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Gamerofthegame
Oct 28, 2010

Could at least flip one or two, maybe.

Gort posted:

Yeah, I wouldn't forgo fighters on my carriers unless I had land-based fighter cover (and perhaps not even then) but I don't see myself sacrificing torpedo bombers in favour of dive-bombers on a carrier, ever. I guess it all depends exactly what stats the two bomber types end up having.

Admittedly I'd forgotten the waaay back air combat dev diary, which has the map divied up into various strategic regions - which the whole of France consists of two areas of. So fighters probably will have a fair amount of reach in, say, the Med.

Though that just goes to "wait, why not just stack naval bombers in Gibraltar and say "HEY THERE ITALY, GOING SOMEWHERE?" or something for the same general effect.

Gort posted:

Yeah, I wouldn't forgo fighters on my carriers unless I had land-based fighter cover (and perhaps not even then) but I don't see myself sacrificing torpedo bombers in favour of dive-bombers on a carrier, ever. I guess it all depends exactly what stats the two bomber types end up having.

Nah, for pacific def CAS all day long, need to bang up those islands.

Agean90 posted:

Cruisers: like destroyers but larger. Not sure what the were good at, neither were IRL navies to be honest

You know how as the war went on everyone figured out that medium tanks were the most practical and most powerful to use, really? Cruisers are medium tanks.

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Agean90
Jun 28, 2008


But not really because carriers were better at killing poo poo to, destroyers did fleet support better for cheaper, and battlecruisers were better at operating independently.

Admittedly I mostly only know about the pacific theater, how all the lesser navel powers fought idk

Mans
Sep 14, 2011

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Gamerofthegame posted:


Fears of early British carriers running around the Mediterranean just barfing Swordfish while Italians uselessly flail come to mind...

well if the British go full out on producing and using the best aircraft of the entire war it will be no surprise if they dominate the air and sea.

Enjoy
Apr 18, 2009

Agean90 posted:

I feel ya bro, here WW2 navies for dummies

Submarines: long hard and full of seamen. Botes that sink, but can also unsink. Used either independently or as part of fleets.

Destroyers: smallest warbote you'll see on the surface. Fast and lightly armored its good at killing subs or using torpedoes to kill large botes with no support. Best used in large numbers.

Cruisers: like destroyers but larger. Not sure what the were good at, neither were IRL navies to be honest

Battle cruisers: you know what sucks? Armor. Armor is for pussies, strip that bullshit off so we can go fast and carry bigger guns.

Carrier: huge fucker that carries airplanes. Will get hosed if caught alone

Battleship BIG GUNS BEST GUNS BEST SHIP so long as there arnt carriers in the region.


Light cruisers are good for swatting aircraft out of the sky so they're great at screening carriers. Heavy cruisers are a faster and cheaper capital ship than battleships so they're good for keeping destroyer blobs at bay.

Westminster System
Jul 4, 2009
Cruisers are the every man with Light Cruisers basically being bigger destroyers and heavy cruisers being little battleships.

Cruisers are basically frigates before their time.

And now destroyers are cruisers and battleships are shore bombardment platforms.

Navies are confusing.

Ghost of Mussolini
Jun 26, 2011
I can't remember which iteration of HoI2 (and HoI2-offshoots) it was, but the ideal fleet was a massive ball of CL and CA + some CVL to increase detection. They would chew their way through everything (except the even more OP naval configuration, a stack of pure NAV bombers).

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea

Ghost of Mussolini posted:

I can't remember which iteration of HoI2 (and HoI2-offshoots) it was, but the ideal fleet was a massive ball of CL and CA + some CVL to increase detection. They would chew their way through everything (except the even more OP naval configuration, a stack of pure NAV bombers).

Sounds a bit like Darkest Hour, where a fleet of 30 modern CAs will murder anything they run into. That game had horrible naval mechanics. I can do an effortpost if anyone wants one, but I might start getting flashbacks halfway through.

Gort fucked around with this message at 14:12 on Dec 12, 2015

Larry Parrish
Jul 9, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Gort posted:

Sounds a bit like Darkest Hour, where a fleet of 30 modern CAs will murder anything they run into. That game had horrible naval mechanics. I can do an effortpost if anyone wants one, but I might start getting flashbacks halfway through.

My favorite Paradox naval game was the one where Aircraft Carriers didnt actually have aircraft, they just had guns with ridiculous range.

vyelkin
Jan 2, 2011

Larry Parrish posted:

My favorite Paradox naval game was the one where Aircraft Carriers didnt actually have aircraft, they just had guns with ridiculous range.

That's every version of HOI2.

Panzeh
Nov 27, 2006

"..The high ground"

Larry Parrish posted:

My favorite Paradox naval game was the one where Aircraft Carriers didnt actually have aircraft, they just had guns with ridiculous range.

To be fair, having seperate air groups from carriers is a micro issue that would need a workaround to be reasonable and have some gameplay to it.

Mans
Sep 14, 2011

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Ghost of Mussolini posted:

I can't remember which iteration of HoI2 (and HoI2-offshoots) it was, but the ideal fleet was a massive ball of CL and CA + some CVL to increase detection. They would chew their way through everything (except the even more OP naval configuration, a stack of pure NAV bombers).

In AoD the best fleet were 30 destroyers. 30 Submarines would devour everything but DDs could wreck submarines.

Of course like you say, NAV bombers were the kings of the sea in every HoI

FLIPSIXTHREEHOLE
Dec 30, 2010

New Stellaris preview with gameplay vids:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/12/11/stellaris-a-fresh-take-on-the-4x-strategy-genre

Not a ton of new information, but it's always nice to see things in action.

- Slightly animated portraits, sweet.
- Using POPs from different races to colonize certain planet types, kewl.
- late game Physics Crisis about opening up a portal to an EVIL DIMENSION? :pcgaming:

Bel Monte
Oct 9, 2012

Manket posted:

- late game Physics Crisis about opening up a portal to an EVIL DIMENSION? :pcgaming:

Do all the alien races on the other side have goatees? Even the robots, scrawled in sharpie?

BravestOfTheLamps
Oct 12, 2012

by FactsAreUseless
Lipstick Apathy

Bel Monte posted:

Do all the alien races on the other side have goatees? Even the robots, scrawled in sharpie?

Cut out of felt, actually.

Psychotic Weasel
Jun 24, 2004

Bang! You're dead.
If I name my science ship Event Horizon do I get a special event towards the end of the game and a Sam Neill character portrait?

FLIPSIXTHREEHOLE
Dec 30, 2010

Psychotic Weasel posted:

If I name my science ship Event Horizon do I get a special event towards the end of the game and a Sam Neill character portrait?




Dr. Weir, 52

+ 2.0 Hell Research Rate
+ 50% Negaverse Relations
+ 25 Heebies
+ 25 Jeebies

Baronjutter
Dec 31, 2007

"Tiny Trains"

Hi, Paradox, I need to play Stellaris. You could outsource making videos of people randomly hovering over the interface and sometimes clicking buttons to me if you want.

DrSunshine
Mar 23, 2009

Did I just say that out loud~~?!!!

Psychotic Weasel posted:

If I name my science ship Event Horizon do I get a special event towards the end of the game and a Sam Neill character portrait?

"Our lead scientist reports that the Wormhole Drive technology is almost ready. We have assembled the prototype ship, but initial readings seem to indicate that it might be possible to tear a rift into another dimension, whose properties could be completely beyond our comprehension. Should we abort the test?"

>Where we're going we won't need eyes to see...
>On second thought, let's research Warp Drive instead.

Sindai
Jan 24, 2007
i want to achieve immortality through not dying
drat, a voiced tutorial robot? Paradox going AAA now.

feller
Jul 5, 2006


I can understand paradox not wanting to make new DLC for Victoria 2, but they could seriously at least fix the fact that it
crashes
on
first
install
more
links

(it's the map/cache folder)

this is embarassing

Psychotic Weasel
Jun 24, 2004

Bang! You're dead.

Sindai posted:

drat, a voiced tutorial robot? Paradox going AAA now.

They should've kept up the trend HOI started in having Hitler due the tutorial.

Robot Hitler:



Also, those IGN videos seem like they were cut from something else with some of the audio removed. Why else would you just have the mouse hover over the same thing for 30-45 seconds with nothing else going on in total silence?

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I have three regrets
The first is to be born in Joseon.
hm those animated portraits are kind of squirmy in a way i don't think i like

everything else looks cool though. I love the chun chun chun of the ship in the first link, I hope there are lots of cool sounds.

Baronjutter
Dec 31, 2007

"Tiny Trains"

Psychotic Weasel posted:

Also, those IGN videos seem like they were cut from something else with some of the audio removed. Why else would you just have the mouse hover over the same thing for 30-45 seconds with nothing else going on in total silence?

It reminds me of video of when they try to teach a computer to play a game by trial and error and this was just footage of one of the iterations. Random mouse movements, random clicking, huge pauses of no activity, but clearly no intention or understanding behind anything.

Crash74
May 11, 2009

Baronjutter posted:

It reminds me of video of when they try to teach a computer to play a game by trial and error and this was just footage of one of the iterations. Random mouse movements, random clicking, huge pauses of no activity, but clearly no intention or understanding behind anything.

In the year 2015 skynet was created at the paradox offices in a mishap involving hearts of iron hitler dlc. The suvivors of the nuclear fire called the war judgment day.

goodness
Jan 3, 2012

When the light turns green, you go. When the light turns red, you stop. But what do you do when the light turns blue with orange and lavender spots?
EU4 vs CK2

After mistakenly believing CK2 was the newer and more updated game I did some reading all last night to see if I would be interested in playing. I got EU4 on steam awhile, only played a few games at the time and while very complicated I think I had some fun? Today I saw that Eu4 is actually the newer and more recent expansion even so now I am faced with deciding which way to go. Does the knowledge from each overlap in play ability?

DrSunshine
Mar 23, 2009

Did I just say that out loud~~?!!!
The music for Stellaris is fantastic. Very "spacey" in a somewhat gentler and chiller sciency sort of way.

The Chad Jihad
Feb 24, 2007


goodness posted:

EU4 vs CK2

After mistakenly believing CK2 was the newer and more updated game I did some reading all last night to see if I would be interested in playing. I got EU4 on steam awhile, only played a few games at the time and while very complicated I think I had some fun? Today I saw that Eu4 is actually the newer and more recent expansion even so now I am faced with deciding which way to go. Does the knowledge from each overlap in play ability?


Some concepts will cross over, and they use the same game engine, but overall not a whole lot. The main thing is CK2 is character based with you controlling a single lord and then their heir's whereas as you've seen EU4 is about countries

Yaoi Gagarin
Feb 20, 2014

Ghost of Mussolini posted:

I can't remember which iteration of HoI2 (and HoI2-offshoots) it was, but the ideal fleet was a massive ball of CL and CA + some CVL to increase detection. They would chew their way through everything (except the even more OP naval configuration, a stack of pure NAV bombers).

I remember this, it was called the Cruizerg. The way it would work is that you would put the fire control upgrade on the CLs, so they would have the same range as a CA. Then you would add two CVLs. At the time there was bug surrounding CVLs: if you had one in your fleet, after at most two or three rounds of combat your fleet would teleport to the engagement range of your shortest-ranged capital ship. That by itself is really good, but when you have CLs with the same range as CAs you basically have 15 extra ships that can do damage, and they're always guaranteed to be in range.

I think this started happening in Doomsday and was fixed in one of Armageddon's patches (but not when that expansion was first released).

YF-23
Feb 17, 2011

My god, it's full of cat!


goodness posted:

EU4 vs CK2

After mistakenly believing CK2 was the newer and more updated game I did some reading all last night to see if I would be interested in playing. I got EU4 on steam awhile, only played a few games at the time and while very complicated I think I had some fun? Today I saw that Eu4 is actually the newer and more recent expansion even so now I am faced with deciding which way to go. Does the knowledge from each overlap in play ability?

EU4 is a newer game but both CK2 and EU4 are actively being developed and expanded.

Bel Monte
Oct 9, 2012

goodness posted:

EU4 vs CK2

so now I am faced with deciding which way to go. Does the knowledge from each overlap in play ability?

On a macro level, there's overlap in the UI and all due to being the same engine, so you'll be making similar movements and choices between the two.

Mechanically, CK2 is more of an RPG Strategy game, while EU4 is a Strategy RPG game....a very light with RPG game at that.

I personally recommend playing by time period. CK2 first, then EU4, but not after you've burnt yourself out on one over the other. I'll still mix and match later on, but I feel playing CK2 first helps lead you into the EU series. Plus, you have DLC for EU4 allowing you to make custom countries. With an expander off steam, you can recreate the most important countries/situations/environments of your CK2 game in EU4. It won't be perfect, but it helps! And it's faster than modding files.

Pretty fun to watch the world grow and change that way.

vyelkin
Jan 2, 2011

VostokProgram posted:

I remember this, it was called the Cruizerg. The way it would work is that you would put the fire control upgrade on the CLs, so they would have the same range as a CA. Then you would add two CVLs. At the time there was bug surrounding CVLs: if you had one in your fleet, after at most two or three rounds of combat your fleet would teleport to the engagement range of your shortest-ranged capital ship. That by itself is really good, but when you have CLs with the same range as CAs you basically have 15 extra ships that can do damage, and they're always guaranteed to be in range.

I think this started happening in Doomsday and was fixed in one of Armageddon's patches (but not when that expansion was first released).

In Darkest Hour you would also add torpedoes to every ship because they would almost double your ship attack.

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea
Yeah, unit addons were all kinds of unbalanced in DH.

Pump it up! Do it!
Oct 3, 2012

Manket posted:

New Stellaris preview with gameplay vids:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/12/11/stellaris-a-fresh-take-on-the-4x-strategy-genre

Not a ton of new information, but it's always nice to see things in action.

- Slightly animated portraits, sweet.
- Using POPs from different races to colonize certain planet types, kewl.
- late game Physics Crisis about opening up a portal to an EVIL DIMENSION? :pcgaming:

Haha, there's a genocide button!

Ham Sandwiches
Jul 7, 2000

My opinion of the genocide button stuff has gone from "ha ha, a genocide button" to "holy loving poo poo is it that important to people" based on the collective reactions to that video.

Baronjutter
Dec 31, 2007

"Tiny Trains"

In basically every 4X game just wiping out a planet from orbit has always been a valid strategy. These are galactic race wars, some serious poo poo goes down. Ground combat is expensive, controlling an occupied planet can be a drain, and maybe your empire doesn't want to be multi-cultural. So, you just bomb their cities from orbit then move your own colonist in. Or you don't even move in, sometimes you don't even want the target, you just want to deny your enemy it.

FLIPSIXTHREEHOLE
Dec 30, 2010

Baronjutter posted:

In basically every 4X game just wiping out a planet from orbit has always been a valid strategy. These are galactic race wars, some serious poo poo goes down. Ground combat is expensive, controlling an occupied planet can be a drain, and maybe your empire doesn't want to be multi-cultural. So, you just bomb their cities from orbit then move your own colonist in. Or you don't even move in, sometimes you don't even want the target, you just want to deny your enemy it.

That's fine as long as there's repercussions to taking that route, like massive negative relation penalties with other empires/races, to the point where basically everyone else in the federation gets a free casus belli on you or they start a union to take down what is clearly a dangerous, wantonly destructive force in the galaxy.

Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

Manket posted:

That's fine as long as there's repercussions to taking that route, like massive negative relation penalties with other empires/races, to the point where basically everyone else in the federation gets a free casus belli on you or they start a union to take down what is clearly a dangerous, wantonly destructive force in the galaxy.

Mushrooms aren't people :colbert:

Dibujante
Jul 27, 2004

Manket posted:

That's fine as long as there's repercussions to taking that route, like massive negative relation penalties with other empires/races, to the point where basically everyone else in the federation gets a free casus belli on you or they start a union to take down what is clearly a dangerous, wantonly destructive force in the galaxy.

Games that do not enforce my moral views should be censored.

Funky Valentine
Feb 26, 2014

Dojyaa~an

Look, if the filthy potato people of Adsehteb IV didn't want to be blown to smithereens, they should've nicely kissed the boot of the Empire.

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Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

Funky Valentine posted:

Look, if the filthy potato people of Adsehteb IV didn't want to be blown to smithereens, they should've nicely kissed the boot of the Empire.

On that note, I wonder if you can confine a species to its home world as a non-spacefaring species like you're the loving Ur-Quan.

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