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Covok
May 27, 2013

Yet where is that woman now? Tell me, in what heave does she reside? None of them. Because no God bothered to listen or care. If that is what you think it means to be a God, then you and all your teachings are welcome to do as that poor women did. And vanish from these realms forever.
I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

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Halloween Jack
Sep 12, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 4 hours!

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.
I actually only do it for games I know I'm going to run (and sometimes not then) or...games I review for this thread.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

I used to not do that, but I'm coming around to the idea that I should, especially games that I am/will be running, because I'm finding that a lot of the time any issues that I have with a game ended up already being addressed in the game if I had just read and thought through it.

And of course there are some books/games that are just nice to read cover-to-cover normally, like Night's Black Agents' Double Tap, or CoC 7th Edition.

Bieeanshee
Aug 21, 2000

Not keen on keening.


Grimey Drawer
I try to read them cover to cover, because let's face it: most of the people writing these books wouldn't know good layout if it flew up their asses and arranged their organs in alphabetical order.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

I only do really thorough cover-to-cover readings for books I'm F&Fing, most of the time I usually only read the crunchy mechanical bits or the parts that seem particularly interesting for me.

Which reminds me, I need to finish up changing breeds at some point. whoops.

LordSaturn
Aug 12, 2007

sadly unfunny

I buy these goddamned things solely to read them cover-to-cover. I find them interesting.

ZorajitZorajit
Sep 15, 2013

No static at all...
I don't read many books cover-to-cover, but the books that I really enjoy I will end up reading the whole contents thereof. I just tend to flip around the setting and fluff stuff ala encyclopedia research more than read it straight through like a novel. I do have this only d20 Cybernet book (a not-that-great Cyberpunk game in d20) that had a narrative running through it and I read all of those on a lark once.

occamsnailfile
Nov 4, 2007



zamtrios so lonely
Grimey Drawer
I tend to read setting and fluff stuff cover-to-cover though I'll gloss over rules a bit more--get the generalities and then look up specifics as needed. I guess I prefer physical books for the long reading phase but PDFs are easier when it's time to reference.

Covok
May 27, 2013

Yet where is that woman now? Tell me, in what heave does she reside? None of them. Because no God bothered to listen or care. If that is what you think it means to be a God, then you and all your teachings are welcome to do as that poor women did. And vanish from these realms forever.
As a follow-up question, to the ones who read the entire book, do you find yourself more often in the GM or player role? See, I tend to just read the relevant bits and call it a day because I'm lazy. But I am likely also influenced by my decision to run multiple different systems at once. For example, I currently am running an IRL Masks game, a roll20+Skype 5e game, a roll20 + Skype Urban Shadows game, a pbp Masks game, and, soon, a pbp Chuubo's game. I might run a Torchbearer game soon as well. I'm wondering if players or GMs tend to read the book more thoroughly and, if GMs, the ones who read more thoroughly tend to run less games at once.

Why? Curiosity in general rpg player practices and curiosity about Fatalers.

PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

I tend to read every last page, myself. Not so much because I intend to memorize the rules, usually I run an abridged version in any case, because most systems, even good ones, are improved by only using the rules when it's fun or interesting, but because I intend to harvest them for inspiration and ideas. You never know what goofy magic item or sidebar tucked away in an appendix will give you a brilliant idea, or the template to realize something you want to do, even if you're not going to use it exactly as-written. Plus, not all books are just dry rules-tomes, Paranoia XP, for instance, had rules that you could use all the way through, but also came absolutely bloated with fluff spilling out of every crack, it was just plain a good read.

EDIT to answer the follow-up question: Basically always a GM and usually only running one game at once.

fool of sound
Oct 10, 2012

Covok posted:

As a follow-up question, to the ones who read the entire book, do you find yourself more often in the GM or player role? See, I tend to just read the relevant bits and call it a day because I'm lazy. But I am likely also influenced by my decision to run multiple different systems at once. For example, I currently am running an IRL Masks game, a roll20+Skype 5e game, a roll20 + Skype Urban Shadows game, a pbp Masks game, and, soon, a pbp Chuubo's game. I might run a Torchbearer game soon as well. I'm wondering if players or GMs tend to read the book more thoroughly and, if GMs, the ones who read more thoroughly tend to run less games at once.

Why? Curiosity in general rpg player practices and curiosity about Fatalers.

I usually read the whole book, though I tend to approach it piecemeal; I skim around and digest it over a month of so before i actually run it. I'm usually the GM, and I never run more than two games at a time.

Bieeanshee
Aug 21, 2000

Not keen on keening.


Grimey Drawer
I'm a player, and I get really uncomfortable when it turns out that I've missed something important, be it mechanics or lore. My RL experiences with players or GMs who cherry-pick through the books has been pretty lousy-- stock settings tend to turn into cardboard backdrops, set pieces drop without context, and even if the first month doesn't end up being hijacked for tutorial play and remedial mechanics, really important things tend to get missed, only to pop up when someone's skimming the book.

I've only played in a Roll20-like game once or twice, so I don't have any observations there. PBP tends to be more tolerant, I think because everything's happening asynchronously, and much more slowly than a real-time session. There's time to page through a rulebook to confirm your reading of something, or to consult the GM, without the risk of annoying the rest of the group.

Of course, there's the strong possibility that I and most of my RL groups over the years have been particularly awful.

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 5, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!


Part 12: "To dolphins, the mutants are great friends and playmates who are closer to them than normal humans, able to swim at their side, and still keep all the best traits of humans."

Tritonia
By C.J. Carella and Kevin Siembieda


So, Tritonia is actually a pre-rifts barge city that was built to float on the water and drift along the currents of the Pacific, much of it built to hang underwater. Though it doesn't come close to any continents, it does have a number of island bases it comes near that are mainly used for farming and mining. However, it's largely self-sufficient, relying on the sea for most things, through farming, fishing, undersea mining, or salvaging. In addition, about one in ten inhabitants is an "amphib", a human who was genetically manipulated to be able to survive underwater. Contrary to most human-dominated settings in Rifts, amphibs are fully accepted and even have held the highest political offices.

Origins

So, Tritonia was built as an experimental community by a company known creatively as OceanTech, Inc. It was very successful and expanded. Hurray!

Far away in South America, a company known ShaperCorp had been developing into experiments on modifying humans for underwater survival. However, most of the test subjects died due to them having more enthusiasm than ethics, and the company was shut down due to public outcry. The surviving and successful subjects were sent to live in Tritonia, and apparently they were cool with leaving their homes and families, but this may have something to do with at least some of them ending up with goldfish heads or whale butts.

The Coming of the Rifts

Not being near any ley lines, Tritonia weathered the coming of the rifts really well, save for some panic and monster attacks. However, they had some military forces present and were able to fight off attackers, as well as take on what refugees they could. Though they approached land at times, they only ran into disasters there, and soon gave it up. They worked to become self-sufficient, despite threats like the Lord of the Deep inflicing severe casualties. Still, that's practically idyllic for Rifts.

Government


"Our president, the Creature From the Black Lagoon."

Originally run by Oceantech's appointed director and administrative board as per OceanTech, but the original director, Rodney Wilzem, committed suicide. Apparently to this day, acting in a cowardly or dishonorable way has becoming known as "pulling a Wilzem". Nowadays there's still a director and an administrative board, which serve until death or resignation, but there's also a representative board elected by the populace. The representative board doesn't have any official power, but acts as a good means for the administrative board to judge popular opinion, which is important, since Tritonians have seemingly overthrown the director more than once. (Despite this, they seem alright with just letting the company appoint another director and board, in defiance of how revolts generally work.)

Daily Life

Things are fairly regimented, with fear of the outside and others generally keeping people in line. Most have some level of combat or technical training to fill in for emergencies, though actual security is handled by the "Sea Wolves", who are a paramilitary police force, but also have power to conduct salvage operations. Unlike most human communities, they don't necessarily hate D-bees, and have taken on D-bee refugees now and then. While they don't necessarily trust or care or magic, they don't hate its practitioners, and are willing to let them stay on the island as long as they don't endanger anyone.

(A thoughtful human community with an even hand? This has got to be Carella's doing.)

Places of Note
  • Getting Around: Monorails or small electric cars allow travel outside during calm seas, though during rough seas, sections of the city are often parted to allow the city to sway, and can often trap people indoors as a result.
  • The Control Center: A large tower at the center of the complex, this is the best-defended portion of the island, since it contains the board's meeting halls and the main sensor systems. Apparently they even have a squad of magic users here to help with the defense, despite their distaste for such.
  • The Visitor's Quarters & Harbor Area: This is the wild 'n crazy part of town, where sailors and outsiders are allowed to visit and stay, and where boats can be outfitted or repaired.
  • The Medical Center: Since it pre-dates the rifts, Tritonia has some of the best medical facilities, and since it's CJ writing this, it's backed up by an actual bonus to recover from comas or avoid death. There's also a throwaway chunk of statistics that points out half of Tritonians have some form of cybernetic or artificial augmentation or organ replacement, and ten percent of the population are borgs of varying degree.
Foreign Relations

Generally, Tritonia is defined by a fierce independence and a superiority complex born of nationality rather than race. They're open-minded about D-bees and the like, and might ally against other humans if necessary. Their primary allies are the New Navy, since the two groups are very much alike, and only their respective independent streaks keep them from uniting formally. Though they are enemies with the naut'yll nation as a whole, they have accepted naut'yll turncoats and refugees. Their greatest enemy, of course, is the Lord of the Deep, since Tritonia floats right around its sphere of influence. They've had some conflicts with Lemuria, but don't know much about them. Though Japan is nearby, Tritonia hasn't actually come into conflict. It reminds us to look forward to Rifts World Book Eight: Japan for that one! Which would actually come on time, so at least it's not hot air.

Tritonian O.C.C.s & R.C.C.s

We're told the Sailor O.C.C. (from South America) or the scholar and adventurer classes are appropriate, as are cyborgs and various D-bee races. It even points us to Aliens Unlimited for additional aquatic D-bees, because certainly that's compatible, right? Well, I'm not going to check, I have my hands full with one Palladium game line, thanks. It's kind of odd to realize the Sailor and Pirate classes weren't reprinted in this book, but I guess they just got released in South America, so I guess there's no winning that particular bit of misorganization.

Tritonian "Sea Wolf" O.C.C.

As mentioned above, these are the paramilitary soldiers and security for Tritonia, as well as salvage experts (presumably because they have the guns to shoot aquatic baddies). A lot of them have cybernetics, often owing to realistic battle damage they've sustained.

Hilariously, they get a meager +1 to dodge, but only underwater. Man, that's what being an elite underwater-trained commando gets you? 5% better than your average civilian chub on defense, but only if you happen to be all wet. Still, they're skilled pilots, swimmers, and combatants otherwise, and get a solid spread of other skill picks. They also get 1d4 cybernetic implants. Their attribute requirements mean you have 50/50 shot of playing one, naturally. Nothing too special, but they fit the bill they're given.

Tritonian Scientist O.C.C.


If you're looking for me | You better check under the sea

Apparently, scientists are extremely respected in Tritonia for their skills. However, bear in mind these are action scientists that are often involved in exploration, repair, rescue, or other adventures. I think there's some confusion here about what scientist does, since they seem to be general technical experts, but eh, it's about as accurate as Rifts ever gets.

Effectively they're just a variant of the Rogue Scientist O.C.C. from the core, only with less science skills and more boat skills. As such, they get a crazy amount of skills compared to most of the supplement O.C.C.s we've seen, and they even come with that venerable 1d4 cybernetic implant roll. You have about a 65% chance of playing one of these, due to a middling intelligence requirement.

Amphib R.C.C.


The results of the "smashing blocks together" school of genetic experimentation.

So, as mentioned before, these are fish-people that came out of illegal genetic experiements before the rifts. They can actually breed true amongst themselves, despite the fact that they're widely varied in phenotype. "gently caress genetics, let's gently caress!" They're seen as having great powers and great responsibilities in Tritonia.

Rifts World Book Seven: Underseas posted:

As children, they are often teased and called "fish face" or "froggie" and similar names, but such teasing is given and accepted good-naturedly, without either contempt or hatred or any "politically correct" attempts to "protect" the amphibs from the teasing and jokes. As a result, amphibs never feel like outsiders at Tritonia.

Wait. What? What the loving gently caress? That's one hell of a leap of logic, a hammy fist-shake at political correctness that flies in the face of human behavior as a whole. Yeah, make them feel different... to feel accepted? Then again, maybe their fish-faced frog brains work differently than ours! Ha ha! I'm just kidding, though, you hideous abominations of science! Wink wink! ;)
Seriously though, you look like a trout, put a bag on it or something.


seriously who could make fun of this

As a result of nobody being prejudiced against amphibs ever in Tritonia, sometimes their fish faces are shocked when they find out how cruel the rest of the world can be to them. Not that you can tell how shocked they are, because fish don't really show shock. Ha ha, those poor mudscampers! Still, this means most don't leave Tritonia, because the outside world is full of racists and, worse, SJWs. They do a lot of undersea work, naturally, and pal around with dolphins because dolphins are awesome nice guys. In case that hasn't been mentioned yet.

Numbers: They're generally physically superior to humans, particularly in regards to strength, and move quickly underwater. There's a table of different looks: plain human, webbed appendages, frog-skinned, a fish head, scaly skin, scaly skin and a fish head, oversized werefish, or oversized werefrog. Well, not really were-s, but it's the best way to to describe them. The less human they look, the more their beauty drops, but generally the more speed and durability they get. They're still just S.D.C. features, but can get custom armor built in Tritonia. Most can breath underwater, though some like the frogfolk or humans can only hold their breath for about 45 minutes or so. They can pick the Sea Wolf or Tritonian Scientist O.C.C.s for free, or choose any other O.C.C... and get a couple fewer skills. They also get minor defensive bonuses, but only underwater. Overall, they're not exceptional, but if you want to play a distaff Mon Calamari, this is how you get it done.

Next: Lasers! Underwater! This somehow works!

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 00:23 on Dec 21, 2015

Lynx Winters
May 1, 2003

Borderlawns: The Treehouse of Pandora

Covok posted:

As a follow-up question, to the ones who read the entire book, do you find yourself more often in the GM or player role? See, I tend to just read the relevant bits and call it a day because I'm lazy. But I am likely also influenced by my decision to run multiple different systems at once. For example, I currently am running an IRL Masks game, a roll20+Skype 5e game, a roll20 + Skype Urban Shadows game, a pbp Masks game, and, soon, a pbp Chuubo's game. I might run a Torchbearer game soon as well. I'm wondering if players or GMs tend to read the book more thoroughly and, if GMs, the ones who read more thoroughly tend to run less games at once.

Why? Curiosity in general rpg player practices and curiosity about Fatalers.

I'm the guy who ends up the Forever-GM, but I'm also the only person at the table that will actually read the book so I usually do have to read cover-to-cover just so I can write personalized quick-reference sheets, teach the game to everyone, and know what my own options are. Right now I'm running Feng Shui 2 and it's kinda nice because they put in a chapter about designing enemies and fights and I don't have to build NPCs like PCs.

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 5, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If I'm running a game, definitely. It's possible I'll skip parts like back-of-the-book locales or adventures that are generally less relevant to me, but I think it's definitely essential to RPGs with detailed settings. As a player, I'm less likely to; if I'm playing in a PbP, I generally won't have the time. I find it interesting that you bring up Torchbearer and Chuubo's, because I feel both Crane and Moran write presuming their books are going to be read cover-to-cover, and I find their games very hard to interpret "piecemeal", with their rules spread into odd sections in the book and often not written like technical manuals (which I think is a bit of an issue, because that's partly what an RPG book is).

Edit: Writing as I do for FATAL & Friends is a bit of an oddity because I think vanishingly few people read Palladium books cover-to-cover, even amongst the fandom. They're not well-organized, but the slapdash layout lends itself very well to being read piecemeal, because it rarely presumes you've read the rest of the book's text.

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Nov 19, 2015

Doresh
Jan 7, 2015

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

Cover to cover. I just generally read any kind of "manual" (maybe except for modern video games because their manuals tend to be like short flyers that barely tell you anything). I typical skip the "What's a roleplaying game?", as well as any advice section that gives me deja-vu. Sections with lots of optional rules might also get cut if said optional rules aren't about stuff I actually care about.

(Though my recent purchase of Double Cross has teached me that skipping around can be useful. Reading through 150+ pages of powers before actually getting to the rules is an odd layout choice.)

Alien Rope Burn posted:

Wait. What? What the loving gently caress? That's one hell of a leap of logic, a hammy fist-shake at political correctness that flies in the face of human behavior as a whole. Yeah, make them feel different... to feel accepted? Then again, maybe their fish-faced frog brains work differently than ours! Ha ha! I'm just kidding, though, you hideous abominations of science! Wink wink!

This stab at PC-ness feels a bit like a whiplash after the constant dolphin glorification and orca apologist stuff o_O

Doresh fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Nov 19, 2015

Humbug Scoolbus
Apr 25, 2008

The scarlet letter was her passport into regions where other women dared not tread. Shame, Despair, Solitude! These had been her teachers, stern and wild ones, and they had made her strong, but taught her much amiss.
Clapping Larry

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

Castle Falkenstein deserves to get read cover to cover. It really does.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

Alien Rope Burn posted:

Next: Lasers! Underwater! This somehow works!

I imagine the first test firing of the undersea Electrolaser would fail rather spectacularly.

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 5, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!

Doresh posted:

This stab at PC-ness feels a bit like a whiplash after the constant dolphin glorification and orca apologist stuff o_O

It comes out of nowhere and is pretty drat odd.

Humbug Scoolbus posted:

Castle Falkenstein deserves to get read cover to cover. It really does.

It was pretty much designed to be read this way - IIRC, I thought most of the setting stuff was done like a journal / narrative.

Kurieg posted:

I imagine the first test firing of the undersea Electrolaser would fail rather spectacularly.

Rifts doesn't have electrolasers (shockingly, getit) but really firing any energy weapon underwater seems like a bad idea unless it's some fantasy technology like a force gun.

Kurieg
Jul 19, 2012

RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20
:blizz::gamefreak:

Alien Rope Burn posted:

Rifts doesn't have electrolasers (shockingly, getit) but really firing any energy weapon underwater seems like a bad idea unless it's some fantasy technology like a force gun.

Lasers wouldn't work, and a plasma weapon would probably par boil the firer if it didn't just explode in the barrel.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Covok posted:

As a follow-up question, to the ones who read the entire book, do you find yourself more often in the GM or player role? See, I tend to just read the relevant bits and call it a day because I'm lazy. But I am likely also influenced by my decision to run multiple different systems at once. For example, I currently am running an IRL Masks game, a roll20+Skype 5e game, a roll20 + Skype Urban Shadows game, a pbp Masks game, and, soon, a pbp Chuubo's game. I might run a Torchbearer game soon as well. I'm wondering if players or GMs tend to read the book more thoroughly and, if GMs, the ones who read more thoroughly tend to run less games at once.

Why? Curiosity in general rpg player practices and curiosity about Fatalers.

I'm a perma-GM. I've read more games than I've played, and I have a list of "games I've read that I want to play" that's a mile long at this point. I feel obliged to read the book thoroughly from cover to cover, though I really appreciate it if players know the game well enough to be able to call me out on it if I'm doing something wrong.

Humbug Scoolbus
Apr 25, 2008

The scarlet letter was her passport into regions where other women dared not tread. Shame, Despair, Solitude! These had been her teachers, stern and wild ones, and they had made her strong, but taught her much amiss.
Clapping Larry

Alien Rope Burn posted:

It was pretty much designed to be read this way - IIRC, I thought most of the setting stuff was done like a journal / narrative.


Yeah Falkenstein was.

Mr.Misfit
Jan 10, 2013

The time for
SkellyBones
has come!

Covok posted:

As a follow-up question, to the ones who read the entire book, do you find yourself more often in the GM or player role?[snip]

Why? Curiosity in general rpg player practices and curiosity about Fatalers.

GM by passion because more often than not, both nobody else wants to run a game and because I really want people to experience some of those stories out there instead of just reading them.
I do mostly read them piece-by-piece, especially where they are only a rules update to known rulesets, otherwise completely to get the new rules and how they work.

Considering that at some time I was running up to 8 games in between some 14 day-intervals, I´d say that it isn´t necessarily correlated ;)

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

At this point reading the books from cover to cover is the only reason I acquire them at all.

Snorb
Nov 19, 2010

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

I read them from cover to cover. I passed time during our Hurricane Sandy-related power outage by reading the D&D 4e Player's Handbook cover to cover. (I said when I started the 4e Monster Manual "Aboleth... oh, Christ, this is just three hundred pages of loving stat blocks, isn't this?" before setting it aside for the Big Eyes Small Mouth 3e book gathering dust on my bookshelf.)

That Old Tree
Jun 24, 2012

nah


Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

It depends a lot on what I expect out of the game and how it's written. If the system is the primary draw, I'll typically skip around, both because there're probably specific bits I'm especially interested in and also because RPGs are usually terribly organized. If I'm more interested in the setting, I tend to start from the beginning and go straight through, even if the book starts out with its system stuff. On the other hand, when it comes to games like Fate or GURPS, I go cover-to-cover. Games that are short and very tightly focused on a setting/theme are also usually cover-to-cover reads regardless of those prior considerations, like Laws Out.

Covok posted:

As a follow-up question, to the ones who read the entire book, do you find yourself more often in the GM or player role? See, I tend to just read the relevant bits and call it a day because I'm lazy. But I am likely also influenced by my decision to run multiple different systems at once. For example, I currently am running an IRL Masks game, a roll20+Skype 5e game, a roll20 + Skype Urban Shadows game, a pbp Masks game, and, soon, a pbp Chuubo's game. I might run a Torchbearer game soon as well. I'm wondering if players or GMs tend to read the book more thoroughly and, if GMs, the ones who read more thoroughly tend to run less games at once.

Why? Curiosity in general rpg player practices and curiosity about Fatalers.

I am often the GM, partly because of the stereotypical "no one else wants to at all" and partially because I enjoy it well enough most of the time. I've got pretty good retention regardless of how I read a book so I frequently act as a rules wrangler no matter who's GMing.

Cooked Auto
Aug 4, 2007

If you will not serve in combat, you will serve on the firing line!




Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

I try but I mostly read the lore sections of the few books I get because the crunch section rarely has a chance to stick in my head unless I get stuff hammered into my skull repeatedly, and even then my recollection of crunch can be spotty. I really am bad with numbers and such.

JohnnyCanuck
May 28, 2004

Strong And/Or Free

Kurieg posted:

Lasers wouldn't work, and a plasma weapon would probably par boil the firer if it didn't just explode in the barrel.

Pfft. You're not thinking Palladium-y enough. They have an answer!

WaywardWoodwose
May 19, 2008

The woods are lovely, dark, and deep,
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep.
I buy a lot of books just to read, but some of them are just too dry, or at worst a slog to get through. I try to at least find out what makes a book different in case i want to steal some ideas down the road. For instance, the Dr. Who RPG has an interesting initiative system.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007



JohnnyCanuck posted:

Pfft. You're not thinking Palladium-y enough. They have an answer!

Blue green lasers? Or is that Car Wars?

ZorajitZorajit
Sep 15, 2013

No static at all...

Midjack posted:

Blue green lasers? Or is that Car Wars?

No, no, it couldn't have been Car Wars. Those lasers don't work in smoke and are the size of four grenades.

Doresh
Jan 7, 2015

Crasical posted:

I like the idea of a non-sorcerer who's gotten their hands on a talisman for a Flight/Additional Damage/Explode shikigami and has gone all mad-bomber with it.

Yeah. It's a great way for some added utility and options to spend your Soul on if you don't use it already. And talismans are effectively Pokéballs.

Though Explode is one of those one-shot talisman tricks. Talisman Shikigami can't recover from using a power that involves them sacrificing themselves. Still, you can throw a fake bomb that summons a bomb monster.

Tenra Bansho Zero


Here's how to build Kenshiro.

Buddhism

Atatatatatatatatatatat

Buddhism is the only other human religion on Tenra aside from the Shintoism of the Priesthood. Like in Feudal Japan (at least AFAIK), both religions co-exist without much issues, and most people freely integrate both into their daily lifes. As the books tells us, this is because Shintoism focuses on the world at large (as well as the countless spirits and gods living in it), while Buddhism is all about personal enlightenment. As such, they don't really don't get in each other's way.

Wheres the Shinto Priesthood had its schism quite recently, Buddhism has spend centuries split into three major sects:

The Phoenix Sect (Hou-Oh)

The oldest and largest sect, and also the only one that is actually organized and has temples. It's also the only sect sanctioned by the Priesthood.
It was founded when Buddhists formed an alliance with the Shinto Priesthood a long time ago. This was primarily done as to not waste time with a potential conflict the Buddhists would've lost anyways because they don't have spaceships. The Priesthood agreed, and even declared Buddhism the official religion of Tenra.
In order to consolidate power and keep Buddhism from breaking apart under the strain of their new-found influence, the monks all settled on the land of Houga (a nice gift from the Priesthood), forming the nucleus of the Phoenix Sect. As a sign of their alliance with the Priesthood, each monk has a small soulgem (the "Jewel of Buddha") embedded in his forehead.

Readers of ProfessorProf's posts about the Fall of the Phantom Star (aka "What happens if the Shinto Priesthood's orbital elevator decides to pay them a visit") might dimly remember that Houga was one of the countries that got completely annihilated in this disaster.
Fortunately for the sect, the head monk Gamou Douan had a grim vision of the coming catastrophe four months before the fact, giving them ample time to to move to the domain of Togo.
When the Fall of the Phantom Star plunged Togo in chaos, the sect quickly took over the place in order to re-established order. Nowadays, the sect's leadership is deeply troubled and confused over the Priesthood's schism.

As rulers of an entire country, the Phoenix Sect has its own military, using anything from warrior moonks to Buddha-themed Armours and even "onmyo monks" who use both onmyojutsu sorcery and Buddhist magic. They are a highly-motivated force to be reckoned with, but they are a purely defensive army.

With their close ties to the Priesthood, it is only natural that the sect also has a much darker side to it. This side comes in the form of special task forces, from the well-known Kuze Order that closely works with the Priesthood to the mysterious order only known as The Hidden 28th Chamber, whose existance is denied by the head monk himself.

The Ebon Mountain Sect (Bokusen)

This sect splintered off from the Phoenix Sect relatively early. Its founder is Bokusen, a highly-regarded monk who attained enlightenment and found the Phoenix Sect to be too stagnant for his taste.

Bokusen's main philosphy was that personal enlightenment cannot be attained through outside help or a single path, and that it can only be reached by starting from scratch, casting aside all traditional rules and taboos - even those laid out by Buddha himself.
Ebon Mountain monks are therefore a highly individualistic lot that each follow a completely different path, ignoring some or even all of the core Buddhist commandments. Not only can you come across an Ebon Mountain monk who is big into sex, drugs and party, but he will also most likely be a jerk because the typical answer to "How can I reach enlightenment?" is "Find out for yerself, dummy.".
They are however not jerks when it comes to their fellow comrades, as the only real rule for an Ebon Mountain monk is to tolerate other monks and the path they have chosen. This stance makes the sect the only one that actually has female and oni monks.

As most Ebon Mountain monks train their body as well as their spirit, they have also developed a number of martial arts that are considered the deadliest in all of Tenra. The main justification for this (aside from the "train body and spirit" part) is that the Buddhist equivalent of "Thou shalt not kill" is seen as meaningless if one isn't able to kill in the first place. They might have overshot their mark a bit, though.
Luckily for everyone, even the most dickish monk will generally only fight in self-defense.

The Bright Lotus Sect (Myouren)

The youngest sect. It is named after its founder Myouren, a kind and gentle monk who cared more about helping others than about his own enlightenment, gainig him many admirers and followers.
The sect originally started out as a group inside the Phoenix Sect that followed Myouren's Bright Lotus scripture. When the Phoenix Sect feared this scripture was getting a bit too popular, Myouren and his followers found out the hard way that the 28th Chamber does in fact exist.
A few followers survived the bloodbath and helped to spread the scripture over all of Tenra. As wandering monks, they preach to the poor and downtrodden (of which there are a lot on Tenra).

Recently, Phoenix head monk Gamou Douan has officially apologized for the little "mistake" involving the 28th Chamber that totally doesn't exist and declared the movement to be not heretical anymore (which brings to mind the wedding scene from Monty Python and the Holy Grail).
The various regents of Tenra are however less amused about the Bright Lotus Sect, for their simple teachings and focus on attaining a better standing in the next life has led to a huge increase in riots and rebellion.

Buddhist Magic

Buddhist Magic aka Hou-jutsu uses ki to perform more direct magic effects than onmyojutsu. The exact workings of this art isn't clear, and there are surprisingly few monks who can actually use it. Ebon Mountain monks seem to have the highest amount of practicioners (most likely through their training), while Bright Lotus monks see this gift as more of a curse, as they just want to be simple monks that don't steal the Buddha's thunder.

    Healing Prayer: The bread-and-butter healing spell.
    Spirit Burst: Shoots an energy ball similar to a hadoken. It starts of rather weak and dinky, but improving your Buddhist Magic skill gives you access to stronger versions, until you can spam suped-up hadokens DBZ-style in a single action until your Soul runs out.
    Soulgem: So apparently soulgems are not just another red metal like Scarlet Steel, but they are Scarlet Steel that has been turned into spiritual batteries with this hour-long Buddhist ceremony. That's an odd omission of the setting book o_O
    Summon Spirit: Your typical "summon the spirit of a dead person to ask him a question or two" spell. The better you roll, the friendlier the spirit.
    Subdue Spirit: Monks capable of using spells can see restless ghosts without problem, so they can help them reach the Afterlife. This spell right here is for those ghosts who are still too attached to the world to pass on on without resistance.
    Meikyo Seal: This highly blasphemous ceremony seals a summoned spirit into a Meikyo mirror, wiping its memories in the process. I wonder what this could be used for... *foreshadowing*
    Meikyo Cleansing: This ceremony reduces a Meikyo mirror's Karma. If there is a soul bound to the mirror (like say of an Armour Rider who went Asura), reducing the mirror's Karma to 0 is the only way for the soul to be released and pass on to the Afterlife. Since Asura's are dicks, their soul will try to resist, possibly slowing down the Karma cleansing process.
    Exorcism: Your typical spell to free a possessed person. In TBZ, the culprit is either a Shikigami or an Ayakashi (the supernatural critters of Tenra).
    Binding Prayer of Acala: Tries to bind an opponent in place, preventing him from moving or taking any offensive action as long as the monk keeps on chanting.

108 Factions of the Lords of Light

A term used for the various kinds of martial arts practiced by Buddhist monks. They are Arts of War, which are essentially skills you learn and improve to gain special (mostly passive) techniques. The 108 Factions are all Arts of War focusing on making your unarmed attacks the most dangerous there are.
Almost every new technique of any of these styles boosts the Unarmed Attack damage, with a true master able to hit like a cannonball and outdamage any standard melee weapon aside from a soulgem polearm or the Zakt-8R Ultimate Edge (though both of have to use soulgems to compete).

Though these styles are mainly used by Ebon Mountain monks, any monk can learn them.

Fist of Acala the Immovable Lord of Light (Fudoh Myoh-oh Ken)

The first of the martial arts, this style is big on risky counterattacks where the monk can decide to have the winner of the contested attack check deal damage as if the defender had 0 successes (leading to a world of hurt for the loser).
Practicioners of this style can also choose to use their Spirit attribute instead of Body for their Unarmed Combat skill, allowing for the old, frail-looking kung-fu master trope. The capstone technique is called Fist of Acala and lets you spend Soul to add your Spirit attribute to any physical roll for one round, giving you a nice buff.

The Hands of Merciful Kannon the Thousand-Armed (Senju Kannon Ken)

Called that way because the style eschews fists for open, cutting hand strikes that are so fast the user appears to have multiple arms. The "Merciful" part comes from being able to use Empathy instead of Body for Unarmed Combat.
Thanks to the high speed attacks, a practicioner of this style can overwhelm his enemy with feints. This allows him to double the margin of success on his attacks and counterattacks, allowing him to utterly demolish n00bs. The capstone is Thousand Unsettled Hands of War, which is like Fist of Acala except that it uses Empathy.

Celestial Form Kung Fu (Seishaku Kei-i Ken)

A martial art said to have been created by studying the stars in the sky. It's totally not Hokuto Shin Ken. And the first technique is only called The North Star because... because.

The main gimmick of this style is that it needs to be charged, with each technique requiring both an action of preparation and all lower-level techniques to have already been prepared. So to you the style's full potential, one has to either charge up over multiple rounds like a DBZ character or spend a couple Kiai points to buy additional actions.
In exchange for this charging up, you gain the biggest Unarmed Combat boosts there are. The penultimate technique The Heavenly Gate gives you a +15 (only surpassed by a Zakt-8R unloading its entire magazine), and the capstone technique The Broken Army gives you a +40, which allows you to knock out pretty much any Armour with one hit (or two if the Rider decides to check off the Dead Box).

That's right. Stay in the background, charge up for a while, destroy everthing you touch. You are already dead indeed.

Next Time: Kijin - harder, better, faster, stronger.

Doresh fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Nov 20, 2015

Covok
May 27, 2013

Yet where is that woman now? Tell me, in what heave does she reside? None of them. Because no God bothered to listen or care. If that is what you think it means to be a God, then you and all your teachings are welcome to do as that poor women did. And vanish from these realms forever.

Alien Rope Burn posted:

If I'm running a game, definitely. It's possible I'll skip parts like back-of-the-book locales or adventures that are generally less relevant to me, but I think it's definitely essential to RPGs with detailed settings. As a player, I'm less likely to; if I'm playing in a PbP, I generally won't have the time. I find it interesting that you bring up Torchbearer and Chuubo's, because I feel both Crane and Moran write presuming their books are going to be read cover-to-cover, and I find their games very hard to interpret "piecemeal", with their rules spread into odd sections in the book and often not written like technical manuals (which I think is a bit of an issue, because that's partly what an RPG book is).

Edit: Writing as I do for FATAL & Friends is a bit of an oddity because I think vanishingly few people read Palladium books cover-to-cover, even amongst the fandom. They're not well-organized, but the slapdash layout lends itself very well to being read piecemeal, because it rarely presumes you've read the rest of the book's text.

The way I read those books is weird. I tried to read them from cover to cover, but only made it past the first chapter before I got bored. So, instead, I just kept flipping through the books and picking up the relevant mechanics. If I read something that didn't make sense, I flipped to the index and found what it was. I'm not trying to say this is the right way to do anything, but I just can't read these things cover to cover.

It's kind or ironic because I write games in that assumption, kind of. It's just some rule I got in my head that I should never use a term until it's been defined previously. So, my games are set-up so that, if you read cover to cover, you would read everything you need to before it was referenced. I don't know why I can't do the same in my reading outside of boredom.

Evil Mastermind
Apr 28, 2008

Hey, if you want to possibly get something F&F-worthy or give your favorite reviewer something, why not sign up for the TradGames Secret Santa?

Heliotrope
Aug 17, 2007

You're fucking subhuman

Covok posted:

I hope this isn't a derail, but I'm curious if anyone reads roleplaying books like this normally? Like, from cover to cover?

I never do, personally, and this is why I'm curious. I just read the cool bits and the relevant-to-play bits. From then on, I only reference it again if I forget something important.

If this is a derail, ignore me.

I read them cover to cover. Even if I never get around to playing them, I like checking out new systems enough to give it at least one in-depth read if it interests me.

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 5, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!


Part 13: "This 'beach stormer' allows the wielder to engage any enemy, from tanks to infantrymen to monsters, at any range, including close combat."

Weapons & Equipment of Tritonia

Blue-green lasers, do they really work? I mean, all the '90s-era RPGs taught us that if you make a laser blue-green, you can fire it underwater! But the reality is that those are just the frequencies you use for communication lasers underwater, like for real-life submarines. But water is a really bad thing to fire lasers in, as it turns out, since it disperses light pretty drat well, and even low-energy communications lasers tend to have a range between 10 and 100 meters. I mean, if you have a weapon that can fire enough light to make people sorry, it can probably have an effect underwater (presuming it's fluidproofed), but the range is going to be hilariously short, like an energetic shotgun. And you'll probably boil yourself, if you care, given the energy levels "mega-damage" would require. Of course, that boiling might reduce the range further, but there hasn't been any real-life testing of such a weapon.

This has been your Rifts science check. Because unlike all that, blue-green lasers work in water "unimpeded" just like they do in air! And, of course, lasers are somehow silent, if you'll recall. (How much regular lasers are limited in water is not detailed.) Mind, you're likely to be unable to see underwater as far as these weapons shoot, but that's forgotten, too. And so, with reality aside, it's time for Tritonia's blue-green lasers! Pew pew.


Keeps calling me its master, but I feel like its slave.
  • BG-15 Blue-Green Laser Pistol: Does garbage damage, but it can do garbage damage underwater! It looks like the Wilk's pistol from the corebook, so they don't need to draw new art for it.
  • BG-20 Blue-Green Laser Rifle: Pretty average, but it's average under the sea.
  • M-80 "Stormbringer" Multi-Weapon Assault System (MWAS): A weapon with too many names. It shoots meh ion pulses, solid mini-missiles, and the Worst Bayonet Ever (does 1d6 mega-damage, which is good for murdering mackerel but not monsters). It requires a high strength for some inane reason.
TL;DR - Tritonian weapons are crap, get a rail gun. Time for armor!


Redefining the term "frogman".
  • SCUBA Body Armor: A fairly heavy suit for armor, but apparently it uses "ballast compartments" with its oxygen supply to enable the wearer to sink or rise. Despite that, it offers no benefit to Swim checks, waterhobos.
  • Amphib Body Armor: A heavier version of the above armor designed for the Amphibs' greater strength. Sometimes they often have no air supply or environmental protection, on the other hand. It's very handwavey.
Without a section divider, on to vehicles!

Merbot Power Armor


Where the legs go, nobody knows.

Merbots? Weren't those the Autobots that combined into a giant merm... no? Oh. Well, this is a power armor designed for underwater use, like you're a beautiful mermaid (or merbutler?). You can go up to 50 MPH underwater, a boring blue-green wrist laser, mini-torpedoes, and a M-90 "Beach Stormer" that's a bigger version of the M-80 that actually does serious damage, unlike it's smaller counterpart. However, it requires an insane amount of strength (40) to use, which this power armor somehow has. Lastly, it has a tail assembly you can eject to climb up on land with, just like the Tom Hanks mega-hit Splash!

"Bottom Feeder" T-23 Mini-Sub


Submarine or balsa wood flyer, your call.

This is a sub crewed by 4-10 (2d4+2)... wait, do they roll randomly to determine how many crew members they need? Weird. Anyway, it has several variants, like the T-23CS (military), T-23BS (science), and T-23AS (salvage). And of course, the science vessel is "BS", amirite? ;)

It has a solid amount of M.D.C., but it's no Glitter Boy. It has passable laser pod and ion guns, and mini-torpedoes. The military version has medium-range torpedoes, in case you need to hit foes ten miles away. Underwater, they can putter about 34 MPH, or 58 MPH on the surface.

Sea "Fin" combat Sled


Yes, this looks like a human design.

This looks more like something weird and asymmetrical the Kittani would come up with, but nope, it's a human design made for exploration. It only offers modest defense, but lets you jet at 65 MPH, despite being as hydrodynamic as a chicken leg. The whole thing looks like a phone handset for the Lord of the Deep. And, like the dolphin armors, the pilot is exposed and can be targeted from behind. It's got mini-torpedoes, terrible lasers, an S.D.C. harpoon gun, and fancy cameras... because, I guess.

Torpedo Sled


"We thought about armoring the legs, but, you know, that sounded like effort."

No, you can't ride this and explode at the enemy. It doesn't even carry any weapons. So much for naming your aquasleds sensibly. It can go 50 MPH, has only modest defense (once again, exposing the rider), and... sensors... and that's all. Nothing shooty, just big goofy turbines with your rear end hanging out the back.

And that's Tritonia! They're pretty decent as far as factions go, and even the fishmen are pretty alright, but when the dumb comes (the jab at political correctness, their weaksauce "revolts") it comes on strong.

Next: In the Navy.

Alien Rope Burn fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Dec 21, 2015

PubicMice
Feb 14, 2012

looking for information on posts
This is an rpg.

This is its GM guide.

Green Intern
Dec 29, 2008

Loon, Crazy and Laughable


:catstare:

This sure is....something.

Hostile V
May 31, 2013

Solving all of life's problems through enhanced casting of Occam's Razor. Reward yourself with an imaginary chalice.

Oh goodness, Normality. A RPG I liked the idea behind but it's incredibly dense and hard to make sense of outside of the GM guide and an article on TVTropes that explains the setting. I kind of wanted to cover it for this thread because it's very unique (nor necessarily in a good way, I'll admit). I'll write up a quick thing for it later that explains what the hell it is you're looking at, but I will say this: the game guide for players is written completely in-universe. That stuff there is how people in that world think and behave. So. Yeah. If you know anything about Nine Inch Nails' Year Zero, think along those lines.

E: meh, nevermind, upon rereading the GM guide that's as good as anything for an explanation. I guess the moral of the story is "don't lobotomize Jesus".

Hostile V fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Nov 21, 2015

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The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

Alien Rope Burn posted:

TL;DR - Tritonian weapons are crap, get a rail gun. Time for armor!

Railguns won't work underwater either - the slug will tear itself apart almost instantaneously.

Supercavitating microtorpedoes are where it's at.

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