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Xaerael posted:Pissing about making emotes before making a core game seems stupider. Isn't that a pretty common disease when you have lovely project management? Focus on small, inconsequential poo poo that is easy to produce and looks flashy (emotes, skins, buggies etc) that you can point to and say "Hey, we're making progress!" while your core gameplay systems that you are to incompetent to make lies rotting by the wayside?
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Nov 16, 2015 13:37
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:haha The social module was a bit of a turning point for me. When it first came out and I saw that CIG was going to be using the same lame "/emotion" system every other MMO on the planet uses, it made me realize that there really wasn't going to be any gameplay innovation to speak of. There are so many ways you can incorporate animations and emotional states without having the avatar be this blank, unmoving statue who waits to be told what to do. One thing I thought would be nice is if they developed a system where the avatar procedurally animated itself based on the length and content of whatever the character was saying (with facial animations recreating the movement of the text) as well as a selector for whatever emotional state the character wanted to be in. Hell steal the emotional states from Inside Out and have the character have the option of feeling neutral, happy, sad, angry, fearful, or disgusted. For characters who want a bit more control you could also offer the ability to emphasize or include certain animations at whatever point you wanted in the string. So if you said "That's a great <*> idea!" then when your character's speech hit the bracketed asterisk it would do something like raise a fist (if happy) or wank off (if disgusted). Or you could add a specific animation like "That's a great </finger> idea!" so your character specifically flicks someone off while speaking. Oh well.
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Nov 16, 2015 13:38
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Chocobo posted:Derek Smart paused a moment, then burst out, “Octopode, Chris Roberts bears all the troubles of the games industry on his shoulders and he is tired.” ahahahahaha! you mad man (time traveler).
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Nov 16, 2015 13:41
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Loiosh posted:Black holes don't look like that It's a depiction of a Black Hole to show where the money is going http://www.universetoday.com/115462/what-would-a-black-hole-look-like/
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Nov 16, 2015 13:43
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Erenthal posted:Isn't that a pretty common disease when you have lovely project management? Focus on small, inconsequential poo poo that is easy to produce and looks flashy (emotes, skins, buggies etc) that you can point to and say "Hey, we're making progress!" while your core gameplay systems that you are to incompetent to make lies rotting by the wayside? Yup. It's pure hollywood, when you think about it. All the sets and props are fake, often to the point of having zero real function, or simply being a veneer of reality to fool the viewer into thinking they're looking at a real thing. I'm still trapped deciding between (and I'm shamelessly stealing this phrase) who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool that follows him? I'll be honest, I think this time it's actually the fool, because when this all comes crashing down, his hopes and dreams of brute forcing himself back into hollywood are over. This is his swan song, and it's sounding worse by the moment.
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Nov 16, 2015 13:48
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138 posted:six different bow emotes seems stupid Hey those six bow motions took four mocap studios and $500K to develop. It took five different animators ten iterations just to get the angle just right. Six of those iterations were after Chris un-approved the whole thing after he saw a rerun of The Last Samurai. Erenthal posted:Isn't that a pretty common disease when you have lovely project management? Focus on small, inconsequential poo poo that is easy to produce and looks flashy (emotes, skins, buggies etc) that you can point to and say "Hey, we're making progress!" while your core gameplay systems that you are to incompetent to make lies rotting by the wayside? Well the animations need to get made regardless and with parallel development you're going to have a lot of people working on asset generation (are emotes assets?) while your core gameplay remains in a state of flux. That in and of itself isn't necessarily indicative of poor project management. The problem is when asset development has to be scrapped or reworked as gameplay matures. Things like module size, module placement, component standardization (like docking points), repair mechanics, cargo mechanics, and everything else that affects ships at a universal level should be in a mature state before you really crunch into assets as otherwise you end up with a Constellation situation. The worst example is the flight model and CIG's decision to make the thrusters all accurately move the ship. This means that balance changes are not only a gameplay issue but an asset issue as well. It's not an impossible problem to solve but it requires a level of organization and configuration control that CIG has repeatedly failed to demonstrate.
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Nov 16, 2015 13:51
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jaegerx posted:So from what I gather this game is never coming out then? game? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfxXug5ZMdk
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Nov 16, 2015 13:54
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Why don't just go full Scientology and create "SpaceOrg" and have their employees sign billion-year contracts to CIG and base themselves in international waters with no employment laws? They could stretch out that money quite a while then. Someone from CIG is seriously reading and considering this post.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:18
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I see why the development is taking so long, their command line has no history so they have to type everything out every time.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:22
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LLJKSiLk posted:Why don't just go full Scientology and create "SpaceOrg" and have their employees sign billion-year contracts to CIG and base themselves in international waters with no employment laws? Derek Smart killed in mysterious car accident
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Nov 16, 2015 14:33
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starkebn posted:I see why the development is taking so long, their command line has no history so they have to type everything out every time. No, it has history, but it spoils their roleplay immersion as pro game makers if they use it.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:36
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138 posted:six different bow emotes seems stupid Nothing is stupid when you've prepaid for it.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:38
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:
There's a series called "Mass Effect" and its a real game. - Commander Shepherd approved of this post.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:40
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Star Citizen is going full Shadows of The Avatar.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:44
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no_recall posted:There's a series called "Mass Effect" and its a real game. ME 1 and ME 2 were great delights. Even ME 3's multiplayer was enjoyable, but their choices when it came to DLC for ME 3 (locking Javik behind a pre-order DLC) was upsetting. He had some fascinating conversations on the history of that universe, especially if you took him with Liara to Thessia, which was the homeworld of the Asari. She talks about all of their relics and gets into a fight with Javik about their relevance as he points out their entire religious belief is wrong and his people were basically horrible racist slavers.
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Nov 16, 2015 14:49
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What's the point in adding so many emotes, when autists won't be able to tell angry_1 from sad_3?
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Nov 16, 2015 14:59
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Paladinus posted:What's the point in adding so many emotes, when autists won't be able to tell angry_1 from sad_3? You'll need very nuanced emotes to describe your feelings about space pirates boarding your ship and raping you.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:01
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Generation Internet posted:I'm starting to see more and more articles on failed kickstarters in real news and it's making me think about Star Citizen quote:I received no answers to my questions, but last night I noticed that my order had been cancelled and my money refunded by the credit card firm. Sounding more and more like Star Citizen isnt it? Amun Khonsu fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Nov 16, 2015 |
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Nov 16, 2015 15:02
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Paladinus posted:What's the point in adding so many emotes, when autists won't be able to tell angry_1 from sad_3? MMO players like to have lots of emotes, especially those that do RP (roleplaying).
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Nov 16, 2015 15:03
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Loiosh posted:MMO players like to have lots of emotes, especially those that do RP (roleplaying). Speaking as an RPer going on for a decade now, I still prefer there to first be an actual working game through which I can do this. I just wish most other RPers felt the same, because most of them can be bought so easily by this sort of smokescreen while they fantasize about how their tri-gendered pyrofox will cruise amongst the stars.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:03
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Loiosh posted:MMO players like to have lots of emotes, especially those that do RP (roleplaying). I am a hot single alien milf *sexy_2*. Please buy spaceships for my son *naughty_69*.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:06
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Paladinus posted:I am a hot single alien milf *sexy_2*. Please buy spaceships for my son *naughty_69*. Whatever happened to that guy after his declaration? Did some kind of CIG's retraction of all the ships he received ever happen, or did he just laugh all the way to his e-bank?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:08
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CrazyLoon posted:tri-gendered pyrofox Reported for stealing my OC.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:09
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So is mushmouth getting a fat ceo paycheck from every one of the 17 companies that are involved in this?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:10
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I'm sure his remuneration is commensurate with his contributions. He is a genius after all.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:13
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138 posted:six different bow emotes seems stupid Got to justify those twenty eight mocap studios somehow
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Nov 16, 2015 15:13
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Loiosh posted:MMO players like to have lots of emotes, especially those that do RP (roleplaying). The real question is where will Star Citizen's Deeprun tram or Goldshire Inn be?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:15
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Refund update #whothefuckknows: After requesting my refund on September 25th the fiasco is finally over. I am free. CIG went from, "we owe you nothing" to "we'll give you $45 spacebux back" and finally to "okay, we give up, here's what you asked for." so in 5-10 days I will finally have my money back. 
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Nov 16, 2015 15:25
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I don't even understand the new avatar someone bought me
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Nov 16, 2015 15:25
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Eonwe posted:I don't even understand the new avatar someone bought me Wasn't that Seraph's old av?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:27
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^ Congrats - that message (5-10 days) usually means it's well underway.Eonwe posted:I don't even understand the new avatar someone bought me Seraph has more money than sense - explained your avatar.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:27
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Eonwe posted:I don't even understand the new avatar someone bought me Seraph is insane, hth.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:27
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Lock up your children.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:28
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CrazyLoon posted:Speaking as an RPer going on for a decade now, I still prefer there to first be an actual working game through which I can do this. There are other games to do that in. It's a bit silly to complain about that for an alpha which does not even include a character selection/creation thing because.. they just finished delivering the necessary features to complete the major portions of the engine rework. I kinda remember during WoW's development a similar moment happening. WoW started in a slightly expanded version of the War III engine and during the friends and family Alpha, the team voted on a choice: continue development like this, or push to do a redesign of the entire engine, redo the animation and fight systems and basically delay the release 3 further years. I kinda wonder if we had open development like this, where you can see the developers making these choices, if people would be reacting in the same way given that multiple games and game engines have gone through this exact process in the past. Another example of this is Halo. It was originally designed on the Myth II engine as an RTS. 2 years before release, Bungie decided it wasn't enough and they made a decision to rebuild their engine for FPS, scrap all the assets and animations and redesign the entire game structure to accommodate that. GTA 3 started on an internal engine before they scrapped work and adopted RenderWare because they wanted a better solution for 3d work as their game scope increased. Here's SC, a game that was originally pitched as an upgrade to Freelancer with an MMO + some FPS stuff if they hit a stretch goal. After they pass 30 million, they make a decision to rescope it and then spend 3 years redesigning CryEngine 3 to enable the expanded vision. 64bit address space, dynamic level/asset loading, a complete change to the scripting system, removal and replacement of the movement system, new PBR-based deferred renderer, replaced Newtonian movement system, and others. I know people mock the developers for doing this (THEN WHY RELEASE SHIPS IN THE HANGAR) and completely ignore the fact it was announced this was early work to show off the level of detail they were striving for in the final game, but that development would change as engine capabilities were added in. Here we are, 3/4 years later (depending on if you consider that real development began after the KS in 2012 or for the teaser KS video that started in 2011), and on stage they've demonstrated this engine upgrade that they've focused most of their development effort on over the last year. The engine they need to deliver the rescoped game. Give Derek all the credit he deserves, he was correct that the game pitched in the KS is not what they're making. It reminds me of my thoughts when I saw the first public Halo reveal at MacWorld, where it had gone from the RTS engine to an FPS and people were thinking Bungie would never deliver third person shooter game with advanced physics and vehicles, and air vehicles... A year after that presentation people hear that Bungie has been bought out by MS. Bungie just learned that Myth II would require a recall before release. The game was deleting the HDDs of customers when uninstalled. 2 years later, they release a First Person Shooter, full of bugs, but much beloved. I'm still uncertain about the future of SC. If they cannot smooth out their content pipeline with the ship portions of the engine mostly complete. If they cannot make the FPS replacement work and fix the movement issues. If they cannot release SQ42 and source additional funding next year, they're sunk, as far as I'm concerned. But I feel that saying they've already failed because they rescoped the game 3 years ago, that they've redesigned the ships as the game engine has had features completed, is premature. I'm willing to support the effort because I've seen this same thing happen year after year in game development. (Here's where I mention that Blizzard redesigned Diablo I a year before delivery. It was originally turn-based).
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Nov 16, 2015 15:36
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:The social module was a bit of a turning point for me. When it first came out and I saw that CIG was going to be using the same lame "/emotion" system every other MMO on the planet uses, it made me realize that there really wasn't going to be any gameplay innovation to speak of. There are so many ways you can incorporate animations and emotional states without having the avatar be this blank, unmoving statue who waits to be told what to do. One thing I thought would be nice is if they developed a system where the avatar procedurally animated itself based on the length and content of whatever the character was saying (with facial animations recreating the movement of the text) as well as a selector for whatever emotional state the character wanted to be in. Hell steal the emotional states from Inside Out and have the character have the option of feeling neutral, happy, sad, angry, fearful, or disgusted. For characters who want a bit more control you could also offer the ability to emphasize or include certain animations at whatever point you wanted in the string. So if you said "That's a great <*> idea!" then when your character's speech hit the bracketed asterisk it would do something like raise a fist (if happy) or wank off (if disgusted). Or you could add a specific animation like "That's a great </finger> idea!" so your character specifically flicks someone off while speaking. good job. now croberts has read this and will order them to delete everything they have done regarding emotes and start over. construction of 3 new mocap studios will commence shortly blinking is now the 100m stretch goal Loiosh posted:I'm willing to support the effort because I've seen this same thing happen year after year in game development. (Here's where I mention that Blizzard redesigned Diablo I a year before delivery. It was originally turn-based). how much are you in for?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:39
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LCL-Dead posted:Refund update #whothefuckknows: Mine was actioned 5 weeks ago. Nada.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:42
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Loiosh posted:It reminds me of my thoughts when I saw the first public Halo reveal at MacWorld, where it had gone from the RTS engine to an FPS and people were thinking Bungie would never deliver third person shooter game with advanced physics and vehicles, and air vehicles... A year after that presentation people hear that Bungie has been bought out by MS. Bungie just learned that Myth II would require a recall before release. The game was deleting the HDDs of customers when uninstalled. 2 years later, they release a First Person Shooter, full of bugs, but much beloved. poo poo, you want to talk disappointment? How about the turn Halo took after MS bought them out and it went from a free-roam sandbox on the ring to the linear slugfest that released on the xbox. You were originally supposed to be able to fly/drive everything and there were easily half a dozen more vehicles planned than what came in the release. That was one of the first games I ever obsessed over during it's development phase. Demiurge4 posted:Mine was actioned 5 weeks ago. Nada. Don't taint my high, it's Monday morning man..
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Nov 16, 2015 15:42
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Was it Patrick who issued your refund LCL?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:47
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LCL-Dead posted:poo poo, you want to talk disappointment? How about the turn Halo took after MS bought them out and it went from a free-roam sandbox on the ring to the linear slugfest that released on the xbox. You were originally supposed to be able to fly/drive everything and there were easily half a dozen more vehicles planned than what came in the release. That was one of the first games I ever obsessed over during it's development phase. Yeah, I remember. As a Mac user back then, you were desperate for anything at all to play, and here Bungie promised us the world. Maybe it was for the best though? Would Halo have been stuck in the SC limbo if MS hadn't bought it and slashed and burned?
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Nov 16, 2015 15:47
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A Neurotic Jew posted:Was it Patrick who issued your refund LCL? Kraiklyn, after "talking to Patrick about my case" since I spent a few emails arguing with Patrick about his math. Erenthal posted:Yeah, I remember. As a Mac user back then, you were desperate for anything at all to play, and here Bungie promised us the world. I was still very new to the gaming world back then. Didn't even own a console and only played Counter-strike on PC because Half Life and all of it's mods was the poo poo. With that in mind, was Halo designated multi-platform or just Mac? The first article I ever saw was written post RTS days and talked about fighting a guerilla style war against the covenant on the ring. It was in a PC Gamer (Or whatever pc gaming magazine was the go-to mag back in 1999/2000) I'd picked up from a friends house.
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Nov 16, 2015 15:53
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