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I'm catching up on episodes and lost it at the "Act like a child, get treated like a child"/"Isn't it illegal to lock a child in a car?" exchange.
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Mar 7, 2016 19:15
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Snak posted:Samael is often the angel of Death, so that's kind of interesting. Lucifer isn't even Satan in the Bible, but instead was referring to some actual guy (and Satan isn't even really the Accuser in Job, either, outside of retcons). I like how he gets every somewhat related name on this show.
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Mar 7, 2016 19:27
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Darko posted:Lucifer isn't even Satan in the Bible, but instead was referring to some actual guy (and Satan isn't even really the Accuser in Job, either, outside of retcons). I like how he gets every somewhat related name on this show. Well I don't like to use Satan to refer to a specific being, since that's where a lot of the confusion comes from. Since Satan means "adversary" and a lot of these adversaries have been collected into a single being depending on your denomination or pop-culture mythology of choice, I prefer to use names more specific to individual stories/myths when available. So that said, in Hebrew scripture, haSatan, or "The Challenger" embodies the struggle of mankind. His "job" is to make faith in God difficult enough to be a meaningful choice. But it should also be noted that in Judaism, there is no concept of Angels having free will or the ability to appose God. (from here)
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Mar 7, 2016 22:41
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The Three Musketeers are pretty fun. Dan's growing on me.
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Mar 8, 2016 03:19
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Is there anyone who has doubts that he set the fake pair on fire?
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Mar 8, 2016 03:49
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Zebulon posted:Is there anyone who has doubts that he set the fake pair on fire? That thing with Maze and the feather makes me think he torched the real ones. Amenadiel could probably tell from how close he was while punching Lucifer, too. I loved the taunting while Amenadiel was working him over. "Fall as I did!" is a pretty twisted way to taunt an angel.
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Mar 8, 2016 04:02
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Zebulon posted:Is there anyone who has doubts that he set the fake pair on fire? Kind of seems like it would've been extremely in character to burn them. He's discovering something new for the first time in existence and will absolutely refuse to let anyone else make a decision for him/trick him.
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Mar 8, 2016 05:13
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Have to admit the big thing that makes me think he might have is Maze holding onto that feather. But given even Lucifer was convinced from a distance that they were real and they're his own drat wings I could see Amanadiel being fooled by seeing them set on fire before he could get any sort of close look at them. Show could easily go either way and my initial suspicion before the scene with Maze was that he just went ahead and torched the fakes to gently caress with everyone trying to use them to gently caress with him. Both seem pretty in character, really.
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Mar 8, 2016 05:18
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This show just keeps getting better and better the more it moves away from a standard procedural. Kudos, writers.
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Mar 8, 2016 05:22
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Is this worth watching?
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Mar 8, 2016 05:26
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Can of Cloud posted:Is this worth watching? Yes.
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Mar 8, 2016 05:26
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Can of Cloud posted:Is this worth watching? Episode 3 is actually episode 12 in production order so it seems a bit weird but everything after is in the correct order.
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Mar 8, 2016 05:49
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pentyne posted:Episode 3 is actually episode 12 in production order so it seems a bit weird but everything after is in the correct order. Solid indication that at least he hasn't completely lost his powers then at least? To be entirely honest I don't want to watch a procedural without Lucifer having his powers. It makes things infinitely more interesting.
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Mar 8, 2016 07:04
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Cat Army 
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Well no one has done any damage to him besides Decker and the angel. He's assumed that it's just him losing his powers, but his other powers didn't work on her either. The door guy not letting them in for a bribe might be a sign that his powers are going away, though.
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Mar 8, 2016 07:10
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Interesting that while Lucifer's charm powers don't work on Chloe, Amenadiel's seemingly do. Kind of undermines any theory that she's part angel or whatever.
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Mar 8, 2016 10:43
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Of course Senator Clay Davis was auctioning off the wings! Shame the FCC wouldn't allow a "sheeeeeeeeeee-it" for old times sake.
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Mar 8, 2016 12:07
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Can of Cloud posted:Is this worth watching? No. It takes a very good concept, waters it down so that it's completely generic and then wastes every opportunity it has to do better. It'll get cancelled soon.
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Mar 8, 2016 13:23
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Etalommi posted:Well no one has done any damage to him besides Decker and the angel. He's assumed that it's just him losing his powers, but his other powers didn't work on her either. Nah, He didn't do the whole "look em in the face and ask what they desire" thing. I think he just had a regular old fashioned bribe ready to go and was kinda surprised the dude said no. I'm honestly confused about the wings. On one hand, it'd completely be in character for him to burn them after finding out he was getting hosed with hardcore. On the other hand, it's ALSO in character for him to hold onto them and burn the fake ones, especially given that realization that if he randomly gets popped he's going back to hell, because he thinks he's losing his powers (or he is). Hell, throw in the idea that he was testing Maze as a way of finding out if she's loyal to him or not, and it's even murkier. It kinda says a lot for the show that the character is complex enough to have something like this be questioned. I'm digging it. I was happy with the ending where the guy got healed, but I'm wondering why. Seems like it's just odd to have a random dude get "touched by an angel", but maybe there's a bigger plan at play with Amendiel? I was cracking up at how charming he was compared to Lucifer who just tends to be as blunt as possible, and getting a rise out of Decker.
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Mar 8, 2016 13:31
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Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:Nah, He didn't do the whole "look em in the face and ask what they desire" thing. I think he just had a regular old fashioned bribe ready to go and was kinda surprised the dude said no. Well, if I were to guess, Amenediel (Amenadiel?) has been keeping tabs on the stuff surrounding Lucifer, but was mostly focused on getting him back to hell. Now that he came so close to falling as Lucifer did, he may've wanted to do something to "redeem" himself. That or he just felt if he got the cop back on his feet then they may not need Lucifer to go poking around helping the police with that case, meaning he's got less reasons to be distracted? Or it's part of some new plan of his to get Lucifer to hell.
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Mar 8, 2016 15:33
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When Malcolm wakes up, he's going to find out that Chloe has been investigating him for corruption the entire time he was down. It may make things complicated for Chloe, which would serve Amenidiel's purposes by making her less focused on Lucifer.
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Mar 8, 2016 15:56
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ShakeZula posted:Interesting that while Lucifer's charm powers don't work on Chloe, Amenadiel's seemingly do. Kind of undermines any theory that she's part angel or whatever. I think most of that exchange was Chloe just loving with Lucifer after being flirted with. I'm not even convinced Amenadiel is using any powers besides being good-looking on the psych, either.
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Mar 8, 2016 16:38
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evilmiera posted:Well, if I were to guess, Amenediel (Amenadiel?) has been keeping tabs on the stuff surrounding Lucifer, but was mostly focused on getting him back to hell. Now that he came so close to falling as Lucifer did, he may've wanted to do something to "redeem" himself. That or he just felt if he got the cop back on his feet then they may not need Lucifer to go poking around helping the police with that case, meaning he's got less reasons to be distracted? Or it's part of some new plan of his to get Lucifer to hell. It also makes his motives much more personal and complex - he's not pursuing Lucifer just for God's sake, but because he's fed up with picking up Lucifer's slack. Amenadiel's tired of the hell gig after only five years, and he's determined to drag Lucifer back to it after he's managed it for millennia. Could this make him a wee bit more sympathetic towards Lucifer in the future?
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Mar 8, 2016 17:59
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AnimeJune posted:Amenadiel also mentioned that he's been subbing in for Lucifer's job since Lucifer quit Hell five years ago. That, combined with Lucifer's gleeful "fall as I did!" taunt may have inspired him to heal the cop to remind himself of who he's supposed to be. Probably not. But a lot more determined to get him back to work, absolutely. I've a strange feeling it will all come full circle with the thing Lucifer said in the pilot episode of "I'm looking forward to eating your heart one day."
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Mar 8, 2016 18:17
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It sounded like Amenadiel is just the doorkeeper, not actually doing the whole 'devil' job. Sort of the night watchman. If Lucifer's accurate at all about his obvious ego, that's got to be driving him nuts. Add on to the fact this smarmy rear end in a top hat can just do whatever he wants, while Amenadiel is still stuck taking orders from the big man? He's probably pissed and can slow down time to brood about it even more effeciently. At the end of the day, there's a fondness, but Lucifer gets to gently caress around while Amenadiel has to pick up the slack. And, biblically, he's probably going to be rewarded for it and Amenadiel knows that.
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Mar 8, 2016 18:21
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evilmiera posted:Probably not. But a lot more determined to get him back to work, absolutely. I've a strange feeling it will all come full circle with the thing Lucifer said in the pilot episode of "I'm looking forward to eating your heart one day."
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Mar 8, 2016 18:52
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bio347 posted:It's been a while since I've read them (I should rectify that, thinking about it), but I'm pretty sure that was a reference to the comics. Although I guess that doesn't rule out it being foreshadowing. Possibly. But then, Lucifer does seem like the kind of guy to keep his promises.
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Mar 8, 2016 18:58
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I could go either way on the real/fake wings. This Lucifer seems to like only by omission. It would serve him to make everyone think that he has destroyed them for the reasons he stated, while still having them as an ace I the hole. For the bigger question, does anyone doubt it was coma-cop's partner who shot him? If he found out that his partner was dirty and was going to be caught, he might have worried that no one would believe he wasn't dirty too. Killing his partner letting him go out as a hero to save his own career.
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Mar 8, 2016 19:18
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I think Amenadiel healed the cop for a play, not out of the goodness of his heart. There is no indication the confrontation took place near where the cop was, there is a hospital full of sick and injured around him. Unless he healed them all, he chose that cop for reason.
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Mar 8, 2016 20:56
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Etalommi posted:I think Amenadiel healed the cop for a play, not out of the goodness of his heart. There is no indication the confrontation took place near where the cop was, there is a hospital full of sick and injured around him. Unless he healed them all, he chose that cop for reason. Then again, if we start getting technical, why isn't God in that tv universe out healing everyone semi-good all the time as a full-time job? He'd clearly have the power to. But then we start getting into proper theological debates and not character ones and that doesn't make for as good a story. Edit: Unless this was the DC Spectre comic or possibly House. But I'm not 100 percent sure this procedural has the chops for that sort of fun. evilmiera fucked around with this message at 21:01 on Mar 8, 2016 |
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Mar 8, 2016 20:58
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OTOH, based on the source material this is absolutely the IP to do theological and existential debates with.
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Mar 8, 2016 21:06
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bio347 posted:OTOH, based on the source material this is absolutely the IP to do theological and existential debates with. Yes but this isn't based on any of that. The premise of this show is literally "Even Lucifer can bootstrap himself out of hell!"
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Mar 8, 2016 21:07
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Etalommi posted:I think Amenadiel healed the cop for a play, not out of the goodness of his heart. There is no indication the confrontation took place near where the cop was, there is a hospital full of sick and injured around him. Unless he healed them all, he chose that cop for reason. Amenadiel shot the cop and is now feeling guilty about it
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Mar 8, 2016 21:20
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Azhais posted:Amenadiel shot the cop and is now feeling guilty about it We don't actually know what Amenadiel's job was in heaven, maybe he's some kind of Angel of Justice.
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Mar 8, 2016 21:29
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Snak posted:Yes but this isn't based on any of that. He didn't so much bootstrap himself as he just decided "gently caress it, VACAY!" and hauled rear end to LA 5 years ago. I'm thinking the cop healing is a plot, moreso than a "Oh, yea, I'm an angel" thing, because as mentioned before, he was willing to let people die in order to get Lucifer back and didn't really seem to care all that much. Maybe cop guy was in hell and Amendiel talked to him when he tried to escape? Sets up a "evil partner hellbent on killing Luci's new bestie" AND it sets up a whole revenge angle based on the fact the shot guy's gonna wake up and be like "I GOT loving SHOT AND YOU INVESTIGATED ME? WHAT IN THE poo poo WOMAN?", maybe he made a deal to get out of hell to help Amendiel get his poo poo together so Lucifer can gently caress off back home to hell and he can swing back up to heaven and soak up some god rays. That's 2 evil humans ready to kill Decker, and that's not even going into the random weird poo poo that a pissed off angel can do. I did crack the gently caress up when they were talking about the saint being a fatty though. Shows they were bros 
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Mar 8, 2016 21:44
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Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:He didn't so much bootstrap himself as he just decided "gently caress it, VACAY!" and hauled rear end to LA 5 years ago. Shows even humans who are on their team are mostly belittled by angels, too. That's the feeling they seem to give off, that of simply not caring for mortals that much. Not that they hate them or anything.
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Mar 8, 2016 22:26
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I reckon he revived the cop to be the one to shoot Lucifer to send him back to hell. Except that's when they'll reveal he is immortal and it's only Decker that can hurt him because reasons.
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Mar 8, 2016 23:43
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Twozzok posted:I reckon he revived the cop to be the one to shoot Lucifer to send him back to hell. Except that's when they'll reveal he is immortal and it's only Decker that can hurt him because reasons. The power of love
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Mar 9, 2016 00:26
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I don't think coma cop is gonna be that pissed off. He knew she was watching right before the shooting started. I think he's gonna know a lot more about what really happened and they'll work together to figure out who it was. It was absolutely his partner Amenadiel comes off as a whiny bitch to me. "You've had to put up with hell for eons against your wishes, but now I've had to do it for five whole years. This is super unfair and you need to take over again."
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Mar 9, 2016 01:41
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This episode is the first time Amenadiel has been fleshed out and I really liked what they did. When we first see him, he's all righteous and superior. He schemes and plots because he believes that he knows what is best and that he is doing God's work. He hates Lucifer's insolence and irresponsibility. But in this episode, we see him more vulnerable. ”Fall as I did!" is a really powerful moment, because even though it doesn't change Amenadiel's opinion of Lucifer, it opens his eyes to self reflection and he sees how thinking that you are right about something can lead you down a blasphemous path. Like it never occurred to him that it was possible for him to defy God without doing it intentionally.
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Mar 9, 2016 03:34
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counterfeitsaint posted:I don't think coma cop is gonna be that pissed off. He knew she was watching right before the shooting started. I think he's gonna know a lot more about what really happened and they'll work together to figure out who it was. It was absolutely his partner I think he's more pissed that Luci is going against God's Will, but he feels like he's the one being punished for it.
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Mar 9, 2016 03:35
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