companies. Those companies had multiple games behind them and were constantly taking in cash. From games and other poo poo.

CIG has no other games, it is living only by morons who buy ever increasing expensive jpegs.

Gwaihir
Dec 8, 2009
Hair Elf

Vire posted:

Wouldn't this actually be somewhat encouraging though? That might actually be the start of a real video game vs what we have seen so far which is nothing.Just the ability to fly around shoot a ship then get out and then shoot a man would be something I guess.

Technical capability is nice, but it doesn't at all mean something will be fun. I've maintained for a while that they have been/will get many/all of the technical issues sorted out, but that the game at the end of the tunnel will just be profoundly un-fun in a myriad of ways. (Cue the drink master 5000, space farmville, whatever the gently caress other poor decisions they have lined up for gameplay)

IMMERSION does not make for fun gameplay.

D_Smart
May 11, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
College Slice

Vire posted:

Holy poo poo if that's the case. Doesn't that just come with cryengine though the physics and being able to walk around? What is even the difference then between that and walking around in the hangar / city footage we have seen?

It does. But they have a custom version of CryEngine. Which means that, as per baseline functionality, all bets are off.

You will be walking around in the new 64-Bit engine. With probably the new animations. That's it. That's the fps module coming to 2.0. Seriously. That's it.

Beet Wagon posted:

Huh. That makes sense. I've seen a couple GIFs of it in arena commander where the interior shell completely breaks loose from the outer texture when it hits a rock and goes spinning away in the other direction, so maybe that's what's stopping them. That makes me wonder though, because the only other possible multi-crew ship they could use is the Constellation I think, right? And that's being reworked from the last thing I remember.

Yeah, that's just part of the problem.

The Constellation isn't ready. But they may dumb in the older variant while continuing to do the re-work

quote:

Unless they are going to just dump the Cutlass back in with reworked animations or functional seats or something, since it's already in arena commander and you can technically put two people in it. Man if they did that it would be the dumbest thing they've ever done. All the white knights would have to acknowledge "multi-crew" being a farce.

As shocking as that sounds, that was apparently the plan earlier this Summer. Not sure if it still is. But yeah.

Yes, it's all tits up at this point.

Das Gray
Jun 26, 2015

Wishes life was in Everquest classic graphics.
Lipstick Apathy
:gary: Parp parp parp parp /hungergames whistle theme :gary:

D_Smart
May 11, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
College Slice

Vire posted:

But we saw them shooting in some demo footage and playing a match wouldn't that be fps gameplay that Illfonic did? I don't see how that wording gets out of it he said all the work? Key word all.

Yes. Most - if not all of it, is gone. And remember that ALL of those demo builds were specifically that: demos. All designed to show "progress" and sell more JPEG ships.

Beer4TheBeerGod
Aug 23, 2004
Exciting Lemon
I expect AC 2.0 to come out before the anniversary sale and to be as polished and release ready as 1.0 was.

JoeBangles
Mar 23, 2005

Parlez-vous grenouille ?
Hello everyone, I'm an auditor, so lend me your ear while I tell you about German law.

The analawsuit is cumming.

D_Smart
May 11, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
College Slice

It's rubbish. I'm actually chatting with the author, Red Morgan, on Twitter right now. https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/661305151303585792

Sarsapariller
Aug 14, 2015

Occasional vampire queen

I don't expect 2.0 to come out at all, rumblings from CIG to the contrary. There's no way they are getting it into a playable state before Christmas.

Atlanton
Mar 23, 2013
I just requested my refund and I already feel better.

Thanks guys!

Vire
Nov 4, 2005

Like a Bosh

D_Smart posted:

Yes. Most - if not all of it, is gone. And remember that ALL of those demo builds were specifically that: demos. All designed to show "progress" and sell more JPEG ships.

I know was merely asking because if thats is indeed the cases that is another nail in the coffin of CIG lying straight to the customer's face because he said all the work that had been done will be playable. Like just straight up in your face easily provable lying that you could just link that forum post forever with no defense for it.

Not some of it will be playable some of it was just a tech demo haha.

Nicholas
Mar 7, 2001

Were those not fine days, when we drank of clear honey, and spoke in calm tones of our love for the stuff?

Vire posted:

Wouldn't this actually be somewhat encouraging though? That might actually be the start of a real video game vs what we have seen so far which is nothing.Just the ability to fly around shoot a ship then get out and then shoot a man would be something I guess.

A large world FPS with vehicles is Cry Engine at its core, and it's taken them 3+ years to get here its still hosed up.

Vire
Nov 4, 2005

Like a Bosh

Nicholas posted:

A large world FPS with vehicles is Cry Engine at its core, and it's taken them 3+ years to get here its still hosed up.

I didn't say impressive just you know the start something finally tangible compared to its loving nothing but lies and jpegs.

SirTagz
Feb 25, 2014

D_Smart posted:

Since we're in the process of burning Klueless Karl, my turn.

Remember when he said some nonsense about my "non existent" legal action as per what I posted here and later moved to my blog?

Well, I went to our archives and randomly dug up some invoices (1, 2, 3)from the named legal firms in that last action. In fact, my calculations were off. When I
looked at our Quickbooks ledger, the amount for just that action across 4 law firms, a PI firm, a forensics imaging firm etc was $609, 738.86

There you have it.

Honestly, this is just as casual as Sandi discovering diplomas while cleaning her desk

Octopode
Sep 2, 2009

No. I work here. I manage operations for this and integration for this, while making sure that their stuff keeps working in here.

Nicholas posted:

A large world FPS with vehicles is Cry Engine at its core, and it's taken them 3+ years to get here its still hosed up.

A "large world" in vanilla CryEngine and the one CIG is developing are vastly different beasts.

D_Smart
May 11, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
College Slice

Octopode posted:

So, are you saying that if it is possible, in the game, to engage in a shootout with other players/AI, that somehow doesn't count as FPS game play because it's not in its own game mode with rules, scorekeeping, and the like; or are you saying that it will not be possible to engage in shooting things from first person whatsoever in the initial 2.0 release? Your sticking point over the specifics of the wording "FPS game play" makes your claim a bit confusing.

If you are suggesting that you will be engaging in what basically amounts to deathmatch against other players and AI (LOL!!!), then I can say is, prepare to be disappointed.

Nicholas posted:

A large world FPS with vehicles is Cry Engine at its core, and it's taken them 3+ years to get here its still hosed up.

Yes. It is. Completely hosed up. As in totally.

Vire posted:

I know was merely asking because if thats is indeed the cases that is another nail in the coffin of CIG lying straight to the customer's face because he said all the work that had been done will be playable. Like just straight up in your face easily provable lying that you could just link that forum post forever with no defense for it.

Not some of it will be playable some of it was just a tech demo haha.

You do realize that they've actually made a mini game out of LYING to backers, right?

Chalks
Sep 30, 2009

Octopode posted:

A "large world" in vanilla CryEngine and the one CIG is developing are vastly different beasts.

Yes, one is a unicorn and one is a horse. Can you guess which is which?

Nicholas
Mar 7, 2001

Were those not fine days, when we drank of clear honey, and spoke in calm tones of our love for the stuff?

Vire posted:

I didn't say impressive just you know the start something finally tangible compared to its loving nothing but lies and jpegs.

I guess but I don't see how it could inspire confidence in anyone (except star citizens)

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist
2.0 is definitely coming out soon. Although it's probably short for pre-alpha tech-demo build 0.2.0

Vire
Nov 4, 2005

Like a Bosh

D_Smart posted:

If you are suggesting that you will be engaging in what basically amounts to deathmatch against other players and AI (LOL!!!), then I can say is, prepare to be disappointed.


Yes. It is. Completely hosed up. As in totally.


You do realize that they've actually made a mini game out of LYING to backers, right?

Absolutely it's just still shocking to me every time they do it so boldly. It is hard for me to get over if this is actually the case it's just so brazen. Plus just wanted to be perfectly clear and make sure there were no holes in my logic about that one so I was more or less asking for clarification.

A Neurotic Jew
Feb 17, 2012

by exmarx

D_Smart posted:

You do realize that they've actually made a mini game out of LYING to backers, right?

hahahahaha. hosed up if true. At least they aren't lying to themselves about what it is they're doing.

tooterfish
Jul 13, 2013

Chalks posted:

Yes, one is a unicorn and one is a horse. Can you guess which is which?
Nah. They're both horses, but one of them's had a horn nailed to its forehead by Chris Roberts, and is now thrashing around on the floor waiting for a Doctor to put it out of its misery.

Chalks
Sep 30, 2009

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

2.0 is definitely coming out soon. Although it's probably short for pre-alpha tech-demo build 0.2.0

It will be interesting to see whether they're able to produce a first person shooter that can rival the huge number of dedicated AAA studios who have been doing nothing but refining this genre for the last decade. :gary:

tooterfish posted:

Nah. They're both horses, but one of them's had a horn nailed to its forehead by Chris Roberts, and is now thrashing around on the floor waiting for a Doctor to put it out of its misery.

I dunno man paid $5000 for some really impressive drawings of unicorns - don't be so negative!

Pogue Ma Hoon
Oct 17, 2013

I like a nice pair of slacks.

Vire posted:

Holy poo poo I just noticed they removed the downvote button from that subreddit. Amazing.

What? No they haven't.

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Vire
Nov 4, 2005

Like a Bosh

Pogue Ma Hoon posted:

What? No they haven't.

on the comments not the thread.

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