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Drop down with cheats in the Exosuit. The world curves back underneath itself and you can swing from the bottom of it.
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Nov 17, 2016 03:07
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The edge where the world drops off to nothing freaks me right the gently caress out. I can't shake the feeling that some nameless horror is going to lurch out of the black.
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Nov 21, 2016 09:52
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Honky Dong Country posted:The edge where the world drops off to nothing freaks me right the gently caress out. I can't shake the feeling that some nameless horror is going to lurch out of the black. See, this is what I think the game is missing. Reapers are scary, but we need some giant squid level of horror. Even if it was non-aggressive. I mean imagine if you swam down 4000m and it was something like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFrY4d4zYFI (Kubo and the 2 strings is a pretty great movie by the way)
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Nov 21, 2016 23:58
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Lonos Oboe posted:See, this is what I think the game is missing. Reapers are scary, but we need some giant squid level of horror. Even if it was non-aggressive. I mean imagine if you swam down 4000m and it was something like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFrY4d4zYFI (Kubo and the 2 strings is a pretty great movie by the way) I would love to see giant squid in this And by love I mean would be terrified with the lights on and hiding behind something while playing.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:14
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An aggressive enemy that showed up now and then and was something you could only either avoid or run from would be a good addition probably. Getting some kind of warning that a giant squid or whatever had entered the area, and probably not seeing it before it despawned after roaming around for 10 minutes or something, but constantly kept you looking over your shoulder as you went about your normal business, would be pretty fun if handled properly. But yeah, they need some unfathomable enemies which are enormous and unstoppable and keep you afraid of the depths.
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Nov 22, 2016 03:05
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Exactly! It would have to be a threat to the Cyclops. Big and fast And it could not be a standard stalker enemy type like in Alien Isolation that just shows up and stops your progress. Maybe if it was tied to specific events either in story or roaming. Something like a giant thermal vent that stops erupting every once in a while and it leaves to go hunting so you can sneak down and grab rare resources. The timer is slightly random so you are likely to run into it if you hang around too long. Bring the Cyclops and you can haul more gear, but you are too slow to escape. Or bring the Seamoth and make out with a few goodies and hope you don't bump into it. So it's kinda a risk/reward thing. Otherwise it just sits down there like it's Smaug. Maybe it's attracted to light and sound so if its detected in the area you can turn off the Sub's power and hope it passes you by. (Of course it makes terrifying sounds and swims right by you) Or set up distractions so you can try and avoid it. And the thing should be HUGE. I know the Sea Dragon is massive but to be honest I am not crazy about the design and I don't feel like it's an animalistic threat. It's intimidating, but not scary. More like an enemy in a game if you get me. The Reapers are different. They look very scary and intimidating, but also feel like a part of the eco-system. Something scary, but natural. I want the "beast" to be something really haunting and alien like staring into the eyes of a spider crossed with a squid. An unknowable other.
Lonos Oboe fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 13:46
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Lassitude posted:An aggressive enemy that showed up now and then and was something you could only either avoid or run from would be a good addition probably. Getting some kind of warning that a giant squid or whatever had entered the area, and probably not seeing it before it despawned after roaming around for 10 minutes or something, but constantly kept you looking over your shoulder as you went about your normal business, would be pretty fun if handled properly. But yeah, they need some unfathomable enemies which are enormous and unstoppable and keep you afraid of the depths. Sadly even *most* survival horror games don't do this, they rely on scripted events most of the time. But I would really like it if predators somehow patrolled a biome instead of just popping in, with some sort of alpha that specifically stalks you like a Clock Tower villain. Not really possible at the moment though.
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Nov 22, 2016 18:36
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Lassitude posted:An aggressive enemy that showed up now and then and was something you could only either avoid or run from would be a good addition probably. Getting some kind of warning that a giant squid or whatever had entered the area, and probably not seeing it before it despawned after roaming around for 10 minutes or something, but constantly kept you looking over your shoulder as you went about your normal business, would be pretty fun if handled properly. But yeah, they need some unfathomable enemies which are enormous and unstoppable and keep you afraid of the depths. Dyz posted:Sadly even *most* survival horror games don't do this, they rely on scripted events most of the time. But I would really like it if predators somehow patrolled a biome instead of just popping in, with some sort of alpha that specifically stalks you like a Clock Tower villain. Not really possible at the moment though. I admit "Designated too scary for you" doesn't really do it for me. The older AvP games and System Shock 2 I'm heavily armed but I'm also tense because I could still gently caress up and get turbo murdered (Oh poo poo, it's a tiny psychic monkey! Nevermind that I can smash it with a wrench). Meanwhile I have no interest in the generally well regarded Alien Isolation, because the entire "Threat" is based on the Alien's contractual immortality. Some "Apex predator you have to drop everything and sit with your thumb up your rear end waiting to leave" sounds like a wet dream for a lot of survival gamers, but not really to my tastes because I'd only view it as a designated setpiece time waster. It's part of why I've gone from considering the Warpers a cool idea to  as they layer on the cheat codes against player agency by letting them yoink you out of your vehichles or teleport out of being stasis locked. No matter how many people say "Well you can still deal with them if you try  " the fact remains they still had to resort to throwing a design panic attack over your tech progression being better than the average starving in the woods like a hobo survival protagonist. (See also: Resident Evil 4 Regenerators worry me more than that one "Only plot set pieces can kill it" Regenerator in the first Dead Space game. The former you COULD kill them without the Thermal Scope, but it was wildly impractical. The latter? "Haha, it's unstoppable until we say so!").All that said, I would LOVE an Abyss specific turbo horror that would lurk around the very borders of the map, but not enter too far into the biome proper. Because the Devs don't want us in the Abyss anyways, so might as well give it a fabulous incentive to avoid leaving the awkwardly tiny terrain limit. "Eh, I'm still 50 meters away from the edge-OH gently caress gotta reach 100m oh Jesus Come sea glide you travel 20% faster than this thing crawls." Section Z fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 19:46
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Section Z posted:
I'll admit, that is way more practical and implementable than my suggestion which would probably require about 6 months of work and probably still suck. I remember in the first Crysis they had ships that would shoot missiles at you if you swam too far out. On levels with no ships, they had that big rear end scary shark that didn't appear anywhere else and it would swim right out of the depths and get you. It was almost an easter egg. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2L2bDs31lM (No music obviously and this guy spawned in a few extra sharks, but you get the idea) I just want my unspeakable horror. Lonos Oboe fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 20:11
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Lonos Oboe posted:I'll admit, that is way more practical and implementable than my suggestion which would probably require about 6 months of work and probably still suck. I remember in the first Crysis they had ships that would shoot missiles at you if you swam too far out. On levels with no ships, they had that big rear end scary shark that didn't appear anywhere else and it would swim right out of the depths and get you. It was almost an easter egg. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2L2bDs31lM (No music obviously and this guy spawned in a few extra sharks, but you get the idea) I just want my unspeakable horror. Yeah, I can definitely understand the urge and you are coming at it from a good place and intentions. The main snag outside of it being possible/practical to implement in games seems to be how many people want to go overboard "It's only scary if you are hosed over or have agency removed in some way  " (Magical Crysis shark following you onto land, essentially)For example, when they are not suddenly popping into draw existence too fast for you to do anything about them, or otherwise over aggressively spawned/broken leashed, Reapers are great. It's still a big scary monster that can loving EAT you, and wants you off it's property. But, because you have actual agency and progressively better REAL options to put you on better footing with them? A lot of people outright dismiss them because you aren't 100% hosed just as hard later in the game as you are at the start of it, and retroactively erase the constant danger they have for you in the early game. Probably making some pithy quote about how "You're not on the top of the food chain here  "Even though there is no food chain, because fish only depopulate in reaction to your existence and engine problems. While sharks of all kinds will ignore all natural sources of food in favor of diving face first through an erupting lava vent just for the chance at biting at the guy placing thermal generators. I'd ADORE a "Food Chain" because then they would have to actually deal with all the interesting repercussions of having dozens of permanently ravenous predators swarming any given area. But that's actual effort compared to just claiming you're not at the top of one, while tisk tisking you for "over fishing" even though you went out of your way to never touch fish in a 100m radius around your new base 
Section Z fucked around with this message at 20:30 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 20:28
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Section Z posted:Meanwhile I have no interest in the generally well regarded Alien Isolation, because the entire "Threat" is based on the Alien's contractual immortality. Serious spoilers on Alien:Isolation for those who have already or don't plan to play it: You actually spend much of the game being able to fight back and chase it off if not kill it, and I'm pretty sure you actually outright murder several aliens later on although it's not explicit. The fear largely comes from it getting the drop on you, or mis-stepping enough times that you start running out of resources, or it catching you in a bad situation, or being caught between it and other enemies. Gameplay-wise you can totally "kill" it and in fact being to cautious is a great way to get yourselves killed. Sometimes you even expressly use the alien as a tool against other threats. The threat is definitely not "entirely" based on it's contractual immortality. Also, the more common (and honestly largely more dangerous if not more frightening) enemies are the Androids, and boy howdy is it satisfying to put them down even if it's super difficulty at first. GlyphGryph fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 20:31
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I agree with all those points. I have said a few times that I admire the fact that the devs are trying to make a game that is not a horror/survival game like The Forest and some of the others. Subnautica is more of an exploration game and these creatures are things to mostly look at and go "ohhh and ahhh" unless you are directly in their way and are messing around with them and they act like animals rather than enemies. (It's one reason I am not crazy about the Warpers) As for the food chain stuff. One downside IMO is that aside from a few situational moments (usually from leaving it) a huge amount of tension is dissolved the second you get the Cyclops. You are as you say "Top of the food chain" I never enjoyed Subnautica more than when I was ducking Reapers and Stalkers to grab the Seamoth and base parts. The moment you build the Cyclops is incredibly cool. But I feel like the journey is far too short. Maybe in the implemented story mode they will stretch it out. But I just feel like you have way too much of a handle on the situation. For example in Minecraft they have the creepers and Endermen who occasionally come along and potentially gently caress up your base. And in Terraria they have things like the blood moon where it randomly becomes a zombie apocalypse that usually uses up your resources and damages your base. In Subnautica, your base is always pristine and only endangered by your own stupid building ideas. And when you collect resources, they can be stockpiled and stockpiled. I am thinking about the Martian where the setbacks made the narrative more compelling. When you have a fishtank, a water purifier, a stillsuit and some Thermal Power. You can put your feet up and charge the power cells to your invincible megasub. I totally agree that you need to balance agency with the meta-challenges. But I can see this game needing a few extra tweaks to be sustaining after. I have clocked up maybe 40 hours of gameplay over 3 playthroughs and feel like I have wrung a lot of the tension out of it. I am not complaining and already have got more than my money's worth. But if they could find a creative way to ramp the challenge aside from more aggressive predators then I would really be incentivized to come back for years to come.
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Nov 22, 2016 20:59
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GlyphGryph posted:Serious spoilers on Alien:Isolation for those who have already or don't plan to play it: Yeah, I was aware of that much (And specified the Alien rather than the Other Stuff for a reason). But how tightly reined in when you can do that much is about the same to my mind. "I've got a flamethrower! Flamethrowers are great at killing Aliens-Wait. Right now I'm only allowed to scare it away? Or it will just tank it to try and hurt me anyways if I try to actually kill them with it? Good job flamethrower." That's still the kind of thing I'm talking about. When you hand someone a flamethrower, and then have to go "Holy poo poo, we gave them a flamethrower? Now what do we do!? Uh... Make it just annoy them I guess?" To be fair, I totally understand from a design standpoint why they had to do this for said game's tone. But even as a justified decision it's still something that just doesn't mesh with me so well. So the problem is me, as much/more than Well Reputed Space Horror Game's design choices. Lonos Oboe posted:I agree with all those points. The rare times I peek at the steam forums, I ironically see some of the guys who were very vocal proponents of "gently caress this exploration poo poo, we're SURVIVAL GAMERS!" also finding the new wrecks loot method very lackluster. If from a "Now my wiki knowledge removes even MORE threat from the game! Because I can just swim to coordinates at a safe height then dive down" standpoint, as much as a replays and making exploring most of the landscape pointless standpoint. Section Z fucked around with this message at 21:16 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 21:12
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Section Z posted:I admit "Designated too scary for you" doesn't really do it for me. The older AvP games and System Shock 2 I'm heavily armed but I'm also tense because I could still gently caress up and get turbo murdered (Oh poo poo, it's a tiny psychic monkey! Nevermind that I can smash it with a wrench). Meanwhile I have no interest in the generally well regarded Alien Isolation, because the entire "Threat" is based on the Alien's contractual immortality. Some "Apex predator you have to drop everything and sit with your thumb up your rear end waiting to leave" sounds like a wet dream for a lot of survival gamers, but not really to my tastes because I'd only view it as a designated setpiece time waster. This is funny because when I think of a good survival horror game, I think of things like Clock Tower and System Shock 2. One of the things I'd love to see again in survival horror is maze-like maps with randomly spawning enemies and I'm surprised more games don't do this. Hearing a hybrid through the walls was what made SS2 so tense sometimes. I kind of agree with you on the whole "defenceless" thing being kind of lame, but only when it's done in such a way that it becomes tedious or frustrating instead of scary. "Oh god I need to get away from this monster because I'll have to start this whole level over *again*" isn't terror. In my opinion it doesn't matter *how* you are supposed to deal with something in a game, as long as it is entertaining and running/hiding can be fun when done right.
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Nov 23, 2016 00:34
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If there is any environment truly appropriate for Lovecraftian horrors in the forbidden deeps... Well this probably isn't the game.
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Nov 23, 2016 07:58
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So I found one propulsion cannon fragment inside the Aurora, and I expected to find another lying around in some of the wreckage just outside the ship but didn't couldn't locate any. Any hints? Basically all I've got right now is a Seaglide, radiation suit, a repair tool.
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Nov 23, 2016 14:59
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LordSloth posted:If there is any environment truly appropriate for Lovecraftian horrors in the forbidden deeps... Well this probably isn't the game. Sorry, you get Kharaa instead. You're gonna walk thru a portal and get transported to a game of NS2 where everyone is a dumbass and there's no commander. True horror.
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Nov 23, 2016 15:47
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Crimson Harvest posted:So I found one propulsion cannon fragment inside the Aurora, and I expected to find another lying around in some of the wreckage just outside the ship but didn't couldn't locate any. Any hints? Basically all I've got right now is a Seaglide, radiation suit, a repair tool. I don't know about the Aurora itself but I recommend poking around some of the more distant, shallow wrecks before exploring the Aurora and closest wrecks. I was able to scan all of the needed fragments for the propulsion cannon and stasis gun in one, and was able to unlock the seamoth over 2 or 3 of them. "Shallow" in this case can still mean up to 300 meters deep, though most are 75-150, so I still recommend the seaglide (and an extra battery), an extra tank, an air recycler, and eventually the seamoth as a staging point to get down to some of them.
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Nov 23, 2016 18:30
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GenericOverusedName posted:Sorry, you get Kharaa instead. You're gonna walk thru a portal and get transported to a game of NS2 where everyone is a dumbass and there's no commander. The instant someone starts commanding, they are immediately mutinied for being a rookie while the rest of the team angrily complains that they don't have a commander and also that their commander sucks somehow, and furiously blames the quality of the hit detection every time they die
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Nov 24, 2016 05:04
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Digirat posted:The instant someone starts commanding, they are immediately mutinied for being a rookie while the rest of the team angrily complains that they don't have a commander and also that their commander sucks somehow, and furiously blames the quality of the hit detection every time they die Meanwhile the other team plays as passively as possible and only attacks RTs.
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Nov 27, 2016 21:47
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Dyz posted:Meanwhile the other team plays as passively as possible and only attacks RTs. That is frankly a rather good way to play NS, don't fight straight up, just deny the enemy resources. It's part of why I don't like the game, the best way to play isn't any fun. Definitely think the team is better suited to a non-multiplayer game, their talent was always with environment design.
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Nov 27, 2016 23:05
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Harassment is good when the game isn't already decided, but I saw way too many games where it was clearly over, but the winning team refused to push into the last base and loving move onto the next game before the server emptied out. Because everyone needed a double railgun exo or else we'd clearly lose to some demoralized skulks and whips, with our jetpacks and grenade launchers.
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Nov 27, 2016 23:30
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Lonos Oboe posted:The show is apparently called "The Deep" according to google and here is a clip https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWM84TSGnjc Actually the craziest thing about this is just having other humans around. I couldn't imagine Subnautica with living people to talk to/come in conflict with. It'd be kinda cool if they figured it out but maybe some of the appeal game's appeal is that you're really all on your own.
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Nov 28, 2016 04:42
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Sushi in Yiddish posted:Actually the craziest thing about this is just having other humans around. I couldn't imagine Subnautica with living people to talk to/come in conflict with. It'd be kinda cool if they figured it out but maybe some of the appeal game's appeal is that you're really all on your own. I'd like it if it was two player co-op and only two. Maybe its just the way the lifepod looked last I played but having it be you and a pal against the ocean feels, at least to me, like it would still be the same level of stakes but some of the terror shared between the two of you. At least until, you know, the both of you go to the darkest places and a reaper tears the other guy's sub in half. 
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Nov 28, 2016 15:23
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Thyrork posted:I'd like it if it was two player co-op and only two. Maybe its just the way the lifepod looked last I played but having it be you and a pal against the ocean feels, at least to me, like it would still be the same level of stakes but some of the terror shared between the two of you. Yeah, two player co-op would be ideal for me, this game is great but I'd love to be able to play it with my brother. More players would quickly start to make it lose appeal though I think.
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Nov 28, 2016 16:52
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Now I'm imagining a group of PRAWN players tackling a Reaper. Take shifts acting as bait while the others punch the poo poo out of it. That would be a good time.
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Nov 28, 2016 17:02
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Good news then because the devs are never going to do multiplayer.
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Nov 28, 2016 19:15
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Cojawfee posted:Good news then because the devs are never going to do multiplayer. In reality I'm fine with this. Not every game is suited to multiplayer and I do like the sense of isolation that Subnautica has.
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Nov 28, 2016 19:47
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The problem with multiplayer in these types of games is that it's moot for me, since I'm fairly certain there is nobody out there who has the patience to wait for me to find just the right spot for a base and get everything set up just so.
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Nov 28, 2016 20:32
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whoops
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Nov 28, 2016 20:35
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I'd just drive all the other players nuts with constant Sealab 2021 references. Fignuts
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Nov 28, 2016 20:42
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Subnautica prototype.
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Nov 29, 2016 06:26
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Jesus Christ they're really getting a handle on the pop-in issue aren't they.
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Nov 29, 2016 14:36
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priznat posted:I'd just drive all the other players nuts with constant Sealab 2021 references. A few pages ago I suggested the thread title should be changed to "Subnautica: If you're looking for me, you better check under the sea" alas, no dice. Otherwise this thread would be top of the games forum.
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Nov 29, 2016 15:44
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Lonos Oboe posted:A few pages ago I suggested the thread title should be changed to "Subnautica: If you're looking for me, you better check under the sea" alas, no dice. Otherwise this thread would be top of the games forum. I would buy you a Mingus Dew.
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Nov 29, 2016 18:28
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i'm gonna be an adrienne barbeauxbot
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Nov 29, 2016 18:31
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Lonos Oboe posted:A few pages ago I suggested the thread title should be changed to "Subnautica: If you're looking for me, you better check under the sea" alas, no dice. Otherwise this thread would be top of the games forum. Just whisper a games mod. It's no big deal. edit: Oh I see you don't have platinum. I'll whisper someone.
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Nov 29, 2016 20:28
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I'm honestly surprised they haven't programmed the vending machine to shoot colas at you fast enough to hurt you. Alas, you cannot make a pirate radio station either.
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Nov 29, 2016 23:16
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LuiCypher posted:I'm honestly surprised they haven't programmed the vending machine to shoot colas at you fast enough to hurt you. Because then you'd still be allowed to have soda, so it could nutshot you half your health every time and the people they listen to for balancing would still complain it's too easy.
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Nov 29, 2016 23:40
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Section Z posted:Because then you'd still be allowed to have soda, so it could nutshot you half your health every time and the people they listen to for balancing would still complain it's too easy. To be fair as of them installing the purified water thing it is pretty easy
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Nov 30, 2016 00:08
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