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Fried Sushi
Jul 5, 2004

A Neurotic Jew posted:

VaultMarine and his Insanely Cool Parkour Adventure, coming to 2.3 in 2 weeks :frogc00l:

Sounds like someone watched the Mirror's Edge trailer over the weekend. Time to add Parkour!

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Bolow
Feb 27, 2007

Beet Wagon posted:

If I sound mad it's because that's the only way I know how to react when my mind is this thoroughly boggled.

I wish I understood games development, then life would be easier.

Imagine 4 iterations of a spaceship crossing Chris Robert's desk, the first iteration is discarded with the second one taking its place. The first iteration now becomes the fourth. This cycle repeats until financial ruin

Wrecked Angle
May 12, 2012

"JURASSIC PARK!"
Well I for one am very much looking forward to the 100's of players all parkouring around me on a procedurally generated, Crysis detailed landscape while multiple servers organically and seamlessly hand off which players are being tracked by which, while I sit and fish for a super rare species which I can take across the universe and sell to a collector for a small fortune.

See you in the 'verse cammando o2

peter gabriel
Nov 8, 2011

Hello Commandos
PARKOUR SUCCSFLLL

smellmycheese
Feb 1, 2016

The number one thing to remember when you are watching Crobbington stumble, ramble, flail and bullshit his way through these 104TC videos is that these are prerecorded with HANDPICKED questions! These are the questions he and Ben have chosen for him to address. Considered on that level it is mindbogglingly incompetent.

Norefund14days
Feb 2, 2016

NO ONE CAN HEAR YOU PARP IN SPACE.
BBB heard back from RSI. These people amaze me with their word garbage.

On February 26, 2016, the business provided the following information:
Customer's complaint is addressed to the wrong entity: his contract is with Roberts Space Industries Corp. ("RSI"), and we are responding on behalf of that entity.

Customer committed his pledge for the development of Star Citizen in 2012, on Kickstarter, and he accepted RSI's Terms of Service when he migrated his account pledge to RSI.

Pursuant to the Terms of Service Customer accepted when he made his pledge, funds pledged are treated as deposit to be used for the "Game Cost", and such deposit "earned by RSI and become(s) non-refundable to the extent that it is used for the Pledge Item Cost and/or the Game Cost..." Customer specifically agreed to "irrevocably waive any claim for refund of any deposit amount that has been used for the Game Cost..." Please see RSI's Terms of Service, Sec. IV A for further reference (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/tos). The Customer committed his pledge to the development of Star Citizen in 2012. Development of the Game has proceeded unabated and RSI is delivering content on a continuing basis. The full value of his pledge has been earned by RSI over years of effort and production, and no portion of it is unearned or returnable to Customer now years after the fact.

Contrary to the Customer's complaint, an accounting is only promised in the unlikely event that the Game is not delivered. The development of the Game is in full progress, involving over 290 developers and staff across four studios. Development has not been abandoned at all, and consequently the accounting is not owed.

Pursuant to Sec. VII of the Terms of Service, Customers did "acknowledge and agree that delivery as of such date is not a promise by RSI since unforeseen events may extend the development and/or production time." While quite a lot of the promised gameplay is now available, we acknowledge that delivery of some game elements has been delayed. This is a direct result of the community's declared desire to have the initial release version of the game developed to a much greater depth, detail, and fidelity than contemplated originally upon start of the campaign. Ultimately, this evolution of development will benefit all backers including the Customer, since every backer will be receiving a much greater value for his/her pledge, but it may - as in this case - cause an extension of the delivery dates. It is inherent to the nature of crowdfunding that such an adjustment to the project may occur.

In summary, RSI has earned and applied Customer's pledge to the development cost of the Game, and in accordance with the Terms of Service, to which Customer expressly agreed, Customer is no longer entitled to a refund. These terms are consistent with the specific nature of crowdfunding. We understand that some individuals may not want to wait for the completion of the project and ask for refunds, but put simply, "takebacks" are not compatible with the whole concept of crowdfunding.

Fried Sushi
Jul 5, 2004

smellmycheese posted:

The number one thing to remember when you are watching Crobbington stumble, ramble, flail and bullshit his way through these 104TC videos is that these are prerecorded with HANDPICKED questions! These are the questions he and Ben have chosen for him to address. Considered on that level it is mindbogglingly incompetent.

You clearly don't understand question development.

smellmycheese
Feb 1, 2016

Fried Sushi posted:

You clearly don't understand question development.

It really does show just how insane this whole thing is. Imagine any business figure, political figure, cultural figure given a half hour platform to answer 10 handpicked questions directly with no interrogation. Then look at Crobbelino in action.

A Neurotic Jew
Feb 17, 2012

by exmarx

NoRefund14Days posted:

While quite a lot of the promised gameplay is now available, we acknowledge that delivery of some game elements has been delayed. This is a direct result of the community's declared desire to have the initial release version of the game developed to a much greater depth, detail, and fidelity than contemplated originally upon start of the campaign. Ultimately, this evolution of development will benefit all backers including the Customer, since every backer will be receiving a much greater value for his/her pledge, but it may - as in this case - cause an extension of the delivery dates. It is inherent to the nature of crowdfunding that such an adjustment to the project may occur.

:fuckoff:

WhiskeyWhiskers
Oct 14, 2013

Norefund14days posted:

BBB heard back from RSI. These people amaze me with their word garbage.

On February 26, 2016, the business provided the following information:
Customer's complaint is addressed to the wrong entity: his contract is with Roberts Space Industries Corp. ("RSI"), and we are responding on behalf of that entity.

Customer committed his pledge for the development of Star Citizen in 2012, on Kickstarter, and he accepted RSI's Terms of Service when he migrated his account pledge to RSI.

Pursuant to the Terms of Service Customer accepted when he made his pledge, funds pledged are treated as deposit to be used for the "Game Cost", and such deposit "earned by RSI and become(s) non-refundable to the extent that it is used for the Pledge Item Cost and/or the Game Cost..." Customer specifically agreed to "irrevocably waive any claim for refund of any deposit amount that has been used for the Game Cost..." Please see RSI's Terms of Service, Sec. IV A for further reference (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/tos). The Customer committed his pledge to the development of Star Citizen in 2012. Development of the Game has proceeded unabated and RSI is delivering content on a continuing basis. The full value of his pledge has been earned by RSI over years of effort and production, and no portion of it is unearned or returnable to Customer now years after the fact.

Contrary to the Customer's complaint, an accounting is only promised in the unlikely event that the Game is not delivered. The development of the Game is in full progress, involving over 290 developers and staff across four studios. Development has not been abandoned at all, and consequently the accounting is not owed.

Pursuant to Sec. VII of the Terms of Service, Customers did "acknowledge and agree that delivery as of such date is not a promise by RSI since unforeseen events may extend the development and/or production time." While quite a lot of the promised gameplay is now available, we acknowledge that delivery of some game elements has been delayed. This is a direct result of the community's declared desire to have the initial release version of the game developed to a much greater depth, detail, and fidelity than contemplated originally upon start of the campaign. Ultimately, this evolution of development will benefit all backers including the Customer, since every backer will be receiving a much greater value for his/her pledge, but it may - as in this case - cause an extension of the delivery dates. It is inherent to the nature of crowdfunding that such an adjustment to the project may occur.

In summary, RSI has earned and applied Customer's pledge to the development cost of the Game, and in accordance with the Terms of Service, to which Customer expressly agreed, Customer is no longer entitled to a refund. These terms are consistent with the specific nature of crowdfunding. We understand that some individuals may not want to wait for the completion of the project and ask for refunds, but put simply, "takebacks" are not compatible with the whole concept of crowdfunding.

Tell them you're aware of other backers being refunded well outside the 14 day period. That your refund is not only due to the slipped deadlines but also that the project that is being delivered is fundamentally different than the one you agreed to when you backed, point to feature creep like procedural tech and the removal of drop-in drop-out co-op, whatever. I wasn't even a KS backer so my case is actually far less tight than yours. I can forward you my emails with CS if you want to show them proof of people being given refunds really recently.

e:Ironically they really hosed up by telling me that they were giving me a refund out of courtesy, rather than due to Australian consumer law.

BitBasher
Jun 6, 2004

You've got to know the rules before you can break 'em. Otherwise, it's no fun.


Norefund14days posted:

...While quite a lot of the promised gameplay is now available...

Mental gymnastics score from the judges: 9.9, 9.9, 9.8, 9.9, 9.9

CHICKEN SHOES
Oct 4, 2002
Slippery Tilde
Man don't even bother with the BBB, they're a worse company than CIG.

Norefund14days
Feb 2, 2016

NO ONE CAN HEAR YOU PARP IN SPACE.

WhiskeyWhiskers posted:

Tell them you're aware of other backers being refunded well outside the 14 day period. That your refund is not only due to the slipped deadlines but also that the project that is being delivered is fundamentally different than the one you agreed to when you backed, point to feature creep like procedural tech and the removal of drop-in drop-out co-op, whatever. I wasn't even a KS backer so my case is actually far less tight than yours. I can forward you my emails with CS if you want to show them proof of people being given refunds really recently.

Send em brother. Anything helps. I'm not gonna stop fighting. Anyone wanna word the response for me? I'm not a wordsmith.

WhiskeyWhiskers
Oct 14, 2013

Norefund14days posted:

Send em brother. Anything helps. I'm not gonna stop fighting. Anyone wanna word the response for me? I'm not a wordsmith.

I don't have PMs so if you've got a reddit account, or if you just want to put your email I can send them.

Chin
Dec 12, 2005

GET LOST 2013
-RALPH
That bit sums it up:

[Question about PG Crysis planets]

Chris: OUR PLAN IS TO, UM...

Yep. Planning stages always take four years for AAAA games.

Happy Sisyphus
Nov 13, 2013

You take the blue paarp - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red paarp - you stay in pre-alpha, and I show you how deep the sperg wallet goes.

BeefThief posted:

I'm gonna spend most of my time in the 'universe fishing in procedural streams and lakes, and whittling jpegs on my front porch

i would invite you to come whittle with me but there is only one chair on my porch unfortunately

WhiskeyWhiskers
Oct 14, 2013

Chin posted:

That bit sums it up:

[Question about PG Crysis planets]

Chris: OUR PLAN IS TO, UM...

Yep. Planning stages always take four years for quadruple AAAA games.

FTFY

Samizdata
May 14, 2007

TheLastRoboKy posted:

Buy another 2500 bucks worth of ships?

Since that will show them how pissed off you are!

Romes128
Dec 28, 2008


Fun Shoe
The only thing more disappointing than stat citizen is that I posted in the gbs ban me thread on Saturday night and I'm still not banned

big nipples big life
May 12, 2014

Romes128 posted:

The only thing more disappointing than stat citizen is that I posted in the gbs ban me thread on Saturday night and I'm still not banned

Ban thread still alpha.

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





Bolow posted:

Imagine 4 iterations of a spaceship crossing Chris Robert's desk, the first iteration is discarded with the second one taking its place. The first iteration now becomes the fourth. This cycle repeats until financial ruin

:negative:

D_Smart
May 11, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
College Slice

Beer4TheBeerGod posted:

First you'll want to organize some details. Most specifically the following:

1. Where are you? Australia/EU is much more consumer friendly compared to the US.

2. When did you make the purchase? This establishes the expectation for delivery as well as the scope of the project.

3. When was the last time you installed Star Citizen? This determines the ToS that you agree to.

4. How did you buy the package? If you used PayPal to buy it then don't issue a bank chargeback because they'll just go after PayPal.

Once you have this information you can put together a package. Your going to make the argument that CIG has failed to deliver the product (which they obviously have), has failed to provide a reasonable expectation for when the product will be delivered (since they outright refuse to provide dates), and finally that the nature of the product has significantly changed from what was originally purchased (since they flat out say so).

Awhile ago I wrote this post which covers a lot of the specifics that can be used to make a compelling argument.

Someone on my forum reported it to the BBB. He just posted their reply.
http://www.dereksmart.org/forums/topic/general-discussions/#post-2647

A Neurotic Jew
Feb 17, 2012

by exmarx
In light of CIG claiming yet again that a large amount of SC has been released, here's what Community Manager Jared had to say about the state of the game on INN today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6ez9m1bkuY&t=1496s

If Star Citizen were a normal game, do you think its at the point where people would start hearing about it or would it still be in the kept behind closed doors stage?

Jared: [blathering for a while]. But, no. If this had been a closed project, if this had still been made under a brand new origin and we were BC funded and all that stuff like any normal game, we probably wouldn't be aware star citizen existed. But that's one guy talking out of his rear end right now the only person who really knows is Chris Roberts.

---------------

v reassuring imo

D_Smart
May 11, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
College Slice

peter gabriel posted:

So looking at stuff like this:









Is this all just bullshit? How and where is stuff like this supposed to be in the game?

Yes.

And have you experienced any aspect of Star Citizen that left you with the impression that the "engine" is capable of running any level at that fidelity?

Romes128
Dec 28, 2008


Fun Shoe

D_Smart posted:

Someone on my forum reported it to the BBB. He just posted their reply.
http://www.dereksmart.org/forums/topic/general-discussions/#post-2647


I live how their whole argument is they haven't delivered the game yet so no refunds but they have no release date for the game as it's still in development.

Shimrra Jamaane
Aug 10, 2007

Obscure to all except those well-versed in Yuuzhan Vong lore.

A Neurotic Jew posted:

In light of CIG claiming yet again that a large amount of SC has been released, here's what Community Manager Jared had to say about the state of the game on INN today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6ez9m1bkuY&t=1496s

If Star Citizen were a normal game, do you think its at the point where people would start hearing about it or would it still be in the kept behind closed doors stage?

Jared: [blathering for a while]. But, no. If this had been a closed project, if this had still been made under a brand new origin and we were BC funded and all that stuff like any normal game, we probably wouldn't be aware star citizen existed. But that's one guy talking out of his rear end right now the only person who really knows is Chris Roberts.

---------------

v reassuring imo

I want to that stupid loving bowtie and stuff it down his throat

Samizdata
May 14, 2007

Hav posted:

We're all black here.

We're also women, and disabled.

What about lesbian and adipositive?

Toops
Nov 5, 2015

-find mood stabilizers
-also,

A Neurotic Jew posted:

After the Starfarer, the next ship on the docket is the Reliant, which, like the Xi'an, was marketed as having multiple flight-modes. Disco Lando swoops into let people know not to expect this to actually be a thing.

https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/319951/question-for-mr-ben-lesnick-regarding-recent-info-from-10-for-the-designers/p16


Does anyone have a good idea for a ship with multiple flight modes? I wanna see if I can implement multiple flight modes that are manually switchable this week.

alf_pogs
Feb 15, 2012


Shimrra Jamaane posted:

I want to that stupid loving bowtie and stuff it down his throat

for some reason i find cmndr cruisin tom the most insufferable. his smug little garfield face

Ostentatious
Sep 29, 2010

D_Smart posted:

Yes.

And have you experienced any aspect of Star Citizen that left you with the impression that the "engine" is capable of running any level at that fidelity?

I'll have you know that Star Citizen has the highest fidelity per square mile out of all the video games ever made

sanctimoniousqfd
Dec 16, 2015

Beet Wagon posted:

Nope, it's been this way since forever. It's just bad design, through and through. The problem is they felt the need to try and automate a bunch of stuff for you to make your ship feel smart (as opposed to Elite's "put your gear down and then strafe down onto the pad" solution which works perfectly) and the end result is that regular flying is loving ruined, any kind of close manuevering is loving ruined, you can never tell where you're going to actually land or if your ship is just going to drift away when you get out, AND there's like three different kinds of assisted landing mode to help you out - all of which are completely loving unusable unless you've played their tutorial and learned how to use them. That tutorial is broken, by the way. So have fun with your brand new super-futuristic pile of poo poo.

All that poo poo that was in that video I made where the computer went apeshit while I was landing? None of that was done on purpose by me. That was just the game having the same loving aneurysm it does any time you fly next to poo poo.

E:D goes one further than button combos - when free-looking you can look through the systems menu on the right pane and find landing gear, lights, cargo scoop, all toggle-able items within the in-game UI. So you have bindable buttons, button combinations and an in-fiction ("immersion") means of doing such a simple thing as lowering landing gear instead of the "landing gear lowered, landing gear raised, landing mode engaged" BS in Star Citizen.

Dusty Lens
Jul 1, 2015

All Glory unto the Stimpire. Give up your arms and legs and embrace the beautiful agony of electricity that doubles in pain every second.

A Neurotic Jew posted:

After the Starfarer, the next ship on the docket is the Reliant, which, like the Xi'an, was marketed as having multiple flight-modes. Disco Lando swoops into let people know not to expect this to actually be a thing.

I'm sure CIG had every hope that it would be a thing in the future and they weren't laughing while they posted it to the store.

Just like the $2500 Javelin.

e; I just don't even know what you say anymore. It's already in the game. Parkour. Birds. Take a poo poo in the river while fishing on your personal planet. The game is finished so there's no refunds.

Dusty Lens fucked around with this message at 04:31 on Mar 1, 2016

Tokamak
Dec 22, 2004

alf_pogs posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFkTG9YungQ

GOOD NEWS! THE CHAIRMAN HAS RETURNED

05:03 - Tri-Monitor Support

Say I have three 4k monitors :smug:

Samizdata
May 14, 2007

Loiosh posted:

One small note on energy weapons, is that they would have recoil based on how powerful they are. I'm not excusing shittiness here, just some information on general relativity. I think a lot of people would be surprised to know that energy is mass. What does that mean practically?

The majority of the mass in every atom is not contained in its components (protons, neutrons, electrons) or even those component's components (quarks) which is referred to as the rest mass, but in the binding energy of the unit. Almost all of the 'mass' of a proton or neutron comes from the energy called the quark potential energy. This potential energy is mainly made up of the color force or strong neuclear force.

Some fun random questions:
- If you bind two oxygen atoms together into an oxygen molecule, does it weight more, less, or the same than two unbound oxygen atoms?
The unbound oxygen atoms weight MORE than two atom oxygen molecule due to the loss of potential and kinetic energy.
- Does a charged flash light weight more or less than an uncharged one?
The flash light loses weight as the potential energy is lost by the emitting of light.

There's some great videos on this for anyone curious: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xo232kyTsO0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztc6QPNUqls

Basically, any energy weapon that had enough force to do impact damage to solid objects would have some amount of recoil. Lasers in fact have a tiny, but measurable, recoil when in operation.

I always thought one of the main points of laser weapons was the almost direct transfer of energy without wasting a good bit on the transfer from potential to kinetic.

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





sanctimoniousqfd posted:

E:D goes one further than button combos - when free-looking you can look through the systems menu on the right pane and find landing gear, lights, cargo scoop, all toggle-able items within the in-game UI. So you have bindable buttons, button combinations and an in-fiction ("immersion") means of doing such a simple thing as lowering landing gear instead of the "landing gear lowered, landing gear raised, landing mode engaged" BS in Star Citizen.

That's true, I forgot about that. Oh, you also have a module you can fit to your ship that enables an auto-docking procedure, if you're a baby back bitch that doesn't like docking at maximum throttle.

Tippis
Mar 21, 2008

It's yet another day in the wasteland.

Samizdata posted:

I always thought one of the main points of laser weapons was the almost direct transfer of energy without wasting a good bit on the transfer from potential to kinetic.

It is. Trying to do kinetic damage with a laser means pumping so much energy into the target that it vaporises or at least gets a big chunking hold through it, at which point energy transfer no longer happens.

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





Toops posted:

Does anyone have a good idea for a ship with multiple flight modes? I wanna see if I can implement multiple flight modes that are manually switchable this week.

Just make their stupid flying wing bullshit. But instead of the wing rotating, make the cockpit slide up to the top so it's all giant and retarded.

kinda like this, if that makes sense. In the first mode it would be like a sword slicing/ramming through space, and in the second it would be like a shovel, just plowing through parpmeisters en masse:

e: forgot my drat pitcher

A Neurotic Jew
Feb 17, 2012

by exmarx

Dusty Lens posted:

I'm sure CIG had every hope that it would be a thing in the future and they weren't laughing while they posted it to the store.

Just like the $2500 Javelin.

e; I just don't even know what you say anymore. It's already in the game. Parkour. Birds. Take a poo poo in the river while fishing on your personal planet. The game is finished so there's no refunds.

I'm the people who respond to Jared with "oh wow hallelujah a list you guys still have it on a list woah and a pipeline too? woah the wizards at CIG do it again gently caress EA"

aleksendr
May 14, 2014

Toops posted:

Does anyone have a good idea for a ship with multiple flight modes? I wanna see if I can implement multiple flight modes that are manually switchable this week.

Something like a slinky with wings ? You could switch between a "straight" mode with the ends pointing forward and back that is fast but with bad turn radius or "bent" mode with both ends pointing at a 45 angle from the center to turn on a dime but is slower on a straight line since you forward thrust is a composite vector ?

1 - Gotta go fast mode :


2- Fast turn mode :

but with the ends pointing at an angle, not both straight back


The ship special abilities could be that in mode #1 it can go very fast but don't really do that much damage and bounce back a lot when it rams and maneuver very well in mode #2.

If you ever played star control the Mmrnmhrm ships where a great example. Fast with bad turn with homing weak weapon in mode 1, slower and quick turner with close range high damage weapon in mode 2

aleksendr fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Mar 1, 2016

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Evil_Greven
Feb 20, 2007

Whadda I got to,
whadda I got to do
to wake ya up?

To shake ya up,
to break the structure up!?

Toops posted:

Does anyone have a good idea for a ship with multiple flight modes? I wanna see if I can implement multiple flight modes that are manually switchable this week.

Something like a collapsible umbrella?

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