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Justin Tyme posted:I loathe the SC community and hope the game never comes out I loathe the SC community and I hope it comes out so I can ram them to death non stop.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:31
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 https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/307405/i-m-not-trusting-anyone-in-the-verse
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Dec 21, 2015 00:32
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I've made a new Lets Play, this is Star Citizen for me. It's good, very good. I have put some uplifting music on it to help with the more boring parts. Uplifting music is on all parts. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I34_Z41P_w4
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Dec 21, 2015 00:33
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Romes128 posted:Their whole reason for refund denial is a sizeable part of the game has been released so I don't expect much more in the near future. It's interesting they phrased it that way, which closely matches what Sandi said in a recent interview. We should remember though that they would refuse refunds in the past as a first response, you just had to be forceful in obtaining one, either by mentioning a charge-back or small claims to show them you were serious. I believe the refund window only opened as far as it did because they foolishly refunded Derek Smart without him asking for one, the poll that they didn't nuke fast enough and the resulting media attention focused on Derek and refunds. The bad press concerned them on top of the FPS delayed indefinitely story, they'd made a lot of promises for 2015 and delivered none of it. It might not be a shortage of money reverting back though it gives that impression, they feel on firmer ground because they shipped the social module & 2.0. It was pretty funny though seeing them go all ballsy about something that's still crashing a month later. 
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Dec 21, 2015 00:33
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here are my predictions for what will be in Alpha 2.2: - lovely dogfuck chat feature removed completely. this game never had a chat feature and never planned to have one. - updated textures on vending machines - updated ladder-climbing sound effects - new lighting in abandoned station 6. - the news van is hangar ready but is now literally just a van ported over from crysis - FPS removed completely, Ben will make a post later saying it was an accident but it will take a while to figure out what happened.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:35
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Mirificus posted:Need to keep the plebes out. If the "Arbitrator court" feature even see the light of day I'm willing to bet Concierges and early backers will suggest they get a different kind of judiciary process than the plebs with only the base game.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:36
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double post
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Dec 21, 2015 00:37
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A Neurotic Jew posted:I'm homeless santa hovering around whenever Chris is upset but having no helpful input to provide.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:38
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AP posted:It's interesting they phrased it that way, which closely matches what Sandi said in a recent interview. We should remember though that they would refuse refunds in the past as a first response, you just had to be forceful in obtaining one, either by mentioning a charge-back or small claims to show them you were serious. The fundamental question remains, though. How on earth could they conceivable harmonise the fact that they're — very officially — doing early alpha testing with the claim that The Game has in any way, shape, or form been released? Are they simply trying to fudge exactly what “product” they've promised to deliver in exchange for the pledges to get around the simple fact that “alpha” inherently means it is not even remotely close to something that can be considered a release version? The doublespeak is simply astonishing and I don't see how any kind of arbitrator could ever be fooled by this dissonant rhetoric.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:39
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Mirificus posted:I went to check the poll results today. lmao they are going full secret police over there
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Dec 21, 2015 00:40
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Gwaihir posted:I loathe the SC community and I hope it comes out so I can ram them to death non stop. If the game doesn't come out we can't make people regret buying it.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:40
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Tippis posted:The fundamental question remains, though. How on earth could they conceivable harmonise the fact that they're — very officially — doing early alpha testing with the claim that The Game has in any way, shape, or form been released? Are they simply trying to fudge exactly what “product” they've promised to deliver in exchange for the pledges to get around the simple fact that “alpha” inherently means it is not even remotely close to something that can be considered a release version? The fans not only believe it but will go to great lengths to defend it
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Dec 21, 2015 00:43
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So I finally succumbed and decided to touch the poop directly instead of writing messages to them here. Created a reddit account, made my first posts and sometime between yesterday and now I was shadow banned.  Very subversive poo poo as you can see. Seems that they've reached the goon quota and aren't allowing any more in. Don't want too many dissonant voices in the eco chamber, ruins the whole effect.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:43
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Some Star Citizens wondering why access to the Shipyard forum is restricted: https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/307413/how-to-find-the-let-s-talk-about-space-ships-sub-forum-no-its-not-you
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Dec 21, 2015 00:46
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peter gabriel posted:I feel pretty toxic but I've just had a roast beef dinner so it could be that Nah, it's our livers man. As omnivores at the top of the food chain, humans tend to accumulate a lot of filth and toxins in our livers. Our livers are toxic. In a way, this makes all of us toxic. Every community of humans is toxic.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:52
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:lmao they are going full secret police over there The actions of the moderators lately really lead me to believe that they know full well this is a complete scam and there is some major doublethink going on in their defense of it. It's reminding me a lot of an essay I read once on "Belief in Belief" http://lesswrong.com/lw/i4/belief_in_belief/ The Article posted:Carl Sagan once told a parable of a man who comes to us and claims: "There is a dragon in my garage." Fascinating! We reply that we wish to see this dragon—let us set out at once for the garage! "But wait," the claimant says to us, "it is an invisible dragon."
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Dec 21, 2015 00:54
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 https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/comment/6128061/#Comment_6128061
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Dec 21, 2015 00:54
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Dirty Hairy posted:Well, got my refund denial letter today. I guess that means it's game on. Has anyone made any inroads with chargebacks when a credit card was used through PayPal? My purchases range from 2013 to a few months ago. I saw Beer's advice from a few pages ago, and I've been collecting tidbits from this thread over the last six weeks for the predicted eventuality that they'd try to gently caress me over. Still, if anyone successfully gets their money back from a credit card purchase channeled through PayPal, post your experience. I imagine that paypal would probably be displeased with a chargeback as they were a middleman. Several angles to contest. Direction of stretch goals is entirely directed by CIG ("release the original game backers pledged for" is not a stretch goal, but "add space pets" is). Giving backers the ability to vote for stretch goals (like particular ships) does not impact this as CIG provides the only poll options backers are allowed to choose from. CIG should then shoulder most, if not all of the responsibility for the continued delay. It is also disingenuous to represent scope creep as the will of the community as backers do not have the ability to specify where funds go. It would be unreasonable to set a $1 stretch goal to buy Chris Roberts a mansion and then claim the meeting of that goal has the consent of the community. $1 is not a significant sum, but in the context of a $100+ million campaign, neither is $1 million. CIG would be hard pressed to put forward 1% of backers as "the community" while dismissing the evident desires of the 99% or so of people that pledged for a less ambitious game. They can't have it both ways. CIG made the decision to alter the products offered. As they acknowledge they can't deliver the items originally promised, it is reasonable to expect them to be able to provide recourse to those impacted by those changes. After all, it is CIG's decision to not honor the original pledge, and CIG has a responsibility to deal fairly, regardless of the novelty of the funding model. According to the ToS, pledges go to pledge items (production and delivery cost), then game. While it is understandable that funds paid into salary cannot be recouped, CIG has made numerous statements pointing out that many ships (pledge items) are not being actively worked on due to prioritization of others. Since CIG says your funds are going to those ships (pledge item), and that they're not working on those ships right now (unless all your money went into Auroras or whatever), you will not automatically accept their explanation that your money has already been spent on fulfilling the pledge items without a cost accounting or delivery of the item. While the ToS limits the conditions under which a refund is authorized, diverting funds to game development (to salaries) instead of fulfilling your pledge item as the ToS dictates is sufficient concern for you to insist on an exception to CIG's policy. Your reiterated request is a courtesy and last option remaining before initiating a chargeback.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:54
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Tippis posted:The fundamental question remains, though. How on earth could they conceivable harmonise the fact that they're — very officially — doing early alpha testing with the claim that The Game has in any way, shape, or form been released? Are they simply trying to fudge exactly what “product” they've promised to deliver in exchange for the pledges to get around the simple fact that “alpha” inherently means it is not even remotely close to something that can be considered a release version? I fully agreed with Derek on this, they need to be able to say they shipped Star Citizen for when SQ42 drops, they are probably incredibly hosed off that they didn't have SQ42 as a separate package from the start. If SQ42 was separate they'd be able to call Star Citizen released right now and the EU 14 days for a refund clock would start, because SQ42 was included in most packages they can't start the clock. So I agree with him, the focus will be on getting a small part of SQ42 out the door asap to cover themselves legally everywhere, not just the EU. Also they aren't going to imply it's shipped to anyone except those looking refunds, they aren't stupid, they'll continue to dangle carrots just out of reach, great stuff coming "soon". Once the "baby SQ42" is out though and "2 weeks" pass, all bets are off, they can do whatever they like and it's going to be a lot harder to get your money back. You can argue at that point you didn't receive what you paid for but most people aren't going to bother, even the EU refund situation in small claims moves from a sure win to a "maybe win". They've got a "baby PU" out now with 2.0 that doesn't have a single piece of persistence in it and the universe part of "PU" is 1 system, they can call poo poo whatever they like, 3 complete alien languages could be 6 lines of dialogue in the opening scene of SQ42.
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Dec 21, 2015 00:55
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Sarsapariller posted:The actions of the moderators lately really lead me to believe that they know full well this is a complete scam and there is some major doublethink going on in their defense of it. It's reminding me a lot of an essay I read once on "Belief in Belief"
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Dec 21, 2015 00:57
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AP posted:they aren't stupid I was with you all the way until this
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Dec 21, 2015 00:58
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Contingency posted:("release the original game backers pledged for" is not a stretch goal, but "add space pets" is). Lol "The purpose of the higher stretch goals is to ensure that the game-as-described is finished in the two year time period" archive.is/L62AL#selection-379.0-379.119 That page is now HIDDEN, redirects to a different page. See for yourself. http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/star-citizen-faq/
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Dec 21, 2015 00:59
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Contingency posted:I imagine that paypal would probably be displeased with a chargeback as they were a middleman. Thanks for this post. I've added it to my collection of useful counterpoints. I'll draft up something over the next few days and see what happens.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:02
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I don't want to build a game, I want to build a pyramid.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:04
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peter gabriel posted:I was with you all the way until this I should have put "they aren't stupid at keeping other people's money", or they are "smarter then everyone who meets the requirements for concierge". Make more videos, you're my favourite poster.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:05
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Mirificus posted:I only started following the RSI forums recently. Have the mods always been like this or it it a recent development? It's been a gradual slide. At first when Wingman was at the helm they were pretty reasonable for an official forum, but Ben was always a complete sycophant. Unfortunately he seems to have been placed in charge of appointing moderators and he gravitates to the most unstable and blatant fanboy-bullies. It's only in the last six months that it's gone full lockdown on all dissent.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:08
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AP posted:I should have put "they aren't stupid at keeping other people's money", or they are "smarter then everyone who meets the requirements for concierge". I can't make any videos, the last one I posted is pretty much the game for me. Hang on a sec I'll try again now 
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Dec 21, 2015 01:12
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Sarsapariller posted:It's been a gradual slide. At first when Wingman was at the helm they were pretty reasonable for an official forum, but Ben was always a complete sycophant. Unfortunately he seems to have been placed in charge of appointing moderators and he gravitates to the most unstable and blatant fanboy-bullies. It's only in the last six months that it's gone full lockdown on all dissent. I'll grant you that it has been worse lately, but they have been acting like wannabe Gestapo agents for the better part of two years now.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:13
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aleksendr posted:The SpaceBase DF-9 scenario seem probable, even more so with the upcoming "split" of SC and SQ 42. A final patch to allow private servers and thats it, thank you for the pledges suckers. With luck SQ 42 wont do too much damage to the reputation of the actors who loaned their voices to the characters. Yeah, it really seems that 2.0 is going to be the main thing of what they promised. Anyone waiting for them to develop other systems or intricate systems I think is going to be disappointed. Alpha 2.0 is what the PU is going to be, which is incredibly laughable compared to any currently released space game, lovely or not. Spend it on everything but the game. Expensive office furniture, business trips, exorbitant salaries, constantly rework or scrap things that are done because you are a control freak, hire A-List actors because you want to be a movie director more than a 'game designer'... (I can't seriously take Chris as a designer anymore after seeing him fumble with his own game. It looks like he never played a PC game before, in addition to his own game.) And yeah, it is a reminder to not crowdfund has-beens who have a glaring reputation of taking forever, being overbudget and generally seem very bad at managing projects. For example, I would never, ever give Tim Shcafer money because he is loving incompetent at managing money and studios. When his game comes out, sure. But never crowdfund him. Especially give the poo poo he pulled with Space Base. Dapper Dan fucked around with this message at 01:20 on Dec 21, 2015 |
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Dec 21, 2015 01:17
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The Marauder posted:I'll grant you that it has been worse lately, but they have been acting like wannabe Gestapo agents for the better part of two years now. I'd say back then the truth was: Not all of them. Some moderators were complete pieces of poo poo, some of which burned out, some became utter poo poo after those ridiculous rules revisions, while some legit did solid enough work, one of which was also let go by Sandi over Ben's head. But with this latest lockdown, it's pretty clear that if they wanted to keep being moderators, even those that did solid work had to start towing the line of oppressive poo poo or just lose their status. CrazyLoon fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Dec 21, 2015 |
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Dec 21, 2015 01:17
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The Marauder posted:I'll grant you that it has been worse lately, but they have been acting like wannabe Gestapo agents for the better part of two years now. Hah, could you imagine the worldwide scorn and scandal if they tried to act like real Gestapo agents? Imagine you're sitting in a bar and talk poo poo about Star Citizen and suddenly, some crazed nerds come in and take you with them. Then you get shot in an alley. Then the media notices someone got shot over a video game and the poo poo hits the fan. And the fan was made out of nitro.  Deadly Star Killers Among Us: Are Space Sims the New Counter Strike?
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Dec 21, 2015 01:21
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Libluini posted:Hah, could you imagine the worldwide scorn and scandal if they tried to act like real Gestapo agents? Star Citizen: Black-Bagging Dissenters in Real Life
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Dec 21, 2015 01:22
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pftc posted:Lol Ok, I amend my comment: release the game was actually a stretch goal, and like the vast majority of stretch goals, as yet unfulfilled.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:22
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Holy poo poo I just got in game and now I don;t want a refund
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Dec 21, 2015 01:23
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AP posted:I fully agreed with Derek on this, they need to be able to say they shipped Star Citizen for when SQ42 drops, they are probably incredibly hosed off that they didn't have SQ42 as a separate package from the start. If SQ42 was separate they'd be able to call Star Citizen released right now and the EU 14 days for a refund clock would start, because SQ42 was included in most packages they can't start the clock. So I agree with him, the focus will be on getting a small part of SQ42 out the door asap to cover themselves legally everywhere, not just the EU. The whales are going to have to sing a mighty song to doublethink out of that one. From the very beginning SC is supposed to be what happen "after" you sit trough the 10 hours fanwank of SC42
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Dec 21, 2015 01:24
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Libluini posted:Hah, could you imagine the worldwide scorn and scandal if they tried to act like real Gestapo agents? TBH, considering there was that nazi-sympathizer moderator that quit/was let go from CIG...that's scarily not that remote a possibility perhaps.
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Dec 21, 2015 01:24
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Contingency posted:Ok, I amend my comment: release the game was actually a stretch goal, and like the vast majority of stretch goals, as yet unfulfilled. Well Mr. Fancy Man. Here are more words Chris Roberts said, how will they alter your theories? "The additional funding that backers are providing let’s us secure the resources to build ships, planets and systems that go beyond the original budget… but not the original vision. Thank you for helping make Star Citizen all that much better, with more immersion and more choices that will allow players to shape their experiences." https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13358-Letter-From-The-Chairman-26-Million https://archive.is/Runiv "Remember that each stretch goal represents a broad array of improvements to Star Citizen: more staff, better equipment, more variety in the finished universe. The ships you choose are just a sample of what each million dollars lets us add to the game!" https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13389-Letter-From-The-Chairman-29-Million-Squadron-42 https://archive.is/BQr76 "Remember that our stretch goals are examples, ways of showing you how we are improving the game with the additional funding and ways to thank you for your early support. The full impact of each additional dollar is actually felt across the board: the project currently employs over 200 people. As a result, every dollar allows us to support this large team and helps improve Star Citizen in both scope and scale." https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13626-Letter-From-The-Chairman-40-Million https://archive.is/nfbYo "Remember: the system, like the new ships, is simply symbolic of what’s being added to Star Citizen with the additional money. Each stretch goal system represents additional artists, tools, programmers and new technologies that will make the finished project even better!" https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13400-Letter-From-The-Chairman-33-Million https://archive.is/9x61K "Like all stretch goals, that’s just an indication of the kind of feature we can add with ongoing funding." https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14102-Letter-From-The-Chairman https://archive.is/J3gp1
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Dec 21, 2015 01:30
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Hi Sandi
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Dec 21, 2015 01:34
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VealCutlet posted:Hi Sandi Lol no
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Dec 21, 2015 01:36
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 Backers have to scrape for information about their game on motherfucking imdb.com because CIG won't tell them poo poo. Open development.  Star Marine is an independent module. Star Marine was never meant to be an independent module. Star Marine was always an independent module. MeLKoR fucked around with this message at 01:39 on Dec 21, 2015 |
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Dec 21, 2015 01:36
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