|
Rakthar posted:So to reiterate the guy who asked earlier in the thread and didn't get a resposne RO = Regional Occupation = "Different homes for different folks"
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:23
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 08:20 |
|
|
Aurubin posted:Why are hellcannons unbreakable? Is that a tabletop thing? Yes. The Cannon is an unbreakable Daemon murder machine who will annihilate elite units (doesn't care whose) if it's handlers get killed (or it eats them).
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:27
|
|
|
Chomp8645 posted:RO = Regional Occupation = "Different homes for different folks" So the bold restriction of "You can conquer these holds but not those holds, because otherwise the campaign turns into a messy clusterfuck" is the compelling gameplay that we were lacking to push this series into blockbuster territory, there we go. I find it neat enough but having played 3 different campaigns with it, when I tried another campaign to remove it, it seemed to create more dynamic battles. The border princes conquered a bunch of dwarf poo poo which meant that they started fielding real armies. After playing vanilla it seemed like a fun change.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:28
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:So the bold restriction of "You can conquer these holds but not those holds, because otherwise the campaign turns into a messy clusterfuck" is the compelling gameplay that we were lacking to push this series into blockbuster territory, there we go. Unironically, yes.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:33
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:So the bold restriction of "You can conquer these holds but not those holds, because otherwise the campaign turns into a messy clusterfuck" is the compelling gameplay that we were lacking to push this series into blockbuster territory, there we go. My only comment here is there are very few factions that truly benefit, those right on the Human/Orc border, Border Princes being one of them. The rest are generally surrounded by provinces they can already use all the same. Occupy everywhere does 2 things, as I've been looking at it hard for my watchtower mod. Opens up the superchains of settlements so you can settle in more places (based off the ruins and the settlement type), and spreads the occupation_decision fields to more factions. That's it. It's a good mod for what it does but idk how much improvement your seeing isn't just luck with AI choices based off the cai traits and where you were looking on the map. Also, no offense to Dresden, but the whole thing feels kinda sloppy, but partly because the system itself is convoluted and kinda weird. Also, to the person that mentioned Zhufbar having special buildings for the VC, it's far more likely you've just never covered a province with iron as a resource before, since that's what provides it. There is no special chains for VC like that in the files, and Zhufbar is not a named location as far as the game notes, Karak Kadrin with the Slayer Shrine is though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:49
|
|
|
Rygar201 posted:Yes. The Cannon is an unbreakable Daemon murder machine who will annihilate elite units (doesn't care whose) if it's handlers get killed (or it eats them). Huh, neat. Wargaming and miniatures were the bit of nerd culture I never touched, for reasons of interest and expense. How faithful to the tabletop are the units? I know the Vampire Counts were an army without range, for instance. I've gotten the impression that Games Workshop was never good at coming up with a balanced game, with incompetence, conspiracy, or both being the cited reason. Wondering how that's impacted the balance of this particular TW installment online.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:50
|
|
|
madmac posted:Spider Rider Archers have poison arrows, which greatly debuff enemy units. They're used mostly as support, to cripple units you're fighting and make them easier to pick off. Night Goblin Archers also have poison arrows though they don't do any more ranged damage than regular gobbo archers do. So they're perfect anti-cavalry then? Due to the slowing effect of the poison, I mean. Will the poison still take effect against armored enemies like heavy cavalry, or does damage have to be dealt?
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:51
|
|
|
Manny and another lord that was just building up fighting Archaon and Sarthorael at Kislev. Autoresolve had the odds at about 4:1 in favor of Chaos. I only got the idea to start taking screenshots halfway through the fight  Using vargheists properly. Note the enemy already piled up on the ghouls and crypt horrors.  Someone didn't think his cunning plan all the way through...  A terrorgheist doing the goomba stomp off a dying giant.  The Everfailure wants no part of a fight with Manny. Manny doesn't even have his zombie dragon yet.  And another one bites the dust...  Sophie hits this line with soulblight right before she charges home. Hundreds of battle-hardened Chaos Warriors rout immediately from one girl with a bad hairdo as the vargheists fly off to engage another line.  The vargheists drop on the main battle line just as Archaon starts to rout. Johnny the chaos giant just right of center screen is about to have a bad day.  The big pile of dudes that ran from soulblight can be seen still running, just over the shoulder of that center vargheist. Manny finally runs the Everfleeing down.  A bird's eye view of the final push. That thing disintegrating on the left over there is some crypt horrors. I finally lost a unit of crypt horrors   Johnny almost got out. Seriously, the line is just a few yards in front of him.  Poor Johnny. So, I made a big mistake with this fight, not that it really mattered because VCs are so drat good. Can anyone tell me what it is? Hint: it did not happen in the battle itself.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:00
|
|
|
rockopete posted:So they're perfect anti-cavalry then? Due to the slowing effect of the poison, I mean. Will the poison still take effect against armored enemies like heavy cavalry, or does damage have to be dealt? One of my test involved Night Gobbo archers slowing a unit of Grave Guard to a crawl as they approached, so yeah heavy armor doesn't matter against poison.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:00
|
|
|
Can poison effects scatter onto your own units if your are shooting into a melee? Or can only the designated target be affected?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:02
|
|
|
madmac posted:One of my test involved Night Gobbo archers slowing a unit of Grave Guard to a crawl as they approached, so yeah heavy armor doesn't matter against poison. Yeah although I'd clarify that poison does no damage to armor / through armor, just slows them down. Poison was ridiculous in charlemagne and got nerfed to gently caress. It's now a 25% speed debuff that lasts 5 seconds. What that means is that a unit that is being shot by spider archers is 25% slower. A charging unit will get there slower, an enemy lord will reposition slower, that sort of thing. In exchange, the spider riders don't do a lot of damage with their projectiles. They won't win missile duels or outgun much of anything. They can't melee arrer boys and win. They are very quick and quite flexible - a huge upgrade to wolf riders in every way. I find that 2-3 units can be great for utility, but I don't think you can use them as a missile core the way you would quarrelers.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:03
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:Yeah although I'd clarify that poison does no damage to armor / through armor, just slows them down. It's a 25% penalty to most stats, not just speed. Poisoned units are garbage in melee, it's one of the reason poison hounds are so effective.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:09
|
|
|
madmac posted:It's a 25% penalty to most stats, not just speed. Poisoned units are garbage in melee, it's one of the reason poison hounds are so effective. Ah well that's more decent than I thought. For me to use it more I think it would need to last more than 5 seconds. As it is, you can basically 'counter' an enemy unit with your own poison unit, but only as long as it can keep shooting. If charge bonus lasts 30 seconds, I think I'd like to see this be 15. Or something like that.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:14
|
|
|
Chomp8645 posted:Can poison effects scatter onto your own units if your are shooting into a melee? Or can only the designated target be affected? Yes it can. In fact here's a small battle I ran against Dwarves in which a unit of Night Goblin Archers have managed to poison pretty much everyone involved.  A poisoned Unit has a Red Down arrow in the Bottom Right of their unit card. Here's the full Poison effect.  It's pretty beefy! Just to see, I moved the Goblins round the flank and fired to see if they hit my own troops less, they still hosed it up fairly often.  Generally any units on the sides will not be hit. Any units in front or behind will be. So try get them round the flanks of a unit that isn't flanked. Or use them on units engaged with Goblin Spearmen because you lose a lot less damage than they do as you don't do any damage to begin with. Fans fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Jun 11, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:16
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:Ah well that's more decent than I thought. For me to use it more I think it would need to last more than 5 seconds. As it is, you can basically 'counter' an enemy unit with your own poison unit, but only as long as it can keep shooting. If charge bonus lasts 30 seconds, I think I'd like to see this be 15. Or something like that. It'd potentially be pretty OP and obnoxious if it lasted 15 seconds though, because that actively encourages you to micro each poison archer unit to retarget after every attack as they could keep 2-3 enemy units crippled simultaneously. That's a huge return on investment (both unit wise and for properly autistic APM/animation monitoring) and not something that has much, if any, counterplay. Much better to keep poison something that a single unit can only consistently keep applied to one foe at a time.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:25
|
|
|
So can someone write up a few good builds for the different lords and faction leaders?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:30
|
|
|
Why the hell does every capital siege play me against a lord with a loving helm of discord?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:33
|
|
|
Just closed out a VH long campaign win with chaos. Quite an interesting experience, it made me want to go back and play some other campaigns with a vassal-heavy strategy. It was a ton of fun rolling up to altdorf with 4 different norse armies at my back ( I even vassalized the varg after I beat em cuz why not) and planning my conquests so they'd expand my vassal's territory was an interesting exercise. Probably the roughest thing about the chaos campaign is how dependent you are on the campaign map and luck of the AI. For instance, in my winning game dwarves got trounced by the orcs without me having to lift a finger, and even when I was wrecking empire face I guess they had pissed off Marienburg and Bretonia earlier because they didn't ally and jump in to attack me. Also I'll pile on to mention that bonus leadership values on VH made a lot of strategies really hard to pull off. In my first game i tried using forsaken and they were good but when every enemy squad fights to near-death I pretty much had to use my heavy armor options to keep battlefield casualties reasonable. Also the turn I ended the game i was at 14k gold and my turn income was -7k. Raiding and pillaging got me through 100 turns but keeping 3 elite armies funded forever is not really doable once you start wrecking your opponents and getting 1000g sacks. Edit: Since I want to start a vassal-heavy campaign, has anyone found an "unlikely vassal" scenario that would be fun to play? For instance I managed to vassal-ize the border princes in my dwarf campaign. I'm thinking something like orcs with an undead vassal would be fun.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:37
|
|
|
Aurubin posted:Huh, neat. Wargaming and miniatures were the bit of nerd culture I never touched, for reasons of interest and expense. How faithful to the tabletop are the units? I know the Vampire Counts were an army without range, for instance. I've gotten the impression that Games Workshop was never good at coming up with a balanced game, with incompetence, conspiracy, or both being the cited reason. Wondering how that's impacted the balance of this particular TW installment online. As far as flavor, I've only played the Chaos campaign and was pretty disappointed, now that I think about it. I was expecting to have dark champions getting possessed mid-battle, demons and black conjurors tainting the field, uncontrollable madmen ignoring my orders. Instead I got a boringly straightforward unit roster of melee guys in armor with no special abilities that could basically belong to any faction if you reskinned them. The only really Chaosy feeling units (in appearance, not even mechanics) were the hounds, spawn, and the dragon ogres. I think both of the Dawn of War games did a much better job with them. I haven't played the tabletop games in many years, but at least then the sore lack of balance had less to do with rank incompetence or sinister intention and more to do with the impossibility of balancing a game that has 15+ different armies each with a literal book of unit choices, many of whom have multi-paragraph rules and between a few and few dozen optional paragraph-long abilities or equipment. Which is fine, and I don't think GW ever intended their games to attract hardcore strategists. They're much more about the hobby of collecting, modding, and painting the units, and for that having a huge amount of customization is optimal.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:37
|
|
|
Avasculous posted:I haven't played the tabletop games in many years, but at least then the sore lack of balance had less to do with rank incompetence or sinister intention and more to do with the impossibility of balancing a game that has 15+ different armies each with a literal book of unit choices, many of whom have multi-paragraph rules and between a few and few dozen optional paragraph-long abilities or equipment. Can you link me to your positive Age of Sigmar review?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:02
|
|
|
madmac posted:A good rule of thumb for TW games is that all those animations are not just an abstraction of what is happening, attack animations, projectile physics and collisions are all something that matter a great deal. On a purely technical level, the TW battle engine is kind of nuts. I like having a unit or two of night goblin archers just to easily poison other units. I love fanatics but I wish there was a way to control when they get released because they rarely ever seem to hit the enemy for me.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:04
|
|
|
KnoxZone posted:I have decided to counter Legendary's bullshit with a lot of bullshit of my own. After taking Marienburg really fast I had Karl spend the next 15 turns constantly sacking that one Orc town next to Marienburg, which boosted his level really high and instantly fulfilled the 'defeat 5 Orc army' quest objectives for Ghal Maraz. Turn 30 and the Emperor has his hammer and the Silver Seal. How did you get a Witch Hunter that quickly? Rakthar posted:There is a separate battle difficulty slider in the options menu bro, how did you conclude it's not a thing? The Lone Badger fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Jun 11, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:08
|
|
|
So how the hell is "a route from their capital" calculated that this doesn't qualify? I have a three-province long contiguous border with the Dwarfs.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:08
|
|
|
Hargrimm posted:So how the hell is "a route from their capital" calculated that this doesn't qualify? I have a three-province long contiguous border with the Dwarfs. As funny as it sounds you may not have a route. It could be that trade routes are traced along actual roads and/or main movement paths, not simple contiguous borders. All of the land directly between you is impassable. To the East there is literally only one single mountain pass that connect the north/south portions of their realm and it's right in that sliver that the Bloody Spear control. On the west the lack of Ackendorf is loving up the main route through Black Fire Pass. If this isn't a bug then that's my working theory. Basically: lol
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:14
|
|
|
Fans posted:Also Goblin Wolfriders and other light cav (Missile or otherwise) have a niche, in that they're good for chasing down and killing units that have broken. Broken units might reform and come back, but set the Wolfriders on them and they'll eventually Shatter and be gone for sure. This is the same niche than the Wolves in Undead Armies have and Pistoleers in Empire fill. Wolf riders can also be a good way to cheese the enemy AI in single player. I'm currently playing a Hard Greenskin campaign and many times already I've danced my wolf riders behind enemy lines just enough to have multiple units of empire knights and crossbowmen chase me around the map. It takes a lot of microing though, but it works nicely because they are fast and have vanguard deployment.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:15
|
|
|
They really need a more direct route through Zhufbar to connect the two since the way it is isolates the factions too much. The Dwarfs don't even have to think about the north until like turn 75 unless you really want to.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:16
|
|
|
Hargrimm posted:So how the hell is "a route from their capital" calculated that this doesn't qualify? I have a three-province long contiguous border with the Dwarfs. As far as I can tell, it's based on roads. Because of the ground that the Bloody Spears control, I'm not sure there's a functioning route.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:16
|
|
|
How can I use ranged poison effectively? Poison seems really powerful for melee engagements, but ranged poison will hit your units as well as the enemy. I guess you could target their range, but at that point why not just used higher damage ranged units to focus them down?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:19
|
|
|
Mostly I use my ranged poison on good bad guy units (heroes, hammerers, etc) that are attacking crappy good guy units (goblins, orc boyz). Maybe I would be better off switching to night goblin swordsmen. I'm not sure, I have at least one army loaded with night goblin archers (like 4 units) which seems to do well, but perhaps I would be better off replacing most of them. I'm doing ok, but I'm still struggling a bit with greenskin army composition. I have at least one army loaded with black orcs and big 'uns, but I have a lot of trouble against ranged and cavalry heavy lineups with that army (though I recently recruited 4 doom divers for that army which will help).
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:26
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:There is a separate battle difficulty slider in the options menu bro, how did you conclude it's not a thing? Going back to this now I'm home and can see the client. As I missing something here?  It sure looks like just one slider to me. And there is nothing else in the main options menu.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:30
|
|
|
Chomp8645 posted:Going back to this now I'm home and can see the client. As I missing something here? From the campaign menu where you are, you can only select the campaign difficulty. The battle difficulty starts at the same setting. When you are actually in the game, on turn 1, hit escape then options. A setting is now available for the Battle difficulty, which you can adjust to whatever you like regardless of what you just set as your Campaign difficulty. The two are still tracked separately, so Battle difficulty is your in combat buffs etc.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:33
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:From the campaign menu where you are, you can only select the campaign difficulty. The battle difficulty starts at the same setting. When you are actually in the game, on turn 1, hit escape then options. A setting is now available for the Battle difficulty, which you can adjust to whatever you like regardless of what you just set as your Campaign difficulty. lmao Well, I admit I was wrong. But why in the holy gently caress would they do it like that?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:36
|
|
|
Chomp8645 posted:lmao Because it's fukken funny m8, the CA way  Why are all your agents blind, retarded, and crippled? See above.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:37
|
|
|
Another note on Night Goblins, it's not obvious when you're playing vs the AI, but their stalk ability means they are all literally kisho ninja from Shogun 2, they're considered concealed even when walking around on wide open snowy plains and can only be spotted within a pretty short distance, like just outside the Night Goblin archers firing range.quote:Well, I admit I was wrong. But why in the holy gently caress would they do it like that? It worked the same way in Shogun 2 and every TW game since. I'm guessing CA just wanted to simplify selecting difficulty for casual players while still giving people who knew what they were doing an out.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:37
|
|
|
Rakthar posted:Why are all your agents blind, retarded, and crippled? See above. I like how some of the traits are reasonable under the circumstances, like the "stupid" characters get a charge bonus and blind people have higher attack because, presumably, they're flailing wildly. But ain't nothing gonna top the king of all traits: BLOOD FEUD
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:42
|
|
|
1st_Panzer_Div. posted:Chomp can be an rear end, but you almost got it with leadership, except harder isn't leadership penalties, easy gives you so much bonus that it can unbalance things. Looking back at the replay I also had a bonus leadership banner on them, so that probably helped. Even on easy they can rout rather quick. Yeah, I'm just getting my barrings in each campaign on easy so I could gently caress around with bad units and specifically make an all goblin army, while figuring out optimal build orders. I might try the gobbo army again on normal just to see how well a full vanguard army does against dorfs, or probably humans because the only goblin armor piercing is artillery and arachnorok.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:42
|
|
|
So how's the multiplayer for this game? Are the modes fun, and is it easy to get a game? Also, if I'm about o get this game, what mods should I look into? Getting rid of RO and increasing AI complexity sound pretty good.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 02:01
|
|
|
literally this big posted:So how's the multiplayer for this game? Are the modes fun, and is it easy to get a game? "Modes" don't exist. Multiplayer is 100% just a custom battle but with two humans (or whatever). So, lazy. But of good quality in the sense that the game is good.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 02:05
|
|
|
literally this big posted:So how's the multiplayer for this game? Are the modes fun, and is it easy to get a game? Try it with RO, it's how it's meant to be played and stops the map becoming a complete mess of nonsense. Removing RO makes the game really easy.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 02:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 08:20 |
|
|
Well that went badly. Started an Empire campaign on Hard. As soon as I'd finished with the Secessionists Karl ran off to conquer Marienburg for the income. While he did that orcs razed my starting province.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 02:20
|
|