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RabidWeasel posted:This actually sounds really fun, I'm impressed. confirming proxy waring is super fun in MP 
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Nov 20, 2015 17:18
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I am inordinately amused by the fact that this time around the revolutionary Greek government is based in Crete while the reactionaries are based in the mainland.
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Nov 20, 2015 17:18
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podcat posted:confirming proxy waring is super fun in MP With all these neat features, it's almost like you want to make a Cold War game. Especially with all this potential for proxy wars everywhere.
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Nov 20, 2015 17:42
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HoI 4 is gonna be really good; I can feel it.
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Nov 20, 2015 17:49
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Part of me is concerned what the hell civil wars are going to do in an 8~ year long game, Spain and China aside. Seems like it'd be just an annoying distraction, especially looking that the way Greece was split up in the example. The rest still looks good, tho, so we'll just see.
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Nov 20, 2015 17:54
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Gamerofthegame posted:Part of me is concerned what the hell civil wars are going to do in an 8~ year long game, Spain and China aside. Seems like it'd be just an annoying distraction, especially looking that the way Greece was split up in the example. Thought the game was still going to be '36 to '48, like HOI2 vanilla was? Edit: the one thing that always strikes me about HOI4 DD's is just how goddamn good the game looks. I mean, aesthetically, it's very pleasing. Drone fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Nov 20, 2015 |
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Nov 20, 2015 17:57
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lol you can already smell the cold war dlc from here
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Nov 20, 2015 18:08
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Mans posted:lol you can already smell the cold war dlc from here Well we always knew it would be coming since Paradox scotched EvW 
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Nov 20, 2015 18:26
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So any two factions within a country can trigger a civil war, then? Neutral-on-Democratic, even, if the conditions are right?
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Nov 20, 2015 19:23
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Ofaloaf posted:So any two factions within a country can trigger a civil war, then? Neutral-on-Democratic, even, if the conditions are right? Pro-skub Revolutionary Republic confirmed.
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Nov 20, 2015 19:49
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Is it possible to have a three-way civil war, like if the communists decide to fight the current democratic government and then the fascists also decide to fight since there's fighting going on?
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Nov 20, 2015 20:31
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vyelkin posted:Is it possible to have a three-way civil war, like if the communists decide to fight the current democratic government and then the fascists also decide to fight since there's fighting going on? Pave the way for Kaiserreich.
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Nov 20, 2015 20:35
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Yeah, a two-way civil war is good for countries sized like Greece, but places like USSR and USA better be able to have multiple factions rising up, if only because they have the higher chance of breaking apart due to their size.
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Nov 20, 2015 20:38
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vyelkin posted:Is it possible to have a three-way civil war, like if the communists decide to fight the current democratic government and then the fascists also decide to fight since there's fighting going on? I would guess so, since it seems to be an event that starts off the civil war, with the effect of spawning a civil war faction and giving them some territory depending on which party started off the civil war. Should be possible to make it so that if a third party has enough support that they'll split off and fight as well. Won't necessarily be in the main game, but it should possibly be easy enough to do.
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Nov 20, 2015 20:41
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vyelkin posted:Is it possible to have a three-way civil war, like if the communists decide to fight the current democratic government and then the fascists also decide to fight since there's fighting going on? In the DD thread, Podcat mentioned that doesn't happen in the current iteration. I'm at work so I don't have time to track down the quote.
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Nov 20, 2015 21:04
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Demiurge4 posted:
I know most people have a hate-on for DLC, but I actually like the Paradox method of DLC, incremental improvements building off the base game and extending its lifespan. I could picture that Paradox is focusing on making a solid game first, then over time adding on resource and economy systems to the Stellaris game to keep it interesting and ensure it isn't a buggy broken mess.
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Nov 20, 2015 21:05
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Paradox DLC isn't really like DLC, it's more like paid patches / expansions that you get most of the content for free anyway if you don't pay.
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Nov 20, 2015 21:10
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He also mentions that this system isn't used for China, because that conflict is too big/too complex. And tiny countries don't get it either, like Albania or Luxembourg. Maybe a later DLC will have a civil war system adopted for the bigger contries so we can have multi-faction affairs (or in the US/USSR cases: Multi-state, member states trying to break away etc).
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Nov 20, 2015 21:25
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Pimpmust posted:Maybe a later DLC will have a civil war system adopted for the bigger contries so we can have multi-faction affairs (or in the US/USSR cases: Multi-state, member states trying to break away etc). It would also be interesting if there were cross-national rebellions that could happen across country lines. Like if a chunk of the northern US and Canada declared it was its own state and not part of either country. It would probably be too hard to manage as a fun game mechanic, though.
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Nov 20, 2015 21:31
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Did they say how they determine which state sides with who?
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Nov 20, 2015 21:39
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It would be cool if they had a bunch of potential break-away states in the game so that future civil wars could go along those lines. So like texas could break away, not because of "fascism" but "texan independence". It would have its own flag and such ready to go within the game. Cascadia, new england, Quebec, so many good potentials and that's just NA. Also are the "big 3" factions hard coded in the game or can you add more? What about democratic communists opposed to the capitalist west AND the brutal dictators of the soviet union? Could you mod that in? I'd just love to see something like a North America that didn't really survive the great depression politically and having a communist civil war, but the result being something not automatically assumed to be in Russia's camp. Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Nov 20, 2015 |
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Nov 20, 2015 22:41
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Factions are dynamic in this, the only set things are Britain, Germany and the USSR being faction leaders at the game start, after that it's all up in the air.
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Nov 20, 2015 23:37
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Baronjutter posted:It would be cool if they had a bunch of potential break-away states in the game so that future civil wars could go along those lines. So like texas could break away, not because of "fascism" but "texan independence". It would have its own flag and such ready to go within the game. Cascadia, new england, Quebec, so many good potentials and that's just NA.
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Nov 20, 2015 23:49
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Ofaloaf posted:I don't know about HoI3, but HoI2 and Darkest Hour had the CSA, Texas and California as potential states. Revolters not present on the map at game start have been in the Hearts of Iron series for a while now. Tying that in to the civil war system so it's not just PROV1234 REBEL_TYPE farting around on a couple of provs would be neat, but breakaway states and such have totally been a thing. Though usually those were not largely designed to be revolters, more smaller states to be released by some foreign power once they take over or win the war.
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Nov 20, 2015 23:53
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Also, those smaller states could be a good way to model the aforementioned neutral-on-democratic civil war. These states could be something similar to the Pacific States in Kaiserreich, modelling a relatively stable region trying to free itself from the tirefire that is the rest of the nation.
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Nov 21, 2015 00:24
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Return of the goofy-rear end communist flags from V2, also cameo appearance by Markos Vafiadis. Wonder if Metaxas gets his due.
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Nov 21, 2015 00:31
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Would it touch like the ethnic dimension of Yugoslav partisan activity or is that getting too much into a grey area? It'd probably work out very well in a V3 iteration (having a Polish, Finnish, Ukrainian, etc. faction during the Russian Empire's collapse). It's a mechanic that I can imagine seeing versions of for a while.
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Nov 21, 2015 00:57
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vyelkin posted:Is it possible to have a three-way civil war, like if the communists decide to fight the current democratic government and then the fascists also decide to fight since there's fighting going on? "Rufo posted:No. Sometimes a faction might have large political support from different ideologies (such as the Republican side in the Spanish Civil War), but a civil war always happen between two parties at a time. he and podcat also note that the AI won't launch coups, and will probably continue not doing so except in special cases (because otherwise 'there would be no ww2'), which seems a little odd to me.
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Nov 21, 2015 02:37
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They confirmed in the thread that the Chinese Civil War is too complex to render with the civil war system everyone else has, so it's got some unique stuff to it. Could it be???? China...represented...better??????
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Nov 21, 2015 02:39
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Funky Valentine posted:They confirmed in the thread that the Chinese Civil War is too complex to render with the civil war system everyone else has, so it's got some unique stuff to it. Not until dlc 2 at the earliest
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Nov 21, 2015 02:40
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PleasingFungus posted:he and podcat also note that the AI won't launch coups, and will probably continue not doing so except in special cases (because otherwise 'there would be no ww2'), which seems a little odd to me. The HoI IV AI may be too smart for its own good- I think it was Podcat that said he had to apply obscene modifiers to the Japanese AI to make it think attacking the US was a winnable and good idea.
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Nov 21, 2015 03:35
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PleasingFungus posted:he and podcat also note that the AI won't launch coups, and will probably continue not doing so except in special cases (because otherwise 'there would be no ww2'), which seems a little odd to me. It probably wouldn't be a good time if at '37-8 all the minors in Europe just suddenly erupted in civil wars every game.
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Nov 21, 2015 04:03
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Or maybe it would be the best time to play as a minor  Funky Valentine posted:They confirmed in the thread that the Chinese Civil War is too complex to render with the civil war system everyone else has, so it's got some unique stuff to it. Maybe China will actually be at war this time. Kind of hoping that something like the Jingwei regime gets in too, or at least is easy to mod in.
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Nov 21, 2015 05:08
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Kavak posted:The HoI IV AI may be too smart for its own good- I think it was Podcat that said he had to apply obscene modifiers to the Japanese AI to make it think attacking the US was a winnable and good idea. Hahaha that's amazing. Just something that assesses it's own strength at like, 500% or something?
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Nov 21, 2015 05:24
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Mister Adequate posted:Hahaha that's amazing. Just something that assesses it's own strength at like, 500% or something? Just break the Japanese AI such that every time it loses a unit, it adds to their internal army strength estimate instead of subtracting from it. Voila, a perfect simulation of Japanese strategic thinking in WW2.
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Nov 21, 2015 05:25
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Kavak posted:The HoI IV AI may be too smart for its own good- I think it was Podcat that said he had to apply obscene modifiers to the Japanese AI to make it think attacking the US was a winnable and good idea. After planning Pearl Harbor the AI Yamamoto goes up into his room and quaffs magical potions and practices archery with his dog.
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Nov 21, 2015 05:29
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Dibujante posted:Just break the Japanese AI such that every time it loses a unit, it adds to their internal army strength estimate instead of subtracting from it. Voila, a perfect simulation of Japanese strategic thinking in WW2.  Of course you'd really need more than one Japanese AI; if the navy is ascendant and in control they should have a slightly more realistic assessment of the world. The army should not. Your idea is one I like. Also count garrison and militia units as being as powerful as nukes.
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Nov 21, 2015 05:31
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Kavak posted:The HoI IV AI may be too smart for its own good- I think it was Podcat that said he had to apply obscene modifiers to the Japanese AI to make it think attacking the US was a winnable and good idea. Imperial Japan: dumber than strategy game AI
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Nov 21, 2015 05:32
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Without bringing in some CK II mechanics, there's no way to represent the out-of-control nature of the Imperial Army. I'm kind of amazed they managed to confine themselves to assassinations and coup plots and nobody launched an armed insurrection.
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Nov 21, 2015 05:37
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Kavak posted:Without bringing in some CK II mechanics, there's no way to represent the out-of-control nature of the Imperial Army. I'm kind of amazed they managed to confine themselves to assassinations and coup plots and nobody launched an armed insurrection. Just make it so that the Japan AI cannot launch amphibious invasions unless the target province is out of supply.
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Nov 21, 2015 05:39
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