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How come this guy can't realize that the things he dislikes are just subjective? What?! He likes the Water Temple? Doesn't that idiot know that it's objectively terrible?
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Oct 18, 2016 00:23
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Earnestly posted:How come this guy can't realize that the things he dislikes are just subjective? What?! He likes the Water Temple? Doesn't that idiot know that it's objectively terrible? I said the first thing and not the second thing, though; nobody has said both things at once.
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Oct 18, 2016 00:24
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Bicyclops posted:I said the first thing and not the second thing, though; nobody has said both things at once. That was less of a jab at anyone, and more of an exaggerated conclusion.
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Oct 18, 2016 00:27
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They're nicely designed videos and an easy way to remember the different levels in games I haven't played in a while. Don't agree with his general preferences so much but there aren't any other flashy Zelda dungeon design videos I'm aware of.
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Oct 18, 2016 00:35
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Electromax posted:They're nicely designed videos and an easy way to remember the different levels in games I haven't played in a while. Don't agree with his general preferences so much but there aren't any other flashy Zelda dungeon design videos I'm aware of. I think this guy goes into the design of Zelda pretty well: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLdg60-UktzB7FOxFNrVBmNZN7jqhkQdIu
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Oct 18, 2016 00:39
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Eh, Mark said he liked Wind Waker, but found the dungeons to be one of the weaker aspects of the game. I don't disagree.
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Oct 18, 2016 00:43
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Also, upon watching it, he states that the puzzles themselves were designed better than past Zelda games. And backtracking was improved in case you died in the middle of the dungeon.
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Oct 18, 2016 02:31
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Go watch the Majora's Mask video. He talks about how the dungeons are all pretty linear, but they each have a unique and creative central idea behind their design that make them fun and rewarding to explore. If all you take away from his videos is nonlinear = good, linear = bad, you're not paying attention. I'm finishing up my first replay of WW in over 10 years right now, and the dungeons are definitely the least engaging part of the game. Especially disappointing is that their complexity doesn't really ramp up very much as you progress.
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Oct 18, 2016 05:46
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Wind Waker has always had the worst dungeons in a 3D Zelda game. I mean, usually, when you get a key, the only thing you can do with it is use it in the same room you got it. It may as well just be a switch. And there's only 5 proper dungeons anyway. And anyone who couldn't hack the Water Temple is a chump.
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Oct 18, 2016 07:12
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Mark Brown's video visualized why I don't enjoy replaying Wind Waker. Huh...
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Oct 18, 2016 07:58
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So I started my quest to play every Zelda game in order last week. I just finished Zelda I for NES last night. All I have to say is, no wonder I never got far as a kid. I don't know how anyone could possibly beat that game without a guide. It was fun though, and decently challenging. The last dungeon was pretty tough, even though Ganon was a chump. On to Zelda II, one of my favorite games ever!
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Oct 18, 2016 13:07
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I beat Zelda 1 without a guide when I was 4. The real problem for me is that I didn't know the main character wasn't named Zelda, so I named my file "Zelda". I went two years before I found out about the first quest 
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Oct 18, 2016 13:17
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Did you burn bushes for 3 weeks?
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Oct 18, 2016 13:23
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I mean I think his video on the water temple is wrong because he doesn't recognise the most obnoxious part of the temple. It isn't the floating block, although that's terrible. It's that the path to Dark Link has two key doors. The problem is that they're separated by two rooms even though that path is linear. You can easily go in, thinking you're progressing with a single key, solve two puzzle rooms only to get to the Dark Link door and realise you've missed a key. At which point you then have to backtrack through both the puzzle rooms and go and find the key, which is likely due to the floating block. That is needlessly frustrating for a player, given that they have no advance warning that they'll need a second key. What he doesn't recognise is that sometimes backtracking is just a massive annoyance instead of a cool and new experience.
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Oct 18, 2016 13:54
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His argument against linearity is basically: If your game is just going to be a series of sequential puzzle rooms that are basically only connected thematically, rather than by gameplay, then just make the game a game about going through puzzle rooms like Portal rather than holding up the pretense of "adventure" and "exploration". You aren't really "exploring" a dungeon if everything is laid out in order and you can't accomplish anything unless you do it the way the designer intended. People generally don't consider the "100 floor enemy rush" caves in Zelda games to be "dungeons" because you don't really explore them, they're just a bunch of near identical rooms with different challenges in them. Mark argues that some dungeons are basically that too, but with a bunch more pomp and circumstance to make you think you're exploring. He definitely dismisses non-linearity far too much, as there can be value in that kind of design, like Portal, but I do agree that it doesn't work well in Zelda games usually. Portal gets away with being a glorified physics puzzle game by having amazing writing/acting, a beautifully simplistic and unique core mechanic, and a well thought out theme. Zelda games on the other hand generally don't have the most captivating story and tend to re-use items (more apparent in later games) so they rely more on their level design and theme of exploration to keep the player excited/engaged.
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Oct 18, 2016 15:03
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Yorkshire Tea posted:I mean I think his video on the water temple is wrong because he doesn't recognise the most obnoxious part of the temple. Good thing that is completely fixed in OoT3D
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Oct 18, 2016 15:05
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mabels big day posted:Good thing that is completely fixed in OoT3D Since I haven't played that version what did they fix about this from the N64 version?
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Oct 18, 2016 17:57
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Ice Fist posted:Since I haven't played that version what did they fix about this from the N64 version? They make the shot of the block floating up to reveal a new passage super obvious, short of putting a giant neon sign that reads go here you dingus
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Oct 18, 2016 18:00
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Ice Fist posted:Since I haven't played that version what did they fix about this from the N64 version? Well, navigating the dungeon is obviously made easier with the Iron Boots being equippable as an item, and also when you raise the water level on the block that hides the key, the camera lingers on that area and shows you very clearly that there is something underneath it.
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Oct 18, 2016 18:00
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I finished Zelda 1 when I was 18 months old. I didn't use a guide because we were too poor to afford lights. I had the NES connected to my TI-83 because we didn't have a TV, either. If you think it is hard, then you must really be bad at video games.
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Oct 18, 2016 18:13
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Yorkshire Tea posted:I mean I think his video on the water temple is wrong because he doesn't recognise the most obnoxious part of the temple. I think you miss his point. If you had got both keys, then you could go forward. And both keys were available at that time. He constantly refers back to an earlier dungeon where you have some choice about what doors to open. If you only have one door and find a key, it's pretty obvious what to do. If you find 3 doors and one key then you have to choose a direction. At this point the dungeon is no longer linear and allows for the player to actually explore.
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Oct 18, 2016 18:16
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Surprised this wasn't posted here: http://www.siliconera.com/2016/10/17/legend-zelda-fans-recreate-links-awakening-using-ocarina-times-engine/
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Oct 18, 2016 18:51
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The Dave posted:Surprised this wasn't posted here: "And a Deeper Darker Original Dynamic More Inspired Storyline"  As cool as porting Link's Awakening to OoT's engine is, I think I might be more excited for Iscar Matthias to make an appearance!!!
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Oct 18, 2016 19:24
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The Dave posted:Surprised this wasn't posted here: This reminds me of those really old Zelda 64 screenshots.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:39
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Waltzing Along posted:I think you miss his point. If you had got both keys, then you could go forward. And both keys were available at that time. Right, but I didn't get both keys because it's unclear that you'll need both, or in fact that there's even a second key. Remember, chests on the map aren't necessarily keys but could just be arrows or rupees or some other poo poo. So if I see a locked door, progress through and get to another locked door after two rooms of puzzles, my only choice is to backtrack and repeat the puzzles I've already solved again. That's not fun for most people, they go "Oh gently caress that," not "Oh man it's so cool that I forgot this key so I get to explore some more."
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Oct 18, 2016 19:45
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The Dave posted:Surprised this wasn't posted here: This'll get shut down way before any new info on BotW gets released.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:46
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ArmyOfMidgets posted:This'll get shut down way before any new info on BotW gets released. No, it'll get shut down about 2 days after the official release of the mod, so that it's out there, fans have their way, everyone can find it on file sharing sites - but Nintendo has done what their lawyers demand of them as well, making everyone happen. That's exactly what happened with the last few Nintendo remake projects, so it'll probably go the same way.
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Oct 18, 2016 22:58
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The Dave posted:Surprised this wasn't posted here: This owns.
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Oct 18, 2016 23:20
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I get a little bored with Anime Link and would love to see a console Zelda return to the appearance of Wind Waker, or closer to it on the scale of cartoony-ness. But I think it won't happen. There's still hope for handheld though. To be honest, I'm kinda surprised that Triforce Heroes went back to WW's chibi style after LBW.
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Oct 18, 2016 23:30
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Carbon dioxide posted:No, it'll get shut down about 2 days after the official release of the mod, so that it's out there, fans have their way, everyone can find it on file sharing sites - but Nintendo has done what their lawyers demand of them as well, making everyone happen. Definitely what happened to the Metroid 2 remake, but there is actually a French-language sequel to Link to the Past that has been out for some time and has never received any kind of legal intervention from Nintendo so far as I know. It could be an exception for some reason, but as of now it's the exception to the rule.
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Oct 18, 2016 23:56
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JustJeff88 posted:Definitely what happened to the Metroid 2 remake, but there is actually a French-language sequel to Link to the Past that has been out for some time and has never received any kind of legal intervention from Nintendo so far as I know. It could be an exception for some reason, but as of now it's the exception to the rule. So uh... Link or what?
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Oct 19, 2016 00:05
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Speaking of fan stuff, Ancient Stone Tablets is finally fully translated. http://bszelda.zeldalegends.net/sekibanfiles.shtml
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Oct 19, 2016 00:05
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ArmyOfMidgets posted:This'll get shut down way before any new info on BotW gets released. Of course it will. I don't know what people are thinking when they reveal/release huge fan things like this RIGHT when the actual owners are actively doing poo poo with that same exact ip. Like, oh hey nintendo is wanting to build interest in BotW, amd now this fan game is getting in on the advertisement. Hey BotW is neat and all, but here's another zelda game! It's like someone saying they were gonna release a beyond good and evil fan game that they were making for 7 years. Now that ubisoft is actually making beyond good and evil 2, guess how that would turn out? Pokemon uranium came out like 3 months before a hugely advertised brand new pokemon game. It also came recently enough after pokemon go that it could have, and probably did, garner attention from people who never played the game, and who would see pokemon for the first time, but it would not be some weird bizarre post apocalyptic thing that the pokemon company does not want people to associate with their product. That metroid thing was cool and all, but it came out right before a new metroid game was to be released. And yeah, so what if federation force sucked? The people who make metroid don't give a gently caress, that fan remake was messing with their advertisement/ect. And it was also a complete remaster of a game by someone who doesn't own the rights to it. Which, well it's obvious how that would go.
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Oct 19, 2016 00:15
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coffeecup posted:I get a little bored with Anime Link and would love to see a console Zelda return to the appearance of Wind Waker, or closer to it on the scale of cartoony-ness. But I think it won't happen. I understand what you mean but saying "I'm tired of anime let's go cartoon" is pretty weird
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Oct 19, 2016 02:48
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Gamerofthegame posted:I understand what you mean but saying "I'm tired of anime let's go cartoon" is pretty weird He's tired of sexy anime, and wants some kawaii anime
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Oct 19, 2016 04:05
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But the beauty, nay, the art of anime is that it can be both kawaii AND sexy (or "sekushii")
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Oct 19, 2016 04:54
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Link is pretty bishonen.
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Oct 19, 2016 20:24
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Ohhhh, I just got it. "Diminish" Cap. I just hadn't said it with a cool accent before.
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Oct 19, 2016 21:05
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Electromax posted:Ohhhh, I just got it. "Diminish" Cap. I just hadn't said it with a cool accent before. Joe Pesci: What should I wear for the deer hunt? Marisa Tomei: Why don't ya just weah de Minish Cap, you rear end in a top hat, because you just diminished ya chances o' gettin' lucky tonight!
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Oct 19, 2016 21:24
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Moriatti posted:So uh... Link or what? It's Zelda: Mystery of Solarus DX. The game is in multiple languages but the instructions and .pdf guide are French only
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Oct 20, 2016 01:43
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