|
I'd imagine Godzilla 2014 also helped to rekindle Western interest in the series.
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 03:28
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 24, 2024 02:38 |
|
|
Waffleman_ posted:I'd imagine Godzilla 2014 also helped to rekindle Western interest in the series.  Beautiful.  Even better, there's a popup Godzilla in the box. 
Raxivace fucked around with this message at 03:37 on Oct 19, 2016 |
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 03:35
|
|
|
Raxivace posted:I wonder if the Criterion release of the original 1954 film a few years before helped too. It certainly helped for me! And my interest in THAT was stoked by Pacific Rim, even though I'm hesitant to cite Pacific Rim as a general influence, given its disappointing domestic performance. Either way, between all that and the upcoming Kong/Godzilla stuff, I think the west is goin' through a bit of a kaiju phase.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 03:36
|
|
|
Just saw this, thought it was really solid. Crowd was decent for a Tuesday night. Interesting to see Anno use Godzilla to approach some of the same themes he was just recently going over in Rebuild about responsibility. Between Akasaka's (I think?) line at the beginning about the optimism and arrogance of Imperial Japan, the fact that Maki Goro was directly spurred by Fukushima, and the parallels between the stills of the Hiroshima Dome and frozen Godzilla at the end, I think you could make a decent case that the film wants the Japanese government to accept partial responsibility for the consequences of its aggression/the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. At the very least I think the nationalist/fascist reading isn't as simple as some viewers think.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 03:44
|
|
|
Waffleman_ posted:The best part was the very Japanese woman with a very Japanese accent playing the natural-born-American-we=swear-you-guys. I think my face was in a permanent cringe every time she appeared in anticipation of her inexplicably switching languages every other sentence. I think that's my main criticism of the movie, I rather liked how grounded everything felt as a contrast to this crazy rear end sea slug is romping around humping buildings, it almost felt like a dramatized documentary for about the first half and that was really compelling. Then more movie-like elements like Patterson's character and in-your-face themes and kooky plans come into play that took me out of that level of engagement. That's why I agree with the people saying the back lasers were silly, conceptually I'm fine with them but visually they didn't earn my belief like the atomic breath did, they were just static, nondescript lines of light emitting from nonspecific glowy areas on Godzilla's back, whereas the breath had a clear if fantastical biological mechanism to it. Despite that, there were scenes there that were worth the price of admission by themselves, for lack of a better phrase they were very visually moving.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 03:54
|
|
|
I was recently linked to an article that quotes Hideaki Anno (the director of Shin Godzilla) and I think it might be pertinent.The Atlantic posted:Anno understands the Japanese national attraction to characters like Rei [a character from Evangelion] as the product of a stunted imaginative landscape born of Japan’s defeat in the Second World War. “Japan lost the war to the Americans,” he explains, seeming interested in his own words for the first time during our interview. “Since that time, the education we received is not one that creates adults. Even for us, people in their 40s, and for the generation older than me, in their 50s and 60s, there’s no reasonable model of what an adult should be like.” The theory that Japan’s defeat stripped the country of its independence and led to the creation of a nation of permanent children, weaklings forced to live under the protection of the American Big Daddy, is widely shared by artists and intellectuals in Japan. It is also a staple of popular cartoons, many of which feature a well-meaning government that turns out to be a facade concealing sinister and more powerful forces. The post war period never ends. Full Article
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:05
|
|
|
Finally saw this tonight. I thought it was really good, and also way more frightening than I thought it would be. It gives you an idea of how Japanese audiences must have felt when the very first Godzilla movie came out. Definitely left an impression on me.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:13
|
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:I was recently linked to an article that quotes Hideaki Anno (the director of Shin Godzilla) and I think it might be pertinent. This is fascinating. I love reading about the weird cultural undercurrents of other countries that don't really have an analogue in the US. Japan's feelings about suicide are definitely right up there, not to mention the other odd things going on. That said, is Eva really a Star Wars level phenomenon over there? I watched the show when I was in junior high and still have some interest in it (watching End of Evangelion was a somewhat formative moment in my adolescence), but I didn't think it was on that level.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:21
|
|
|
Yeah, Evangelion's been huge ever since it came out.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:28
|
|
|
Yoshifan823 posted:This is fascinating. I love reading about the weird cultural undercurrents of other countries that don't really have an analogue in the US. Japan's feelings about suicide are definitely right up there, not to mention the other odd things going on. The Eva opening theme still places on "top ten most popular karaoke songs" charts.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:31
|
|
|
Yoshifan823 posted:That said, is Eva really a Star Wars level phenomenon over there? I watched the show when I was in junior high and still have some interest in it (watching End of Evangelion was a somewhat formative moment in my adolescence), but I didn't think it was on that level. I'm not quite comfortable saying it was a "Star Wars level phenomenon" simply because I'm not sure how you'd go about measuring that, but it was certainly tremendously successful and influential, and remains one of the most valuable anime marketing properties to this day.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:32
|
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:I'm not quite comfortable saying it was a "Star Wars level phenomenon" simply because I'm not sure how you'd go about measuring that, but it was certainly tremendously successful and influential, and remains one of the most valuable anime marketing properties to this day. Like there are people that utterly despise the episodes my avatar comes from, and are mad that the show didn't end with a typical happy ending that is standard to the genre, that characters succumbed to pressure, that things didn't play out as they expected etc. I suspect it's a lot of the same people that are mad that Shin Godzilla has too much talking.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:41
|
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:I was recently linked to an article that quotes Hideaki Anno (the director of Shin Godzilla) and I think it might be pertinent. drat, he not only points out Japan's elephant in the room that their obsession with youth in their stories politely dances around, but he firmly grabs the trunk and yanks on it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 04:41
|
|
|
I, Butthole posted:Just realised - weren't they tracking the residual radiation from Godzilla's path? Then he stands still for two weeks - wouldn't there have been a notable decline of the radiation that would lead to the discovery of the hald-life only being 20 days earlier? I'm pretty sure this is how they found out about the half life. The scientist at the end mentions that she just received data from "the survey", which I can only assume is a study of Godzilla's radiation trail. The data wasn't available until after Godzilla was defeated, which is awfully convenient, but whatever.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 05:38
|
|
|
Choco1980 posted:drat, he not only points out Japan's elephant in the room that their obsession with youth in their stories politely dances around, but he firmly grabs the trunk and yanks on it. I think there's an element of escapism that's left out of his analysis: that childhood (usually the high school years) was the time before one's involvement in the incredibly high-stress working environment of modern Japan. The fact that we're still talking about karōshi in 2016 is telling.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 05:39
|
|
|
So I just came back from my second viewing, alone as I predicted. I feel like I had all these thoughts to elaborate on while watching it but its hard to remember them all, so I'll just stick with what I remember most. Gonna spoiler it all cause I don't know what is or isnt a spoiler: In regards to as a satire on bureaucracy and such, I felt like it wasn't as strong as some seem to state it. The beginning, with ever changing meetings and committees and changing of rooms and calls for ministerial decorum, is a definitely hit-you-over-the-head satire of governmental bureaucracy. It's undermined kinda though by the repeated insistence from Yaguchi and other characters of their frustrations with it. Satires in general don't work well when the protagonist and other characters are constantly plainly pointing out the absurdity of whats going on. Yaguchi complains about inaction and having to have a committee to have a press conference and other things multiple times, and it takes away some of the punch of the very heavy satire. Either way, by beginning of the first planned attack on Goji, which is halted because of civilians, this has more or less melted away, and now whats being portrayed is more or less the typical and expected chain of command/actions for a functional high level democracy. Maybe its kinda silly that the military guy relays to the defense minister who relays to the prime minister, but even that goes away after the third time or so. My other big thing, which pervades the movie throughout but is most apparent here is, I don't pretend to understand the intricacies of Japanese government or society in general to know exactly what is being played for absurdity and what is just something I don't particularly understand because I cannot see an analogue for in in my own culture/country. All that said, the parts that ARE satire of government bureaucracy I did genuinely enjoy quite a bit. The first 40 minutes or so of this movie, up to and including the second overall assault on Goji and then his subsequent awesome destruction of half of tokyo via atomic breath and fire, is by far one of the best Godzilla movies ever made. Absolutely marvelous ratcheting up of tension, great human drama mixed with poignant satire and genuine disarray in the face of such a grave threat. Top notch special effects that left this rubber suit purist almost wholly satisfied. The second assault on goji, with the tanks and artillery, is THE best scene of military-vs-godzilla in any of the godzilla movies, not least of which because in the other movies its almost always way too long and way too boring. This one was punchy and action packed and absolutely great. Revisiting my earlier criticism, the music that plays during goji's hellfire IS a bit strange (and has the catchy name "SS_103_GZM (Famously)" in the soundtrack) as its a lone weeping string instrument with some piano in the background. It fits overall, as its very tragic sounding, but it does also not fit with the absolute mind-boggling destruction on screen. I liked it more this time though. Like many have said, the third act/post-hellfire part of the movie drags on just a bit too long which just a bit too much plot. Yaguchi has managed to become more and more important as events unfold, lending credence to his "flat hierarchy" style of operating. Various characters in the film notice/congratulate him on this and he obligingly responds each time by reiterating how is just his duty and what "needs to be done". I didn't dislike this per se but i could have been trimmed a bit. I think one of the big takeaways from my second viewing is that two things that definitely did not need so much elaboration/plot were 1.all the machinations and play by play of the international side of things. OBVIOUSLY the theme of Japans relation to the rest of the world and especially the US in regards to its sovereignty/self defense is a huge part of this story, but it didn't need to be quite so long winded and shown on screen. Every scene where an american pol/military talks on an airplane or staring out of a window could have been axed. And not just cause the actors were terrible, but because they added jack poo poo to the story. Ultimately, I don't even really know why Kayoco Patterson even needed to be in the movie, but if she did, she definitely did not need as much screen time/awful english time, as she did. All of that plot could have been just as impactful and significant in half the words/runtime as it was. and 2. Why did it even matter that they figured out Goro's crazy origami riddle? It didnt changed any of their plans, they were ALREADY making the coagulant. When they solved it, they thought for literally 3 seconds "oh no, does this mean it won't work??" and then they're like "no, it probably will" and that's it, back to making the coagulant, which they were already doing. Again, it was a good and interesting part of the movie, but it ended up taking too much time and dragging out the end of the movie. Coulda been made shorter. Like some have said, I was pretty underwhelmed by the final "fight" (if you can call it that) of the movie. A very cool idea and executed quite well, but it didn't feel very epic or like much of a fight at all. Loved bringing down buildings on him, very neat ("the city fights back for once" as one person here put it). But it was just too short and not quite dramatic enough for my taste. People who have said "how can anyone say theres not enough godzilla in this movie, havent they ever seen a godzilla movie lol", this final scene is why, I at least, think this. Every interaction with Goji up to this point has been short and sweet and full of tension, great. But we NEED a big finale. We need some more goji. I don't think we quite got it with this finale. Also, I said last time that the music during this part also felt out of place. I still felt that way during this part. I came back home and found it on the soundtrack and lo and behold, its the theme from Battle in Outer Space. A very bright marching tune that just did not fit with the dread that the movie had so expertly built up during the course of the film. It's not a deal breaker or anything, but definitely led to the overall lack of excitement I had for the ending. One last thing, I managed to actually enjoy the CG Godzilla in the movie for almost all of it, but there WERE a couple of moments during the end where he moves, especially during his back lasers and then after wards when he moves forward a bit and kinda just moves too fast, where the CGI was really bad. Like 2004 level poo poo. It was so strange cause they do such a good job the rest of the movie but drat those couple of fast jerky movements he does during the back lasers and afterwards were totally vibe-killing. Despite this crazy well of text I just wrote, I REALLY like this movie. It is truly a great Godzilla movie and a worthwhile entry in the franchise. It really brings alot of new and modern things to the genre/franchise that really elevate it. It's not perfect in anyway but awesome none the less. I tried desperately throughout the film to get a read on "is this facist, yo?" aspect of the film but the only honest read of this movie's politics is "I don't loving know, its all over the place". There's alot there but I don't know how coherent it is. Like I said, I think its hard to get a good read on the politics of a piece of art without having the deeply ingrained understanding of the socio-cultural-political norms of a country gained by being, you know, from that country.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 05:41
|
|
|
Gozinbulx posted:all the machinations and play by play of the international side of things. OBVIOUSLY the theme of Japans relation to the rest of the world and especially the US in regards to its sovereignty/self defense is a huge part of this story, but it didn't need to be quite so long winded and shown on screen. Every scene where an american pol/military talks on an airplane or staring out of a window could have been axed. And not just cause the actors were terrible, but because they added jack poo poo to the story. Ultimately, I don't even really know why Kayoco Patterson even needed to be in the movie, but if she did, she definitely did not need as much screen time/awful english time, as she did. All of that plot could have been just as impactful and significant in half the words/runtime as it was. I disagree quite heavily that Kayoco Patterson was unnecessary to the movie. The character provides a very necessary contrast to the timid Japanese bureaucrats. In regards to the actress Satomi Ishihara herself, her English may have been bad but her acting was fine. To be honest, I'm a little astonished every time someone says otherwise.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 05:56
|
|
|
I just came out from seeing it and I honestly think this is a good film. I went with a group of friends who were making various quips and jokes throughout it. My personal favorite was Operation: Listerine. We were also in complete hysterics when they dropped a good size of Tokyo on Goji. It was a good bit but it definitely destroyed whatever dread I had from him waking up and disintegrating pretty much everything thrown at him.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 05:57
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 06:02
|
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:I disagree quite heavily that Kayoco Patterson was unnecessary to the movie. The character provides a very necessary contrast to the timid Japanese bureaucrats. Isn't Yaguchi the contrast to the timid Japanese bureaucrats? Like I said, she can be in the movie, but I don't know why quite so much time is spent on her. Also I don't think shes a bad actress, but the english-language parts are pretty silly. Also, she's very pretty.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 06:18
|
|
|
The absolute worst effect shot in the movie was clearly the stage 2 to 3 transformation. He kinda went fuzzy and they animated his skin texture or something which just highlighted every drat polygon on him. I too seem to recall some dodgy mo-cap in the finale but nothing as blatant as that.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 06:19
|
|
|
The most jarring CGI to me was anything involving trains. Looked like an early ps2 cutscene once or twice. The first breath scene is so memorable though. When the smoke/gas started I assumed it would ignite into flames, which was amazing when it did. Seeing the flames roll throughout the city looked awesome and really felt like powerful destruction. When the flames focused into the beam with that high pitched noise and started lasering buildings in half though, was jaw dropping
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 06:55
|
|
|
I vote for when the final set of trains hit Godzilla and they sort of bounce up in the air wigging out like a video game physics glitch. At any rate I didn't mind too much, the scenes that mattered were fantastic. I think it also says a lot that in the first scene where the audience gets a good look at Godzilla the people in my theatre all laughed pretty loudly, but everyone took the subsequent scenes seriously as the creepiness of the design began setting in, even when he was moving even more ridiculously. Great design throughout, only part I found generic and dumb was when they showed the tail zombies. God I hope they don't feature in the next films, I can't imagine that not being awful.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 07:01
|
|
|
Xy Hapu posted:Great design throughout, only part I found generic and dumb was when they showed the tail zombies. God I hope they don't feature in the next films, I can't imagine that not being awful. A reference to the worst Godzilla movie in the best Godzilla movie? 
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 07:50
|
|
|
Thrilled to see the old boy get back to his roots as a fell beast of the Apocalypse.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 08:12
|
|
|
I, Butthole posted:A reference to the worst Godzilla movie in the best Godzilla movie? 
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 11:23
|
|
|
I, Butthole posted:A reference to the worst Godzilla movie in the best Godzilla movie? you're gonna have to explain how that's a reference to the 1998 godzilla
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 13:30
|
|
|
I assume it's just that the '98 movie has the horde of micro-zillas.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 14:26
|
|
|
I, Butthole posted:A reference to the worst Godzilla movie in the best Godzilla movie? The final shot's purpose has absolutely nothing to do with the '98 movie and everything to do with being earned by way of all the talk on how Godzilla is an evolving creature whose nature is to survive and promulgate. Can't say I thought it was dumb, actually thought it was pretty freaky to think that in its death throes of being frozen, it still tried to fight back by becoming the thing that defeated it--a collective. Also references Evangelion poo poo more than the old 98 movie, if anything---angels and EVE and all that poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 15:24
|
|
|
david_a posted:I assume it's just that the '98 movie has the horde of micro-zillas. oh right, i forgot they had godzilla be a... hmmm okay so the word probably isn't hermaphrodite but i don't know what else to call a self-reproducing animal
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 15:39
|
|
|
Nomadic Scholar posted:I went with a group of friends who were making various quips and jokes throughout it. Get new friends.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 15:45
|
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:I disagree quite heavily that Kayoco Patterson was unnecessary to the movie. The character provides a very necessary contrast to the timid Japanese bureaucrats. Her main role is serving as a symbol of cooperation (not dependence) between Japan and the rest of the world, which is what they need in order to beat Godzilla.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 15:46
|
|
|
mandatory lesbian posted:hmmm okay so the word probably isn't hermaphrodite but i don't know what else to call a self-reproducing animal It's hard to apply a label because we can't really tell what's going on there. The flaked off parts they found left behind which they thought might grow into a new creature would be an example of fragmentation, the new creatures growing from Goji's tail would be ... budding, perhaps? We don't really know what kind of reproduction it was without knowing whether those new creatures developed from unfertilized eggs (parthenogenesis) or from sperm (sperm-dependent parthenogenesis) or just grew like dividing cells. Note that I'm not in any way an expert
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 16:00
|
|
|
Snowglobe of Doom posted:It's hard to apply a label because we can't really tell what's going on there. The flaked off parts they found left behind which they thought might grow into a new creature would be an example of fragmentation, the new creatures growing from Goji's tail would be ... budding, perhaps? We don't really know what kind of reproduction it was without knowing whether those new creatures developed from unfertilized eggs (parthenogenesis) or from sperm (sperm-dependent parthenogenesis) or just grew like dividing cells. i meant the 98 zilla, tho i guess it applies to this one as well, different processes of reproduction aside (budding vs eggs)
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 16:03
|
|
|
mandatory lesbian posted:i meant the 98 zilla, tho i guess it applies to this one as well, different processes of reproduction aside (budding vs eggs) Ah, the '98 Zilla would have been asexual reproduction via parthenogenesis. There's actually dozens of species of unisex lizards and other reptiles which reproduce via obligate parthenogenesis but there's also sexual species that occasionally reproduce parthenogenetically under certain circumstances (such as komodo dragons!) so we still can't say whether Zilla was one or the other.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 16:15
|
|
|
Sorry for the dumb joke but yes I know that Anno was not referencing Emmerich's 98 Godzilla with the final shot Now let us never speak of 98 Zilla again.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 16:40
|
|
|
I haven't seen '98zilla since I was a kid and it seems that its better that way. I somehow doubt it can live up to my memories of the Taco Bell commercials.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 16:43
|
|
|
Raxivace posted:I haven't seen '98zilla since I was a kid and it seems that its better that way. I somehow doubt it can live up to my memories of the Taco Bell commercials. Here's the only good Zilla anything https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWJO7CZhW38
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 16:52
|
|
|
BattleTech posted:A cool thing: http://imgur.com/a/fPddB Goddamn this is really awesome. Man I want to see this movie again. Maybe with the extended release I'll be able to talk someone else into going with me. I'm really glad this is doing well.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 17:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 24, 2024 02:38 |
|
|
Happy Noodle Boy posted:Here's the only good Zilla anything I dunno, the New Years Eve spot they did with only like a minute to midnight where they had Zilla stop the ball dropping and fling it at the times square gatherers, was pretty great debut timing.
|
|
#
?
Oct 19, 2016 17:30
|
|