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SpiderHyphenMan posted:Just because Gamergate started as a hashtag doesn't mean it's not a real source of actual serious problems for a non-zero number of women. Less importantly, that article is basically just "This show for nerds about harassment is clearly a reference to Nerd Harassment and not harassment in general, because Nerd Harassment is relevant to me and therefore my reading connecting the two is valid."
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Nov 25, 2015 01:09
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Jessica does strike me as being a deliberately unlikable, unsympathetic character, but as you go on, they give a variety of rationales for it. She's a typically bratty teenager, and the situation as filmed gives her more than a little basis for feeling like she's to blame for the crash that killed her family. When she wakes up, she's taken in by a distant acquaintance's family as a blatant publicity stunt, and ends up with powers she can't readily monetize. When Trish talks her into being a hero, the first or second "hero" thing she ever does puts her in contact with Kilgrave, who collects her like she's a baseball card and puts her through hell. At the other end of that, she's a barely functional alcoholic who deliberately avoids the one remaining positive presence in her life. Basically, Jessica's entire life from age fourteen onward, or however old she's meant to be in the flashbacks, is a conga line of trauma, and it's understandable if she's barely holding on. I thought it was reasonably obvious that given all of that, saving Hope became the one good thing that Jessica thought she could do. She fixated on that, because otherwise she'd have stayed in that blind panic she's in for a bit of the first episode, and would probably have drank herself to death in a gutter somewhere on the other side of the world. All of which is to say that I don't think the criticisms of her planning skills are terribly merited. Someone earlier in the thread put it very well, in that "I would not have made the same mistake" isn't much of a criticism; neither is "well, call SHIELD or the Avengers." Jessica is an ordinary woman with virtually no relevant experience (I'd be surprised if she actually has a private investigator's license) or any real contacts besides Jeri, doing the absolute best she can under the circumstances, and with that in mind, she succeeds admirably. (I would enjoy it if there was some Easter-egg reference in "Agents of SHIELD," where they find out some New York tactical team they sent to investigate Kilgrave ended up being commanded to forget all about him, or padlocked themselves in a storage locker, or some other inconvenience that kept them out of the plot. I suppose SHIELD's reorganization and current limitations would explain its lack of involvement just as well, though.) As for her super-strength, such as it is, I thought it was reasonably used. Jessica habitually holds back, because she's trying to keep her powers a secret, and even when she completely cuts loose she's not really that powerful, especially on the MCU scale. (Even in the comics, Jessica's super-strength is habitually underplayed unless she's apocalyptically angry; the only real example I can think of of her using it is in The Pulse, when she flies up several stories and beats Norman Osborn with a motorcycle, when she thought he'd hurt her unborn baby.) She's half-drunk and exhausted when the support group jumps her, so when Robyn pops up and whacks her in the face with a two-by-four, she drops. She's in Buffy the Vampire Slayer's weight class. My main criticism of the show is that it could've used a couple of lighter episodes to break things up, particularly near the end. I had a very hard time watching the last half of the series, and actively had to skip scenes with Robyn; I don't get how anyone can give the show poo poo for the "inside you" line while ignoring pretty much every single word out of Robyn's mouth. Everything she said sounded like an intern's contribution and she added virtually nothing to the show.
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Nov 25, 2015 01:39
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We know she does have her PI license. Its mentioned that all her fees and paperwork are up to date.
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Nov 25, 2015 01:43
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Please talk more about this Salon Gamergate article written by Arthur Chu I want to see how long it takes for all my favorite people to show up.
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Nov 25, 2015 01:49
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This show is only related to Gamergate in the sense that nearly every woman on planet Earth has to deal with lovely and creepy dudes pretty much all the time, including women on the internet.
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Nov 25, 2015 01:53
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What other ridiculous poo poo clogging up the internet can be referenced for this comic book show? (The Luke Cage IS WHAT A MAN SHOULD BE! show is something of a gimme at this point)
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Nov 25, 2015 02:11
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Gyges posted:Jessica isn't a great fighter, especially when surprised. She's good when she initiates and is able to freely use her super strength on surprised people. This is just an excuse for the bad fight scenes. Why hasn't she had fight training? It would hardly be unusual for her, and in fact, considering that she works as a PI (which can be a dangerous job), actively tried to be a proper superhero for a while, and presumably acted as Kilgrave's muscle when needed, it's almost weirder for her not to have training. It's not like if Jessica had been really good at fighting (or even just competent) that this thread would be full of people complaining about how unrealistic it was. Crow_Robot posted:Simpson's fault isn't wanting to kill Kilgrave, it's not listening to/heeding the advice of/acknowledging the opinions of the females around him. I agree that's what they were going for, and it's a totally legitimate point for them to make. But my point is that they hosed up and undermined that point by having Simpson turn out to be 100% right in the end. I'm criticising the execution, not the intention.
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Nov 25, 2015 02:42
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Comrade Fakename posted:This is just an excuse for the bad fight scenes. Why hasn't she had fight training? She has super strength and durability.
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Nov 25, 2015 02:44
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I think it perfectly fits Jessica's character for her to have never bothered getting proper training for a fight. Why would she have? She has frikkin super strength. She can just punch stuff, right?
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Nov 25, 2015 02:47
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The show's depiction of metropolitan lesbians as being inhabitants of murderous drama whirlpools trapped in cycles of emotional abuse was problematically accurate.
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Nov 25, 2015 02:48
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Yeah, Luke is the first other superhuman she's ever met, and the MCU has all of five or six high-profile superheroes at this point. She got her powers before she hit 18, which means she's solidly outclassed everyone she's ever met. She hasn't needed to actually learn how to fight because she can casually bench-press a thousand pounds. It'd also be difficult to learn even basic self-defense when you're stronger than your trainer by a factor of 10 or so, and even tougher to do so without the trainer telling someone about it.
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Nov 25, 2015 02:49
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zoux posted:In the first issue, after JJ and Luke Cage have sex there's this panel: That picture Luke's facing was in Jessica's bedroom on the show, that's a neat callback.
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Nov 25, 2015 02:54
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I'm upset the anal wasn't as implied as it was in the comic.
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Nov 25, 2015 02:55
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Wanderer posted:
She may be stronger than the trainer had she, ever, you know, used her powers other than times where the story has to remind itself she actually has super powers. But then again it may be difficult to train someone who wakes up with a hangover when morning is almost over, after apparently preferring to purchase bottles of liquor with only one shot left in them and getting drunk on it the night before.
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Nov 25, 2015 03:01
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Comrade Fakename posted:This is just an excuse for the bad fight scenes. Why hasn't she had fight training? I agree that the fight scenes are not well choreographed, most likely because that's not this showrunner's strong suit (certainly vs. Stephen DeKnight, whose bread and butter has been violent action media for years now.) But I actually believe she might not have fight training. Trish is really type-A and proactive, so she'd totally take Krav Maga. But Jessica is a broken, depressed alcoholic with no sense of self-worth. The reality that her friends love and value her is a constant obstacle for her...making proactive decisions in the interest of self-improvement probably isn't something she'd do. She can't even repair her door. Not that it excuses poorly staged action scenes. The actual superhero genre elements on this show seem peripheral to the story Melissa Rosenberg wanted to tell.
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Nov 25, 2015 03:06
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Junkfist posted:I'm upset the anal wasn't as implied as it was in the comic.
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Nov 25, 2015 03:07
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Xealot posted:I agree that the fight scenes are not well choreographed, most likely because that's not this showrunner's strong suit (certainly vs. Stephen DeKnight, whose bread and butter has been violent action media for years now.) Daredevil had some sick fight scenes like the single cut brawl in the second episode.
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Nov 25, 2015 03:12
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LividLiquid posted:Comic spoilers: Didn't she get pregnant from that encounter? No, it happened later after her and Luke were officially an item. I kind of want them to cover that part of her story later because it's a big part of her "healing" arc where she sort of works through her Killgrave baggage. To bad we can't watch her beat the poo poo out of [comic spoiler]the Goblin with his glider.
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Nov 25, 2015 03:42
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Toplowtech posted:I actually think the original comics was an answer to far more numerous and larger problems than those associated to that hashtag and contriving its adaptation's theme to a terrible twitter famewar, is like pretty pretty reductive.
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Nov 25, 2015 03:54
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Gyges posted:No, it happened later after her and Luke were officially an item. I kind of want them to cover that part of her story later because it's a big part of her "healing" arc where she sort of works through her Killgrave baggage. Well the Spider-Man rights are now shared between Sony and Marvel. But I have no desire to see that. That was such a disappointing issue. Now that it was bad but to see the Goblin taken down publicly and Spider-Man wasn't the one to do it but rather Cage and Jones.
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Nov 25, 2015 04:30
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Gyges posted:No, it happened later after her and Luke were officially an item. I kind of want them to cover that part of her story later because it's a big part of her "healing" arc where she sort of works through her Killgrave baggage. With Spider-Man getting added to the mcu, one can hope.
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Nov 25, 2015 04:34
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Gyges posted:No, it happened later after her and Luke were officially an item. I kind of want them to cover that part of her story later because it's a big part of her "healing" arc where she sort of works through her Killgrave baggage. No, she was dating Scott Lang at the time she found out she was pregnant with Luke's kid. That's what broke her and Scott up. Then she went to Luke and he asked if she wanted it; she said yes and that's when they became an item. It's not clear to me when the baby was conceived though, unless the entirety of Alias takes place over the span of just a few weeks.
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Nov 25, 2015 05:48
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Dongattack posted:eeehhh, JJ was such a boring character that i won't be watching the next season. What next season? Daredevil S2, Luke Cage, or The Defenders?
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Nov 25, 2015 05:52
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Argue posted:No, she was dating Scott Lang at the time she found out she was pregnant with Luke's kid. That's what broke her and Scott up. Then she went to Luke and he asked if she wanted it; she said yes and that's when they became an item. It's not clear to me when the baby was conceived though, unless the entirety of Alias takes place over the span of just a few weeks. I thought it was something else that made Scott break up with her. It's been a while since I read it.
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Nov 25, 2015 05:52
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Gyges posted:I thought it was something else that made Scott break up with her. It's been a while since I read it. Nah the exchange is something like Jessica: I'm pregnant Knock-off Antman: Oh. Not mine? Jessica: No. Knock-off Antman: Well, was nice knowing you. This is one of the few comics I've actually read within a decade so this is a novelty for me.
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Nov 25, 2015 06:26
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The Sharmat posted:Nah the exchange is something like He then gets killed by Bendis in Avengers Dissassembled. That is also Scott Lang which is the one that more people know now.
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Nov 25, 2015 06:29
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No one knew who any Antman was before the movie and I refuse to believe otherwise.
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Nov 25, 2015 06:32
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The Sharmat posted:No one knew who any Antman was before the movie and I refuse to believe otherwise. Lol as if Hank Pym's being a wife beater wasn't in established comic fan lore
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Nov 25, 2015 06:37
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Only comic fans knew that, so again, no one knew that because comic fans aren't people.
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Nov 25, 2015 06:43
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The Sharmat posted:Nah the exchange is something like That actually sometimes happens. I dated a woman for about a month before she figured that she was pregnant with her ex-boyfriends kid. We partied hard, and we just assumed morning sickness was a hangover. So once the girl I dated was pregnant with her ex-BF's kid, then it's kind of reasonable to check out once the kids start showing up. She had hooked up with her ex a month before we ever met. So I can't even complain about things that happened to my waifu before we ever met. thrakkorzog fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Nov 25, 2015 |
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Nov 25, 2015 08:47
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thrakkorzog posted:That actually sometimes happens. I dated a woman for about a month before she figured that she was pregnant with her ex-boyfriends kid. We partied hard, and we just assumed morning sickness was a hangover. Did she not have a choice?
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Nov 25, 2015 17:42
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Well, Tennant carried the show hard. Really curious what they'll do in season 2 without him, I certainly have no interest in watching a season with just the rest of the cast. The way Kilgrave kept escaping got extremely ridiculous. They should either have shortened it down a bit or maybe have the season start out with Jessica just doing regular cases while slowly building up Kilgrave in the background instead of going all in on it from episode 1. Or maybe just spend more episodes on the wacky adventures of the Superduo Jessica and Kilgrave, that was pretty rad. The fight scenes were laughably bad. It's like they didn't have any idea how to show super-strength so they just said gently caress it and shot it all halfassedly as hell. Way too much space wasted on the Lesbian Lawyer subplot. It was really stupid how she devolved into being comically evil with the whole aborted purple man fetus thing later on as well. Really wasn't expecting loving Nuke of all people to show up. Hope they do that one iconic Miller moment with that character and Daredevil/the Avengers. Decent show overall, a bit worse than Daredevil but I don't regret watching it. Please don't mess up Iron Fist Marvel/Netflix/Disney (if it even gets made) Kainser fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Nov 25, 2015 |
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Nov 25, 2015 18:41
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notthegoatseguy posted:Well the Spider-Man rights are now shared between Sony and Marvel. But I have no desire to see that. That was such a disappointing issue. Now that it was bad but to see the Goblin taken down publicly and Spider-Man wasn't the one to do it but rather Cage and Jones. I'd really like to see the Cage v Spiderman issue brought to screen. Basically Peter Parker is mourning the death of a friend the whole issue and every time Parker is having a sad reflective moment about things Luke cage breaks down a wall and beats his rear end.
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Nov 25, 2015 18:42
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Jimlit posted:I'd really like to see the Cage v Spiderman issue brought to screen. Basically Peter Parker is mourning the death of a friend the whole issue and every time Parker is having a sad reflective moment about things Luke cage breaks down a wall and beats his rear end. Ok now I want this to happen.
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Nov 25, 2015 19:11
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This show is very good and I recommend it a lot, though as people have pointed out it's much stronger thematically than on a plot level. There are a few two many twists and improbable coincidences used to keep things moving, and it probably would have been better off about 3 episodes shorter. Still, it's dealing with issues and perspectives that are nearly unprecedented in superhero and detective noir stories in a very thoughtful way. Obviously David Tennant was brilliant, but not so far to the point that I don't think the show has a future without him. And I can't wait for more Luke Cage. At first I didn't care for Trish much - I think her actress wasn't pulling off a convincing American accent - but she really grew on me, to the point that I got really worried at the various points her life was in danger later on. Can't wait for her to become a full-fledged superhero. I really hoped that when the old black cop said he's two years for retirement and waiting for his pension they would subvert that cliche but nope!
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Nov 25, 2015 20:03
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Jimlit posted:I'd really like to see the Cage v Spiderman issue brought to screen. Basically Peter Parker is mourning the death of a friend the whole issue and every time Parker is having a sad reflective moment about things Luke cage breaks down a wall and beats his rear end.
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Nov 25, 2015 20:04
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Omnomnomnivore posted:At first I didn't care for Trish much - I think her actress wasn't pulling off a convincing American accent I didn't know she was faking her accent.
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Nov 25, 2015 20:07
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The Sharmat posted:I didn't know she was faking her accent. Rachael Taylor is Australian. And I might just be weirdly sensitive here. It's one of those things that once I figured out what British and Australian actors doing American sound like I can't unhear it. Like, I didn't think Charlie Cox did great with the accent either, he sort of covered it up by mumbling a lot. Though in Trish's case I guess being a child TV star means she probably got tons of speech coaching and stuff so maybe it's in character.
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Nov 25, 2015 20:19
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The MCU is infinitely more likable than the comics, at least so far, and maybe only because the MCU hasn't been around long enough to sort of strangle itself with its own tail. Let me explain - in the comics, no villain is every truly defeated. In the MCU, it happens all the time. After I finished Jessica Jones, I looked up the Purple Man on a Marvel wiki and my eyes wanted to roll back in my head at how stupid it was. He basically has the same powers, goes toe-to-toe with a bunch of heroes, partners up with other villains, gets defeated and seemingly killed multiple times, you know, the usual comic book villain crap. At the end of JJ, Kilgrave is definitely defeated, no coming back. This is what makes the MCU different - the only thing I can see happening is something in a future plotline with the aborted fetus's stem cells. I bet anything someone else is going to use that dangling plot thread, especially since the scientist dad mentioned stem cells, and stem cells = voodoo fetus science to most people. Kilgrave's powers aren't as frightening in the comics where people with "iron wills" like Daredevil can just resist him, or where agencies are prepared to SCIENCE the gently caress out of him in a prison cell somewhere on a moment's notice. About future seasons, I don't like any of the characters enough to watch a second season. Tennant was incredible, and Kilgrave was a terrifying villain. It's actually one of the scariest super-powers I can imagine when used by a sadistic madman. There were some really dumb decisions by characters made throughout the show, the worst of which was lesbian lawyer getting convinced to help Kilgrave escape. For one thing, it was totally unrealistic: Kilgrave shouldn't know how to manipulate people like that. The last, what, twenty years of his life were spent never asking anyone to do anything, but to command them. He shouldn't know how to manipulate people without his powers. The one time we see him not use his powers to get what he wants, he uses the greatest super-power of all: 1.2 million dollars. But Jessica shouldn't have left Kilgrave alone with anyone at that point, the lawyer shouldn't have known how to disable the safeguard, and did the lawyer even believe his powers at that point?
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Nov 25, 2015 20:54
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Omnomnomnivore posted:Rachael Taylor is Australian. And I might just be weirdly sensitive here. It's one of those things that once I figured out what British and Australian actors doing American sound like I can't unhear it. Like, I didn't think Charlie Cox did great with the accent either, he sort of covered it up by mumbling a lot. Though in Trish's case I guess being a child TV star means she probably got tons of speech coaching and stuff so maybe it's in character. Yeah since I saw her in Transformers first where she had her original accent. I wonder if she went to the same American voice coach as Rosamund Pike did for Gone Girl, they sounded very similar.
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Nov 25, 2015 20:57
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