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SirPhoebos posted:On the second point, while Vecna wasn't talked all that much about in the Planescape line, Sigil features prominently in the final adventure of 2nd Edition, Die, Vecna, Die!, where Vecna manages to get into Sigil as a God.. If you know anything about Planescape, it should be obvious why that's loving impressive. And what, lasts 5 minutes before the Lady of Pain flays his soul-essence for a subjective eternity? There's a reason none of the gods try and get into Sigil.
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Sep 23, 2016 04:40
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While we're on the subject, how does the Lady feel about the children of gods? I have an idea for a mod for Throne of Bhaal...
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Sep 23, 2016 04:48
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It's eyerolling how it flatout assume all the critters will love and want to hang out with beasts - and surprised no one commented the "I have a totally hot vampire girlfriend" text.
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Sep 23, 2016 04:49
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wiegieman posted:And what, lasts 5 minutes before the Lady of Pain flays his soul-essence for a subjective eternity? There's a reason none of the gods try and get into Sigil. I thought they were all trying to plot ways, just, uh, no-one wants to actually take the risk and step into that (literal) blender?
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Sep 23, 2016 04:52
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wiegieman posted:And what, lasts 5 minutes before the Lady of Pain flays his soul-essence for a subjective eternity? There's a reason none of the gods try and get into Sigil. Nope. it's revealed that Vecna has been empowered by/manipulated by a pre-Power being called the Serpent which is the same kind of thing the Lady is, and acts as a counterweight to keep her from interfering.
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Sep 23, 2016 04:56
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:the same kind of thing the Lady is. What does that mean?
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Sep 23, 2016 04:57
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Night10194 posted:I thought they were all trying to plot ways, just, uh, no-one wants to actually take the risk and step into that (literal) blender? Pretty much my takeaway is everyone with some cosmic power from gods to abyssal lords want Sigil, but Her Serenity is just too god drat powerful to gently caress with.
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Sep 23, 2016 04:59
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Kavak posted:What does that mean? gently caress you our special snowflake gets to violate a major rule of the setting because. The Lady is meant to be one of those things that doesn't have an answer or explanation - she just is, and anyone who goes looking for that answer regrets it. And keeping gods out of Sigil means they have to act through emissaries and agents, which facilitates gameplay for PCs.
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Sep 23, 2016 05:09
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What if, Beast is actually good, and I'm just being blinded by my own close-minded bigotry? What if...
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Sep 23, 2016 05:09
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Kavak posted:Why the Outlands? Shouldn't it go to its polar opposite plane, Limbo? Or do they mean take it super close to the spire so it stops working? Shouldn't that be a possibility for any artifact? It's not just the Rod, you bring it and Miska together to cancel each other out. Concordant Opposition, being the ultimate plane of True Neutrality, is probably the only place in the multiverse where they'll perfectly annihilate each other.
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Sep 23, 2016 05:11
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Cythereal posted:gently caress you our special snowflake gets to violate a major rule of the setting because. So they answered that I take it. Or are you supposed to come up with your own answer and apply it to the scenario for your group? Bieeardo posted:It's not just the Rod, you bring it and Miska together to cancel each other out. Concordant Opposition, being the ultimate plane of True Neutrality, is probably the only place in the multiverse where they'll perfectly annihilate each other. Pure Law meets Pure Chaos in Pure Neutrality... Whatever happens is probably going to visible from Sigil (Depending on whether its the ring or donut version)
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Sep 23, 2016 05:16
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Cythereal posted:gently caress you our special snowflake gets to violate a major rule of the setting because.
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Sep 23, 2016 05:17
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Robindaybird posted:Pretty much my takeaway is everyone with some cosmic power from gods to abyssal lords want Sigil, but Her Serenity is just too god drat powerful to gently caress with. For my '18th Century Not-Europe Gets Suddenly Connected To The D&D Cosmology' setting, one of the consistent weirdnesses for the Europeans is them and the Outsiders kinda talking past one another about what God is (the Outsiders basically don't believe the God of Abraham is a thing that can happen). Until a couple of them go to Sigil and learn about the Lady and come back and tell Outsiders 'Yeah it's like that rather than your Powers.' and they get it. Also, Sigil is always a mess no matter what. Sending a pack of Hessians and priests to go poke around Sigil and be baffled is Good Times. Night10194 fucked around with this message at 05:37 on Sep 23, 2016 |
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Sep 23, 2016 05:34
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MonsieurChoc posted:Sounds like that should have been the fiction anthology's theme: Beasts arrogantly meeting other supernaturals and learning painfully the error of their ways.
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Sep 23, 2016 05:46
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Seriously Sigil is like the best thing in D&D and 'I dunno, send these poor buggers to Sigil' is one of the best plotlines. A lot of it is that Sigil isn't really bound to the crazy faux-epic of D&D settings. Like, no-one in Sigil except some of the Clueless really gives a poo poo about Pelor and his generic holiness, or whatever ancient evil surfaced on some backwater Prime world last week. They're too busy having philosophy knife-fights.
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Sep 23, 2016 05:48
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:Nope. I had thought it wasn't so much the Lady actively kerning gods out so much as it was Sigil's position in the dead centre of the Wheel meant it was inherently impossible for a god to exist there?
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Sep 23, 2016 06:06
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She basically annihilated a god of portals that tried to take control with a thought, so I think it's all on her.
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Sep 23, 2016 06:14
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The Lone Badger posted:I had thought it wasn't so much the Lady actively kerning gods out so much as it was Sigil's position in the dead centre of the Wheel meant it was inherently impossible for a god to exist there? All sorts of magic goes on in the Cage that can't work outside of it. I like the "Mass destruction" explanation- a god has slipped the Lady's net and has entered Sigil, but killing him would cause a lot of collateral damage she doesn't want to deal with, so a subtler approach is needed. Robindaybird posted:She basically annihilated a god of portals that tried to take control with a thought, so I think it's all on her. Torment gave me the impression that Sigil was originally Aoskar's domain that she usurped, which I like better than someone trying to move on her. Makes her more mysterious and untouchable- she just rolled in one day millennia ago and killed the resident god, then banned worship of him and herself.. Plus it's a good explanation for why there are so many goddamn portals in Sigil.
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Sep 23, 2016 06:25
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SirPhoebos posted:Neat thing about Ujimitsu in the CCG. All of the Clan Champions had the Unique trait, meaning you could only have one in your deck, except for Shiba Ujumitsu. Rather than correct the obvious mistake, AEG said that it was Ujimitsu's special ability to be at multiple battles at once. 
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Sep 23, 2016 07:48
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I admit I never gave much of a poo poo about Planescape since it all felt too precious for me, but you're making it sound a lot like Fallen London, so that's pretty cool.
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Sep 23, 2016 10:11
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People tend to sell it in the most obnoxious "only squares care about dungeons or dragons when you could discourse with the very concept of stealth farts, nyeh!" way, but Planescape is generally pretty cool. If you're into fantasy literature, I guess Planescape was New Weird before there was any New Weird, maybe?
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Sep 23, 2016 10:27
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Godly magic is nullified by the Spire, so gods actually present in Sigil are at greatly reduced power. Whatever the Lady is, she isn't subject to that restriction, so on her home turf she's more powerful than any deity.
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Sep 23, 2016 13:17
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Nessus posted:I admit I never gave much of a poo poo about Planescape since it all felt too precious for me, but you're making it sound a lot like Fallen London, so that's pretty cool. Planescape is cool when it focuses more on being a bunch of gonzo aliens and things having crazy adventures in a hell city while occasionally traveling to other worlds and meeting tons of people from all over reality.
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Sep 23, 2016 13:19
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Never, ever read the Planescape tie-in novels.
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Sep 23, 2016 14:31
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Do play Planescape torment though. Some of the best writing in video games. E: I seriously can't recommend this game enough, so long as you have the patience to read all the dialogue. By popular demand fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Sep 23, 2016 |
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Sep 23, 2016 15:04
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Horrible Lurkbeast posted:Do play Planescape torment though. Some of the best writing in video games. This is basically where I got my image of Sigil from.
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Sep 23, 2016 15:08
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The only downside to torment is the Infinity Engine has aged quite poorly in terms of play-ability - mainly the atrocious path-finding that plagues all games in the engine, but thankfully the majority of combat is completely optional.
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Sep 23, 2016 15:15
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The combat in that game was uninspired but fortunately it was very easy to just hoard curatives and roll over anything that I couldn't avoid.
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Sep 23, 2016 15:21
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I was going to suggest finding that transcript someone made of Torment, but instead I'll recommend hacking at it with something like Cheat Engine. I've never been a fan of the Infinity Engine, and it just gets in the way for Torment, but the atmosphere and non-combat interactions in the game are top notch. Just remember to max your Wisdom and Intelligence to get all of the dialogue options, and everything else to trivialize the annoying combat. And level wizard. They end up getting access to spells that look like Final Fantasy summons.
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Sep 23, 2016 15:47
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It's worth it to play to the end at least once to make choices.
By popular demand fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Sep 23, 2016 |
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Sep 23, 2016 16:03
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Alternatively, just go read the Let's Play: http://lparchive.org/Planescape-Torment/ The most interesting thing about Planescape is that while D&D's weird cosmology is what makes it so wonderful, the rule system doesn't match the theme its going for. That's why I was really attracted to Spark and Sig. Jason Pitre advertises the system (that's Spark) as one that's about exploring ideas and challenging beliefs, and while the tone is a bit pretentious I think he at the very least made the system that it let's a group explore ideas and such without shoving it down their collective throats. I've always thought that a rules system that was actually about influencing belief would be more suited for running games in Planescape. Jason apparently had the same thought, and so he wrote Sig: The City Between. Also, the Ludography in Spark has a couple of interesting entries featuring a certain author we all love to bash. Puzzling out why said author gets credited would be part of the fun of writing the review.
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Sep 23, 2016 16:18
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To be fair, very few rule systems paid anything more than lip service to their settings until very recently. Most are just varying complexities of combat engines, with an afterthought of a skill list on the side.
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Sep 23, 2016 16:52
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Kavak posted:So they answered that I take it. Or are you supposed to come up with your own answer and apply it to the scenario for your group? At least to my understanding of the setting, you're not supposed to answer it because why would a Planescape campaign find that applicable? The Lady is a plot device to keep Sigil the way it is and lock out gods, demon princes, etc, and force them to be civilized with each other.
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Sep 23, 2016 17:35
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One of the recurring rumors in the Planescape books is that she is some number of squirrels in a robe. Planescape could be a bit twee at times.
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Sep 23, 2016 17:38
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A force so powerful the only thing in the multiverse that can defeat her is Squirrel Girl; checks out.
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Sep 23, 2016 17:40
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Mors Rattus posted:One of the recurring rumors in the Planescape books is that she is some number of squirrels in a robe. Excuse me, those are Ratatosks 
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Sep 23, 2016 20:18
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One of my favourite ads from the Sigil sourcebook was for a shop that specialized in food imported from the Prime. One line read "SQUIRREL. Meat that grows on trees!"
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Sep 23, 2016 20:28
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SirPhoebos posted:Alternatively, just go read the Let's Play: http://lparchive.org/Planescape-Torment/
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Sep 23, 2016 20:38
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Bieeardo posted:One of my favourite ads from the Sigil sourcebook was for a shop that specialized in food imported from the Prime. One line read "SQUIRREL. Meat that grows on trees!"
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Sep 23, 2016 20:39
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Siivola posted:That's from In the Cage: A Guide to Sigil. It's actually an ad for imported animals, for both food and pets, and includes miniature giant space hamsters. They're a bargain, too, at only a single gold piece per! Miniature giant space hamsters (and regular giant space hamsters and carnivorous giant space hamsters) are from Spelljammer, another book that deserves a good write-up here.
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Sep 23, 2016 22:27
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