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I haven't watched a lot of Fox shows that made it to a second season, so I don't know their writing pitfalls very well. I'm terrified that Lucifer will go the way that it would if it were a CW show: Chloe spends the next (n+1) seasons being totally oblivious to Lucifer being the actual Devil, while ever single other character with lines figures it out within a couple episodes of meeting him. This latest episode makes me feel hopeful though, revealing Chloe as the source of his mortality means that she'll necessarily be in a closer orbit around the hellish/heavenly part of Lucifer's life rather than just being a co-buddy cop.
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Apr 13, 2016 03:34
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I do appreciate that Lucifer is pretty quick to catch on to some things, like his brother moving in next to his therapist, and here, after he gets shot and is fine, he pretty much immediately guesses that he's only mortal around Chloe, and he immediately goes to test his theory.Mr.Pibbleton posted:The most realistic police procedural is A Touch of Cloth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15IRXKn9LSU Thanks for this, it's hilarious. I'll have to order some DVD's of it.
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Apr 13, 2016 03:41
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Binary Logic posted:Okay I'm only going to explain this once more, and then restrict my comments to enjoyment of the series and storylines.
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Apr 13, 2016 03:50
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My main problem with this episode is that Lucifer seemed to lie at the beginning of it when he seemed to agree that he and Decker slept together. Then again maybe he didn't on account of mostly just following along with her presumption before telling her what really happened.
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Apr 13, 2016 10:07
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Gyges posted:Mortal sins are bad, but you can still confess to a priest and be forgiven. Obviously dude is going to need to be super religious, but then he's actually been to hell so that shouldn't be an issue. Mortal Sins' ticket to hell is entirely refundable, as with all sins. The only unforgivable sin is rejecting Christ and never repenting. Confession isn't a magic ticket, you have to genuinely repent and be sorry and try to make amends etc etc. It doubly doesn't count if you commit sins with the intention of just going to confession later and washing it all away.
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Apr 13, 2016 11:56
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Alchenar posted:Confession isn't a magic ticket, you have to genuinely repent and be sorry and try to make amends etc etc. It doubly doesn't count if you commit sins with the intention of just going to confession later and washing it all away. Eh, that depends on which of the many branches of Christianity you ask.
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Apr 13, 2016 12:02
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Alchenar posted:Confession isn't a magic ticket, you have to genuinely repent and be sorry and try to make amends etc etc. It doubly doesn't count if you commit sins with the intention of just going to confession later and washing it all away. Having been in hell, I'm pretty sure he'll be genuinely contrite. I'm not suggesting he just enter into a constant cycle of sinning an confession, rather that he get any lingering sin desires out of the way and then devote himself to not going to Hell. Angels don't get to over rule Jesus on whether or not you're on the guest list.
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Apr 13, 2016 12:09
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Titan posted:
I read a theory or fanfiction that Chloe is a descendant of Eve, which is interesting from a Bible story or plot perspective but leaves a lot of questions hanging. The idea that Lucifer's saving of Chloe or mercy shown towards her is what gave her some 'power' over him is neater. And now Luci has arguably saved Malcolm. Binary Logic fucked around with this message at 12:37 on Apr 13, 2016 |
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Apr 13, 2016 12:34
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Bible-wise, every human that ever lived is related to Adam and Eve.
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Apr 13, 2016 12:37
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True, but this show plays pretty fast and loose with its bible myths.
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Apr 13, 2016 13:23
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Binary Logic posted:I read a theory or fanfiction that Chloe is a descendant of Eve, which is interesting from a Bible story or plot perspective but leaves a lot of questions hanging. The idea that Lucifer's saving of Chloe or mercy shown towards her is what gave her some 'power' over him is neater. I kind of like the idea that God is just screwing with Lucifer in some Rube Goldberg attempt to teach him a lesson, or for a laugh, or both.
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Apr 13, 2016 15:13
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AbsolutelySane posted:I kind of like the idea that God is just screwing with Lucifer in some Rube Goldberg attempt to teach him a lesson, or for a laugh, or both. I really like the theme or trope that the longer they are on Earth, the more human they become. It's been done with aliens (both invaders and superheroes) many times and is interesting to see in this scriptural context.
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Apr 13, 2016 15:45
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Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:I think my favorite part of this episode was the guy completely believing Lucifer about what the coin was, no questions asked. Binary Logic posted:Decker would have to gather evidence, get witness statements, wait for the coroner's report, type up all the notes, etc etc. She'd work on this case for weeks. Astrofig posted:I thought the whole 'inadmissible if they don't read you your rights' thing was a myth----isn't that only if they're going to question you? counterfeitsaint posted:You'd think after what he went through figuring out exactly what to avoid to not go back to hell would be a major priority for him. counterfeitsaint posted:Catholics aren't generally the 'repent and accept Jesus and you're good' sort evilmiera posted:My main problem with this episode is that Lucifer seemed to lie at the beginning of it when he seemed to agree that he and Decker slept together. Then again maybe he didn't on account of mostly just following along with her presumption before telling her what really happened. Alchenar posted:Confession isn't a magic ticket, you have to genuinely repent and be sorry and try to make amends etc etc. It doubly doesn't count if you commit sins with the intention of just going to confession later and washing it all away. Binary Logic posted:I read a theory or fanfiction that Chloe is a descendant of Eve, which is interesting from a Bible story or plot perspective but leaves a lot of questions hanging. Binary Logic posted:I really like the theme or trope that the longer they are on Earth, the more human they become. It's been done with aliens (both invaders and superheroes) many times and is interesting to see in this scriptural context.
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Apr 13, 2016 17:02
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You know, in all this talk of lying devil's, the nature of divine forgiveness, and the poor forethought of detective coma we've missed the biggest hole in his deal. How the gently caress is he going to take a physical coin to Hell? Luci brought it up with his physical angel hands. How's detective gluttony planning on bringing down?
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Apr 13, 2016 17:58
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Tiggum posted:It all comes down to what counts as a lie, really. Is he literally unable to say something that he doesn't believe? Or does it count intent, so he can use irony? Or is it just a matter of preference, that he likes to be deceptive without outright lying? He was clearly stringing her along a bit before telling her the truth, so there are plenty of loopholes regardless of the exact rule. "When the Devil wants you to do something, he doesn't lie at all. He tells you the exact, literal truth. And he lets you find your own way to Hell."
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Apr 13, 2016 17:59
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Gyges posted:You know, in all this talk of lying devil's, the nature of divine forgiveness, and the poor forethought of detective coma we've missed the biggest hole in his deal. And now you understand how the Devil outsmarted a really dumb and desperate human. bio347 posted:Lucifer doesn't lie as an honour thing, it's not a literal restriction. The comics have a great line about it: He even had a line, in one of the earlier episodes, about how the humans in hell brought themselves there and chose their own punishments.  Can't find the exact quote, but it was along these lines... “Why do they blame me for all their little failings? They use my name as if I spent my entire days sitting on their shoulders, forcing them to commits acts they would otherwise find repulsive. 'The devil made me do it.' I have never made one of them do anything. Never. They live their own tiny lives. I do not live their lives for them.” ― Neil Gaiman, The Sandman, Vol. 4: Season of Mists
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Apr 13, 2016 18:06
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My hands down favorite thing of the show so far has got to be the model's deepest, darkest desire for a cheeseburger.
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Apr 13, 2016 20:43
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In theory there could be be human descendants of Lilith and Adam... There's no mythological basis for this as far as I know, but Amenadiel has no mythological basis either. I'm actually starting to wonder when we're going to see another angel... Maze said "I slept with your brother" as though that's totally unambiguous. Surely Lucifer has many brothers and the only reason it wasn't ambiguous was because of context. I do think there's not a hard and fast rule about Lucifer's mortality. I am totally okay with this. I like that Lucifer doesn't lie and Amenadiel lies constantly. Which is interesting. I was thinking about how Amenadiel is fictional, his name sounds like real words. So I tried to look it up. "Amen" is of course Latin for "truth". "Adiel" is a Hebrew name from the old testament. This page talks about its origins and cites references that it means "Ornament of God" (the -el component of names in Hebrew is usually a reference to Elohim). So roughly translated, "Amenadiel" might mean "True Ornament of God". Of course if you type "Amen Adiel" into google translate, you get "Pleasant Diet", so it also could be that...
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Apr 14, 2016 17:26
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Snak posted:Of course if you type "Amen Adiel" into google translate, you get "Pleasant Diet", so it also could be that... Well, that explains why detective gluttony is so hungry after coming back.
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Apr 15, 2016 01:25
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Gyges posted:You know, in all this talk of lying devil's, the nature of divine forgiveness, and the poor forethought of detective coma we've missed the biggest hole in his deal. Sure it will take him staright out of hell...right back into his dead body.
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Apr 15, 2016 14:01
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It's surprising that this show so far has had the best freshman season of the bunch. Guess Rush getting cancelled worked out for the lead actor.
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Apr 19, 2016 03:13
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"You're supposed to be blonde." "Yeah, I get that a lot."
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Apr 19, 2016 05:43
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Oh, man. Between name dropping Mike Carey and Malcolm actually becoming a likable character, I am SO glad this got a season 2.
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Apr 19, 2016 06:17
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That was a good episode. The finale looks like it's going to be amazing.
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Apr 19, 2016 07:21
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"Did you know anything about this whole room with staircase and actual windows facing outside on your property?" "Nope!" 
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Apr 19, 2016 10:42
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hahaha i was thinking the same thing... If the US had Window tax that could have all been avoided
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Apr 19, 2016 11:41
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"He's the best Lucifer we've had in years!"
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Apr 19, 2016 12:19
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NoneMoreNegative posted:"Did you know anything about this whole room with staircase and actual windows facing outside on your property?" I got the impression that it wasn't his property - it was his daughter's place and he was just there packing up her things. It confused me for a moment too but he wouldn't have said 'I should have called her more often' if she lived with him.
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Apr 19, 2016 13:20
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Gonz posted:"You're supposed to be blonde." Came here to post this, was beaten like a prideful angel The turn at the very end of the episode kinda threw my personal speculation off, I was hoping the season finale would happen in Hell, but I guess mister Morningstar will have to deal with Earthly justice instead?
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Apr 19, 2016 13:46
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The previews do look like the finale is gonna ramp up the OH poo poo factor by a few degrees.
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Apr 19, 2016 14:03
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evilmiera posted:Sure it will take him staright out of hell...right back into his dead body. Yeah, I was wondering what good the coin would do if he dies. Great, he comes back from hell, but what does that do for him? Does he become immortal?
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Apr 19, 2016 20:15
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Stabbey_the_Clown posted:Yeah, I was wondering what good the coin would do if he dies. Great, he comes back from hell, but what does that do for him? Does he become immortal?
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Apr 19, 2016 20:53
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Oh, he wasn't gonna kill him. He was going to punish him. Angela can't kill mortals. Don't mean he can't break various pieces off and make him suffer.
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Apr 19, 2016 21:38
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drat that Angela
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Apr 19, 2016 22:14
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Watermelon Daiquiri posted:drat that Angela Well she was the boss!
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Apr 19, 2016 22:21
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Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:Oh, he wasn't gonna kill him. He said that was "dads rules", so I'm pretty sure Lucifer can kill people if he wants to. Its not like he feels a need to stick to his fathers rules.
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Apr 19, 2016 22:24
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Watermelon Daiquiri posted:drat that Angela  I groaned a bit when they brought out the Maz "daggers that can hurt Lucifer and Amenadiel" bit, that's getting a bit TOO close to Supernatural territory.  I'm really surprised how enjoyable this show is...I was so angry they were adapting one of my favorite books into a crap TV show, it was a pleasant surprise that it's genuinely enjoyable. At least my pessimism still has to look forward to Preacher being ruined, and then American Gods later on down the road...
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Apr 19, 2016 22:25
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SiKboy posted:He said that was "dads rules", so I'm pretty sure Lucifer can kill people if he wants to. Its not like he feels a need to stick to his fathers rules. Even if he's able to, I don't think he really wants to. He just wants to punish dudes who deserve it.
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Apr 19, 2016 23:29
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counterfeitsaint posted:Even if he's able to, I don't think he really wants to. He just wants to punish dudes who deserve it. Totally agree, I just think it's worth noting that it's probably that he's choosing not to kill people, rather than that he can't.
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Apr 19, 2016 23:36
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SiKboy posted:Totally agree, I just think it's worth noting that it's probably that he's choosing not to kill people, rather than that he can't. I agree too. Lucifer is all about dealing out justice. Death doesn't fit his idea of what justice should be. Like in the pilot with that producer, he could have killed him after he shot Chloe but instead decided to punish him by showing his true form and whatever else he did to make the guy go insane.
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Apr 19, 2016 23:49
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