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FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

Mr Dog posted:

Actually I already use gnome-software to install things and it is really good. Far better than opening a command line and running package manager search results through a pager. Installing software on a desktop system shouldn't be done using caveman tools even if that's how it has always been done up until now.

Unlike the command line it also uses a special systemd target in order to reboot for system software updates.

I have the terminal bound to ctrl + alt + t.

It takes me very little effort to type "sudo dnf install $package" or "dnf search packages |grep 'some description'"

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Truga
May 4, 2014
Lipstick Apathy

ratbert90 posted:

I have the terminal bound to ctrl + alt + t.

:same:

Tankakern
Jul 25, 2007

ahmeni posted:

my old linux laptop that i was using for a tv box has died so i took its ssd and put it in a nice new intel nuc
its very nice except for some hosed up steam+bluetooth bugs but maybe its time to get a steam controller

i cannot for the life of me figure out what the heck is the deal with current intel drivers though, am i supposed to be using xorg-x11-drv-intel or am i supposed to be letting the builtin modesetting kernel driver handle things

post the lspci

DONT THREAD ON ME
Oct 1, 2002

by Nyc_Tattoo
Floss Finder

ratbert90 posted:

I have the terminal bound to ctrl + alt + t.

It takes me very little effort to type "sudo dnf install $package" or "dnf search packages |grep 'some description'"

barf. mine is alt+enter

also the terminal is always maximized so opening it? it's no problem for me.

Captain Foo
May 11, 2004

we vibin'
we slidin'
we breathin'
we dyin'

gnome-software is slow and bad

carry on then
Jul 10, 2010

by VideoGames

(and can't post for 10 years!)

Captain Foo posted:

gnome-software is slow and bad

i like when it finds updates after i already installed them with dnf

Celexi
Nov 25, 2006

Slava Ukraini!
i like it when it fails to install a package and then i install it in dnf and it installs fine

Cybernetic Vermin
Apr 18, 2005

good thing the best minds are hard at work solving the famously most serious problem with linux on the desktop: the difficulty of installing and updating software

Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost
sounds like you have a bad packagekit backend OP

because it works fine on arch

Cybernetic Vermin posted:

good thing the best minds are hard at work solving the famously most serious problem with linux on the desktop: the difficulty of installing and updating software

it may shock you to learn that the gnome development community consists of more than one person and consequently they can work on more than one thing at a time

better tell richard hughes to stop working on a useful and expected system component that is present in all modern interactive operating systems, wouldn't want to look like a tryhard.

Notorious b.s.d.
Jan 25, 2003

by Reene

Mr Dog posted:

it may shock you to learn that the gnome development community consists of more than one person and consequently they can work on more than one thing at a time

it would indeed shock me if gnome demonstrated the ability to walk and chew gum at the same time

Notorious b.s.d.
Jan 25, 2003

by Reene
meanwhile, on the gtk blog

https://blog.gtk.org/2016/09/01/versioning-and-long-term-stability-promise-in-gtk/

there are so many fuckin gems in here, i don't know where to start

stable, moving targets

quote:

From a GNOME perspective, GTK+ has been a reasonably stable, albeit moving target, because GNOME developers and GTK+ developers can share feedback and proposals and quickly keep up with internal changes. From the perspective of the community, on the other hand, following GTK+ development has been more painful.

"abi stable"
(readers of this thread know "abi stable" means "abandoned, but please ship our ancient sonames forever")

quote:

Updates within long-term stable series will be ABI stable. Alongside these stable series, GTK+ development will continue in semi-stable development series. These development releases will contain some API changes between minor versions.

semantic versioning that flows backwards, uphill

quote:

The new GTK+ versioning scheme is a modification of the “semantic versioning” scheme that we have followed until now.
[...]
For instance, after the 3.22.0 release and at the start of the new development cycle, the pkg-config file will be called gtk+-4.0 and the version in the configure.ac file will be set to 3.90.

Jerry Bindle
May 16, 2003

quote:

GTK+ has three primary stakeholders: application developers who want feature and API stable releases; desktop developers who want access to development versions of GTK+ in order to introduce new functionality at a rapid pace (this includes most of the GNOME project); and the GTK+ team itself, which needs the ability to iterate on the internals of the library during longer development cycles.

lol GTK+ users aren't stakeholders...?

Truga
May 4, 2014
Lipstick Apathy
lusers are dumb if you didn't even write the code yourself you better shut up

hobbesmaster
Jan 28, 2008

Mr Dog posted:



it may shock you to learn that the gnome development community consists of more than one person and consequently they can work on more than one thing at a time

but unironically

why does gtk continue to exist when qt is around and orders of magnitude better?

Notorious b.s.d.
Jan 25, 2003

by Reene

hobbesmaster posted:

but unironically

why does gtk continue to exist when qt is around and orders of magnitude better?

gnome.

all the non-gnome users of gtk kinda silently melted away during the 3.x fiasco

(literally the only gtk application i can name is firefox. and they didn't migrate to gtk 3 until this year. 2016. five years after the release of gtk 3)

Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost
i dunno, why does kde continue to suck rear end and have no thought put into its ui design

say what you will about gnome, but they think about their ui design and apply their ideas consistently

now, some of them may be bad ideas

but they're at least consistent about them. consistency means predictability, which is good

(besides, i like the aesthetics and functionality of gnome 3)

Notorious b.s.d.
Jan 25, 2003

by Reene
parsimony is a virtue but it is not the only virtue

i can say gnome 3 is consistently hot garbage

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

Notorious b.s.d. posted:

parsimony is a virtue but it is not the only virtue

i can say gnome 3 is consistently hot garbage

I use gnome 3 and like it, but I try to not think about the dumpster fire garbage that is GTK3.

It's like banging a good looking escort and trying not to think of the crabs she might have.

hobbesmaster
Jan 28, 2008

Mr Dog posted:

i dunno, why does kde continue to suck rear end and have no thought put into its ui design

say what you will about gnome, but they think about their ui design and apply their ideas consistently

now, some of them may be bad ideas

but they're at least consistent about them. consistency means predictability, which is good

(besides, i like the aesthetics and functionality of gnome 3)

kde is completely separate from qt though. kde is a disaster for the same reason that gtk is a disaster and qt isn't - there's a company putting actual thought behind its development and doing all the boring work behind making stuff actually work

Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost
Don't get me wrong though, RH and Canonical profoundly hosed the entire GNOME ecosystem around the time when GNOME 3 came out. In 2010 or so Linux was a niche but actually somewhat credible desktop OS. In 2016 every former Linux user who isn't completely batshit crazy has long since abandoned this mess for OSX.

Even from a purely technical as opposed to political perspective I don't think it was possible for them to have managed the GNOME 2 to GNOME 3 and Gtk 2 to Gtk 3 transition any worse than they did, that's kind of perversely impressive somehow.

Half a decade later GNOME 3 is actually a good desktop environment. With no users.

It doesn't help that the KDE project also succumbed to this collective insanity at around the same time with KDE 4. Had that not happened GNOME would have been completely wiped out.

Breakfast All Day
Oct 21, 2004

Truga posted:

lusers are dumb if you didn't even write the code yourself you better shut up

"lol if u cant figure it out either shutup or fix it" *fixes it by writing systemd* "RHEEEEEEEE"

vocal linux users are terrified of a working, sensible otob desktop experience because without spending 16 hours a day janitoring their system theyll be faced with the reality that they have nothing productive to do

Condiv
May 7, 2008

Sorry to undo the effort of paying a domestic abuser $10 to own this poster, but I am going to lose my dang mind if I keep seeing multiple posters who appear to be Baloogan.

With love,
a mod


Mr Dog posted:

Don't get me wrong though, RH and Canonical profoundly hosed the entire GNOME ecosystem around the time when GNOME 3 came out. In 2010 or so Linux was a niche but actually somewhat credible desktop OS. In 2016 every former Linux user who isn't completely batshit crazy has long since abandoned this mess for OSX.

Even from a purely technical as opposed to political perspective I don't think it was possible for them to have managed the GNOME 2 to GNOME 3 and Gtk 2 to Gtk 3 transition any worse than they did, that's kind of perversely impressive somehow.

Half a decade later GNOME 3 is actually a good desktop environment. With no users.

It doesn't help that the KDE project also succumbed to this collective insanity at around the same time with KDE 4. Had that not happened GNOME would have been completely wiped out.

kde did it a few years later iirc, which is what makes gnome 3 even more egregious. they had plenty of time and a rival desktop to see why this was a bad idea and not do it, but they did it anyway.

edit: double checked, kde 4 was released in jan 2008, and gnome 3 was released apr 2011. they had 3 loving years to see how kde 4 was turning out, and decided "hey, lets do it too!"

Condiv fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Sep 3, 2016

Notorious b.s.d.
Jan 25, 2003

by Reene
unlike gnome 3, kde 4 did eventually stabilize and reach feature parity with prior versions

and kde 5 is not another wrenching transition. they learned their lesson on that one. the desktop and shell are now developed independently of the core frameworks

atomicthumbs
Dec 26, 2010


We're in the business of extending man's senses.

Tankakern posted:

post the lspci

Lunx onj the desktop

ahmeni
May 1, 2005

It's one continuous form where hardware and software function in perfect unison, creating a new generation of iPhone that's better by any measure.
Grimey Drawer

Tankakern posted:

post the lspci

I switched to the modesetting driver and it is very loving good now. played some of elite dangerous: space parking simulator at over steam steaming 1080p with my ds4 connected by a comically long usb extension cable

ahmeni
May 1, 2005

It's one continuous form where hardware and software function in perfect unison, creating a new generation of iPhone that's better by any measure.
Grimey Drawer
oh here have an lspci i guess

pre:
[root@steambox ~]# lspci
00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series SoC Transaction Register (rev 21)
00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 21)
00:13.0 SATA controller: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series SATA Controller (rev 21)
00:14.0 USB controller: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series USB xHCI Controller (rev 21)
00:1a.0 Encryption controller: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series Trusted Execution Engine (rev 21)
00:1b.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series High Definition Audio Controller (rev 21)
00:1c.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series PCI Express Port #1 (rev 21)
00:1c.1 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series PCI Express Port #2 (rev 21)
00:1c.2 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series PCI Express Port #3 (rev 21)
00:1f.0 ISA bridge: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series PCU (rev 21)
00:1f.3 SMBus: Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx SMBus Controller (rev 21)
02:00.0 Network controller: Intel Corporation Wireless 3165 (rev 81)
03:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller (rev 15)

The XKCD Larper
Mar 1, 2009

by Lowtax
Gnome Software does not work on my computer

Apocadall
Mar 25, 2010

Aren't you the guitarist for the feed dogs?

The XKCD Larper posted:

Gnome Software does not work on my computer

tired and thought that said "game software" and was going to say well no poo poo, color me surprised

Tankakern
Jul 25, 2007

ahmeni posted:

I switched to the modesetting driver and it is very loving good now. played some of elite dangerous: space parking simulator at over steam steaming 1080p with my ds4 connected by a comically long usb extension cable

yeah you did the right thing. the only thing i'm aware that might be an issue with using modesetting is power consumption, and if you're using it on a nuc then screw that

The XKCD Larper
Mar 1, 2009

by Lowtax

Apocadall posted:

tired and thought that said "game software" and was going to say well no poo poo, color me surprised

No in fact what I typed was "Gnome Software".

The XKCD Larper
Mar 1, 2009

by Lowtax
I get an error box with this in it whenever I attempt to install programs from Gnome Software:

code:
Detailed errors from the package manager follow:

Failed to obtain authentication.
I'm using i3 and an otherwise stock Fedora 24 Desktop install.

Soricidus
Oct 21, 2010
freedom-hating statist shill
if the good lord had meant man to install software from a gui he wouldn't have given us rpm yum dnf

Olivil
Jul 15, 2010

Wow I'd like to be as smart as a computer
can we all agree zsh is the best sh

VikingofRock
Aug 24, 2008




Olivil posted:

can we all agree zsh is the best sh

Seconded

Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost
gently caress no

i hate dealing with that poo poo whenever i boot an arch liveusb to fix things

Captain Foo
May 11, 2004

we vibin'
we slidin'
we breathin'
we dyin'

Mr Dog posted:

gently caress no

i hate dealing with that poo poo whenever i boot an arch liveusb to fix things

The best sh is powersh

eschaton
Mar 7, 2007

Don't you just hate when you wind up in a store with people who are in a socioeconomic class that is pretty obviously about two levels lower than your own?
the best shell is the Command Processor in Symbolics Genera which doubles as a Lisp REPL

Macintosh Programmer's Workshop comes in second

mike12345
Jul 14, 2008

"Whether the Earth was created in 7 days, or 7 actual eras, I'm not sure we'll ever be able to answer that. It's one of the great mysteries."





elementary mac os linux just released its latest stable. I know elementary has a big fan base in yospos, so I thought I'd mention it.

Loving Africa Chaps
Dec 3, 2007


We had not left it yet, but when I would wake in the night, I would lie, listening, homesick for it already.

Olivil posted:

can we all agree zsh is the best sh

Someone itf had a really nice zsh skin plz advise

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Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost
the more ppl customize they linux the less interesting poo poo they do with it

bash is fine you loving ricers

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