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you can't make simple fixes to mighty number 9 that will immediately make it a good game, because even if you get beyond the technical issues, no, a lot of people are not enjoying how the game is designed
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Jul 1, 2016 15:59
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The Colonel posted:you can't make simple fixes to mighty number 9 that will immediately make it a good game, because even if you get beyond the technical issues, no, a lot of people are not enjoying how the game is designed Eh. MN9 is flawed but at least some of the complaints are piling on due to dissatisfaction with the way the game was handled rather than actual displeasure with the game. I think with a little work you'd get something unbiased people would at least enjoy, nothing is going to satisfy the people whose major upset is with how the game was released rather than the final product.
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Jul 1, 2016 16:02
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The Colonel posted:you can't make simple fixes to mighty number 9 that will immediately make it a good game, because even if you get beyond the technical issues, no, a lot of people are not enjoying how the game is designed Every review and opinion I've read that's not by a died-in-the-wool Mega Man fan or heavily invested in the campaign says they enjoy the general gameplay and boss encounters. The criticisms come from the drab graphics, technical issues, and poor writing which could all be fixed with a CD Projekt style mega-patch if they cared enough. The game is getting mediocre reviews, 5s and 6s. That almost always speaks to a game that's "solid" but technical issues drag it down. Some games have made their big turnaround a few patches later like The Witcher or that Marvel action RPG but I doubt Comcept/Inti Creates cares enough to continue support for this.
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Jul 1, 2016 16:19
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TheKingofSprings posted:*Mostly made up of other people's money How so?
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Jul 1, 2016 16:26
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al-azad posted:Every review and opinion I've read that's not by a died-in-the-wool Mega Man fan or heavily invested in the campaign says they enjoy the general gameplay and boss encounters. The criticisms come from the drab graphics, technical issues, and poor writing which could all be fixed with a CD Projekt style mega-patch if they cared enough. Yup, I totally agree. It's not a perfect game, but I think if the technical issues were fixed up, it could be one of those divisive games where some people absolutely love it and some people hate it. Like a Mega Man 4 - 8, 10.
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Jul 1, 2016 16:52
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TheKingofSprings posted:*Mostly made up of other people's money I guess I really don't see a difference between buying or pre-ordering a game you don't like and kickstarting one. No one got ripped off here. I know it's a lot more entertaining to paint a narrative where Inafune was always a talentless con man and this is some kind of disaster of a game that reveals his true form, but it's just a kinda ok game made by a group of people who have good and bad games on their resume.
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Jul 1, 2016 16:57
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Lurdiak posted:I guess I really don't see a difference between buying or pre-ordering a game you don't like and kickstarting one. No one got ripped off here. Kickstarter asks other people to shoulder at least some of the financial risk for development sight-unseen. It's the entire point of it to allow things to get created that would be too expensive or risky to be created otherwise. However that isn't a promise of quality, but it's not exactly the same as preordering,.
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Jul 1, 2016 17:14
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ImpAtom posted:Kickstarter asks other people to shoulder at least some of the financial risk for development sight-unseen. It's the entire point of it to allow things to get created that would be too expensive or risky to be created otherwise. However that isn't a promise of quality, but it's not exactly the same as preordering,. No, sure, I get it, it's not the exact same, and pledging 800 dollars on a game that turns out to suck years later is pretty different from me pre-ordering Skyward Sword a month before it comes out and finding out it's the worst Zelda since the CD-I, but I mean there's no moral dimension where it differs. Unless the budget was obviously mis-allocated or the final product was missing key features that were promised, no one cheated the system or ripped anyone off. A product was funded and came out, and the place the money came from doesn't really make it any more or less unacceptable for the game to not live up to expectations.
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Jul 1, 2016 17:20
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Lurdiak posted:I guess I really don't see a difference between buying or pre-ordering a game you don't like and kickstarting one. No one got ripped off here. The big problem with the fantasy of Inafune as a conman is that there is no way he could have come out financially ahead on MN9. MN9 would have taken all of that 4 million dollars to produce, likely quite a bit more. This isn't a situation where the budget was misappropriated. Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 17:44
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They kept nearly every promise for Mighty No 9, even if most of them are not quite that great. That by itself is impressive, even if they needed way more money to make it all good.
Diabetes Forecast fucked around with this message at 17:57 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 17:54
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Colon Semicolon posted:They kept nearly every promise for Mighty No 9, even if most of them are not quite that great. That by itself is impressive, even if they needed way more money to make it all good. One of the bigger successes in Kickstarter history seen as a massive failure across the internet.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:00
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I think this review/Let's Play sums Mighty No 9 up in the first couple minutes: "One of those Kickstarter style games where you give them money and you get a bunch of bullshit in return".
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Jul 1, 2016 18:00
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I *assume* they kept their multiplayer promise, I can't confirm because I still can't find anyone to play it with!
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Jul 1, 2016 18:02
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Schwarzwald posted:The big problem with the fantasy of Inafune as a conman is that there is no way he could have come out financially ahead on MN9. The idea of Inafune being a Japanese version of Chris Roberts is definitely more entertaining to some people than the game we ultimately received. I'm disappointed with Mighty No. 9, but I'm pretty sure Mega Man was still a fun series overall and that Inafune still contributed to it being what it is. It's a shame MN9 doesn't live up to that legacy, but I can still play the games on a mess of platforms I currently own and they have not magically all turned to poo poo. If there's anything MN has been effective at for me, it's been making me really appreciate the old Mega Man titles I've always enjoyed.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:07
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ImpAtom posted:I *assume* they kept their multiplayer promise, I can't confirm because I still can't find anyone to play it with! This guy wants to play with me: 
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Jul 1, 2016 18:07
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ImpAtom posted:I *assume* they kept their multiplayer promise, I can't confirm because I still can't find anyone to play it with! For me, this is the aspect that's most frustrating. It seems like some of their stretch goals were made to exist without any thought as to how/if it would enhance the game. It just seems like they could've had a lot more resources to throw at the main game itself if they had never promised multiplayer and just made it PS4/PC/Wii U/Xbone. Obviously it's easier to say now that they never should've targeted handhelds or the previous gen consoles but still, Mighty No. 9 feels like a good idea that either didn't have enough of a budget or didn't do a great job of allocating and efficiently using the budget it had.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:07
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Pyroxene Stigma posted:One of the bigger successes in Kickstarter history seen as a massive failure across the internet. I dont know if "delayed a year and still hasnt come out on any handheld platform it was promised for" is a great success, but at least it came out. Is there even any word on the physical backer goods?
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Jul 1, 2016 18:13
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ah, mega man zx combining my two favorite things, rising and lowering water levels and instant death spikes
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Jul 1, 2016 18:22
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A slew of Mega Man looking games have popped up in my Steam queue like Noitu Love and Momadora(??) that look neat and I can only assume are better games.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:23
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al-azad posted:A slew of Mega Man looking games have popped up in my Steam queue like Noitu Love and Momadora(??) that look neat and I can only assume are better games. I don't know I'd call either game like Mega Man (beyond being 2d platformers) but they're both fun games.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:28
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Oh yeah, what is the multiplayer element, anyway?
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Jul 1, 2016 18:30
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To fix Mighty No 9 you'd also need to fix the bad level design and boring and the weird gameplay choices that don't really make sense and make the pacing really awkward. Air-dashing being infinite is silly, it removes any need for precise ground movement Bosses need to stop regenerating their health if you don't dash into them immediately and also need to stop flying out of attack range and becoming invincible on top of that Dashing into enemies doesn't add anything to the game but a score system. Shade's level is garbage The downward dash is impossible to cancel, and is really easy to press by accident causing Beck to drop 100 ft into spikes in slow motion. The problems with presentation are actually a big deal. The game tends to rely on spectacle a lot but the presentation sucks the energy out of that. Jumping across cars speeding along a highway should not seem so boring. Cryo is terrible and I hate her. Instant death being the only source of difficulty most of the time isn't very fun. Neither are the spikes being placed in bizarre places just waiting to kill you for no particular reason.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:34
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Full Battle Rattle posted:Oh yeah, what is the multiplayer element, anyway? Running through challenge rooms and levels with one player as beck and the other as call. Call ends up being like tails in sonic 2 because she still cant dash or fire several shots at once,and her dying or being scrolled offscreen by beck dash spamming has no consequences, only whether beck dies or not matters. Theres also a race mode but i havent had luck finding anyone to try it with.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:38
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Inspector Gesicht posted:I hate Cave Story + as I can never finish it, not even on Easy mode, because there is a massive hike in difficulty as you go along. That and the sheer idiocy in how you're supposed to figure out finding the alternate endings or mutually-exclusive weapons without a guide. Another round of Shovel Knight, please. What, Shovel Knight was way more difficult for me than Cave Story sans the True Ending. Hardest part for Cave Story is....Monster X? But even he's not too bad and he's super fun to boot. Unless there is some super easy mode to Shovel Knight which I forgot about.
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Jul 1, 2016 18:59
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Pyroxene Stigma posted:One of the bigger successes in Kickstarter history seen as a massive failure across the internet. If you want a real failure look how much the Coolest cooler raised (I think it's still top three of all time) and what a poo poo show that has been for backers. I wanna say they were charging an extra 100 bux or so if you wanted it before 2017 or something like that. Oh yeah and then there's the Ouya as well which I think we all know plenty about. Tracula fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Jul 1, 2016 |
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Jul 1, 2016 19:11
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I'm dumb and double post.
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Jul 1, 2016 19:12
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Ventana posted:What, Shovel Knight was way more difficult for me than Cave Story sans the True Ending. Hardest part for Cave Story is....Monster X? But even he's not too bad and he's super fun to boot. Unless there is some super easy mode to Shovel Knight which I forgot about. i think shovel knight is harder but it does have more forgiving checkpointing
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Jul 1, 2016 20:57
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Looper posted:i think shovel knight is harder but it does have more forgiving checkpointing Shovel Knight objectively has the best checkpoint system. (For those who haven't played, you can destroy checkpoints for more loot but obviously if you die you go back to the last un-destroyed one. It's a pretty simple but amazingly effective risk/reward scenario).
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Jul 1, 2016 20:58
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Cave Story depowers you when you get hit which was always a weird punishment to me. When I'm in a tough section the last thing I need is to be brought down to my weakest level which just leads to more hits. It's why all the Gradius inspired SHMUPs are lost on me, why the gently caress do I come back with nothing after dying while enemies that take 100 hits against my pea shooter are spawning???
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Jul 1, 2016 23:12
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al-azad posted:Cave Story depowers you when you get hit which was always a weird punishment to me. When I'm in a tough section the last thing I need is to be brought down to my weakest level which just leads to more hits. It's why all the Gradius inspired SHMUPs are lost on me, why the gently caress do I come back with nothing after dying while enemies that take 100 hits against my pea shooter are spawning??? It's the powerups-as-rewards rather than powerups-as-crutch method of design. You're supposed to gain additional power for playing well which in turn lets you snowball your good play. (See also: Mario.) It makes sense in score attack games where the goal is to do as well as possible rather than just win.
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Jul 1, 2016 23:17
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plus, if you could just hold on to your power-ups in cave story, you could kind of tank everything
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Jul 1, 2016 23:18
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Also there's a (semi-secret?) weapon that starts out almighty and upgrades into progressively more of a piece of poo poo.
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Jul 1, 2016 23:31
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the nemesis is, like, the most useful weapon in the game next to the spur for getting the true ending, it rules
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Jul 1, 2016 23:33
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ImpAtom posted:It's the powerups-as-rewards rather than powerups-as-crutch method of design. You're supposed to gain additional power for playing well which in turn lets you snowball your good play. (See also: Mario.) It makes sense in score attack games where the goal is to do as well as possible rather than just win. I wouldn't lump Mario into it because that game is more about avoiding obstacles than fighting enemies. I'm talking about combat heavy games where you're expected to be at a certain power level to do well but failure reduces it. And of course the only way to get more power is by defeating the enemies you're ill equipped to fight. So yeah, Cave Story is a harder game than Shovel Knight as far as I'm concerned because you can hit a low point where your only option is to back into a corner and plink away.
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Jul 2, 2016 00:09
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Schwarzwald posted:The big problem with the fantasy of Inafune as a conman is that there is no way he could have come out financially ahead on MN9. My favourite accusation is "Inafune was skimming money from Mighty no.9 to pay for the Red Ash campaigh!" which is just... like, did you even look at the Red Ash campaign? Does that look like something that had any time or money spent on it at all?
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Jul 2, 2016 00:57
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al-azad posted:
Sword is better when it's lower level'd though, and the levels won't matter for the Spur, and any other weapon aside from missiles isn't going to be (or shouldn't be) super heavily used enough to where you'll be crippled if you get hit and they level down. You'll die first in Cave Story before you find your weapons leveling down really holds you back.
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Jul 2, 2016 01:03
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al-azad posted:I wouldn't lump Mario into it because that game is more about avoiding obstacles than fighting enemies. If you charge into an area with all of your weapons fully levelled and get hit enough to lower all of them to level one, you're probably dead anyway. And if you're trying to level stuff up, the blade and nemesis are both strong enough for tough enemies
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Jul 2, 2016 01:19
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The endgame of Cave Story is orders of magnitude harder than anything in Shovel Knight, especially if you're on the path to the true/good ending. Love both games to bits though 
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Jul 2, 2016 02:59
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I thought Shovel Knight was pretty easy but then on replays it was suddenly hard so I think I might just literally be a crazy person or something.
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Jul 2, 2016 03:07
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i gave mega man x7 a try out of morbid curiosity coming just off of the zero/zx games, there's something unbelievably hilarious about the first five minutes of zero's gameplay. also everything else about the game, mega man x7 is very funny
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Jul 2, 2016 03:35
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