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Conot posted:Will give it a shot. Should I play it on Ultra like the description says or is it better suited to Normal to give that "Arcane Might" feeling? Ultra or Large is probably a good idea. I'm playing on Large because my rig can't really handle Ultra, and even there the magic is incredibly powerful. As in, even a single Searing Doom will outright murder half a regular infantry unit.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:14
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The only time I've had a demigryph knight die is when my battery of cannons accidentally pummeled them in the back with three salvos. And even then, two casualties.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:16
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The game is balanced for normal unit sizes.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:29
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sassassin posted:The game is balanced for normal unit sizes. Thats only really true for magic, AFAIK. All other units get a boost to relevant stats (unit size/unit health) as unit sizes change. So the game still remains "balanced" at Ultra as it is at Normal, other then in regards to magic, as previously noted.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:33
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Robo Reagan posted:all i know about ftfy
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Jun 8, 2016 16:38
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Great OP, though please add descriptions/rundowns for Empire Legendary Lords, and you can probably delete the 'Gunpowder' part of the TW explainer since we're not dealing with lines of bayonet muskets here. Also I think the major difference between Empire Spearmen w/shields and Swordsmen, apart from the anti large bonus, is that Swordsmen get a decent charge bonus. Defensively they're pretty equal against infantry. Maybe put in a note on Honest Steel somewhere too.Robo Reagan posted:all i know about this game is it made nerds really mad before it released The DLC thing was funny because most of the rage came from 'gamers', while those of us
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Jun 8, 2016 16:39
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Been playing on Very Hard, and I found the Dwarves incredibly simple compared to Empire thus far. A full stack of Warriors/Quarrlers can beat anything the orcs throw at you, you can use underway interception like lightning battle, and Grimgor is your only real existential threat for the first little bit. Take out Gunbad and the orcs only come from the south, get a couple extra stacks and you can roll up all the badlands pretty easy in time. Especially if you keep Karak Azul afloat to keep them busy. Empire has to figure out who likes them and who doesn't based on random AI traits, throw gifts at everyone, and constantly hope they don't get backstabbed while in a current war already. I keep running into problems where I get new missions to attack new enemies (which you can ignore, but still), or one of the Bretonnian randomly declares war on me, or the Norscans roll up with 6 stacks down the river to Altdorf at turn 55. Empire takes a lot more luck to really pull off the powerhouse the Dwarfs can be, at least at high difficulty. Mazz fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 16:41
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You guys weren't kidding about Manfred being godawful overpowered. I had hosed up and gotten myself into a pretty bad fight against empire troops where they had a 3/1 advantage in early game and his army was still largely full of garbage units. I sniped the enemy lord first thing which caused a good third their force to just gently caress off. Unfortunately by this point the only thing left on field of any note was Manfred and the Varghulf who both just kinda rampaged around wrecking poo poo. I did end up losing the fight, but both Manny and the Varghulf survived and barely any of that force managed to. I honestly thought I was going to pull it off because half of their army was running around terrified of Manfred the entire time. EDIT: Do wizards for the Empire campaign feel useless to anyone else? I feel like the only time I got any good use out of mine was during a siege I managed to get both a bright and celestial wizard up on the walls. The enemy had a big fuckoff ball of light/heavy cavalry sitting at the end of the main thoroughfare that runs the length of the wall prepared to fling themselves at whoever made it to ground level first so I just started dumping AOE spells into them as soon as they came off cooldown/I had the celestial farts to do it for several minutes straight while I cleared the walls. Rhymenoserous fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 16:42
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I'd constantly have a single vampire lord survive 1vs500 and win a fight after I lost a army because of all the self healing available and the fact they can barely get a couple swings off before they run away. It's a shame necromancers are so underwhelming, I thought they would of had some bonuses to raising dead in fights but the vampires can do that while also being unkillable. Lore of death is absurdly strong, but I love the lore of vampires healing and zombie/skeleton creation spells, a swarm of zombies cropping up behind a engaged line can be a serious morale hit. I'm hoping a patch or mod down the line I could just run around with a handful of necromancers in a army and create a swarm every battle.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:47
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Conot posted:Thats only really true for magic, AFAIK. All other units get a boost to relevant stats (unit size/unit health) as unit sizes change. So the game still remains "balanced" at Ultra as it is at Normal, other then in regards to magic, as previously noted. It's a bit more nuanced than that. Hellcannons for instance, are a single model artillery unit so they get increased HP going from medium to Ultra while regular artillery gets more dudes/HP and also twice as many cannons. Monsters are in a similar situation, Giants and the like are much stronger on medium unit size even with less HP. quote:T: Do wizards for the Empire campaign feel useless to anyone else? I feel like the only time I got any good use out of mine was during a siege I managed to get both a bright and celestial wizard up on the walls. The enemy had a big fuckoff ball of light/heavy cavalry sitting at the end of the main thoroughfare that runs the length of the wall prepared to fling themselves at whoever made it to ground level first so I just started dumping AOE spells into them as soon as they came off cooldown/I had the celestial farts to do it for several minutes straight while I cleared the walls. Magic right now suffers from no scaling on higher unit sizes and also some sketchy internal balancing. (EG Searing Doom requires careful aim and can be dodged but does gently caress-all damage even when perfectly placed while Spirit Leech does massive damage from range and is completely unavoidable.) madmac fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 16:51
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I'm a bit disappointed that from what people described of hellcannon, that they aren't just big monsters with a tendency to go berserk like elephants and have a long range artiliery shot power. Instead being just reskinned cannons that can be broken apart.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:53
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Ludo Friend posted:Migration games are great fun. Manfred decided he was gave no fucks about how precious homeland and sailed off to tilea. I think having your leader choice give you a different starting position would be an interesting change. Like there's the vampire faction down by Brettonia - that would make a great alternate start. It would also be cool if they imported the migration option from Attila, where you could convert your settled faction into a horde, and then resettle them again somewhere else. Maybe we'll see that in one of the future added races (are there any factions in the Warhammer lore that are migratory? Not pure hordes, but ones that picked up and moved somewhere else at some point).
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Jun 8, 2016 16:54
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Murgos posted:Demigryphs are kind of what lets Empire play with the big boy monster factions so I hope they don't get nerfed too much but you could totally see it coming. Although I suppose that at the same time Empire magic should get a buff but how you would make magic effective anti-monster without exacerbating the lord sniping I have no clue. If they are nerfing demigriffs, it would make sense to buff high tier Empire artillery a bit. Luminarchs and Hellblasters are stuff useful currently, but a bit underpowered for how tricky it is to get them.
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Jun 8, 2016 16:57
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They should smarten up and create some Generic Quests, tech trees and RNG some Items then sell a "Minor Faction" pack that unlocks all the factions  .
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Jun 8, 2016 16:58
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good OP. here's some more screenshots of this great game (some using GemFX, still tinkering with it).      
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Jun 8, 2016 17:06
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The Cheshire Cat posted:(are there any factions in the Warhammer lore that are migratory? Not pure hordes, but ones that picked up and moved somewhere else at some point). There are the Dark Elves, who uprooted their castles and turned them into sailing ships. Then there's the Ogres, who are renown for traveling the world as swords-for-hire. But besides those none of the factions are known for moving, settling, then moving again.
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Jun 8, 2016 17:06
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Conot posted:Will give it a shot. Should I play it on Ultra like the description says or is it better suited to Normal to give that "Arcane Might" feeling? I've played this mod on Ultra and even on Ultra the spells are pretty devastating. An overcasted Burning Head will rip half an army apart if the vortex scatter favors you. It's a fun mod and does a lot to make mages feel powerful and unique, and it also buffs a lot of the mediocre/bad hero artifacts and skills to be more exciting. Gelt actually doesn't feel like a waste of a LL spot in this mod because the Lore of Metal owns bones! I haven't tried Kemmler in it to see if it makes him not crap. I haven't really played it past the first 50-60 turns though so I don't know if it presents a problem re: mage stacking ruining battles or something.
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Jun 8, 2016 17:19
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Conot posted:Thats only really true for magic, AFAIK. All other units get a boost to relevant stats (unit size/unit health) as unit sizes change. So the game still remains "balanced" at Ultra as it is at Normal, other then in regards to magic, as previously noted. Magic is an important part of the game, but it also effects environmental things like needing more/less units to defend walls, and cavalry charges get are far more dangerous when you can't field deep enough ranks.
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Jun 8, 2016 17:40
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The direct damage can be underwhelming, but the buffs and debuffs are great.
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Jun 8, 2016 17:57
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genericnick posted:I'm not even sure how good this idea is. If you take both settlements Zhufbar looks rather shaky against the vamps. In my game I had to confederate them just a few turns later because it looked unlikely that they would hold out long against the VC. Also marching a big stack north early tends to invite a raiding visit from Ironhide that can seriously damage your growth.
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Jun 8, 2016 17:59
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Effectiveness be damned, if summoning a giant flaming skull onto the field is wrong, I don't wanna be right.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:00
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Speaking of mods, it would be nice if advice-givers mentioned any mods they were using before giving advice (difficulty level is a good idea too). There can be a big difference playing the base campaigns vs campaigns with no enemy agent actions, super powered spells, settlements that can build T4 buildings, occupy any settlements regardless of race, etc etc.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:05
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Zephro posted:Confederating them is fine, though, since you'll do a much better job with their provinces than the AI will. Just be careful because confederating will clear the garrison (hoping this is a bug that is fixed soon).
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Jun 8, 2016 18:10
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drat Dirty Ape posted:Just be careful because confederating will clear the garrison (hoping this is a bug that is fixed soon). I don't think clearing the garrison is a bug. It's a (poorly explained) balancing measure that makes military allies valuable, and means that confederating opens up opportunities for you if you see an enemy do it.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:16
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Zephro posted:Confederating them is fine, though, since you'll do a much better job with their provinces than the AI will. My favourite opening move as Vampire Counts is to wait until Zhufbar gets into a war and gets their stack annihilated, then offer to join their war in exchange for them becoming my vassal. Dwarf bro for lyfe! 
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Jun 8, 2016 18:21
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drat Dirty Ape posted:Speaking of mods, it would be nice if advice-givers mentioned any mods they were using before giving advice (difficulty level is a good idea too). There can be a big difference playing the base campaigns vs campaigns with no enemy agent actions, super powered spells, settlements that can build T4 buildings, occupy any settlements regardless of race, etc etc. Speaking of speaking of mods, does anyone have a good guide for making them? I've seen a lot of people grumble about the building requirements for units (slayers!  ) and I'd like to try to make a mod that removes the requirements but multiplies the cost by however many buildings are needed to unlock them.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:26
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drat Dirty Ape posted:Speaking of mods, it would be nice if advice-givers mentioned any mods they were using before giving advice (difficulty level is a good idea too). There can be a big difference playing the base campaigns vs campaigns with no enemy agent actions, super powered spells, settlements that can build T4 buildings, occupy any settlements regardless of race, etc etc. For what it's worth, so far I've been playing strictly vanilla Hard/VH switching from Ultra to Large unit size after the first couple days.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:33
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Mukip posted:I disagree with the OP assessment about Empire spearmen. They seem to be only slightly worse than swordsmen against infantry and have less upkeep, which matters when running multiple stacks. They make fine chaff with tech/lord bonuses and are probably the best chaff vs Chaos in particular, given all their cavalry and large targets. Their stats seem very similar, but Spearmen are actually significantly weaker (I assume we're talking about the ones without shields because the shielded ones aren't cheaper) even if the 30% missile deflection from the shield is irrelevant. The difference between Swordsmen's damage (unmodified) at 22/6 (base/ap), and Spearmen's at 20/5 is fairly minor, but because Spearmen attack significantly slower, Swordsmen end up doing quite a bit more damage (~65%), and that's before you take their higher melee attack into account.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:35
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Triskelli posted:Speaking of speaking of mods, does anyone have a good guide for making them? I've seen a lot of people grumble about the building requirements for units (slayers! 1. Get PFM from TWC 2. Open a new mod, add the table main_units from data.pack, delete the entires in the additional_building_required field, and double the recruitment_cost. 3. Delete every row entry but the ones you changed, and name the table to something like trisk_data_core. 4. Save it 5. Make sure it's enabled, you'll probably have to turn out of date mods on Thats it. Mazz fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 18:39
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Wallet posted:Their stats seem very similar, but Spearmen are actually significantly weaker (I assume we're talking about the ones without shields because the shielded ones aren't cheaper) even if the 30% missile deflection from the shield is irrelevant. The difference between Swordsmen's damage (unmodified) at 22/6 (base/ap), and Spearmen's at 20/5 is fairly minor, but because Spearmen attack significantly slower, Swordsmen end up doing quite a bit more damage (~65%), and that's before you take their higher melee attack into account. On that note, how exactly do Melee Attack and Melee Defense interact? Since both stats tend to fall between 1 and 100 for almost every unit I'm tempted to think it might work through straight hit/miss percentages somehow, but I really have no idea. I can never tell whether it'd actually be worth it to buff a Lord's or Hero's Melee Attack up from 60-something, or if I'd already be running into diminishing returns at that point.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:46
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drat Dirty Ape posted:Speaking of mods, it would be nice if advice-givers mentioned any mods they were using before giving advice (difficulty level is a good idea too). There can be a big difference playing the base campaigns vs campaigns with no enemy agent actions, super powered spells, settlements that can build T4 buildings, occupy any settlements regardless of race, etc etc. Ehhhh I question that my T4 minor mod makes any kind of difference to difficulty. All it does is allow you to build a couple buildings in provinces outside your capital, all of which you could already build in your capital if you wanted. The turn timer and building costs are the same as a T4 major. The economy buff is pretty minor as empire doesn't even have tier 4 econ buildings and the dwarfs sure as gently caress don't need them to make a ton of money as it is. The hard part of TW is the early/mid game where you aren't a powerhouse, and T4 minor settlements aren't a thing that will change that. Spells and poo poo though, I agree. Perestroika posted:On that note, how exactly do Melee Attack and Melee Defense interact? Since both stats tend to fall between 1 and 100 for almost every unit I'm tempted to think it might work through straight hit/miss percentages somehow, but I really have no idea. I can never tell whether it'd actually be worth it to buff a Lord's or Hero's Melee Attack up from 60-something, or if I'd already be running into diminishing returns at that point. We can't, it's one of the things CA isn't super transparent about as it's a core mechanic they like being hidden somewhat, but yeah you do run into diminishing returns as you widen the gap. It's still reasonably valuable, but if you can get weapon damage or pure HP instead, do that first. For defense I go: +HP , then armor, then melee defense. For attack: I'd probably say speed, then weapon damage, then melee attack, then charge bonuses I base it on the percentage of time those traits will be valuable; i.e. I consider HP paramount because HP is always active; and more is always good. armor next since it effects melee and ranged hits (but AP bypasses it, hence the downgrade), and then melee defense (unless you feel its too low to begin with). I value speed a lot because you do a lot of loving moving in this game, and time to engage can be pretty important. Mazz fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 18:46
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The Cheshire Cat posted:are there any factions in the Warhammer lore that are migratory? Not pure hordes, but ones that picked up and moved somewhere else at some point Ogre Kingdoms pretty much. The race as a whole in the lore has wanderlust. Ogres can pretty much be found everywhere in the world, looking for new and exciting things to punch and eat.
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Jun 8, 2016 18:52
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Perestroika posted:On that note, how exactly do Melee Attack and Melee Defense interact? Since both stats tend to fall between 1 and 100 for almost every unit I'm tempted to think it might work through straight hit/miss percentages somehow, but I really have no idea. I can never tell whether it'd actually be worth it to buff a Lord's or Hero's Melee Attack up from 60-something, or if I'd already be running into diminishing returns at that point. Everyone should read this breakdown linked in the OP, it really explains a lot of the semi-arcane combat systems.
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Jun 8, 2016 19:05
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Maybe people can weigh on the campaigns they've played and the flavor they got out of them: 1. Orks. I felt this was the easiest campaign. Throw big boss tents everywhere and revolts stop real quick. You get free waagh armies, the units are all quite beefy if you don't use a billion goblins, and you get the underground movement of the dwarfs. Really big roster, and fun lategame artillery. Cons: The fact that you have to unlock research sucks, the tech tree is super lame, the giant is terrible as all giants are, and orky magic seems underwhelming at the moment so you will probably end up going light on the agents. Also you have to use goblin big bosses as assassins and your agents are underwhelming. Underground movement is a big factor - it helps you avoid all corruption and terrain penalties. Can't trade but can confederate, so you really don't care about the diplo game at all other than killing dudes to confederate orks. 2. Dwarfs. These guys are fiddly at the start, but I didn't feel any fiddlier than the empire. In both cases you start with 1 province, about 5 turns worth of obvious conquests, and then you get a province at the end. Seems about right. You have to deal with grimgor but as long as you understand that quarrelers don't do it against him, the fight can be ok. You just gotta get shots for your thunderers if you picked Thorgrim (you wanna pick Thorgrim). Your dudes are tanky as poo poo and AP is kinda rare at the start of the game, which tends to lead to fun battles. If you get established I feel the dwarves start to steamroll from about turn 40. I could see a new player having difficulties with the first 10 turns though, so maybe Orks would be the easiest choice for that. 3. VC. So people keep suggesting them and I'm a little bit confused. No artillery, so sieges are always the hard way. No ranged units. Flyers are awesome but just a touch fiddly in terms of how to use. Corruption requires work from the building side and agent side, and when you're done applying it you just stop taking penalties. Cities with insufficient corruption take a -8 morale penalty so conquering into uncorrupted / poorly corrupted lands is real tough. Your territory is the balkans of the map and is the crossroads for everyone with some chokepoints dumping armies right into your territory. You have no movement modes other than normal which means your flying undead counts will have to patiently wait a turn to build a raft to ford the river so they can kill an invading army. This pissed me off, a lot. Anywhere you go without corruption you take attrition. During sieges you will typically be taking attrition. Raise dead is bugged for about 50% of players and only displays 0 corpses no matter what happened. Magic is very binary with things like Soul Leech / Fate of Bjuna being amazing and the rest lovely. Necromancers are terrible but vamps are great. As VC you will want to secure your starting two provinces then figure out which human factions to expand against until chaos comes. You can trade, but in a fun quirk nobody wants to trade with you. 4. Empire. Your starting units are fragile but fast. You get some secessionists to take down that will give you your starting province around turn 10. If you declare on the wrong person they'll call in a nearby dwarf hold and wreck your poo poo. You are slightly west of the map balkans so your territory is smack dab in the middle of like 12 human empires, all of them hate you. They start with full stacks and strong garrisons, so your starting army (which is what you can afford) can't really take them. You have units that are kinda papery so its hard to generate the mismatches you need to rack up huge kills. I guess there's the reiksguard, but they don't seem to kill fast enough to swing battles alone. You also will tend to rack up diplomatic penalties if you do that, so it's better to go take VC territory, which will be lovely and corrupted. Also the provinces around the empire SUCK. Empire gets a 4 city province, to the north is a 3 city province, and everything else are two city provinces. Compare that to what the Dwarfs and Orks get and it's ridiculous. The VC do get two nice provinces but then run into the same 2 city province issues that the Empire does. I don't understand that design choice. So I really didn't enjoy the Empire campaign and it felt even worse than the VC one. You still have all the movement bullshit the VC. Enjoy rivers, which you have a ton of. 5. Chaos. IDK, I felt the huns were lovely in Attila and I feel Chaos is lovely here. Someone else can write this up.
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Jun 8, 2016 19:10
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I don't really get what's supposed to be bad about two-city provinces.
Fangz fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 19:16
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Perestroika posted:On that note, how exactly do Melee Attack and Melee Defense interact? Since both stats tend to fall between 1 and 100 for almost every unit I'm tempted to think it might work through straight hit/miss percentages somehow, but I really have no idea. I can never tell whether it'd actually be worth it to buff a Lord's or Hero's Melee Attack up from 60-something, or if I'd already be running into diminishing returns at that point. See here: https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/4m9sdw/how_melee_attack_and_defense_armor_and_damage/ There are diminishing returns, but you're very well rewarded for boosting melee attack and melee defense at basically all the reasonable values you'll see in game and they are stats you should be prioritizing highly. Actually that was based on old information, apparently armor is a randomized percentage based damage reduction that caps out around 200 Armor Value, so it may be that those +30 armor talents are actually quite good on everyone (though AP is still a thing obv)! LGD fucked around with this message at 19:22 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 19:18
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Guys this game is real good. It's the first total war game I've played (out of Rome 1, Medieval 2, Shogun 2, Rome 2) that I immediately went and started a 2nd campaign immediately after finishing my first one. Also it's co-op campaign actually loving works nearly flawlessly. My buddy and I ran into one bug that we had to do a work around to keep the game moving, but in recent attempts at Shogun 2 vanilla and Rome 2 vanilla co-op campaigns we couldn't even get past the first turn. It's just really loving good. That is all.
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Jun 8, 2016 19:19
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Fangz posted:I don't really get what's supposed to be bad about two-city provinces. Fewer building slots to boost each other with. With a three town province you can have: wealth buildings+defense in everything, then a town with +growth, a town with +public order and the main settlement with whatever you want (adjust as needed for special buildings). In two province, you often have to give up either growth or public order boosts or something. Not a huge deal, but it's there.
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Jun 8, 2016 19:21
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The issue is way minimized now that there is no corruption as it existed in the past games, so expansion is always a net sum. I felt the Empire campaign was the most fun as it remained challenging all the way to victory and on. Also that assessment is way wrong. Wissenland and Middenheim both border Reikland and each has three-region provinces. Reikland itself is the only human four-region province, and Marienburg has that unique money making port right next door.
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Jun 8, 2016 19:24
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Man the AI is very good at microing the loving wolves. I saw an almost full army get annihilated by them purely from wolf micro. The only counter had been to build a defensive perimeter around the Mortars and just trying to beat them down while holding the enemy at bay from the forward assault. Then again this dude only had a single unit of Reiksguard and no other cavalry, so maybe that was just a poor army composition.
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Jun 8, 2016 19:24
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