NES Accessory Mafia

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Tobbs Gnawed: Apr 4, 2007; All round mafia nice guy

Anomalous Amalgam posted:

I'll vote jedit but feel like we might be getting ducked. Let the record show, I watched TM and he was the only person who visited Inf outside of myself and I believe TM is the correct Lynch.

TM and Jedit are both scum, but TM is definitely not the roleblocker.

With the roleblocker gone, we can use all our power roles effectively, nobody can claim to have failed their night action, etc.

He's definitely the right dunk.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 21:08

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# ? Apr 25, 2024 13:47

Anomalous Amalgam: Feb 13, 2015; by Nyc_Tattoo; Doctor Rope

##vote Jedit

# ? Nov 26, 2016 21:15

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Flying Leatherman posted:

1) I believe we did in fact confirm TQ's role.

2) Only if you accept that, on N3, Tobbs visited Infi. This would mean that TQ and Tobbs were both scum and that there is a separate roleblocker, whicih is impossible.

Refraining from comment on 3, but as I mentioned in the doc, you're asking us to swallow an awful lot here to believe that you're not scum.

1) As I said, it doesn't matter if his role is confirmed if his alignment isn't.

2) TQ doesn't have to be scum to track Tobbs to Infi, because he doesn't know what Tobbs did. Infi wasn't blocked or killed, but that only accounts for two of a possible three. Tobbs could be any other active role.

Also can you explain why it's impossible for TQ/Tobbs/Glowku/the RB to be a scum team because of Night 3 actions? Because I'm not seeing it. Glowku performs the kill, RB blocks me, Tobbs does something, TQ tracks Tobbs to give him cred. Even if you believe I blocked Asiina that's still a valid possibility.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 21:26

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Ok, catching up on anything I missed here/in masonry.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 23:44

Soaring Kestrel: Nov 7, 2009; For Whiterock.; Fun Shoe

Jedit posted:

1) As I said, it doesn't matter if his role is confirmed if his alignment isn't.

2) TQ doesn't have to be scum to track Tobbs to Infi, because he doesn't know what Tobbs did. Infi wasn't blocked or killed, but that only accounts for two of a possible three. Tobbs could be any other active role.

Also can you explain why it's impossible for TQ/Tobbs/Glowku/the RB to be a scum team because of Night 3 actions? Because I'm not seeing it. Glowku performs the kill, RB blocks me, Tobbs does something, TQ tracks Tobbs to give him cred. Even if you believe I blocked Asiina that's still a valid possibility.

I think you're right that it's not impossible solely based on night actions. I think I miscounted the people left in the game; I had thought one more scum would have let them control the vote, and that was incorrect.

That said, TQ's and Tobbs's posting has seemed pretty town to me. Yours hasn't, and the explanation that "the universal backup has actions that match up with the roleblocker" is a pretty big coincidence. Plus, I'm not sure who exactly you were trying to "trap" with most action claims already out on the table by not admitting the roleblock. It doesn't hold water to me.

# ? Nov 26, 2016 23:53

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Flying Leatherman posted:

I think you're right that it's not impossible solely based on night actions. I think I miscounted the people left in the game; I had thought one more scum would have let them control the vote, and that was incorrect.

That said, TQ's and Tobbs's posting has seemed pretty town to me. Yours hasn't, and the explanation that "the universal backup has actions that match up with the roleblocker" is a pretty big coincidence. Plus, I'm not sure who exactly you were trying to "trap" with most action claims already out on the table by not admitting the roleblock. It doesn't hold water to me.

KB. For reasons previously mentioned and because of a sudden switch in his attitude I was starting to have doubts about him. He was pressing me for information, I felt that he was trying to put spin on it, and I outsmarted myself by not giving over everything.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:03

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Jedit posted:

[kb is scum stuff]

I too have been thinking about this. If all claims are true then Town in this game is obscenely powerful. More than half of us have either a protective or investigative role, and on top of that we had multishots of vig, executioner and double vote. Against this the scum apparently have ... a roleblocker? That can't be right. The only way scum win that setup is if half the Town plays scummy and they rip themselves apart. Which nearly happened, admittedly, but still I think this game would already be over if they hadn't lucked into killing the Cop on N1. How does Mason Recruiter help scum avoid all that? Well, I assume the masons discuss where their night actions are going to go. KB recruits them, they plan what to do, then the scum plan on that basis.

The only problem I see with this as a theory is the lack of NK on turn 2. We know AA was jailed and KB protected because the Jailer and Doc told us and they're both dead - although Kash hasn't posted Infi's alignment I'm assuming he's Town because Tobbs didn't die too - and Asiina was already in the masonry as per KB's statement which neither Asiina or FL have refuted. That implies KB isn't scum, as if he was then AA was either the target or the killer and in either case the scum could have had Glowku make the kill instead of whoever did do it.

I appreciate the effort. But this post is a big post basically saying I am scum followed by saying, but I can't be scum.

Which seems like a waste of time. I want to respond to the bit about game balance though:

Remember they had an unlimited Juggernaut. If you'll recall early in the game I posited this would be the only thing that would balance the insane amount of protection we had, then it flipped. In terms of balancing the vote manipulation roles, I'm thinking an extra scum balances that, so we probably were dealing with 4 scum in this game. Juggernaut, Roleblocker, Godfather?, ? guess we'll see. One thing that has me suspicious of AA is if there is no scum ninja then I think both a tracker and a watcher does make things trickier. So I wouldn't be shocked if one of them was scum.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:06

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Truth Quark posted:

Hey KB, who did you mason this time?

Tobbs.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:07

Truth Quark: Mar 21, 2010; EAT THE DONUTS

##vote Jedit I think we are good to do this now.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:09

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Truth Quark posted:

My one concern, is that TM is clearly being bussed based on the fact that zero "confirmed" town players have jumped on the vote so far. I have a feeling scum have a reason for bussing him beyond him being scummy as gently caress, such as being a lynch bomb or something similar. It would make sense given the relative power of town this game to give scum a role like that.

That's interesting. Yeah, I guess he might be something like that.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:09

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Jedit posted:

OK, thoughts on KB's RB stuff:

Things I think he overlooked:

1) TQ could be scum. Some of his results are confirmed subject to timestamp - I don't recall if he said he tracked Asiina to AA before or after she claimed it - but scum Tracker isn't out of the question anyway. In either case he could be lying about not having seen Pig go anywhere and Pig could thus be the RB.

2) Tobbs could be lying about having been blocked. This would allow AA to be the RB as it would mean the only night without an RB was the night he was jailed. However, I don't think this is particularly likely as that was also the night we had no kill. It would also probably mean he was lying about being a Bodyguard, but that begs the question of what he is given he can't be the RB.

3) I'm not seeing anything that would stop TM being the RB if AA lied about the watching result. He hasn't been observed or blocked on any previous night.

So for 1. TQ can be scum, but he can not be the roleblocker. He is confirmed tracker. Me and Asiina had figured it out before he even posted about it based on the way he was talking about things and once he claimed had decided he must have followed me N1. His claims definitely pan out. If he's scum, he's scum tracker, so this doesn't impact the search for the roleblocker.

For 2, Yeah, the reason this isn't a thing is the missing kill on N2. I could dive into this a bit more, but I'd need to go back and map all the claims, not just the living powers. But this requires both AA and Tobbs to be lying together. And just based on voting patterns, opinions, etc this isn't likely right now. And we know Tobbs isn't a roleblocker either since he was seen visiting Inf.

For 3, This is sound initially but falls apart with thought. So for TM to be a roleblocker then both a scum roleblocker and a scum ninja had to visit Inf for the kill, if AA is telling the truth. If AA is lying, it would mean he is scum with TM in this scenario, and scum doesn't red handed catch their roleblocker. It makes no sense.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:16

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Sorry, but with a doctor, elite bodyguard, tracker, watcher, and jailer on the table, no way in hell am I believing that someone who has to guess the night kill is getting roleblocked.

Asiina makes more sense, especially since we suggested that jailing a juggernaut could prevent a NK.

##vote Jedit

We need to dunk the roleblocker.

And yeah, agreed.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:17

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Jedit posted:

No, but the logic chain isn't complex - it was the reason I targeted Asiina myself. The scum needed to kill the protective roles. If Asiina jailed the RB while they were trying to block Tobbs and kill Infi they'd lose someone, so Asiina had to go first. Glowku was already a suspect so if I managed that they'd not be able to get around me easily, so I got blocked.

TQ: you are right, I was trying to trap someone into claiming they'd been blocked or into deliberately misreading me. The first half didn't work, the second half worked a bit too well. On average it was a successful play, though.

You were the last to claim at the time, from what I remember. There was no one left to catch.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:18

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Jedit posted:

1) As I said, it doesn't matter if his role is confirmed if his alignment isn't.

2) TQ doesn't have to be scum to track Tobbs to Infi, because he doesn't know what Tobbs did. Infi wasn't blocked or killed, but that only accounts for two of a possible three. Tobbs could be any other active role.

Also can you explain why it's impossible for TQ/Tobbs/Glowku/the RB to be a scum team because of Night 3 actions? Because I'm not seeing it. Glowku performs the kill, RB blocks me, Tobbs does something, TQ tracks Tobbs to give him cred. Even if you believe I blocked Asiina that's still a valid possibility.

1) It matters for this vote. We need to knock out the roleblocker.

2) Yes, and if Tobbs is any other active role, he's still not the roleblocker since Inf wasn't blocked.

TQ/Tobbs/Glowku/The RB can be a scum team, probably. I'd have to look over the full action map to figure it out. But in that scenario, The RB is still the one I want to cuddle. From what I can tell right now, the RB is either you or FL, and if FL is scum, I will congratulate him after the game. You are the only option. So in this theoretical scum team, you are scum with them. Which, going back to opinions/votes, again makes it weird that they'd vote you out here if you are the RB. The TM vote is easy to sell right now. But they are voting you. So probably they aren't scum? We'll see.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:23

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

I also want to discuss night actions a bit for tonight.

If we cuddle Jedit and he flips roleblocker as expected, this is the plan we've discussed in the masonry for tonight:

Tired docs Tobbs -- If Tired is really a doc, then that means Tobbs will not die tonight, at a minimum.
AA watches KB -- If anyone kills me, AA will see it, if he's really a watcher.
TQ tracks AA -- Let's determine once and for all if AA can really watch people. Does AA visit me? Do I not die?
Tobbs bodyguards TQ -- If AA is scum, he might want TQ to die to prevent anyone from seeing him not move or move to the kill. So we protect TQ. If scum goes for the kill anyway, they also die.

So actual likely kills for the night will be Tobbs if Tired isn't a doc, or Me/FL/AA if he is. If TM is really a doc, scum could kill him unseen/watched potentially, but then they get rid of our top suspect, seems unlikely. But if they do, it helps narrow things down still. If they kill me, they haven't narrowed down the power roles, so still good for town. If they kill AA they resolve the AA issue for us entirely and it proves AA was telling the truth about TM, so seems unlikely they'd do that. But if they do, still helps us. If they kill FL, again, no power role lost.

Anyone have any feedback they want to offer? I know Tobbs is in. How do AA/Tired/TQ feel about this plan?

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:33

Truth Quark: Mar 21, 2010; EAT THE DONUTS

I don't really like broadcasting night actions but I was planning to track AA anyway.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:41

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Truth Quark posted:

I don't really like broadcasting night actions but I was planning to track AA anyway.

I totally agree normally. But this is a situation where we can learn a lot by proper coordination.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:44

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Votecount for Day 5

Jedit (3): Tobbs Gnawed, Anomalous Amalgam, Truth Quark

Not Voting (5): CapitalistPig, Flying Leatherman, Infinitum, Jedit, King Burgundy

With 8 alive, it's 5 votes to execute. There is currently no deadline set.

Here is where vote's stand. I think technically Pig is trying to be on TM right now although that isn't showing because looks like Kashuno accidentally removed TM from votefinder instead of Infinitum. And pretty sure TM is trying to vote for AA but again, not in votefinder.

So that leave me, FL, and Jedit to vote. Pretty sure me and FL are both ready to end the day whenever based on mason chat.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:48

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

I'd like to hear from AA/TM about the plan before ending it though, I guess.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:49

votefinder: Jul 6, 2010; scoop scoop

Votecount for Day 5

Jedit (3): Tobbs Gnawed, Anomalous Amalgam, Truth Quark

Tired Moritz (2): CapitalistPig, ~~CapitalistPig~~, CapitalistPig, Jedit

Anomalous Amalgam (1): Tired Moritz

Not Voting (2): Flying Leatherman, King Burgundy

With 8 alive, it's 5 votes to execute. There is currently no deadline set.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 00:55

Soaring Kestrel: Nov 7, 2009; For Whiterock.; Fun Shoe

Per above, I am indeed comfortable in placing my vote down and will do so before 24 hours from day start (I'm assuming that's the deadline, even if there isn't one set in votefinder). I'll wait for people to check in, but for what it's worth since nights are open, I think we can probably do it any time.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 01:18

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Flying Leatherman posted:

Per above, I am indeed comfortable in placing my vote down and will do so before 24 hours from day start (I'm assuming that's the deadline, even if there isn't one set in votefinder). I'll wait for people to check in, but for what it's worth since nights are open, I think we can probably do it any time.

Yeah, I keep treating this game like it doesn't have open nights.

No reason to wait I guess.

##vote Jedit

# ? Nov 27, 2016 01:30

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

King Burgundy posted:

Here is where vote's stand. I think technically Pig is trying to be on TM right now although that isn't showing because looks like Kashuno accidentally removed TM from votefinder instead of Infinitum. And pretty sure TM is trying to vote for AA but again, not in votefinder.

So that leave me, FL, and Jedit to vote. Pretty sure me and FL are both ready to end the day whenever based on mason chat.

If I didn't already vote TM, I'm on TM.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 01:45

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

King Burgundy posted:

1) It matters for this vote. We need to knock out the roleblocker.

2) Yes, and if Tobbs is any other active role, he's still not the roleblocker since Inf wasn't blocked.

TQ/Tobbs/Glowku/The RB can be a scum team, probably. I'd have to look over the full action map to figure it out. But in that scenario, The RB is still the one I want to cuddle. From what I can tell right now, the RB is either you or FL, and if FL is scum, I will congratulate him after the game. You are the only option. So in this theoretical scum team, you are scum with them. Which, going back to opinions/votes, again makes it weird that they'd vote you out here if you are the RB. The TM vote is easy to sell right now. But they are voting you. So probably they aren't scum? We'll see.

Looks like you'll be congratulating FL, then. loving idiot.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 01:47

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Jedit posted:

Looks like you'll be congratulating FL, then. loving idiot.

So you think FL is the roleblocker then? Want to make a case on him?

If you aren't scum, you played a really poor game that led us to this point. So your comment is probably more appropriate for yourself.

Like, this is another scenario where you aren't acting like you should be if you are really town. If you are town, you should KNOW FL is the scum roleblocker at this point and be voting him.

I'm fine being wrong. I can be wrong a lot. But this isn't a situation where I would feel particularly bad about being wrong if I was. I would have done my best based on the information that was available to me such as your really scummy play.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 02:02

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

King Burgundy posted:

So you think FL is the roleblocker then? Want to make a case on him?

No, you think you know it. If everything is as you said then sure, it's me or him and it's not me, but it could still be Pig if TQ is scum. I know you're dismissing that, but you shouldn't; knowing that TQ isn't the RB doesn't impinge on the search for the RB, but not knowing that he's scum does because it opens up possibilities that otherwise are closed.

One thing I do know is certain is that unless AA is scum then TM performed the NK. And I think it's more likely that TM is scum than AA because of his fake claim.

Anyway, it's 2am here. See you in the AAR, probably.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 02:57

Soaring Kestrel: Nov 7, 2009; For Whiterock.; Fun Shoe

##vote Jedit

I'm not going to be up for deadline, so here we go. AA, TM, if you could check in as we head into night and discuss the plan above before the next day starts?

# ? Nov 27, 2016 03:37

votefinder: Jul 6, 2010; scoop scoop

This game will be better without Jedit!

# ? Nov 27, 2016 03:39

Truth Quark: Mar 21, 2010; EAT THE DONUTS

This game will never end

# ? Nov 27, 2016 08:20

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

it just did :ghost:

# ? Nov 27, 2016 12:54

Asiina: Apr 26, 2011; No going back; Grimey Drawer

Can I just flip him I know the answer. Jeez Kash.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 16:18

Tired Moritz: Mar 25, 2012; wish Lowtax would get tired of YOUR POSTS

_{_{(n o i c e)}}

let him play pokemon in peace

# ? Nov 27, 2016 17:54

Kashuno: Oct 9, 2012; Where the hell is my SWORD?; Grimey Drawer

I have played no pokemon this weekend it has been an absolutely insanely busy holiday weekend for he first time in like 5-6 years so I underestimated how much time I had for this

# ? Nov 27, 2016 18:41

Kashuno: Oct 9, 2012; Where the hell is my SWORD?; Grimey Drawer

[quote]
Kashuno wrote on Nov 15, 2016 21:04:
Jammer
Scum
Roleblocker
Arcade Style controller. NES Advantage clone.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 18:42

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Oh look I was completely correct.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 19:10

Anomalous Amalgam: Feb 13, 2015; by Nyc_Tattoo; Doctor Rope

King Burgundy posted:

Oh look I was completely correct.

# ? Nov 27, 2016 20:08

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

AA did you see the plan?

# ? Nov 27, 2016 20:12

King Burgundy: Sep 17, 2003; I am the Burgundy King,
I can do anything!

Oh and TM?

# ? Nov 27, 2016 20:12

Truth Quark: Mar 21, 2010; EAT THE DONUTS

Game is dead. Also I wouldn't be surprised if TM stopped posting now that Jedit is dead.

# ? Nov 28, 2016 00:09

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# ? Apr 25, 2024 13:47

Tobbs Gnawed: Apr 4, 2007; All round mafia nice guy

I'm still playin'

# ? Nov 28, 2016 00:15

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